Duff to improve with Keegan?

[kennedmc]

As for the jibe about taking the handy number thats a cheap shot at a player that gave his all to Blackburn and signed a new contract which guaranteed the club a payout, a player who could have left when they were relegated but didn't. Even when he signed for Chelsea, he completely changed his game when a new manager was brought in.
All the while he was our best player, form constantly being good, to such an extent that when he didn't play for us, we've had no outlet going forward.
The remarks about Hunt seamlessly replacing Duffer says more about Damien's lack of form and confidence than it does about Hunt's ability. I like Hunts swagger, I like his workrate, but calling a spade a spade he's a very hit and miss player, he was outstanding when he came on against Wales and got the crowd going but his overeagerness against the Czechs cost us.
I'd suggest that anyone revelling in Duffers constant slide in form is at best an idiot and at worst a complete fcukwit.

Drop the personal insults.

I'm not revelling in his slid in form. I hope to see him and performing well back in an Irish jersey. As I mention above the after a full preseason perhaps he will be back to his best.

The fact remains that he signed for Newcastle - why did he do this? It was an incredibly stupid decision and the only reason he did it was money and the fact he thought he'd get a game very week. It smacks of a lack of ambition. Liverpool under Benetez or Newcastle under errr Glen Roeder.

Nearly every attacking Chelsea player had to change their style of play under Mourinho - look at Joe Cole.......a player doing what the coach wants them to do hardly merits a medal!

Hunt and Duff are very different players and bring different things to the team.. Hunt is not an out and out winger and is more an wide midfielder with a great engine who can tuck in when needed.

Both Hunt and Duff when fully fit offer us good (but different) options.

[Kingdom]

Drop the personal insults.

I'm not revelling in his slid in form. I hope to see him and performing well back in an Irish jersey. As I mention above the after a full preseason perhaps he will be back to his best.

The fact remains that he signed for Newcastle - why did he do this? It was an incredibly stupid decision and the only reason he did it was money and the fact he thought he'd get a game very week. It smacks of a lack of ambition. Liverpool under Benetez or Newcastle under errr Glen Roeder.

Nearly every attacking Chelsea player had to change their style of play under Mourinho - look at Joe Cole.......a player doing what the coach wants them to do hardly merits a medal!

Hunt and Duff are very different players and bring different things to the team.. Hunt is not an out and out winger and is more an wide midfielder with a great engine who can tuck in when needed.

Both Hunt and Duff when fully fit offer us good (but different) options.

I Wasn't Actually referring to you my friend, but i'll desist them anyway. Now Kingdom will refer to the other point you made. Its my assumption that Duffer wasn't allowed sign for Liverpool. They were Effectively playing without a Regular left winger for a while and were known admirers of Duff.

Mourinho had said in the press that he would allow Duff to leave on conditions suitable to the player and the club.

Whats your opinion on Shay Given?

[kennedmc]

I seem to recall Duff saying at his press conference he could have signed for Liverpool but chose not to.

Given is a terrific goalkeeper who was signed for Newcatle 10 years by Kenny Daglish. when he was a 20 year old and starting out in the game.

[Kingdom]

I seem to recall Duff saying at his press conference he could have signed for Liverpool but chose not to.

Given is a terrific goalkeeper who was signed for Newcatle 10 years by Kenny Daglish. when he was a 20 year old and starting out in the game.

I don't remember Duff alluding to that at all, but thats not saying that I'm right.

You refer to Duff as lacking ambitio, does Given not have the same lack of ambition?

[drummerboy]

I think the injuries have taken their toll on Duff. He has lost a fair bit of pace, something he needs to play out wide. Can't see him too much longer.

[endabob1]

Not sure about Liverpool but it is 100% true that he could have signed for Spurs, who had just finished 5th. A fee was agreed with both clubs, I even think he passed a medical, the fact that he (allegedly) doubled his salary by moving to Newcastle was assumed to be what swung the decision.

[youngirish]

I'd still have Duff over the likes of flavour of the moment BigManCas (Aiden McGeady) in the Irish team in a heartbeat irrespective of how he's playing for Newcastle.

[tetsujin1979]

Not sure about Liverpool but it is 100% true that he could have signed for Spurs, who had just finished 5th. A fee was agreed with both clubs, I even think he passed a medical, the fact that he (allegedly) doubled his salary by moving to Newcastle was assumed to be what swung the decision.
I'm sure noone here would choose the exact same position in another company, just because they were offering twice the money :rolleyes:

[amaccann]

Whats your opinion on Shay Given?

