Climate Change

[Boh_So_Good]

That's far more scientific than the IPCC reports. Thanks.

Actually, it probably is. But Don't take my word for it


Galactic Cosmic Rays and Climate by Charles A Perry from Science Direct
http://www.greatglobalwarmingswindle.co.uk/pdf/Gamma%20Rays%20and%20Climate%20-%20Perry,%20Charles.pdf

Long range solar forecast - Science@NASA
http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2006/10may_longrange.htm

Professor Paul Reiter’s testimony to the House of Lords
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld200506/ldselect/ldeconaf/12/12we21.htm

E. Hanna and J. Capellan, “Recent Cooling in Coastal Southern Greenland and Relation with the North Atlantic Oscillation,” Geophysical Research Letters 30 (2003): 10.1029/2002GL015797
http://www.agu.org/pubs/crossref/2003/2002GL015797.shtml

Let me know when you read through there and I'll posts hundreds more by other "morons who can't add 2+2"

**************************

IPCC Avoids Scientific Method And Should Be Reformed Or Disbanded

Dec 14 2007

http://nzclimatescience.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id...



The two main "scientific" claims of the IPCC are the claim that "the
globe is warming" and "Increases in carbon dioxide emissions are
responsible". Evidence for both of these claims is fatally flawed.

To start with the "global warming" claim. It is based on a graph showing
that "mean annual global temperature" has been increasing.

This claim fails from two fundamental facts

1. No average temperature of any part of the earth's surface, over any
period, has ever been made.

How can you derive a "global average" when you do not even have a single
"local" average?

What they actually use is the procedure used from 1850, which is to make
one measurement a day at the weather station from a maximum/minimum
thermometer. The mean of these two is taken to be the average. No
statistician could agree that a plausible average can be obtained this
way. The potential bias is more than the claimed "global warming.

2. The sample is grossly unrepresentative of the earth's surface, mostly
near to towns. No statistician could accept an "average" based on such a
poor sample. It cannot possibly be "corrected"

It is of interest that frantic efforts to "correct" for these
uncorrectable errors have produced mean temperature records for the USA
and China which show no overall "warming" at all. If they were able to
"correct" the rest, the same result is likely

And, then after all, there has been no "global warming", however
measured, for eight years, and this year is all set to be cooling. As a
result it is now politically incorrect to speak of "global warming". The
buzzword is "Climate Change" which is still blamed on the non-existent
"warming"

[monutdfc]

Professor Paul Reiter’s testimony to the House of Lords
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld200506/ldselect/ldeconaf/12/12we21.htm
[/url]

Let me know when you read through there and I'll posts hundreds more by other "morons who can't add 2+2"

Ok, you do that and I'll discredit your sources one-by-one.
Here's one for starters:
http://www.exxonsecrets.org/html/personfactsheet.php?id=421

[monutdfc]

Actually, don't do that. If you want to believe crackpots on the net you do that. I'll stick to believing peer-reviewed scientists (ie the IPCC).
BTW your 4th link above is consistent with climate change theory and the observed slowing of the gulf stream/north atlantic drift.

Ha ha, just spotted the google-ad on this page:- a link to the Smithsonian Ecocentre, presented by ConocoPhillips!

[pete]

Sure we recycle or reuse, we get energy saving bulbs & such but does any one actually sacrifice anything for "the environment"? Take public transport & leave car at home, cancel foreign holiday etc...?

[monutdfc]

Sure we recycle or reuse, we get energy saving bulbs & such but does any one actually sacrifice anything for "the environment"? Take public transport & leave car at home, cancel foreign holiday etc...?

Good question. I just had a big crisis of conscience with the wife over a foreign holiday we just booked (last one I reckon!) She shares an office with a climate change scientist who laughed at her even giving it a second thought, which amazed me.
I cycle to work (and I have a car space), and holidayed in the UK for the past 2 years travelling by boat (although I have since checked out fast ferry emission figures which aren't great). Take the train or bus whenever possible. It's ****ing against the wind though - individual actions of course help, but without political will for wholesale change meaningful changes won't happen - the plastic bag tax, drink driving, speeding, etc the general mass of Irish people just won't stop doing things without rules and enforcement. Also, and this is understandable, the general public sees climate change as just another Y2K or the threat of nuclear war - 'they' will fix it before it happens; there is no tangible effects in the western world (or no uncomfortable ones anyway). It's like telling teenagers not to smoke, and it is understandable.
Problem is, it could be too late when it is evident - if the permafrost melts and releases millions of tonnes of CO2 this causes a feedback loop and the process accelerates.

