Ireland U21 vs England U21 in Turners Cross!

[Shelsman]

Great news:

http://www.fai.ie/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2089

Now how can I get a ticket? Go to one of the league games before?

[bwagner]

I think we could get beat in all games

[The Legend]

I think we could get beat in all games

Nothing like good 'ol fashioned irish optimism!:rolleyes:

[cheifo]

Hard to remember who will be eligible for these games.Problem is that a lot of the players will be in the senior squad but if the likes of O halleron,O Dea, Andy Keogh and Darren Gibson are playing then we wont be too bad.Saw Englands squad for the forthcoming Euro champs and I have to say I will be impressed if someone beats them.

[endabob1]

.Saw Englands squad for the forthcoming Euro champs and I have to say I will be impressed if someone beats them.

With Stuart Pearce in charge?? A lot of their players are over-hyped I'll be very surprised if they win it

[youngirish]

Hard to remember who will be eligible for these games.Problem is that a lot of the players will be in the senior squad but if the likes of O halleron,O Dea, Andy Keogh and Darren Gibson are playing then we wont be too bad.Saw Englands squad for the forthcoming Euro champs and I have to say I will be impressed if someone beats them.

England have a sh*te record at youth level. Their youth teams are overhyped mediocrity like their senior teams. If Givens wasn't in charge we should beat them.

[Stuttgart88]

They have some good players, some that would get into our first XI even, David Bentley & Tom Huddlestone for example. Their left back (whoever he is) too :)

They deservedly beat Germany to qualify.

However, as England always always do, they are forgetting that at least 6 other European countries have a really good crop of U21s too!

[cavan_fan]

England have a sh*te record at youth level. Their youth teams are overhyped mediocrity like their senior teams. If Givens wasn't in charge we should beat them.

They have certainly got better players than we have, especially as they are less likely to have to call their good players up to the senior squad. On the other hand player quality doesnt necessarily precit success.

[cavan_fan]

By the way this is England squad, I've highlighted those I think would get in our senior squad

England U21 squad: Alnwick (Tottenham), Carson (Liverpool), Hart (Man City); Baines (Wigan), Cahill (Aston Villa), Ferdinand (West Ham), Hoyte (Arsenal), Onuoha (Man City), Rosenior (Fulham), Taylor (Newcastle), Whittingham (Cardiff); Bentley (Blackburn), Huddlestone (Tottenham), Milner (Newcastle), Noble (West Ham), Reo-Coker (West Ham), Richardson (Man Utd), Routledge (Tottenham); Derbyshire (Blackburn), Lita (Reading), Nugent (Preston), Vaughan (Everton), Young (Aston Villa)

[pateen]

think the last time Ireland played England at this level in turners cross, Alan Shearer scored.
Remember seen some footage of this a few years ago.

Anyone recall this? 1989 I think was the year

[Dr. Ogba]

You were doing so well until this.....


Richardson (Man Utd),

[cavan_fan]

You were doing so well until this.....

I was thinking he could take Douglas' place!

[youngirish]

Isn't Richardson about 24? England are fielding bangers.

Btw Lita is better than Nugent (typical English overhyped mediocrity) and Derbyshire and half those players you mentioned are no better than our poorer dross that's in the senior squad already.

Ashley Young - 9 million. Joke. If he was an Irish U21 you wouldn't get 9K for him.

[Ordinary Fan]

Cahill and Noble turned down the opportunity of playing for Ireland.

We never do well at U21 because of our smaller playing pool. Anyone who is good at that level generally plays for the full team. If Given wanted to be more successful he would play games to suit the players available but his mandate is to identify players for the full team.
Looking at the number of current and previous u21's he has not done to bad for a plonker.

[Manc Irish Wolf]

I couldn't give a monkeys how good their individuals are - I have been hearing the same old 5hite over here for years. The strength of the Irish team/people/spirit always has and always be that the sum is greater than the parts (I don't care if that sounds like sentimental rubbish - it's true). The fact of the matter is that this country is torn apart by having no unified national mentality - speak to most clubs fans and they'd prefer their club to better than their national team - that's why they will never be as strong as us. Ferdinand? Cahill? Reo-Coker? Sack having any of their players - give me O'Dea, O'Halloran, and Potter any day. Totally believe in the Keane mentality - if you fight hard enough any one can be beaten.

[cavan_fan]

Isn't Richardson about 24? England are fielding bangers.

Btw Lita is better than Nugent (typical English overhyped mediocrity) and Derbyshire and half those players you mentioned are no better than our poorer dross that's in the senior squad already.