My impression of Given was always that, having played for Sunderland, he liked the region & had put down roots there. I can't imagine any other reason (I don't think he's paid a fortune) for standing behind one of the worst defences in the Premiership.

[Kingdom]

My impression of Given was always that, having played for Sunderland, he liked the region & had put down roots there. I can't imagine any other reason (I don't think he's paid a fortune) for standing behind one of the worst defences in the Premiership.

which shows a lack of ambition no? I'm slagging him by the way, he's a brilliant keeper one of our best, but I'd just to ahve seen him successful.

[RivaldoBabb]

At this point I'd rather have Hunt and McGeady start for us to be honest.

I hope Duff recovers but what I've seen with him since his comeback has not been inspiring.

So Damien Duff is not worth a place in the starting 11 now because that great manager Kevin keegan has dropped him? Do me a favour...

As always, I like to make judgements on whether an Irish player is worth his place in the starting 11 by his peformances for IRELAND, i really couldnt give a rats what happens at that joke of a club Newcastle. Duff has ALWAYS played well for Ireland, illustrated by 2 man of the match performances in the double header at Croker last year and is on a completely different planet in terms of talent than Stephen Hunt.

I dont subsribe to the theory that he is past it either, I think his confidence is shattered running up and down the left wing at Newcastle trying to help defenders that cant defend, so if he is sold in the summer then it will be for his benefit.

We dont have many class players in the Irish squad, but Duff is one of them and will show it once again.

[Lionel Ritchie]

Not sure about Liverpool but it is 100% true that he could have signed for Spurs, who had just finished 5th. A fee was agreed with both clubs, I even think he passed a medical, the fact that he (allegedly) doubled his salary by moving to Newcastle was assumed to be what swung the decision.

couple of things...

afaik Duffer hasn't passed a medical since leaving Blackburn.

Very first I've heard of the Liverpool connection ...paper talk aside.

For reasons both in and out of Football -Spurs would've been a more convenient move than Newcastle ...that Newcastle had to pay more in wages to lure him is probably testament to that.

At the start of this season, if I were Duff, I'd have felt vindicated in the move on purely footballing grounds, to be playing in a team that now could call on Geremi, Owen, Viduka, Smith, NZogbia, Martins, Barton...

[amaccann]

which shows a lack of ambition no? I'm slagging him by the way, he's a brilliant keeper one of our best, but I'd just to ahve seen him successful.
Well that's a different kind of ambition; the one to settle down in a place (presumably) you were comfortable living in. Ambition on the pitch didn't enter it, or Given would have easily found a "better" club. Duff on the other hand had the pick of some top teams in the Premiership & instead chose a perennial struggler with problems on and off the pitch. It doesn't take a wild guess to suspect he chased the Kings Shilling.

[seanfhear]

the big clubs have a major say on which clubs they transfer their players to [witness man utd with heinz to liverpool]
perhaps chelsea did not want duff to go to liverpool or spurs and duff may have gained financially by keeping his mouth shut and joining newcastle
acording to rumour spurs were interested not sure about liverpool
duffs injury record may have put off alot of clubs even when he was with blackburn
i believe he at that time would have been an ideal player for man utd but was to injury prone to justify the money chelski paid for him

[aidz1]

Barring injury, obviously, i cant see how you would drop duff from an irish squad. he still is one of our better players who has a lot of qualities.

[irishfan86]

If everyone gets a clean slate, and he is judged on his current form under this new management team, it's hard to see him being highly rated.

Now perhaps the DVDs Trap is watching of actual Ireland games will give him a different perspective on Duff...but again most of those games were before the injury.

I don't want Duff to fail, I hope he can return to top form and dominate once again.

All I'm saying is that if I were a betting man I'd say it's all downhill from here, with perhaps a few sparks of brilliance from time to time.

If he went to a team with a good header of the ball I think he could still be useful because of his killer crossing ability, but Newcastle don't have that player (Ameobi never plays), and we don't either (although perhaps Walters or Alan Lee could fulfill this role).

Drogba and Duff was a match made in heaven. Put a big man into our squad and Duff's crosses will actually become very important.

[Razors left peg]

Hes played very well for us for a long time now without having the same consistancy in the Premiership, maybe he is just suited to International football better, I think Andy Reid definately is

[eirebhoy]

Hes played very well for us for a long time now without having the same consistancy in the Premiership, maybe he is just suited to International football better, I think Andy Reid definately is
I think with Duff it's a mental thing. With Reid he's just not suited to the British game as many playmakers aren't. That doesn't mean he won't be a success there and I suppose it's probably good that he gets used to playing under constant pressure.