There are many ways for a country to reduce its emissions without impinging greatly on quality of life. Proper planning is one. Higher building standards is another. But the government delayed on that one until after the building boom. Decent public transport is a third.

[Boh_So_Good]

Ok, you do that and I'll discredit your sources one-by-one.
Here's one for starters:
http://www.exxonsecrets.org/html/personfactsheet.php?id=421


Ah so it all funded by Big Oil companies and every single scientist who rejects the Al Gore matra is either working for Bush or is an internet crackpot.

Thanks for your balanced view on the matter. Now go buy some persil in the Green container so you can save polar bears.

PS: The Chinese New Year celebrations today all over China were cancelled during to the worst snowfalls in generations. But they must all be working for big oil and internet crackpots as well. Here is a thing. I guess the reason why the world is recording unusually old temps north of the tropics this winter is that the Earth itself is being paid off by Exxon. There ya go.

How much longer before the famers in Cavan start buying thongs is it now?

[dahamsta]

Just the ones you point out Bohs_So_Good. Pretty much everything you've posted so far has been refuted. You're on a hiding to nothing my good man, give up while you're... behind.

[pete]

I don't think I do anything to help lessen fossil fuel emissions that inconveniences me. I think anything I do is not by design. I would not think of cancelling a foreign holiday as good for my mental health ;)

[rebs23]

Since the beginning of time we have been listening to people telling us that the end of the world is nigh such as the second coming of christ, the nuclear bomb and now climate change/global warming. All the efforts to alter/affect climate change seem to be proscriptive and seek to control ones liberty which is why people like Boh so good immediately write off the arguments as just another piece of crackpot nonsense.

However no matter whether you believe in climate change or not the general direction that the proponents of climate change believe we should be going in are very worthwhile/neccessary and will need to happen anyway. eg reduce, reuse and recycle (stop wasting our natural resources, oil won't last forever, cutting down our oxygen supply in the amazon, less pollutants in the atmosphere, alternative fuels for transport, more public transport, etc).

I cannot think of a single reasons why these are not good things so for me the argument about whether it is happening or not are irrelevant. The argument for me is how we go about getting these things to happen. Nuclear power, hydrogen fuel cells (stroage problems), bio fuels, etc. For me economic incentives is the way forward, punative measures just won't work in the long run.

[Boh_So_Good]

Since the beginning of time we have been listening to people telling us that the end of the world is nigh such as the second coming of christ, the nuclear bomb and now climate change/global warming. All the efforts to alter/affect climate change seem to be proscriptive and seek to control ones liberty which is why people like Boh so good immediately write off the arguments as just another piece of crackpot nonsense.

Also there is a very real commercial engine behind these Endtime hysterias. It sells newspapers, documentaries, books and DVDs. Look how fantastically rich Al Gore has become since he became an 'evironmentalist' by living in a house which uses the same electricity as a factory and flies all over the world telling the rest of us we cant.


However no matter whether you believe in climate change or not the general direction that the proponents of climate change believe we should be going in are very worthwhile/neccessary and will need to happen anyway. eg reduce, reuse and recycle (stop wasting our natural resources, oil won't last forever, cutting down our oxygen supply in the amazon, less pollutants in the atmosphere, alternative fuels for transport, more public transport, etc).

I absolutely agree 100% that protecting the environment is something we have to do. But for real reasons and not crazy fraudulent ones like AGW. The Global Warming stuff is only being embraced by politicians because it allows all kinds of juicy revenue oppertunities through Carbon Taxation and major corporations love it because they can flog all kinds Low-Carbon products. That the irony of all this. The pro AL Gore types are just being suckered in by mass media, to buy into mass consumerism. This is not how we should go about protecting the environment.



I cannot think of a single reasons why these are not good things so for me the argument about whether it is happening or not are irrelevant. The argument for me is how we go about getting these things to happen. Nuclear power, hydrogen fuel cells (stroage problems), bio fuels, etc. For me economic incentives is the way forward, punative measures just won't work in the long run.

Well you can forget Nuclear power for Ireland because the Global Warming brigade here are all against it cos they got their science on the issue from Christy Moore in the same way they get their Climate science from Al Gore. you would have to deliver it wrapped in some pop culture or hollywood manner for the Global Warming types to accept it. They need a Manchester United type hype of any issue before they can grasp it.