Ashley Young - 9 million. Joke. If he was an Irish U21 you wouldn't get 9K for him.

Nugent wil be a quality forward he's the best player in that squad. Lita is as good as he'll ever be, which is OK.The point is that many of these players would be getting us v excited if Irish, for example compare Steven Taylor and Darren O'Dea.

On the otbher hand I hve no idea why MO'N paid 9 million for Ashley Young, the money must have been burning a hole in his pocket.

[Qwerty]

When was the last time England won a Euro or World championship at any level?

[Stuttgart88]

Gerry Francis: England's culture of failure

After a lifetime in football, it was only recently that the author realised how far behind the national team are when it comes to preparing for internationals Published: 05 June 2007

I have been in football all my life. My dad was a pro, I captained England as a player and have managed in all four divisions. Despite all that experience, what I found over the last four months working with the England Under-19s opened my eyes.

Tomorrow, England's senior team are away to Estonia. Lose and we probably will not make the European Championship finals. Even if we get to the finals, history shows we are unlikely to win. That is not a dig at Steve McClaren - the problems go deeper than who is the England manager at any given time, much deeper.

When I started playing professionally, in 1968, England were world champions. We have rarely looked like winning a major tournament since and, after my experience of the international youth set-up, I will be surprised if we ever do again.

It was in February when Trevor Brooking, the Football Association's director of football development and a former England team-mate of mine, asked me to have a look at the Under-19s. He wanted me to consider the whole picture, both by giving Brian Eastick, the coach, hands-on support, and by examining the structure. I was involved with a series of friendlies and then, last month, the qualifying tournament for the European Under-19s Championship. This was staged in England. If you did not realise they took place, that is no surprise to me.

The first thing that struck me was the impossibility of preparing a side for the one-off matches the way you would at club level. There simply is not time to develop patterns of play. The squad you pick is not the one that turns up and you have one day to work with them. You are just throwing a team together.

Despite this, the team went into the tournament unbeaten all season, having played some good opposition. Confidence was very high. We had some fine players, including Everton's James Vaughan, Michael Johnson of Manchester City, Giles Barnes of Derby, Fabrice Muamba, who at the time was on loan at Birmingham from Arsenal and has now moved permanently, and Adam Hammill, the Liverpool striker who has been on loan to Dunfermline. And that is without those players who have moved up a level or two, like Micah Richards, Theo Walcott and Lee Cattermole. I had no doubt that if we had a full squad available, we would qualify for the finals and have a good chance of winning them.It did not work out like that. We lost to the Netherlands and Russia and, though we beat the Czechs, we will not be at next month's finals. Why?

The first problem was the timing. The qualifying tournament clashed with the Football League play-offs. That should have been thought through. It cost us half a dozen players, including Barnes.

Then there was the "injury" list. Eleven players were described by their clubs as "injured". Some, like Chelsea's Scott Sinclair obviously were. A number of other players, however, had played for their clubs on the last weekend of the season but were unavailable for the Under-19s. One we particularly missed, because we already had several strikers out, was Vaughan, who had been scoring regularly and playing well for us. I see he has been called up for this month's European Under-21s Championship finals.

Having been a manager for 17 years, I do understand the managers' viewpoints. It is their jobs on the line and I was always anxious when my players went away on international duty. But as a former England player I would never stop a player from representing his country. I know how exciting it is.

When it came to the friendlies, I think Brian, and the other age-group coaches, can and should accept the club comes first. You have too little time to work on the team anyway. But tournament football is unique. The players are away as a group and playing a series of pressurised matches in a short time. Penalty shoot-outs often feature. There is no substitute for experience when it comes to such situations.

We are handicapping our senior team by not making the most of the opportunities for them to gain that experience when younger. If we were qualifying for, and winning, these tournaments, at the age of 18, 19, and 21, players would go into the senior competitions with the belief that comes from having done it before. There is a difference between thinking you can do something, and knowing you can. Players need to develop that winning mentality. I felt very sorry for Brian, his staff, and the boys, who had worked so hard throughout the year that, with so many players missing, they were not able to show what they were capable of.

It is less of a problem at Under-17s, the age group at which we recently reached the European final - because those players are not involved in first-team squads. But at the later, crucial ages, we do not put out our best teams. It is ludicrous. People look at the results and say, "The kids are not good enough". They are, if we could only play our best players. The likes of Richards, Walcott and Cattermole, for example, once they have played Under-21s, are not deemed to be available for the Under-19s. Why not? Playing for them in a tournament, and possibly winning, would be good for their international education. On the same basis, consideration should have been given to playing Wayne Rooney - who is not involved with England in Estonia as he is suspended - in the Under-21s tournament. It should not be degrading to go back down a level.