[Colbert Report]

Duff looks slow, unsure and, to be blunt, overweight. Sadly, he's done. He might be worth keeping on the Ireland squad if he's willing to play as a left full back, as we have none other than Kilbane. He was the greatest Irish player since the Charlton years in my opinion - he delivered the goods in every game he played for us up until his big injury.

[Sligo Hornet]

Not sure about Liverpool but it is 100% true that he could have signed for Spurs, who had just finished 5th. A fee was agreed with both clubs, I even think he passed a medical, the fact that he (allegedly) doubled his salary by moving to Newcastle was assumed to be what swung the decision.


I'm sure noone here would choose the exact same position in another company, just because they were offering twice the money :rolleyes:

totally agree...nothing to do with money, after all Michael Owen joined just because of his love of the bracing and rugged North East Coastline;)

[Ozymandias]

as far as I recall ..the fee agreed with newcastle was a cut price deal so duff wouldn't go to liverpool or spurs...the fee that spurs and liverpool were quoted was nearer the 12m at the time this would have meant a pay cut at liverpool and chelsea didn't want him to go to spurs either

that been said he is not the player he was ....but a good preseason could see him back flying fit again next year....don't think it will be with newcastle though

[back of the net]

duff didnt even make the squad of 16 for the birmingham game - keegan is clueless but duffs form does not merit a starting place - every time i have seem him play for keegan he has been poor - the old duffer of a few years ago is gone - he is fastly becoming a very average olayer

[BigmanCas]

I'd still have Duff over the likes of flavour of the moment BigManCas (Aiden McGeady) in the Irish team in a heartbeat irrespective of how he's playing for Newcastle.

Smart talk - more rubbish talk....

[jbyrne]

duff should be judged on his Irish performances only which have always been good. until that changes he should be in the team. playing for newcastle must be a nightmare for any half decent player

[shakermaker1982]

He's not for the scrap heap yet fellas. If he gets a run of games together at Newcastle I'm sure he'll come good.

[tricky_colour]

It seems the decision to drop him was tactical.

http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/nufc/newcastle-united-news/2008/03/18/duo-were-dropped-for-three-pronged-attack-72703-20639688/

[Diarmo]

I think that Duff merits a place in the squad certainly, but maybe give him a rest from being our first choice left winger. Firstly, maybe he needs some focus, which seems to be lacking at Newcastle. To be fair, they have some decent players, but no focus as a team. For Ireland, if Duff was replaced by McGeady or Hunt, it could act as the proverbial kick-up-the-**** he possibly might need. Also, it'd be a good way of rewarding the excellent form McGeady and Hunt are in.

Furthermore, the debate seems to focus on whether to allow club form or Ireland form to govern his selection. I think relying on players whove done it for Ireland in the past is really important, but i think that if a player is playing well at his club, it should spill over into International football. Having said that, in a year I would love to see Duff tearing right backs apart again. A continental move, anyone?

[paul_oshea]

id love to see duff go continental. I definitely agree with EB though about duff, there is something about him, even at the airport in bratislava he is very quiet and reserved, i reckon its all a confidence thing with him, with ireland he seems more relaxed and used to playing well and can therefore deliver...

[irishfan86]

For Ireland, if Duff was replaced by McGeady or Hunt, it could act as the proverbial kick-up-the-**** he possibly might need.

I don't think it's a lack of trying that's keeping him back, it seems to be a lack of pace.

He just can't run past people anymore, he's not physically capable.

I do agree with your point about him going continental though, pace isn't as much of a requirement in some of those leagues.

[Drumcondra 69er]

I don't remember Duff alluding to that at all, but thats not saying that I'm right.

You refer to Duff as lacking ambitio, does Given not have the same lack of ambition?

Duff did more then allude to it he mentioned it right out.

"Duff said on Monday: "A lot of people - Liverpool fans in Ireland - will ask 'why didn't you sign for them?'

"But I just listened to my heart and it told me to come to Newcastle. That's all it is." "

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/foot...ed/5204958.stm

This was discussed on another thread previously but as someone mentioned the reason Duff went to Newcastle was because they matched the wages he was getting at Chelsea. Chelsea wanted a higher fee from Liverpool or Spurs (nearer rivals I assumne) then they accepted from Newcastle so Duff would have had to take a pay cut. He didn't which showed a lack of ambition for me, how much money did he need? He hasn't been the same player recently since his injury, I hope he comes good again.

http://foot.ie/showthread.php?t=40161&page=51

Given won't move because his wife won't leave the area and his brotehr and sister live up there, I think he too could have been more ambitious much as I consider him a legend, Arsenal admired him for years.

