Munich 1958

[feo123]

Doubt there is but anyone old enough to remember anything about it?

[EAFC_rdfl]

I thought the Harry Gregg documentary last night was very good,must have been so hard for him meeting people who were there on the day

[rambler14]

Harry Gregg is a hero. If it wasn't for him Bobby Charlton and numerous other players would have died. He is a true Man Utd legend.
I can't understand why he hasn't been made Sir Harry Gregg.
It was a black day for football and I don't know how i'd react if that happened to the current Man Utd team as i'd feel a piece of my life had gone missing.
Those footballers were on the verge of greatness. They were on the verge of becoming European Champions. Some of the fallen players like Duncan Edwards would've gone on to be world beaters.
If the crash hadn't have happened I have no doubt that Man Utd would have more European Cups than what they have now, they would probably have four or five by now maybe 6. England would have won more than one World Cup and we could well be saying that the greatest player the world ever seen was one Duncan Edwards who if i'm to believe what i'm lead to believe was untouchable even though he was only 21.
When he died he had already amassed a total of 151 Appearences for Man Utd scoring 20 goals and not only that in a time when international matches were rarely played Edwards achieved 18 Caps forr England scoring 5 goals. Its not often someone becomes a regular in a Man Utd side from Age 16.

What could have been??????

[Ash]

I stayed in a hotel in Portsteward owned by Harry Gregg.

[feo123]

Watching the documentaries on MUTV the last few days makes you realise how big this was when it happened, it was such a tragedy....united would have gone on to win many trophies in the few years after had that not happened, edwards looked like a magician.
sandy busby was on mutv last night aswell, some great stories!!

[rambler14]

One of the papers had a great picture today of the 1966 England side carrying Duncan Edwards on their shoulders as the victorious England captain.
It was either in THE STAR or THE MIRROR. Think it was THE MIRROR.

[Lionel Ritchie]

One of the papers had a great picture today of the 1966 England side carrying Duncan Edwards on their shoulders as the victorious England captain.
It was either in THE STAR or THE MIRROR. Think it was THE MIRROR.

I'm sorry but that's sounds like appallingly bad taste. I know he was a very gifted lad and what have you but that's as subtle as a brick through a window.

...did they have Bobby Moore in the crowd wearing a flat-cap and waving a wooden rattle?

Back OT, great credit and respect due to Harry Cregg. Heard him the other day on Dunphy and he's quite a guy. Must be very hard for him right now.

[feo123]

Would be a huge shame if any idiots ruin the minutes silence on sunday, 99% of city fans will stand and respect the minutes silence, it was manchester as a whole that was affected by the crash, but theres always a few idiots who could ruin it! a minutes applause and there'd be no worries, just with the silence it will be dangerous imo.

united also to wear a special kit, 50's style, numbered 1 to 11 no sponsors etc.

[Risteard]

Were the Irish teams black-armbands worn tonight for the Munich disaster?
Because England had none.

[Lionel Ritchie]

Would be a huge shame if any idiots ruin the minutes silence on sunday. They will and it was extremely naive of the organisers to hope for otherwise.


99% of city fans will stand and respect the minutes silence, it was manchester as a whole that was affected by the crash. Sure there was a former City player killed in the crash. That's the angle Man City have been trying to appeal to their supporters on. It won't work. 99% will stay quiet. But 1% of the away capacity is about 70. More than enough to destroy a minutes silence.

[EAFC_rdfl]

I have to agree, that picture sound's so wrong and distasteful.

Also, of course there will be a few trying to ruin the minutes silence, but I think a minutes applause would be kind of inappropriate to remember such a tragedy, a minutes silence I feel is still the best way to show respect.

[Danny]

Were the Irish teams black-armbands worn tonight for the Munich disaster?
Because England had none.

No, they said during the game it was for someone related to Darren Gibson who died

[reder]

Is there not a minutes silence for them at the game tonight? I hope to god it is well respected if there is one and that is coming from a Liverpudlian.

I think the minutes silence at the manc derby is a recipe for disaster. City fans refer to Man U fans as "Munichs" and given the hatred between the 2 clubs, I'd imagine city have absolutely no intention of staying silent.

I think the idea of a minutes silence is an awful one, personally. Applause is the only way to go.

Wouldnt like to be in Manchester City centre after that fixture!