The outlook is very different elsewhere. Countries like France and Italy, and on the world scene Brazil and Argentina, regularly play their top players in these tournaments and are very successful. The benefits are then felt at senior level.

It would be really beneficial to our international game to ensure we play the best sides in competitive matches. It would build our reputation internationally and give the kids that winning mentality. If they can handle it as teenagers, they will be prepared for it later on. The FA appears wary of standing up to clubs on the issue. It needs to, for the benefit of future England teams.

Italy demonstrate value of youthful experience

By Glenn Moore

The Italian squad who won the 2006 World Cup was a tournament-hardened group. More than a dozen of the party had won the European Under-21 Championship, a biennial tournament won by Italy in 1992, 1994, 2000 and 2004.

Such a statistic underlines the value of taking Uefa's age-group tournaments seriously. England have rarely done so. In various formats there have been 46 tournaments involving the three championships, currently U17, U19 and U21, in the last two decades. England have won one - the 1993 Under-18 Championship, hosted in England.

Robbie Fowler was the tournament's top scorer, with five goals. Darren Caskey, whose subsequent career was somewhat less notable, scored the only goal of the final in which England beat Turkey at the City Ground. Julian Joachim was the star while Gary Neville, Nicky Butt, Paul Scholes and Sol Campbell also figured.

The most successful country in this period has been Spain, with 10 victories, followed by Italy and Portugal with seven, and France with six. Spain regularly blow up in tournaments but the other three nations account for six of the eight appearances by European teams in World Cup and European Championship finals during the past decade.

http://sport.independent.co.uk/football/comment/article2614558.ece

[endabob1]

Good article

It's interesting how players do and don't develop, Darren Caskey has spent most of his career in the lower & non-leagues

He is now playing in the Conference North for my local side Kettering Town

[youngirish]

I couldn't give a monkeys how good their individuals are - I have been hearing the same old 5hite over here for years. The strength of the Irish team/people/spirit always has and always be that the sum is greater than the parts (I don't care if that sounds like sentimental rubbish - it's true). The fact of the matter is that this country is torn apart by having no unified national mentality - speak to most clubs fans and they'd prefer their club to better than their national team - that's why they will never be as strong as us. Ferdinand? Cahill? Reo-Coker? Sack having any of their players - give me O'Dea, O'Halloran, and Potter any day. Totally believe in the Keane mentality - if you fight hard enough any one can be beaten.
All that rubbish about Ireland doing well (in the past) because of their great team spirit is a load of old English media nonsense sh*te. We were good in the past because we had good players. On the flipside England players have never been as good as their media likes to make out otherwise they'd have a decent record in International tournaments and not consistently fail to get beyond the quarter final stages. They have a sh*t record in youth tournaments also.

Ferdinand and Taylor? Mainstays of two of the worst defences in the Premiership last year. 2 overrated donkeys (actually is Steven Taylor even rated by anyone?). Nugent? 15 goals in 40 odd appearances for a team chasing promotion in the Championship? How does that make him one of the best prospects in Britain? Answer it doesn't but he's English so he's hyped up to ridiculous levels anyway. He's average at best. I'd rate Stokes as being way better potentially yet you don't hear much about him in the British media.

[Stuttgart88]

All that rubbish about Ireland doing well (in the past) because of their great team spirit is a load of old English media nonsense sh*te.
Couldn't agree more. Their default response to any good Irish performance is "great passion". Equally their default response to a bad English performance is "there was no passion" when actually they weren't good enough.

[youngirish]

Couldn't agree more. Their default response to any good Irish performance is "great passion". Equally their default response to a bad English performance is "there was no passion" when actually they weren't good enough.

The typical example to how biased the English media are for me is demonstrated by reading the tabloid rags over here (I know I should have more sense but I was bored) before the World Cup ridiculous, totally unrealistic claims that Ashely Cole was one of the best fullbacks in the world and Paul Robinson was one of the best goalkeepers in the Premiership. Paul Robinson is absolute garbage. I could list 15 better goalkeepers than him in the Premiership.