Nuclear power is far too sensible an option for the Global Warming shower to either understand nor accept. They prefer to feel ethical by buying the consumer product which has a photo of a polar bear on it. Cos, ya know, they are loike sooooooooooooooo enlightened.

[BohsPartisan]

Best thing you can do with these people is smile and nod.

[pete]

Good point about the commercialism of Climate Change. Companies need to find new markets otherwise they cannot grow. Climate Change offers great opportunity to sell new products.

[Boh_So_Good]

Good point about the commercialism of Climate Change. Companies need to find new markets otherwise they cannot grow. Climate Change offers great opportunity to sell new products.

It's been a major business for a while now - which is why it gets so much attention in the media. The irony is that the chattering class "socialists" who want to save the planet are the last bunch to have figured it out. Which really shows how easily led by mass media Sorcha in Dalkey with his 'Fair Trade' coffee really is.

If you look at TV now, everything from detergent to oil and cars are being repackaged as planet saving products. I have even seen ads for low carbon car insurance. It so obviously all a fraud and tacky sales pitch. All you have to do is put a polar bear on the box and the chattering classes will run salivating to buy it while assuming that they haven't been sucked in by "The Man" when this is precisely what's happening.

and these people call Global Warming Skeptics "morons who can't add 2 +2" and I also have to laugh the way gushingly PC newspaper such as the Guardian and the Irish Times pontificate endlessly about saving the planet when the newspaper industry is an incredibly polluting and toxic business.

You couldn't make this stuff up if you tried.

[osarusan]

You couldn't make this stuff up if you tried.

You obviously can though.

[BohsPartisan]

You obviously can though.

POTM! :D

[pineapple stu]

Best thing you can do with these people is smile and nod.
Who, environmentalists or Boh So Good?

[BohsPartisan]

Who, environmentalists or Boh So Good?

Anyone who claims carbon emissions are not the primary cause of climate change.

[jmurphyc]

Yeah, whether you think climate change/global warming exists or not one think that really annoys me is how much we, the public are constantly told we have to cut down our carbon footprint, buy environmentally friendly products, etc as if we're to blame when it's governments and big business who not only cause most of the problem, but also are more than happy to continue to go about polluting and selling us products which have way too much packaging (which we are then expected to dispose of, costing us money).

[BohsPartisan]

Yeah, whether you think climate change/global warming exists or not one think that really annoys me is how much we, the public are constantly told we have to cut down our carbon footprint, buy environmentally friendly products, etc as if we're to blame when it's governments and big business who not only cause most of the problem, but also are more than happy to continue to go about polluting and selling us products which have way too much packaging (which we are then expected to dispose of, costing us money).

Good post. Putting the onus on individuals to make changes is the wrong approach and only lets the real polluters off the hook. Big business wil however always do what is best for its shareholders financially which is why the major decisions that affect the majority need to be taken out of the hands of the CEO's and made democratically.

[Boh_So_Good]

Anyone who claims carbon emissions are not the primary cause of climate change.

Do you honestly have any idea how thick that statement is in its most literal sense. Have you ever heard of the Sun by any chance? Volcanos? Decaying plants.

You haven't a clues about this issue on any level. I bet you think there was no "climate change" before Henry Ford and Ronald McDonald. That the earth enjoyed a "socialist climate" of no extremes and all the global temps were in egalitarian balance...etc...

As for reducing one's "carbon footprint". The quantities of CO2 in the natural environment are so great, that reduction of human input would have very little and mostly likely no affect upon concentrations in the air. China surpassed the US by 10% relative increase in 2006, to be 8% ahead of US in CO2 emissions. This fact is not promoted in the 'science' of AGW.

We shall have to see what the numbers are for 2007. With this rapid growth of China and India, any and all reduction of US and EU emissions is entirely MEANINGLESS. US, EU and most comical of all Ireland's reductions in emissions is only a symbolic gesture (pathetic in our case), and it is now mandatory that we make this tokenistic symbolic gesture to convince China to slow its exponential growth of CO2 emissions. A joke. Especially considering that the record cold in China this winter won't make them more Carbon Ethical because some damp island off the coast of Europe is doing so. Reminds me of the crackpots in this country who used to think that Ireland's nutrality during the Cold War sent shudders down the halls of the Kremlin and Pentagon.