[Junior]

There were two 30 minute programmes on BBC4 on Monday (and repeated again tonight I think).

I watched the first one and to be honest it was very poor imo for a BBC production. Just Bobby Charlton and Harry Cregg and a couple of women supporters of the day adding very little to the story??

Im sure there were a lot more past and present Man Utd, general footballing world, manchester people, that could have been interviewed or asked to retell how the disaster impacted their lives or the parents lives or whatever.

The second one is purely from Bobby Charltons perspective, might watch it tonight but not impressed with the first one at all.

[reder]

I watched the first one and to be honest it was very poor imo for a BBC production.

The second one is purely from Bobby Charltons perspective, might watch it tonight but not impressed with the first one at all.

Its a programme based on a horrible tragedy, not some light entertainment. Lost is back on this week, watch that, it sounds more like what your after!

[Junior]

Its a programme based on a horrible tragedy, not some light entertainment. Lost is back on this week, watch that, it sounds more like what your after!

Who said anything about light entertainment? Its because it was such a horrible tragedy that I expected a quality, thought out production, that gave me, as a viewer an insight in to the events and feeling at the time. Not something that looked like a GCSE student had put together as part of his course work.

I am sure some of the other progammes might do the event justice, this programme didnt in my opinion. I think your comment is in poor taste.

[WoodquayBoy]

I am a United fan, and while I think a minute's applause would mask any jeering, I am of the opinion that a minute's silence is more appropriate than a minute's applause.
Changing to a round of clapping gives in to the boo boys - have the silence, have stewards and cops in the middle of the city fans, and if someone as much as farts, grab him/her and turf 'em out.
Must also be noted that City will be wearing a special strip on Sunday as well, and fair play to them for the efforts they are making - the away end at Old Trafford is to be festooned in posters of Frank Swift, the former City goalkeeper who was one of those killed in the crash (he was working for News of the World at the time)

[rambler14]

I would be surprised if it's respected. I was at the Manchester Derby 2 years ago and it was played the day after Noel Cantwell died so there was a minutes silence.
I was quite near the Man City fans and they gave it about 10 seconds and then suddenly 1 person shouted out "Munich Wa*ker". With that more Man City fans started shouting and eventually broke into one of their offensive Munich chants.
For the sake of the occasion a minutes applause is needed as the Man City fans won't care. They wouldn't refer to the Munich crash in their chants if they cared about Frank Swift.

[WoodquayBoy]

I was at the derby about five years ago that fell either a few days before or after Feb 6, can't exactly remember, was sitting above the c*nts and they spent most of the match with their arms out at their side moving to and fro, but if they want to show their inhumanity and lack of dignity, let them do so when there are millions of people watching

[Block G Raptor]

Would be a huge shame if any idiots ruin the minutes silence on sunday, 99% of city fans will stand and respect the minutes silence, it was manchester as a whole that was affected by the crash, but theres always a few idiots who could ruin it! a minutes applause and there'd be no worries, just with the silence it will be dangerous imo.

united also to wear a special kit, 50's style, numbered 1 to 11 no sponsors etc.

You can guarantee that the City fan's will boo! was at Anfield the Weekend Matt Busby died, the Liverpool fans impeccably observed the silence whilst the city fans chanted horrific abuse about busby and indeed munich, Have hated City fans since

[feo123]

did anyone hear the jeering during the minute silence at croke park this evening? may have been a few drunk young lads or something but it was shamful!

[Armando]

Nah, I was at the game and it was just a few Brazil fans who took a while to calm down from their partying!

[jmurphyc]

It sounded like someone was speaking on a megaphone during it. Anyone else hear this? What the **** was that about? Also, I wasn't timing, but that seemed like the shortest minutes silence I've ever heard at a match.

[stojkovic]

Nah, I was at the game and it was just a few Brazil fans who took a while to calm down from their partying!

I can also confirm this.

Stop looking for a story that isnt there. Looking to blame Scousers/Gooners/Rovers etc.

It was all innocent. The Brazil fans couldnt understand the PA announcer as he didnt have a Gort accent.

[feo123]

I can also confirm this.

Stop looking for a story that isnt there. Looking to blame Scousers/Gooners/Rovers etc.

It was all innocent. The Brazil fans couldnt understand the PA announcer as he didnt have a Gort accent.

and you expect me to know that sitting at home?

