Oman for Stoke City?

[Steve Bruce]

Personally I feel any team on this island would be at best a league 1 side and I don't think a top League 1 side.

Linfield although playing in an inferior league than the LOI would comfortably compete for the LOI championship(proven in competitive matches against the top LOI Teams) but to say we would live in championship is ludicrus.(sp?)

[OneRedArmy]

Personally I feel any team on this island would be at best a league 1 side and I don't think a top League 1 side.

Linfield although playing in an inferior league than the LOI would comfortably compete for the LOI championship(proven in competitive matches against the top LOI Teams) but to say we would live in championship is ludicrus.(sp?)
Yawn.

[btid1]

Just to add another player to the mix.Stephen Ward was not recognised as a top notch player here but is now a Wolves regular.Wes Hoolahan is another.

I would agree that Drogs,Pats,Cork and possibly Bohs (might struggle) could mix it with the teams in the bottom half of the Championship.

[gustavo]

A year or so I might have agreed but I think the standard here has dropped slightly and I dont think that many would be able to survive in that particualr league , Tbh its annoying seeing this old chestnut being dragged up again , Why should we always look to Britain to compare our own league or look for some kind of validation ?

[btid1]

A year or so I might have agreed but I think the standard here has dropped slightly and I dont think that many would be able to survive in that particualr league , Tbh its annoying seeing this old chestnut being dragged up again , Why should we always look to Britain to compare our own league or look for some kind of validation ?

Fair point but I think the reason I would compare is because like it or not the EPL is probably the top league in Europe at the moment.Three teams in last 4 of CL last year does indicate this is true.

This is largely due to the money swilling around and in that sense any comparision is unfair.

[pineapple stu]

I'm not saying EL teams would win the Championship; I'm not even saying they'd all do well. But I can't believe that our top teams couldn't at least exist in that league somewhere above 22nd place - alongside the Burnleys, Colchesters, Norwich's etc.

We're certainly better than Division 1 standard - which, if you're saying we're not up to the Championship, is the level you're putting us at.
I hate this. We've had what a lot of people are referring to as one of the weakest leagues in recent history this season. Our new champions were held by a Sammarinese team in Europe - and a side making their European debut who qualified by losing the Cup Final at that - and yet you reckon they'd finish above Norwich, Colchester, Burnley in a 46-game season?

You don't bother making any mention of the kind of players these teams have. Colchester, to pick one, have in Aidan Davison, Teddy Sheringham and Kevin Lisbie players far more experienced and able than any in Ireland. But you instead put their name out as to be scoffed at without any sort of attempt to analyse their squad - "Colchester - pffft!"

Norwich have the likes of David Marshall, Darren Huckerby, John Hartson, Jamie Cureton, Dion Dublin, Gary Doherty, John Otsemobor - do you honestly think any eL team could come close to them over a season? You've obviously just looked at a league table and assumed them to be poor based on their position with no other research at all.

The eL does, I think, fight above its weight when you compare it to the level in England of comparative attendances (the Conference, with the top teams being lower Division Three), but to suggest that our top teams would hold their own in a league where only three teams average under 10000 (over three times the best we can offer) and where TV Revenue is far in excess of what we get is nonsense, I'm afraid. Over 46 games, the one-off Cup factor (which we do so well here) would wear off, injuries and suspensions would hit, morale would drop and any side in the top half of the eL would be doing very well to get 20 points over the season.

Obviously some players are good enough to make the jump, and best of luck to them, but to argue that an entire eL club - 20 players in this day and age - would hold their own in a league is nonsense.

Maybe someday people will actually see the eL for what it is - a poor league in the greater scheme of things, but still a highly entertaining and, more importantly, enjoyable competition. Start having delusions of grandeur way above our station like your above post and we're never going to achieve anything of any practical value.

[dcfcsteve]

I hate this. We've had what a lot of people are referring to as one of the weakest leagues in recent history this season. Our new champions were held by a Sammarinese team in Europe - and a side making their European debut who qualified by losing the Cup Final at that - and yet you reckon they'd finish above Norwich, Colchester, Burnley in a 46-game season?