BP, I'm sorry but you'll have do some research beyond imaging Joe Higging in a long white coat insulating his attic with back issues of the Socialist Worker me oul china.

Here is a clue. Go have a look through the Books of Kells, the Lindisfarne Chronicals, the Annals of the Four Masters and see if you can find any illustrated images of monks driving 4-wheel drives and eating McDonalds. Cos they had "global warming" back then too.

There is not one scientist, nor any collective of scientists who can prove with any degree of certainity that mankind is boiling the earth with carbon emissions. Not a single one. Not a sausage. Nada. It's all wild speculation based on cherry picked data, wrapped up in a political package and being sold to dumb white folks in affulent societies by The Man.

You have been had.

[BohsPartisan]

Yeah whatever BSG. Research.
What research have you done beyond reading articles written by cranks with a neo-liberal agenda to push (and getting paid handsomely for doing so!)?
I've done as much "research" as you.

[jebus]

Do you honestly have any idea how thick that statement is in its most literal sense. Have you ever heard of the Sun by any chance?

And BSG's reference points comes to the fore at last. I knew this thread had a whiff of Murdoch about it :)

[pete]

Links People. Any chance can link to reference sites? :o

The US not the best example but seen a recent poll which says Climate Change down the list of priorities of voters for Presidential election. Nothing like the fear of a recession to change priorities.

For what it is worth I don't think China or India would change much to help the global climate. They would however change to reduce local pollution (poisoned rivers 'n such).

[Boh_So_Good]

Just a quick update. "Global Warming" has officially stopped. In years to come future generations will look back at this Global Warming hysteria with amazement.




http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PO0802/S00344.htm

Gore acknowledged Thursday that recent cooling trends as manifest in
China's coldest winter in 100 years, Baghdad's first snow ever, North
America's greatest snow cover in 50 years, record levels of Antarctic
sea ice and record cold in a number of countries in both hemispheres
appear set to continue.

He cited the fact that all major global temperature tracking agencies
(Hadley, NASA, GISS, UAH, RSS) have released data showing that over the
past year, global temperatures have dropped dramatically, from between
0.65C and 0.75C, enough to wipe out most of the warming recorded over
the past 100 years.

All in one year, and the single fastest temperature change ever
recorded, either up or down.


I'll sit back now and wait for the obligatory insult hurled my way as a rebuttle to the above peer-reviewed facts (all can be checked, verified) which contradict this weird, middle class religion which has something to do paying carbon offsets via Al Gore's holding company which creams off a percentage so he can pay his 30K a month electric bill when he is not flying in private jets around the world.

It's all for the polar bears afterall.

[osarusan]

Just a quick update. "Global Warming" has officially stopped. In years to come future generations will look back at this Global Warming hysteria with amazement.

It's all for the polar bears afterall.

As Kingdom Hoop has already pointed out -


Just on a point of interest for Boh_So_Good, global warming is now more commonly, and accurately, referred to as CLIMATE CHANGE. I.e. that doesn't mean Ireland turns into a glorious tropical paradise but a windswept craggy isle flailing in vain to keep its head above water.


Climate change focuses on dramatic changes to our climate, and the part mankind plays in that process.

The last line of the piece you've quoted should give you a hint in that direction.

All in one year, and the single fastest temperature change ever
recorded, either up or down.
Climate is changing faster than ever before........sure, no cause for alarm.



Oh, I almost forgot....

I'll sit back now and wait for the obligatory insult hurled my way

You're full of crap.

[Boh_So_Good]

As Kingdom Hoop has already pointed out -


Climate change focuses on dramatic changes to our climate, and the part mankind plays in that process.


So the sudden dramatic drop is world temps is not cause by any other factor than mankinds evil sins?

Anyways back to this end of the quantum mechanical field for a moment, I just got through reading an interesting article in Astronomy magazine which has stated that the increased solar activity of the last 10 years has suddenly tapered off. Happened around mid October. Bang on the time global temps started to plummet.

The graphic can be laid over the global temps of both the Earth and Mars for the last decade and they match up nicely. This is without even having to bend the data like the Blessed Al Gore did with his now discredited "hockey stick" con job which sent the MTV audiences hearts racing during his Hollywood movie.

Can you see where I am going with this?

