UEFA Coefficient

[JC_GUFC]

It's that time of the year again when myself, the UCD fans and a few other nerds get excited about the UEFA Coefficient.

In tonight's CL games only 2 seeded teams out of 7 won.

Lithuania are ranked just above us and their champions lost at the Montenegran team, so a win for Derry tomorrow would put us ranked above them already and up to the dizzying heights of 33rd in Europe!
The Latvian (29) champions lost in Wales and the Finnish (31) champions had a late winner coming from behind to win in San Marino.

Linfield's draw was a good result but the Kazakh champions got a draw away from home and with TNS winning there are only 6 leagues worse ranked, one of them being Montenegro as they have no rating.

A move up to 33rd for the eL would probably guarantee both clubs being seeded in the UEFA Cup.

[mattl]

Yeah there is plenty of scope for improvement in our ranking based on those results. Our aim this year should be to get at least 2 more co-efficient points and get all 3 teams seeded going forward. This could realistically be achieved from the following results:

Derry QR1: 2 Wins (2)
Drogheda QR1: 2 Wins (2)
Pats QR1: 1 Draw (.5)

Derry QR2: 2 Losses (0)
Drogheda QR2: 1 Win and 1 Draw (1.5)

Drogheda Round 1: 1 Draw (1)

= 7 Points => Coefficient of 2.333

This is surely a realistic target to aim for?

[Dodge]

Askng a lot for Drogheda to get a win and a draw in the second round and for Derry to get 2 wins in the first.

I'd expect Derry to win at home and Drogs to win both legs. If Derry qualify they'll more than likely get nothing from Donetsk and a lot depends on Drogheda's draw. If they get Dunfermeline we could be laughing but there a fair few high profile teams ahead of the Scots.

If Pats get anything it'd be a bonus. Don't want to be Mr Doom & Gloom but I wouldn't be expecting massive things

[JC_GUFC]

Agreed, you can't really expect Drogs to qualify for the 1st round proper of the UEFA Cup. Derry were fortunate that they drew Gretna but there's a chance that Drogs will be drawn against the English UEFA Cup team (Blackburn is it?) otherwise it will be a Scandanavian team.

[Dodge]

The won't get the English UEFA cup team but may get the Intertoto qualifier. Top seeds in the 2nd qualifying round will be OB Odense, Standard Liège, Vålerengen IF and Dunfermline (if OB and Valerengen qualify)

http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/seeduc2007.html

[JC_GUFC]

Sorry, that should have been Intertoto team.

With a bit of luck they'll be drawn against Dunfermline or a Swedish team.

<Edit>
Actually it looks as if all the Swedish teams will be unseeded too.

[Dodge]

They'll be seeded if one or two unseeded teams win in the first round. Guess which unseeded team I want to win?

[JC_GUFC]

They'll be seeded if one or two unseeded teams win in the first round. Guess which unseeded team I want to win?

SP Libetad?! ;)

[bigmac]

2 points is a good target to have every year - if we could get up to having a running total of around 10, then we'd be comfortably inside the top 30 and good years could step us up a bit further. I think that last year was a very good year, and probably won't be repeated this year, so our target should be to move up a few places to get both teams seeded in the UEFA. This year's draw mroe than ever shows the importance of seeding. It's also possible that it will be more difficult to be seeded next year if Belarus and San Marino aren't moved into the Northern division.

It won't be easy though, Finland are only dropping .33 off their coefficent this year, and they are the next team above us in the Northern division. Lithuania are definitely catchable if results go well, so here's hoping.

[Dodge]

SP Libetad?! ;)

Well you got the San bit right even if its a different language)

[mattl]

I know it's expecting a lot, but this is what we should be aiming for. I'd be very disappointed if one team didn't get to the third round. We've done it the last three years in a row remember - Shels in 2004, Cork in 2005 and Derry in 2006. They all reached the 1st Round of the Uefa Cup remember.

But as you all said, a lot depends on the draw.

[Cymro]

I think the draw has not been kind to Irish clubs this year whereas last year it was. Getting Odense in the first round of the UEFA Cup compared to getting Gretna in the second round are the two extremes of the luck of the draw.

Considering the draw, Drogheda are the only team you'd expect to get through the first round without fail. Derry should get through, but a lot depends on the result they get tonight, and if they do get through against Pyunik, the chances of beating Shakhtar Donetsk are pretty slim.

[mattl]

Don't forget though the inital draw last year was quite tricky.

Derry had Goteborg and very few if any thought they would progress.

Likewise Cork had APOEL Nicosia in the CL who were one of the top seeds.

It was only Drogheda who had a draw that was easy enough, but even then Drogs were unproven at European level and people were unsure if they would pull a Longford or not.

I think overall the draw is On Par with last years at this stage.

[paul_oshea]

I think overall the draw is On Par with last years at this stage.

gretna are not as good as donetsk, i know different competitions but still. Didnt donetsk hammer celtic only a couple of seasons ago....i know it was almost overturned in the return leg but still.