[zenokelly]

Don't forget lads that he went out to those games voluntarily in Eastern Europe to be with the team, and paying for the trip out of his own pocket.

I have great respect for that and wish him the best of luck for himself (and Ireland) that he gets back to his early form for Chelsea and WC 2002 form.

However, I have to agree he is finished (hopefully just temporarily)

SPecifically aiming this at Finnpark and Kennedmc

[Kingdom]

Cool D69er I've no problem if people put facts in front of me. I'm not doubting Duffer for Ireland. I've no reason to. He's always done the business for us and until he stops doing so he'll get the credit he deserves for it.

Now what the Irish lads do in their club careers is a different story.:D

[irishfan86]

Don't forget lads that he went out to those games voluntarily in Eastern Europe to be with the team, and paying for the trip out of his own pocket.

I'm a Duff fan and don't question his desire or commitment.

The fact that he went to support the team is fantastic, and I admire that; however, the fact that he paid for it out of his own pocket is about as significant as me tossing some change at a homeless person, considering his wages.

[NeilMcD]

It shows he is a fan and fair play and that he cares but yeah I agree the money bit is irrelevant.

[kennedmc]

Don't forget lads that he went out to those games voluntarily in Eastern Europe to be with the team, and paying for the trip out of his own pocket.

I have great respect for that and wish him the best of luck for himself (and Ireland) that he gets back to his early form for Chelsea and WC 2002 form.

However, I have to agree he is finished (hopefully just temporarily)

SPecifically aiming this at Finnpark and Kennedmc

What are you aiming at me?

I have never questioned Duff attitude, commitment or performances in an Irish shirt.....he has been obviously one of our few oustanding players over the last 10 years.

My point was why he signed for Newcatle in the prime of his career (Not like Given when he was a 20 year old and starting out).

He's only turned 29 and in the right environment he could easily do a job for Ireland for another 3/4 years.

[zenokelly]

Perspective? - as in he had a long lay off so he's only getting back in to it which is fair enough - it might take him until next season to get going again.

One of my beefs with Duff is (please correcrt me if I'm wrong) he had the chance to join Spurs or Liverpool but he chose to join Newcastle :rolleyes:

It seems to me he wasn't up for the challenge and went for the easy option.

Hopefully he'll still be able to do it in a green jersey.


What are you aiming at me?

I have never questioned Duff attitude, commitment or performances in an Irish shirt.....he has been obviously one of our few oustanding players over the last 10 years.

My point was why he signed for Newcatle in the prime of his career (Not like Given when he was a 20 year old and starting out).

He's only turned 29 and in the right environment he could easily do a job for Ireland for another 3/4 years

This to me questions Duff's desire/commitment to the game and I replied by saying about his commitment to go to the Eastby his own accord.

I'm not aiming anything at you.

Maybe I misunderstood your post but I don't think I did

[Razors left peg]

Left out against Bolton today too, bit of a worry although it would be nice to see him leave that joke of a club in the summer

[shakermaker1982]

I have a feeling Keegan will be gone before the Season is out to be honest. His formation is a shambles, you can't play a 3 man midfield with crap like Butt, Geremi and Barton. Fulham to win.

I hope you didn't stick any money on this ;)

[carloz]

I have a feeling Keegan will be gone before the Season is out to be honest. His formation is a shambles, you can't play a 3 man midfield with crap like Butt, Geremi and Barton. Fulham to win.
God the bookies must be really worried of you. Saying a team that hasnt won away from home in nearly 2 years will win today. :rolleyes:

[jmurphyc]

God the bookies must be really worried of you. Saying a team that hasnt won away from home in nearly 2 years will win today. :rolleyes:

:D. Ciaran knows his football, leave him alone.

[danonion]

His career is over - the great Kelvin Koogan dropped him for the win against mighty Fulham.

[Superhoops]

Can see Duff ending up in the Championship next year.Something missing from his game since he came back from injury.

[tricky_colour]

:D. Ciaran knows his football, leave him alone.

Just back against his tips - your'd make a fortune :p:D

[Emmet]

the big clubs have a major say on which clubs they transfer their players to [witness man utd with heinz to liverpool]
perhaps chelsea did not want duff to go to liverpool or spurs and duff may have gained financially by keeping his mouth shut and joining newcastle
That's it exactly. Liverpool and Spurs offered several million pounds more than Newcastle for Duff but Chelsea made it clear to Duff they would keep him in Chelsea's reserves until his contract ran out rather than sell him to a rival club. Freddie Sheppard actually thanked Chelsea at the press conference!