When solar activity was high between 1996 and 2007 - the Earth heated up AND when it suddenly ended just before the end of last October a worldwide drop in global temps were recorded by Hadley, NASA, GISS, UAH, RSS.

This is about as conclusive evidence as you will ever find that the sun is the main driver of climate change and not American soccer moms driving SUVs.


You're full of crap.

Oh dear. It always gets ugly when someone's religious dogma is exposed as a fraud.


Some more heretics who disagree with Al Gore:


"In scientific circles, C02 is referred to as a `trace gas' that, for
hundreds of thousands of years, has remained at or below five
ten-thousandths of the atmosphere by volume. Even among the so-called
`greenhouse gases' (GHG), C02 accounts for less than 4%, with water
vapour being by far the most significant GHG. C02 is clearly a
miniscule component of the massive mechanisms that create climate and
cause climate change."
Dr. Timothy Ball, Chairman of the Natural Resources Stewardship Project
(NRSP.com), Former Professor Of Climatology, University of Winnipeg



"...and I think future generations are not going to blame us for
anything except for being silly, for letting a few tenths of a degree
panic us"
Dr. Richard Lindzen, Professor of Meteorology MIT and Member of the
National Academy of Sciences


"What most commentators-and many scientists-seem to miss is that the
only thing we can say with certainly about climate is that it changes"
Dr. Richard Lindzen



[most of the current alarm over climate change is based on] "inherently
untrustworthy climate models, similar to those that cannot accurately
forecast the weather a week from now." Dr. Richard Lindzen


The Fourth Report of the IPCC might just as well decree the
suppression of all climatology textbooks, and replace them in our
schools with press communiqués. ... Day after day, the same mantra -
that 'the Earth is warming up' - is churned out in all its forms. As
'the
ice melts' and 'sea level rises' the Apocalypse looms ever nearer!
Without realizing it, or perhaps without wishing to, the average
citizen in bamboozled, lobotomized, and lulled into mindless acceptance.
... Non-believers in the greenhouse scenario are in the
position of those long ago who doubted the existence of God ...
Marcel Leroux



It should be abundantly clear by now that the AGW hypothesis is
contradicted by the facts/measurements/observations and should
therefore be abandoned and be substituted by a hypothesis which
better matches the facts.
- Hans Labohm

[Lionel Ritchie]

Gore acknowledged Thursday that recent cooling trends as manifest in China's coldest winter in 100 years, Baghdad's first snow ever, North
America's greatest snow cover in 50 years, record levels of Antarctic
sea ice and record cold in a number of countries in both hemispheres
appear set to continue Ice and snow in winter? Who'd have thunk it?


... Non-believers in the greenhouse scenario are in the
position of those long ago who doubted the existence of God ...
Marcel Leroux oh sweet precious martyrdom

[pete]

Whether you call it Climate Change or Global Warming IMO Carbon off setting & switching of light bulbs & the such is a complete waste of time. Just reading a magazine giving these great examples that if get the bus to work 1 day equals to X million barrels of oil saved. Sure the number sounds large but as a percentage of total oil used if insignificant which is why the percentage is never used.

I heard recently that beef production is one of the biggest producers of carbon dioxide. Probably cutting out our red meat would have the biggest impact.

[dahamsta]

Whether you call it Climate Change or Global Warming IMO Carbon off setting & switching of light bulbs & the such is a complete waste of time. Just reading a magazine giving these great examples that if get the bus to work 1 day equals to X million barrels of oil saved. Sure the number sounds large but as a percentage of total oil used if insignificant which is why the percentage is never used.Post the actual facts or delete your post pete. I've had enough of some of the frankly disgusting and damaging "opinions" in this thread. From this point on every post needs sources or it will be deleted.

adam

[NeilMcD]

Here is an industry breakdown for Ireland. Its from the Tegasc website and the Source: Environmental Resource Management.


Agriculture is largely farts from the cows.

[pineapple stu]

The problem with that is that cows have always been farting, while people have only recently started driving lots of cars and having lots of factories. So while cows may cause a majority of carbon emissions, people are causing the majority of the increase in emissions, which is what's causing the problem.

[NeilMcD]

I agree with you, there is very little possibility of a decrease on the Agriculture side of things. That is why they concentrate on the areas that they can actually reduce.