[Dodge]

But thats the 2nd round of the CL qualifiers, the same round Cork got Red Star Belgrade (shove your serbian spelling up your arse!) so its pretty equivalent

[Real ale Madrid]

gretna are not as good as donetsk, i know different competitions but still. Didnt donetsk hammer celtic only a couple of seasons ago....i know it was almost overturned in the return leg but still.



That was Artmedia Bratislava i think.

[DmanDmythDledge]

gretna are not as good as donetsk, i know different competitions but still. Didnt donetsk hammer celtic only a couple of seasons ago....i know it was almost overturned in the return leg but still.
Yeah (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/europe/3753356.stm). Also they've just signed Lucarelli from Livorno, who has been the top scorer in the Serie A over the past 3 seasons.

[JC_GUFC]

Didnt donetsk hammer celtic only a couple of seasons ago....i know it was almost overturned in the return leg but still.

Funny thing was people were surprised at that result. The funniest result in Europe was when Artmedia beat Celtic 5-0! :eek:

[GavinZac]

Likewise Cork had APOEL Nicosia in the CL who were one of the top seeds.
pedantic i know, but it was Apollon Limmasol

[paul_oshea]

ya but in that one celtic won at home 4 - 0 or something like that jufc, whereas shankestar beat them convincgly. and that was basically 5 stupid mistakes in that game, like the wales one against slovakia ( funnily enough )

[sfc red]

That was Artmedia Bratislava i think.

Too right it was. Same night we drew 0-0 with Steaua

"Let's all laugh at Celtic..." - great night :D

[Dodge]

End result of those ties; Celtic out, Shels out.

happy days all round

[paul_oshea]

Too right it was. Same night we drew 0-0 with Steaua


i remember watching that match alright in the stockwell palace ( like many EL teams european matches :D cheers steve), and i remember feeling the same frustration i felt anytime i went to watch an EL match live and on tele.....didnt byrne the dope miss a sitter when the tie was still open, i think it was just before half time, like that CB for cork last week that missed an easy header against the hammer-biys. Anyhow they always seem to miss ( relatively simple/too many chances just like robbie keane needs 3 chances to score 1 :D) that they need to put away, that they would probably score in a normal EL match ( or maybe not ), ah well i spose thats where the inexperience comes in......could be again related back to teams getting further and more experience in europe benefiting the league as well. :)

[pineapple stu]

Well, we've equalled five years ago anyways. Moldovan side won, so we're both tied with Lithuania (or technically 0.001 gaps all around), not that it makes any difference anyways as Moldova aren't in our UEFA Cup section and we're both seeded in the CL. Bosnian side won as well. Finnish side got a late winner to win 2-1 in San Marino. Useless rejects! :)

[LeixlipRed]

Too right it was. Same night we drew 0-0 with Steaua

"Let's all laugh at Celtic..." - great night :D

I'd forgotten all about that. Remember being at the game getting a text saying Celtic were 4 down and then the chant starting up. Fun times. And PAul, Byrne did miss a sitter in that game. Managed to score a goal from a far more difficult position in the away leg though. Not that having 17 players sent off just after it kinda ruined our chances :D

[paul_oshea]

And PAul, Byrne did miss a sitter in that game. Managed to score a goal from a far more difficult position in the away leg though. Not that having 17 players sent off just after it kinda ruined our chances

ya he got thad downward header i think was it? cant fully remember but i remember thinking how did the flute get that one and miss the sitter, i thought he must have meant to miss it too and it ended up going in :D

[sfc red]

I'd forgotten all about that. Remember being at the game getting a text saying Celtic were 4 down and then the chant starting up. Fun times. And PAul, Byrne did miss a sitter in that game. Managed to score a goal from a far more difficult position in the away leg though. Not that having 17 players sent off just after it kinda ruined our chances :D

At least the 17 players who got sent off had 17 other Fenlon signings up in the stand to console them :p

[pineapple stu]

Update after the first legs - we're up to joint 33rd (http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method3/crank2008.html), having ended last year in 35th.

San Marino and Andorra have their first ever non-defeat in European football.

[higgins]

0.500 is awful ...
2 Home games and an away leg to San Marino!!

Looks like we'll do well to get 1 point this season

[pete]

0.500 is awful ...
2 Home games and an away leg to San Marino!!

Looks like we'll do well to get 1 point this season

Drogs should be on a Crimes Against Coefficient list ;)

Last years total was not likely to be matched but 1.5 would have done to keep the momentum. Looking for lucky Drogs 2nd round draw to gain points now.

[Dodge]

This weeks European results in my view fits in with what many people are thinking, that the league has dropped in standard this year.

Derry are 7th this year so they've droppd. Odense is the highest ranked team any Irish side has faced in UEFA Cup in years (bar PSG and Nantes in the later rounds). Only drogheda disappointed

[OneRedArmy]

0.500 is awful ...
2 Home games and an away leg to San Marino!!