[osarusan]

Those big "bangs" during the minutes silence at Old Trafford - were they supposed to happen?

EDIT : Yes they were. 8 gunshots for the 8 players.

[Burny89]

BBC are reporting that it was fireworks being set off outside

[osarusan]

BBC are reporting that it was fireworks being set off outside

Did you get that from the "live text" on the BBC? I also got the "gunshots" from them. They've edited it.

[feo123]

was wondering what that was, maybe they should have said ther'd be gunshots before the game!

[Burny89]

yeah it was in the live text, howevr they mentioned the commerative gunshots in the write up and now in the players comments report they mention loud bangs outside

[reder]

yeah it was in the live text, howevr they mentioned the commerative gunshots in the write up and now in the players comments report they mention loud bangs outside

I am just waiting .. and I mean waiting for this one to grow legs. Mark my words, sooner or lather Leeds fans or us (Liverpool) will get blamed for those bangs.

Was speaking to a few city fans who were at the game. Naturally, they are over the moon with the result. Man city made a special request to them to observe the silence so they decided to do so. However, the level of policing in the away end was crazy and they felt that they were being bullied into silence. If they moved they were going to get nicked.

However, I watched the minutes silence and the start of the game and I have found a few things very disrespectful in relation to the whole thing :

- Ferguson standing there chewing away during the silence.

- Man Utd "fans" selling their "munich packs" with scarf etc on ebay after the game.

- the fact the club are charging people to go into the exibition for the disaster and making yet more money from the disaster. No wonder so many hardcore mancs hate their board.

- the stepover queen not bothering with an armband.

It might be morose or whatever but I cant shake the feeling that the mancs and media were very very p1ssed off with the bit of class the City fans showed. Man City FC, hats off to you, you are a credit to league football.

Lets hope Man U can take a leaf out of your book and stay quiet for at least 10 seconds when the Hillsborough anniversary comes around.

[WoodquayBoy]

The bangs outside were not gunshots but fireworks, let off, apparently, by UNITED fans who had asked the club for a salute to each of the 8 players who died. The club refused, rightly saying 23 people died and not just 8 players, but some United fans decided to go ahead with the tribute outside unfortunately. Someone might have stopped them because there were only 6 bangs, or maybe the last two happened after the end of the silence inside the ground

[jebus]

The bangs outside were not gunshots but fireworks, let off, apparently, by UNITED fans who had asked the club for a salute to each of the 8 players who died. The club refused, rightly saying 23 people died and not just 8 players, but some United fans decided to go ahead with the tribute outside unfortunately. Someone might have stopped them because there were only 6 bangs, or maybe the last two happened after the end of the silence inside the ground

Honestly that all sounds like a bit made up to excuse people setting out to ruin the minute's silence. I was flicking back and forth between sky sports news, sky news and bbc news during the game and whilst sky sports news talked about it it was completey ignored by the main news channels, it all smacked of the Premier League not wanting to seem like this sort of thing would go on.

Plus what sort of United morons would stage their own firework salute during a minutes silence? And why did Neville etc. seem so startled that it was happening

[feo123]

I am just waiting .. and I mean waiting for this one to grow legs. Mark my words, sooner or lather Leeds fans or us (Liverpool) will get blamed for those bangs.

Was speaking to a few city fans who were at the game. Naturally, they are over the moon with the result. Man city made a special request to them to observe the silence so they decided to do so. However, the level of policing in the away end was crazy and they felt that they were being bullied into silence. If they moved they were going to get nicked.

However, I watched the minutes silence and the start of the game and I have found a few things very disrespectful in relation to the whole thing :

- Ferguson standing there chewing away during the silence.

- Man Utd "fans" selling their "munich packs" with scarf etc on ebay after the game.

- the fact the club are charging people to go into the exibition for the disaster and making yet more money from the disaster. No wonder so many hardcore mancs hate their board.

- the stepover queen not bothering with an armband.

It might be morose or whatever but I cant shake the feeling that the mancs and media were very very p1ssed off with the bit of class the City fans showed. Man City FC, hats off to you, you are a credit to league football.

Lets hope Man U can take a leaf out of your book and stay quiet for at least 10 seconds when the Hillsborough anniversary comes around.