[dahamsta]

As long as we have people like pete saying "sure it's only a tiny part of the problem" - without, once again, even bothering to state the actual facts they're supposed to be representing - you'll have rubes out there believing them and continuing to contribute to the problem. By that retarded logic, it's ok to shoot one person in the head, cos, you know, it's only one murder. :rolleyes:

That kind of pre-pubescent mé-féin thinking does more damage than every cow fart in the world.

adam

[Boh_So_Good]

Well well, it only seemed like yesterday that if a dandelion bloomed a week early in Waterford, our TV screens would be filled with some Global Warming Activist (ex Socialist Worker Student type) in fits of messianic convulsions warning that "evil mankind was boiling the earth with carbon!" (for full effect add Dalkey/Foxrock accent)



Meanwhile 2008 looks to be the coldest and most extreme GLOBAL WINTER in decades and not a peep out of most of the media. Certainly not RTE. Where is the Green Party???? Been kinda quite lately.





http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/m.../09/do0902.xml

Last week, virtually unreported in Britain, the extraordinary winter weather of 2008 elsewhere in the world continued. In the USA, there were blizzards as far south as Texas and Arkansas, while in northern states and Canada what they are calling "the winter from hell" has continued to break records going back in some cases to 1873. Meanwhile in Asia more details emerged of the catastrophe caused by the northern hemisphere's greatest snow cover since 1966.

[dahamsta]

Bohs_So_Good, are you genuinely having trouble with the phrase "climate change" or are you just sh*tstirring at this point? Because I'm seeing sh*tstirring, and I'm not inclined to let it continue.

[anto1208]

Im not sure what his point is , Bohs_So_Good what are you saying that global warming / climate change isnt happening ? Do you have a window ?

[monutdfc]

The problem with that is that cows have always been farting, while people have only recently started driving lots of cars and having lots of factories. So while cows may cause a majority of carbon emissions, people are causing the majority of the increase in emissions, which is what's causing the problem.
Yes and no. I'm in the middle of an excellent book, Clive Ponting's re-release of "An Environmental History of the World" and the cow population of the earth has grown exponentially over the last hundred years or so ( the book is at home, I'll look it up and post the actual figures if I think of it). If there is a switch of meat consumption from beef to the meat of non-ruminants the problem can be massively reduced.
BTW, the methane emissions from cows come mainly from their mouths, not through their arse.

[John83]

Meanwhile 2008 looks to be the coldest and most extreme GLOBAL WINTER in decades and not a peep out of most of the media. Certainly not RTE. Where is the Green Party???? Been kinda quite lately.
Weather isn't climate.
Weather extremes are predicted by global warming.
The Green Party's volume of press releases against global average temperature isn't actually going to prove anything.

I have no doubt this has been explained to you before.

[jebus]

Weather isn't climate.
Weather extremes are predicted by global warming.
The Green Party's volume of press releases against global average temperature isn't actually going to prove anything.

I have no doubt this has been explained to you before.

Quiet! He's still trying to grasp the birds and the bees concept at the moment and doesn't need unwelcome distractions

[Boh_So_Good]

The term "Climate Change" was an Owerllian-style Newspeak tactic which the Global Warmers came up when the eh,..."global warming" suddenly stopped. Rather than admit that they were incorrect in their hysterical predictions.

But if some people on this board would rather nitpick terminology rather than deal with the reality that Al Gore and the rest of them whipped up a phoney, groundless crusade then that's their problem. Won't change the fact that the world has suddenly become cold since last October.


and here is why the "global warming" stopped:



Up To 69% Of Global Warming Due To Solar Variability
Nicola Scafetta, Bruce J. West
Physics Today
March 2008

http://www.fel.duke.edu/~scafetta/pdf/opinion0308.pdf

[dahamsta]

So you're telling us that you absolutely don't believe that the climate has changed dramatically in the past 10-20 years, exacerbated by the activities of humans since the industrial revolution? As anto1208 said: Do you have a window?

Jesus, even Helen Keller could tell the difference in temperature in the past 20 years.

adam

[osarusan]

if this is true......
The term "Climate Change" was an Owerllian-style Newspeak tactic which the Global Warmers came up when the eh,..."global warming" suddenly stopped.


and this is true........

interesting article in Astronomy magazine which has stated that the increased solar activity of the last 10 years has suddenly tapered off. Happened around mid October. Bang on the time global temps started to plummet.

When solar activity was high between 1996 and 2007 - the Earth heated up AND when it suddenly ended just before the end of last October a worldwide drop in global temps were recorded by Hadley, NASA, GISS, UAH, RSS.


then by your logic, the term 'climate change' should only have been around since last October.

