Domestic compensation vote on Saturday

[KildareFan]

The Domestic Compensation vote takes place at a SGM called by the SFAI tomorrow
It looks as if it is going to be a stormy affair
See here (http://www.soccerscene.ie/p2995.html)

[gufcfan]

Who the hell is Tom Morrow?

hehe

[passerrby]

anybody any idea how it went

[A face]

If this goes ahead then there has to be change for eircom League clubs playing in other competitions, like msl, lsl, etc all schoolboys competitions so they can develop their own players.

How is this done in other countries? In England for example, if a schoolboy signs from a junior club to say Tranmere, what do they pay if anything?

[KildareFan]

FAI now finds itself in another mess as the Schoolboys voted against the proposal
See report (http://www.soccerscene.ie/p3000.html)

[A face]

FAI now finds itself in another mess as the Schoolboys voted against the proposal
See report (http://www.soccerscene.ie/p3000.html)

I dont understand this .... the SFAI voted against the proposal (i.e. LOI clubs dont have to pay out money now?)

Why would they do that? What advantage would it give to LOI clubs if they had to pay compensation?

Am i miss reading the whole thing or what?

[passerrby]

I dont understand this .... the SFAI voted against the proposal (i.e. LOI clubs dont have to pay out money now?)

Why would they do that? What advantage would it give to LOI clubs if they had to pay compensation?

Am i miss reading the whole thing or what?

I think that the fai are planning on billing the EL clubs regardless.
PS this was not EL driven but FAI driven.

[KildareFan]

It is a complex issue but the following might help

Under FIFA Rules Schoolboy Clubs are entitled to compensation (this dates back to 2001) for players who change status this is whether players go abroad or are signed as Professional players by Eircom League Clubs.

The Amount is far more than being offered by the FAI. Schoolboy Clubs have never forced this issue and the FAI tried to railroad a Domestic Compensation through.

The initial compensation does not appear to be a problem but there is a major problem with players who are subsequently sold particularly if they are sold abroad as Schoolboy Clubs lose out and Eircom League clubs "clean up"

[A face]

The initial compensation does not appear to be a problem but there is a major problem with players who are subsequently sold particularly if they are sold abroad as Schoolboy Clubs lose out and Eircom League clubs "clean up"

How do LOI cleanup though?

Are you saying that schoolboy clubs feel they get compensated from clubs abroad with X and when LOI club sell players they get Y (Y > X)?

Of course a LOI will get more, as the players are more developed and old when they sell them on, what do they expect?

But all that said, i cant understand why SFAI have shot down the proposal for domestic compensation? Surely some compensation is better than the
current situation. Or are they just looking for more?

[KildareFan]

No thats not the situation

Say Player A goes directly from Schoolboy team to Man yoo at 16 years of age

Schoolboy Club gets 60k from Under 12 to Under 16 10 k each year and 20k for last year.

Man yoo have no choice in that that is FIFIA Guidelines

If Player A signs a pro contract with an Eircom League Club - Schoolboy Club gets 2k

Player A then Transfers to Man Yoo for a transfer fee of 150k

Eircom League Club gets 150k Schoolboy Club will get another max of 7.5k

Why should Schoolboy Club lose out ? Schoolboy Clubs have no problem with Eircom League Clubs getting more money but they do have a problem if it is at the expense of Schoolboy Clubs.

All they are asking is that in any subsequent transfer that they would not be any worse off than if he had left Schoolboy Club to transfer directly to Man Yoo

Remember if a deal is not done strictly speaking the Schoolboy Club is entitled to far greater amounts than being mentioned for every year that he played before signing for Eircom League Club.

i.e. If the FIFA Rules were applied Schoolboy Club is entitled to 60k from Eircom League Club - Yes 60k for every player signed by an eircom League Club and thsi gets bigger if they don not sign the player until 18 or 19.

The Schoolboy Clubs have never insisted on this as Eircom Leagues are not in a position and cannot afford that amount.

But it is coming close to the situation where Schoolboy Clubs will force the issue and EVERY Eircom League club will be in serious financial trouble.

[Macy]

This could be a positive development in that it'll force the eL teams to get more involved in school boy football. As they should, provide the whole path from youth team to senior football, with the few at the end of the process at 20-21 getting the move abroad. Take the greedy "nursery" clubs out of the equation altogether.

[KildareFan]

Silly statement to be calling the Nursery Clubs and I assume you mean the Schoolboy Clubs from that as being "greedy'

Amazing the way some people can only see with tinted glasses

Imagine the outcry if Sunderland had defaulted on the O'Donovan transfer fee, Cardiff the Jason Byrne fee etc I could go on

[Macy]

Not all school boy clubs style themselves as so called nursery clubs, but I'm sure you're well aware the type of club I'm talking about. There's a few around Dublin that are all about winning not player development, closely followed by how many players they can get over on trial to the UK, and then how many they can put on plaques in club houses of the few that do actually make it.

It's often talked about the problem of players being lost who come back after not making it, and the FAI have tried to address this. However, the issue will not be reduced or go away until some in school boy circles stop pushing kids into trials and boasting about how many they send over and instead concentrate on developing the players as players not as commodities. The FAI have a key role in this, if they have the balls.

A way to do this is to have the eL clubs more involved in schoolboy football, where player development will be more important as the obvious intention would be to bring them through to senior football, not to send them on a plane at 16. The top players will still be picked up, as the likes of Kevin Doyle have shown.