-fans selling their scarfs and that on Ebay has absolutly nothing to do with the club
-''the stepover queen'' as you call him WAS wearing an amrband!
-the munich tunnel is free of charge to view, which exhibition were you talking about?
-your fairly nip-picking there with the ferguson comment aswell!

[NeilMcD]

I just think its sad that people are so biased towards their team that they cannot see whats right or wrong or what happens more often then not that they are nit picky with the opposition but they would not be so nit picky with their own club as reder did above. At the end of the day the Premiership is just a TV Show that you can change the channel on.

[reder]

More from the classy mancs. The idiot who paid that for the scarf needs his/her head tested but the seller is the lowest of the low.

More scarf selling. (http://www.football365.com/story/0,17033,8652_3132015,00.html)

Wonder when the kit is being released and sold at £40 a pop!

[noby]

Honestly, I don't see the big deal. I presume everyone at the match got a free scarf. Some people are selling theirs; some people are buying. So what?

[reder]

I just think its sad that people are so biased towards their team that they cannot see whats right or wrong or what happens more often then not that they are nit picky with the opposition but they would not be so nit picky with their own club as reder did above. At the end of the day the Premiership is just a TV Show that you can change the channel on.

The day was about remembering those who died in the tragedy. It wasnt a show! United via their media, were demanding respect all week and as far as I can see, they were the only ones not doing so.

Come on. Selling the scarfs etc is pathetic. I'd say the poor souls who lost their lives would be sick at the thought of idiots making money off the back of it.

Count yourself very lucky you know nothing about football tragedies at club level. Stick to Bohs!

[Junior]

The day was about remembering those who died in the tragedy. It wasnt a show! United via their media, were demanding respect all week and as far as I can see, they were the only ones not doing so.

Come on. Selling the scarfs etc is pathetic. I'd say the poor souls who lost their lives would be sick at the thought of idiots making money off the back of it.

Count yourself very lucky you know nothing about football tragedies at club level. Stick to Bohs!

So why have you just posted petty point scoring comments because ferguson chews gum, Touts sell stuff on ebay shocker,etc..... Im not sure you really understand what the day was supposed to be about....... or was it just an opportunity to have a few digs at your ivals......

[reder]

What has Everton got to do with this?

So what do you guys call this then?

Well? (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/columnists/columnists.html?in_article_id=512327&in_page_id=1951)

I totally understand what the day was about. Thats why I am taking issue with these aspects.

[WoodquayBoy]

it all smacked of the Premier League not wanting to seem like this sort of thing would go on.
I agree that they tried to gloss over it, but I am reliably informed by people who were at the match, and others who live in Manchester, that what I suggested a few posts back is what happened


what sort of United morons would stage their own firework salute during a minutes silence? And why did Neville etc. seem so startled that it was happening
I follow United and you have no idea of the amount of morons who class themselves as fans of the club. As for Neville and Rooney looking surprised, it was because it happened outside the ground and it wasn't expected, sudden 'explosions' out of nowhere

[Armando]

The day was about remembering those who died in the tragedy. It wasnt a show! United via their media, were demanding respect all week and as far as I can see, they were the only ones not doing so.

Come on. Selling the scarfs etc is pathetic. I'd say the poor souls who lost their lives would be sick at the thought of idiots making money off the back of it.

Count yourself very lucky you know nothing about football tragedies at club level. Stick to Bohs!


reder, come on, your blinkered dislike of all things Utd is shining through in this thread.
You fail to mention that City fans were also trying to sell their scarves. The sad truth is that every club out there have 'fans' who would try to make a quick buck over such memorabilia.

The link you posted further down is quite ridiculous really. The headline says 'Utd try to cash in' so you willingly buy into it. Did you even read the article? The £5,000 fee(which was waivered in the end by the way) was out of pettyness on the Utd boards part, not greed. They were incensed when the BBC charged them a fee for the footage broadcast at George Bests funeral and this was Utds stupid way of getting one back on them - thankfully they saw sense and dropped it.

[dfx-]

Count yourself very lucky you know nothing about football tragedies at club level. Stick to Bohs!

I think you'll find Bohs are as big a tragedy as any :)

[feo123]

i still dont see how fans selling their scarfs and memorabilia has anything got to do with the club itself?

[Lim till i die]

Count yourself very lucky you know nothing about football tragedies at club level.

What was it Boris Johnson said about Scousers??