[Emmet]

Duff did more then allude to it he mentioned it right out.

"Duff said on Monday: "A lot of people - Liverpool fans in Ireland - will ask 'why didn't you sign for them?'

"But I just listened to my heart and it told me to come to Newcastle. That's all it is."He's not going to sit there and say "Well - Liverpool was my first choice and Spurs was my second choice but Mourinho said he'd never sell me to either of those so in the end I had no choice but to join Newcastle." That's very likely what he was thinking when he said he was listening to his heart!

People need to look at Heinze and what happened with him. He was desperate to join Liverpool but he couldn't - Man Utd wouldn't allow it. The fee they took from Real Madrid was 'undisclosed' which means it was almost certainly substantially less than what Liverpool offered. Clubs do have a major say on where players go to - Duff was not allowed to join Liverpool or Spurs because Chelsea saw them as their rivals.

The real choice Duff had was - Chelsea's Reserves or Newcastle. In that light I think he made the right decision.

[Razors left peg]

I heard that he had been approached by Valencia too. Surely that would have been ideal?

I think I remember him saying years ago that he doesnt particularly like hot weather so maybe he wouldnt go to Spain because of that

[SkStu]

I think I remember him saying years ago that he doesnt particularly like hot weather so maybe he wouldnt go to Spain because of that

he looks like the sort of lad who soesnt like much except sleeping and chicken fingers.

[endabob1]

He's not going to sit there and say "Well - Liverpool was my first choice and Spurs was my second choice but Mourinho said he'd never sell me to either of those so in the end I had no choice but to join Newcastle." That's very likely what he was thinking when he said he was listening to his heart!

People need to look at Heinze and what happened with him. He was desperate to join Liverpool but he couldn't - Man Utd wouldn't allow it. The fee they took from Real Madrid was 'undisclosed' which means it was almost certainly substantially less than what Liverpool offered. Clubs do have a major say on where players go to - Duff was not allowed to join Liverpool or Spurs because Chelsea saw them as their rivals.

The real choice Duff had was - Chelsea's Reserves or Newcastle. In that light I think he made the right decision.

Again not sure about Liverpool but a £5m fee was deffinitely agreed with Spurs it was on the official website at the time (or maybe just after) but he said his conversations with Carr & Given made him think Newcastle was the better option. Like most people I think he went because Newcastle were offereing him silly money and who would blame him, in reality there's not a huge difference in Class (and I say this as a Spurs fan) between 5th to 15th in the EPL and if someone offered to double my salary I'd be gone in a flash.

[fergalr]

To correct several misconceptions on this thread, this is from an article at the time of the transfer:

Yet if Liverpool's enthusiasm for deploying him on the right was a disincentive to moving to Anfield, Duff simply refused to countenance joining Chelsea's London rivals. "As a Chelsea player I couldn't join Spurs," he reflected, apparently seriously

http://football.guardian.co.uk/News_Story/0,,1828193,00.html

[Drumcondra 69er]

He's not going to sit there and say "Well - Liverpool was my first choice and Spurs was my second choice but Mourinho said he'd never sell me to either of those so in the end I had no choice but to join Newcastle." That's very likely what he was thinking when he said he was listening to his heart!

People need to look at Heinze and what happened with him. He was desperate to join Liverpool but he couldn't - Man Utd wouldn't allow it. The fee they took from Real Madrid was 'undisclosed' which means it was almost certainly substantially less than what Liverpool offered. Clubs do have a major say on where players go to - Duff was not allowed to join Liverpool or Spurs because Chelsea saw them as their rivals

The real choice Duff had was - Chelsea's Reserves or Newcastle. In that light I think he made the right decision.

Why wouldn't he? Heinze wasn't shy about stating he wanted to go to Liverpool? It's common knowledge that Duff would have needed to take a substantial pay cut, Chelsea were prepared to accept an offer from Liverpool that was a lot higher then they got from Newcastle. Totally different to man u not accepting an offer for Heinze. But they were also happy to accept a lower offer from Newcastle to ensure Damo didn't join one of their rivals as that meant Newcastle could bulk up his wages to match his reputed £100k plus per week. At no stage was he given an ultimatum of rotting in the reserves if he didn't go to Newcastle, it's nonsense to suggest so mate.