But that's not the case. It has been around for years.

The reason the term has been around for years is because people realised something, something which has been pointed out to you repeatedly on this thread, and that something is that climate change doesn't mean that the world becomes a sunny paradise, but is subject to much more drastic and damaging changes in climate than previously.

================================================== ==================================================

EDIT: Boh So Good, I went to that link you posted, and look what I found -

Sun and Global Warming:

Finally, our study focused on developing a phenomenological multiscale model to estimate the solar contribution to global warming during the last century. Current energy balance climate models seems to underestimate the solar impact on climate by 1.5-3 times. It seems that the increase of solar activity during the 20th century might be responsible of approximately 50% of the global warming, but this contribution was not uniform during the century. The sun might have contributed 75% of the global warming during the first half of the century (1900-1950) but only 30% during the second half of the century (1950-2000). Thus, our findings would confirm that the sun played a dominant role in climate change in the early past, as several empirical studies would suggest. However, anthropogenic-added climatic forcing might have progressively played a dominant role in climate change during the last century and, in particular, during the last decades.
http://www.fel.duke.edu/~scafetta/

ironic that somebody who complains about "cherrypicking" should be doing it. With you, not surprising though.

[Lionel Ritchie]

Won't change the fact that the world has suddenly become cold since last October.
:
...It's called winter. Look it up. Happens every year. ;)

[dahamsta]

Don't encourage him LR, ffs!

[jebus]

It's surprising how similar this thread is to it's Dumbass counterpart due to Bohs So Good's participation :)

[GavinZac]

It's surprising how similar this thread is to it's Dumbass counterpart due to Bohs So Good's participation :)

For all the arguments, annoyances and oddities, theres only one person on my foot.ie ignore list. And this thread is thus quite funny to read :D

[pete]

I don't think the average person in the street links weather changes with use of carbon fuels. Oil hit $111 a barrel today which is more likely to focus the mind as that has an immediate impact on our lives hitting us in the pocket.

[kingdom hoop]

I don't think the average person in the street links weather changes with use of carbon fuels. Oil hit $111 a barrel today which is more likely to focus the mind as that has an immediate impact on our lives hitting us in the pocket.


Ah ha, so you're this fabled "the average person." :D

[Boh_So_Good]

This is a remarkable article and goes to the root of just how politicised the whole global warming hysteria is. We see not one, but two scientists converted in one fell swoop off of the global warming support list. The fact that one had to resign from NASA, and that NASA refused to publish his findings is astounding:




http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=290213857214322

Climate Change: When new facts emerge, the open-minded tend to alter
their views. This is what has happened to a Hungarian environmental
scholar whose position on global warming has been transformed.

Until his Damascus moment, Miklos Zagoni, a physicist and environmental
researcher, had been touted as his nation's "most outspoken supporter of
the Kyoto Protocol." But then this activist saw the work of a fellow
Hungarian scientist. His world was rocked.

Ferenc Miskolczi, an atmospheric physicist at NASA's Langley Research
Center with three decades of experience, had found that researchers have
been repeating a mistake when calculating the impact of greenhouse gas
emissions on temperatures.

Al Gore needs to come clean about his Generation Investment Management private equity firm. Al Gore needs to be transparent about where GIM gets its funding from, what projects it invests in, and the main stakeholders involved. If Al Gore has nothing to hide, then he should take the initiative to show the world independent proof that all his global warming alarmism isn't tied in to a self-centered profit motive.

Any sign of that 27 feet rise in sea level he promised in his Hollywood movie yet? Not that he would notice flying everywhere in private jets.


So you're telling us that you absolutely don't believe that the climate has changed dramatically in the past 10-20 years, exacerbated by the activities of humans since the industrial revolution? As anto1208 said: Do you have a window?

Jesus, even Helen Keller could tell the difference in temperature in the past 20 years.

adam


You really don't get that the earth climatic cycles have around longer than MTV do you? How many petrol combustion engines were there in the 12th and 13th century when "global warming" even more severe than predicted for this century took place?

[jebus]

You really don't get that the earth climatic cycles have around longer than MTV do you? How many petrol combustion engines were there in the 12th and 13th century when "global warming" even more severe than predicted for this century took place?

Are you actually suggesting that the industrial revolution and it's subsequent fallout have not had any effect on the warming process?