Please show me where I said we'd finish above all those teams.


Norwich have the likes of David Marshall, Darren Huckerby, John Hartson, Jamie Cureton, Dion Dublin, Gary Doherty, John Otsemobor - do you honestly think any eL team could come close to them over a season? You've obviously just looked at a league table and assumed them to be poor based on their position with no other research at all.

Clearly nonesense - as I've stated previously in this thread that I've seen Norwich play in the flesh this season. I've actually seen them twice so far this season (a friend is a Norwich fan) and once last season, plus onmce or twice on Sky. They were extremely average every time I've watched them this season. So - far from it being me who is making lazy assumptions about a team's capabiltiies purely on the basis of their league table position - it's clearly yourself who is the one making lazy assumptions. So much for just looking at a league table.... :rolleyes:

As for the rest of your post, we'll just have to agree to differ.

[Sam_Heggy]

Personally I feel any team on this island would be at best a league 1 side and I don't think a top League 1 side.

Linfield although playing in an inferior league than the LOI would comfortably compete for the LOI championship(proven in competitive matches against the top LOI Teams) but to say we would live in championship is ludicrus.(sp?)

Irish league football at its best:
http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=KYkA6l6MR2c

[pineapple stu]

Please show me where I said we'd finish above all those teams.
Mea culpa - you said our clubs'd finish alongside those teams. My argument still holds.

You also said our clubs'd hold our heads above water and finish above three teams. I'll go through the entire Division One and show that that's not true if you want.



As for the rest of your post, we'll just have to agree to differ.
Fair enough - you can believe what you want obviously. But people believed the earth was flat for centuries despite being an equally implausible argument with equally strong circumstantial evidence against.

I was talking to our club CPO last night, who was talking to Danny Murphy recently. Murphy is the lad who left Cork to join Motherwell last season. Was one of the highest regarded defenders in the eL, but has now been shipped out to Dunfermline in Division One. Murphy was saying that every game in the SPL - even against Gretna or St Mirren - is far tougher than in the eL. Players are simply that bit bigger, that bit stronger, that bit faster than here, and it makes a massive difference.

That mightn't come across as obviously when you watch Norwich once or twice, but it is the reason why no eL club would survive in Division One. I recall Derry going to Paris last year (after an admittedly excellent home result) and getting shoved off it entirely - PSG comfortably won 2-0, could have been more, and that's what'd happen mostentimes if eL sides were in Division One. They'd get a few good results (like the 0-0), but more often it'd be comfortable defeats.

As an aside, where are all the players who made the jump over last season?

Jason Byrne - eL top scorer the past four (?) seasons - scored on his debut for Cardiff, gradually dropped out of view, nowhere near the team now.
Pat Kavanagh - never made it near the Birmingham first team; back with Bray
Danny Murphy - Out of the SPL
Bobby Ryan - ditto
Trevor Molloy - ditto (is he with Airdrie or someone now?)
Paul Keegan - ditto
George O'Callaghan - left Ipswich; is he getting his game for Brighton now? Are they back in Division Two now?

I'm sure there's more. There's some players who do well (Doyle and Long obviously), but more who don't. Again, on the basis that a squad is about 20 players, no eL team would have a hope of surviving in Division One.

Also, look at the players we sign. Joe Gamble came from Barnet when they were in the Conference and became an eL star. Danny Murphy came from non-league and did the same. John O'Flynn came from Peterboro reserves and did the same. There's many more of those.

There's a reason our top players don't make it in the SPL/Premiership/Division One more often than not. There's a reason our top imports come from English non league. We're going to have to face up to the fact that our league is not as good as the English Division One, or the SPL.

I would say top eL teams would be mid table in Division Three. Lower eL teams would be Conference standard.

[MariborKev]

Getting back on topic.

Oman off to PlunderIreland for a trial now.