Looks like we'll do well to get 1 point this seasonNothing like a bit of overreaction is there?

We probably overachieved slightly last year and its a slight underachievement so far this season. Nothing more, nothing less.

Pats got a stinker of a draw and how your could view their result as awful is beyond me. Glentoran's result last night, now that was awful!

Derry and Drogs both disappointed slightly, but we aren't going to increase the annual coefficient every year. Its the 5 year trend thats important and yet again we are getting dragged into overanalysis of individual results.

Anyway, its not like European football is going to be impacting your club anytime soon so you have nothing to worry about for the next few years.

[swinfordfc]

Lads,

we loss .166 and already we have .5 this year to replace it so relax would be a word i would used - but in fairest derry and st pats did well - drogs result was poor - all we need is derry to get a score draw over there! - its not impossible!

[dcfcsteve]

Drogs should be on a Crimes Against Coefficient list ;)



Longford are the nominated Irish entrants for that particular list.... :D

And they took over the slot from Pats

[bigmac]

Just as a pointless bit of information - had Ireland been ahead of Finland this year (i.e. both teams seeded in UEFA), then Drogs would be playing a Luxembourg team, and Pats would be playing Rhyl.

[Dr.Nightdub]

See, that's how co-efficient-itis can warp people's thinking. If you were going abroad to support your team, would you rather get the ferry to Holyhead or a flight to Copenhagen?

[kdjaC]

See, that's how co-efficient-itis can warp people's thinking. If you were going abroad to support your team, would you rather get the ferry to Holyhead or a flight to Copenhagen?

On last nights evidence, bus up north to Glentoran :D


kdjac

[TonyD]

And they took over the slot from Pats

Christ, you lose ONE poxy tie 10-0 :o

[Gareth]

To contine the run of good form in Europe, we really need two out of three teams to progress. Hopefully Pats can pull of a super score draw or a 1-0 win, Drogs must manage some form of result 0-0 or a win. And well Derry, I hope they manage something but well, away trips can be unpleasant. Fingers crossed. Lets all pray to our collective gods that we get 3 wins and that will set us up nice :)

[GavinZac]

Lets all pray to our collective gods that we get 3 wins
Flynny's cup tied.

[HolylandsMan]

I think Donetsk beat Celtic 3-0 at home in the Champs League Group stages (Milan and Barca were also in the group I think). If my memory serves me correctly, Celtic beat them 1-0 at home.

Don't realistically think Derry can match Donetsk over two legs but you never know. The important thing is to get the result Wednesday night which will be hugely difficult in itself.

[paul_oshea]

holy thats right that was the score

[eirebhoy]

I think Donetsk beat Celtic 3-0 at home in the Champs League Group stages (Milan and Barca were also in the group I think). If my memory serves me correctly, Celtic beat them 1-0 at home.

Don't realistically think Derry can match Donetsk over two legs but you never know. The important thing is to get the result Wednesday night which will be hugely difficult in itself.
Shaktaar are a fantastic team. Derry would probably be destroyed over there if they get through.

[paul_oshea]

ya they are almost as fantastic as ac milan.

[eirebhoy]

ya they are almost as fantastic as ac milan.
I'm sure there's a few fantastic players in the LOI. Anyway, Shaktaar will be the biggest test a LOI will have in years imho. Mainly because they wouldn't underestimate the opposition as much as, say, Valencia.

btw, paul - "gretna are not as good as donetsk". :D Seriously? ;) Look at their squad list. They sold Tymoschuk for around €10m recently but got in Lucarelli and have some excellent players. They're still better than Celtic anyway.

[LeixlipRed]

Lucarelli must be getting on in years though? Seems to have been an ever present in Serie A for over a decade. How would donetsk compare to Steau of 2005 or Depor of 2004 even?

[Terry]

Was just wondering, where would we have to end up in the coefficient table so we would have 4 teams entering into european competitions?

On this years results so far, what swinford said is correct. We lost .166 at the start and already have .500. If we continue each year improving points wise than what we are lossing, we will continue to climb the table. Some people think we should be jumping 8 or 10 places each year, which is completely unrealistic.

[pete]

There are been higher standards set in recent years. Suggestion 0.5 is good because its replacing 0.166 is hopeless logic. The Draws by Pats & Derry were somewhat expected but Drogs drawing in San Marino was pathetic. :eek:

[Dodge]

There are been higher standards set in recent years. Suggestion 0.5 is good because its replacing 0.166 is hopeless logic. The Draws by Pats & Derry were somewhat expected but Drogs drawing in San Marino was pathetic. :eek:

Can't see how anyone could expect Pats to get a draw. I expected the other two to win though

[pete]

Can't see how anyone could expect Pats to get a draw. I expected the other two to win though

Somewhat expected as in not a huge surprise or shock.