[jimhacker]

Not all school boy clubs style themselves as so called nursery clubs, but I'm sure you're well aware the type of club I'm talking about. There's a few around Dublin that are all about winning not player development, closely followed by how many players they can get over on trial to the UK, and then how many they can put on plaques in club houses of the few that do actually make it.

It's often talked about the problem of players being lost who come back after not making it, and the FAI have tried to address this. However, the issue will not be reduced or go away until some in school boy circles stop pushing kids into trials and boasting about how many they send over and instead concentrate on developing the players as players not as commodities. The FAI have a key role in this, if they have the balls.

A way to do this is to have the eL clubs more involved in schoolboy football, where player development will be more important as the obvious intention would be to bring them through to senior football, not to send them on a plane at 16. The top players will still be picked up, as the likes of Kevin Doyle have shown.

Excellent post!

Far as I know it's a few of these Dublin clubs who have led the charge to have the new scheme voted down. However, Kildare man makes a fair point - it's not the schoolboy clubs who have forced this issue at all.

[KildareFan]

Getting Eircom League Clubs involved in Schoolboy Football is not the answer as all that will happen is that Eircom League Clubs will then become the poacher and grab the best children in their respective areas at Under 12, Under 14 etc

Don't think Eircom League Clubs have the Know how or personnel to run that many schoolboy teams

I agree witha lot you say. In my opinion
1. Players should have to play in their own area -a la GAA style
2. Eircom League Club should affiliate with local Leagues and take on Board their Academy Teams thus allowing the players continue to play with their own local area teams

[micls]

1. Players should have to play in their own area -a la GAA style


There's no such rule in the GAA. The only rules are in switching clubs

[Battery Rover]

There's no such rule in the GAA. The only rules are in switching clubs

In club football / hurling you have to play in the parish you live in from the age of 18 years and over.

[micls]

In club football / hurling you have to play in the parish you live in from the age of 18 years and over.

I was talking about underage, but I was unaware that rule existed.

For example, the O hAilpin's play for Na Piarsaigh down here despite not playing for the parish.

Also a few girls in our club aren't from the parish

[Macy]

Getting Eircom League Clubs involved in Schoolboy Football is not the answer as all that will happen is that Eircom League Clubs will then become the poacher and grab the best children in their respective areas at Under 12, Under 14 etc
Better them than some of the Dublin schoolboy clubs. As I said, the clear aim would be to bring through players to the senior team, not short term aims of winning at every level, or getting players trials. It's a difference in emphasis from short term success to long term player development.


Don't think Eircom League Clubs have the Know how or personnel to run that many schoolboy teams

Probably not, but then know how of the current system isn't necessarily a disadvantage given the technical ability of those that do come through.


1. Players should have to play in their own area -a la GAA style
2. Eircom League Club should affiliate with local Leagues and take on Board their Academy Teams thus allowing the players continue to play with their own local area teams
1) Players don't have to play for their local team in the GAA, there's plenty of examples I can list in Longford of players living outside the parish of their club for their entire lives.
2) This is another possibility, but would need a massive change in the attitudes of what underage football in this country is really about. It would need to be about player development not success and I'm not sure the will is there in certain high profile clubs.

[passerrby]

agree with macy we have about eight underage teams at monaghan and have been pestered in the past with clubs looking for young lads to travel to dublin where im sure they will be offered over the water. the FAI said they would try and deal with this but have never got a handle on it maybe there is no solution

[Mark Breen]

I agree witha lot you say. In my opinion
1. Players should have to play in their own area -a la GAA style
2. Eircom League Club should affiliate with local Leagues and take on Board their Academy Teams thus allowing the players continue to play with their own local area teams

I'm sorry but i do not agree with your first statement's....

Firsly point one.... Why should a young player be resticted to playing for his local team... I've seen plenty of managers who are clueless and just scream absolute crap at their squads, and struggle to give any encouragement or guidance, why should kid's be forced to play under a manager or club who doens't have a clue what they are doing when he could travel to a team 15 minutes or even 30 minutes on the other side of the city and play for a club who are run properly with good facilities and play under a coach who has his coaching certs and a good idea of how to develop the kid/Kids.....

On your second point, I agree this should be done and if i'm not mistaken this is what Shamrock Rovers did some years ago out in Tallaght ( I could be mistaken) I think they took over a club from Tallagh !!!

[DmanDmythDledge]

2. Eircom League Club should affiliate with local Leagues and take on Board their Academy Teams thus allowing the players continue to play with their own local area teams
All eircom League clubs have to have an affiliation with a schoolboy club as part of licensing. For example, the big four Dublin teams all have a link up with the schoolboy teams which allows for natural progression from U8 right up to U20. However UCD's link up with Mount Merrion is only an affiliation, although some players have gone on to sign for UCD.

[Ash]

In club football / hurling you have to play in the parish you live in from the age of 18 years and over.

Not sure if thats an actual rule, although it might be frowned apon if the player
plays up through the underage ranks and then transfers to a rival club.

For example, former Town player Stephen Mullen used to play for Athlone GAA
but then wanted a mid season transfer to Garrycastle. Athlone wouldnt allow
it so he sat out the rest of that season until his registration had expired and
then joined up.

Another lad I know transferred from Athlone GAA to Mullagh in Galway.

[Patrick Dunne]

A hurler from Athlone ?