[lofty9]

Getting back on topic.

Oman off to PlunderIreland for a trial now.


Do you know what happened at the Stoke trial? Was talking to someone who said he had an awful time there.

[Cymro]

Mea culpa - you said our clubs'd finish alongside those teams. My argument still holds.

You also said our clubs'd hold our heads above water and finish above three teams. I'll go through the entire Division One and show that that's not true if you want.



Fair enough - you can believe what you want obviously. But people believed the earth was flat for centuries despite being an equally implausible argument with equally strong circumstantial evidence against.

I was talking to our club CPO last night, who was talking to Danny Murphy recently. Murphy is the lad who left Cork to join Motherwell last season. Was one of the highest regarded defenders in the eL, but has now been shipped out to Dunfermline in Division One. Murphy was saying that every game in the SPL - even against Gretna or St Mirren - is far tougher than in the eL. Players are simply that bit bigger, that bit stronger, that bit faster than here, and it makes a massive difference.

That mightn't come across as obviously when you watch Norwich once or twice, but it is the reason why no eL club would survive in Division One. I recall Derry going to Paris last year (after an admittedly excellent home result) and getting shoved off it entirely - PSG comfortably won 2-0, could have been more, and that's what'd happen mostentimes if eL sides were in Division One. They'd get a few good results (like the 0-0), but more often it'd be comfortable defeats.

As an aside, where are all the players who made the jump over last season?

Jason Byrne - eL top scorer the past four (?) seasons - scored on his debut for Cardiff, gradually dropped out of view, nowhere near the team now.
Pat Kavanagh - never made it near the Birmingham first team; back with Bray
Danny Murphy - Out of the SPL
Bobby Ryan - ditto
Trevor Molloy - ditto (is he with Airdrie or someone now?)
Paul Keegan - ditto
George O'Callaghan - left Ipswich; is he getting his game for Brighton now? Are they back in Division Two now?

I'm sure there's more. There's some players who do well (Doyle and Long obviously), but more who don't. Again, on the basis that a squad is about 20 players, no eL team would have a hope of surviving in Division One.

Also, look at the players we sign. Joe Gamble came from Barnet when they were in the Conference and became an eL star. Danny Murphy came from non-league and did the same. John O'Flynn came from Peterboro reserves and did the same. There's many more of those.

There's a reason our top players don't make it in the SPL/Premiership/Division One more often than not. There's a reason our top imports come from English non league. We're going to have to face up to the fact that our league is not as good as the English Division One, or the SPL.

I would say top eL teams would be mid table in Division Three. Lower eL teams would be Conference standard.

O'Callaghan is a fairly regular starter/substitute for Brighton, and yes they are in League One.

I agree totally with what you're saying, but comparing it to the earth being flat is a bit extreme.

[Mad Moose]

An O'Callaghan has been pretty much a star on loan at the Sussex club this season.

That division might be his limit too.

[Raheny Red]

Do you know what happened at the Stoke trial? Was talking to someone who said he had an awful time there.

Yeah read that myself, anyone know what happened exactly?

[SunderlandBohs]

Oman starting a week trial with us at the AOL today. It's kind of Keane's policy to have a look of players who are out of contract like Kiki Mustampa, John Pelter & Samuel Kuffour. There is certainly players in the League good enough for the championship more so League 1. The success rate of players making in England & Scotland is the best its every been. I'm not sure the likes of Bohs, Drogs, Pat's would be good enough to stay in the Championship, maybe hanging around the bottom six, but the standard of the League is just as good as League 1 or the SPL. I'd be more than confident those three could hold there own or even be challenging the for the play-offs.

[Aaron]

Yeah read that myself, anyone know what happened exactly?

Apparently in training they used him as a striker so he decided to sack it and return to Derry

[CollegeTillIDie]

Most of George O'Callaghan's difficulties are his bad attitude. In terms of talent and ability he is up there. Seems to thrive where he is one of the big fish in a relatively smaller pond!