As for Ashley Cole? Arsenal had their best run defensively for years in the champions league last season before they played Barcelona in the final. I think they only conceeded one goal in 9 games or so. Ashely Cole was injured but came back for the final where they were beaten 2-1. Coincidence? Possibly but then he joined Chelsea the team with the best defence in the league two seasons running. This year they've been rubbish defensively. Ashley Cole is a poor player. I can't see what he offers a team. He can't cross the ball, doesn't score, can't pass very well, isn't great defensively (average at best) and is poor in the air. He does run up and down like a headless chicken though and is English so he must be good. Saying that he is better than JOS but that's hardly a glowing endorsement.

[Stuttgart88]

The typical example to how biased the English media are for me is demonstrated by reading ...totally unrealistic claims that Ashely Cole was one of the best fullbacks in the world and Paul Robinson was one of the best goalkeepers in the Premiership.

Where did you geat "one of the best" from? He was categorically THE best.

As for Robinson, the guy is a great reflex shot stopper and a superb ball kicker, though when he does parry the ball, 50% of the time it goes staright back into play.

However, give him a second to think and he's awful. He's the type of 'keeper the English ridiculed when I was growing up, a flashy shotstopper who'll flap & punch instead of catching (first goal in Croatia anyone?), the antithesis to the cool, measured & commanding goalkeeper they used to have in abundance.

Whatevever about the backpass in Croatia, how he got away with the first goal without his reputation in tatters is beyond me.

In the early 1990s there was a trivia challenge doing the rounds, to name 10 foreign keepers to have played in the Premiership / first divsion. Smeichel & Srnicek were exceptions. Now anyone under 16 would struggle to name 10 English keepers to have played in the top flight!

By the way, Beckham is the best wide midfielder in the world again, in case you hadn't noticed.

[youngirish]

Stutts, Robinson is a young David James all over again. Makes great saves every now and then but flaps at crosses, consistently makes mistakes and never seems to cut out any of the goals that he really should be expected to prevent. I think he's very poor. Foster is their best goalkeeper at the moment but he's not on the media radar at the moment so he's not in the English squad. Once he gets there he will automatically be promoted from nowhere to being the best goalkeeper on earth.

Oh yeah nearly forgot. Stephen Gerrard has consistently been the best midfielder in the world for the past 5 years. That Zidane fella was a load of old cobblers, wasn't he? They never learn.

[Pablo]

Great to see the Cross get these gams. Its now the best Soccer Ground in the country while Lansdowne is Closed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XutcEGTtxZI&e

Video from last weekends Cork City V Derry game of the newest stand.

[Paddy Garcia]

All that rubbish about Ireland doing well (in the past) because of their great team spirit is a load of old English media nonsense sh*te.

I don't agree.. at all. A never say die attitude was really important to our past success. Players were far more committed to the shirt than their counterparts in England. Even those who for years travelled around just to warm the bench.

The fact that the English media used this to undermine (& I agree they did) our success does not mean that we should feel we have to deny it.



We were good in the past because we had good players.

Totally agree with this. Don't though knock the passion - even Stan recognised its importance during Jack's reign.

[youngirish]

I don't agree.. at all. A never say die attitude was really important to our past success. Players were far more committed to the shirt than their counterparts in England. Even those who for years travelled around just to warm the bench.

The fact that the English media used this to undermine (& I agree they did) our success does not mean that we should feel we have to deny it.



Totally agree with this. Don't though knock the passion - even Stan recognised its importance during Jack's reign.

Never did deny it but it wasn't as important to us as the fact that we had very good players many of whom would have walked into the English International teams at the time. Passion and pride alone gets you nothing you need the players first and the passion and pride is the icing on the cake. San Marino play with passion and pride.

[geysir]

Great to see the Cross get these gams. Its now the best Soccer Ground in the country while Lansdowne is Closed.
Looks good, I don't think the seats will get too much wear.
Isn't the pitch size a good way on the small side?

[NeilMcD]

I would say that pride and passion are your starting point. As Johnny Giles says, your work ethic should be your starting point and from there you go about getting your players to play in a constructive manner.

[Risteard]

Yes.
A good thing imo entertainment-wise but doesn't suit Ricos football.

[Paddy Garcia]

Never did deny it but it wasn't as important to us as the fact that we had very good players many of whom would have walked into the English International teams at the time. Passion and pride alone gets you nothing you need the players first and the passion and pride is the icing on the cake. San Marino play with passion and pride.

Yeah I agree, great players actually.

[Pablo]

Looks good, I don't think the seats will get too much wear.
Isn't the pitch size a good way on the small side?

It used to be quite small. Thats why it used to be called "The Box" Its been extended over the years though while the various stands were being built. Its about average now, certainly not a big pitch Like Dalymount though.