GAA will have to pay the players "expenses"

[Dodge]

GAA unhappy with Minister's welfare stance
Thursday, 26 April 2007 21:09

Minister for Sport John O'Donoghue met with the GAA and the GPA today to discuss the joint GAA-GPA submission on player welfare support.

The submission was issued in response to the Association's request for clarification on the matter but had failed to take account of the Minister's position as it was set out in recent correspondence with the GAA.

The Minister has requested the GAA to submit a proposal which recognizes his position on the matter.

Minister O'Donoghue said: 'I have reiterated my position that the Department does not intend to provide direct funding to meet the costs of either direct grants to GAA players or of player welfare policies as the knock-on effects of such an arrangement across all other sports would be detrimental to sports development.

'Responsibility for player welfare issues rests with the GAA in the same manner as similar player welfare issues in other sports must be dealt with by the responsible National Governing Body of Sport.

'I have indicated that I am prepared to make funding available, on an annual basis, which will facilitate the GAA in freeing up existing monies within the Association to meet the additional costs of agreed player welfare supports in the event that an agreement is reached between the GAA and the GPA on the issue of additional player welfare supports.'

The GPA were satisfied with the Minister's stance on the situation.

They stated: 'The Minister's position, that he is prepared to 'make funding available, on an annual basis, which will facilitate the GAA in freeing up existing monies within the Association to meet the additional costs of agreed player welfare supports in the event that an agreement is reached between the GAA and the GPA on the issue of additional player welfare supports,' is wholly consistent with his position on the matter thus far.'

However, the GAA were not happy with the Minister as they stated: 'The GAA is disappointed that its detailed and costed submission in regard to grants for inter county GAA players which is supported by the GPA, has been rejected by the Minister for Sport.

'Despite the fact that the payment of grants to intercounty players was an initiative of the GPA, and was encouraged by Government representatives for a considerable period, Minister O'Donoghue is now saying that it is a matter for the GAA itself to pay these grants through some undefined funding mechanism, in addition to its increased expenditure and significant commitment to player welfare.

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Laughable the GAA thought they'd get away with this

[GavinZac]

Laughable the GAA thought they'd get away with this
isnt he just saying he'll give the money to the gaa and the gaa can use that to pay expenses, rather than him giving money directly to players?
its just him washing his hands of the dirty money if so.

[Dodge]

My reading of it is that he's forcing the GAA into paying the players themselves. Effectively finishing the sham of their claim to be amatuers

[Jerry The Saint]

isnt he just saying he'll give the money to the gaa and the gaa can use that to pay expenses, rather than him giving money directly to players?
its just him washing his hands of the dirty money if so.


My reading of it is that he's forcing the GAA into paying the players themselves. Effectively finishing the sham of their claim to be amatuers

Exactly - this is the big step. Which is why the GPA is delighted but the GAA is furious with the minister's decision. Once the 'pay-for-play' genie is out of the bottle you can't put it back in. County panel members will become defacto semi-professional, some wealthy sponsor in the likes of Kildare, Wicklow will offer to top-up player expenses, and eventually you get the contract lawyers involved and the breakdown of the county structure as it is today with players abandoning poorer teams...

[WeAreRovers]

My reading of it is that he's forcing the GAA into paying the players themselves. Effectively finishing the sham of their claim to be amatuers

Correct, the arrogance of these people literally knows no bounds.

Fait play to JOD for being the first sports minister to stand up to them. Vote FF!

KOH

[Dodge]

Fait play to JOD for being the first sports minister to stand up to them. Vote FF!

Easy tiger...

Easily more GAA people in FF than any other party

[Macy]

Fait play to JOD for being the first sports minister to stand up to them. Vote FF!
Eh, he's still going to give them the money to play the players, just not directly!

Jerry The Saint - I'd imagine it would be a shocker for the GAA to have to pay the players rather than making themselves rich on their backs.

[paul_oshea]

Exactly - this is the big step. Which is why the GPA is delighted but the GAA is furious with the minister's decision. Once the 'pay-for-play' genie is out of the bottle you can't put it back in. County panel members will become defacto semi-professional, some wealthy sponsor in the likes of Kildare, Wicklow will offer to top-up player expenses, and eventually you get the contract lawyers involved and the breakdown of the county structure as it is today with players abandoning poorer teams...

ya its a vicious circle, thats what i would fear also. spiral effect.


rather than making themselves rich on their backs

making who rich? the GAA? and what if they are rich, its not a share scheme with dividends paid out to members! id love if the FAI were rich, that way facilities up and down the country could be improved no end - to name just one benefit!

[Dodge]

making who rich? the GAA? and what if they are rich, its not a share scheme with dividends paid out to members! id love if the FAI were rich, that way facilities up and down the country could be improved no end - to name just one benefit!

The point he's making is they would be if clubs here (and the national team) didn't have to pay the players wages. All Premier division clubs would instantly add 500k into their coffers for the past 10 years...

[OneRedArmy]

Eh, he's still going to give them the money to play the players, just not directly!

Jerry The Saint - I'd imagine it would be a shocker for the GAA to have to pay the players rather than making themselves rich on their backs.But Macy thats the beauty of the Governments position.

The GAA wanted the payments to come directly from Government so they could wash their hands of them and refer to them as "Government funding" or "grant payments" or some such fudge which didn't involve the GAA directly but would keep the GPA quiet for a while.

The Government have rightly stated that they can't show favouritism and they must treat sports equally, so will not get involved in funding players directly.

If the money comes from the GAA its effectively pay for play and amateurism goes out the door.

[WeAreRovers]

Easy tiger...

Easily more GAA people in FF than any other party

Two words - Jimmy Deenihan. :eek:

Personally I'm hoping for a FF/Lab coalition and I think I'll get it. ;)

Macy - See OneRedArmy's post for an explanation of JOD's position. He's trying to flush the greedy bastids out. Quite clever actually.

KOH

[Dodge]

Don't let 1 or decent skins in FF fool you (and I think you'll be right)

[WeAreRovers]

Don't let 1 or decent skins in FF fool you (and I think you'll be right)

Eyes wide open as regards FF but Charlie O'Connor and Conor Lenihan will be getting a lot of Rovers votes in Dublin South West - and rightly so.

KOH

[geysir]

Exactly - this is the big step. Which is why the GPA is delighted but the GAA is furious with the minister's decision. Once the 'pay-for-play' genie is out of the bottle you can't put it back in. County panel members will become defacto semi-professional, some wealthy sponsor in the likes of Kildare, Wicklow will offer to top-up player expenses, and eventually you get the contract lawyers involved and the breakdown of the county structure as it is today with players abandoning poorer teams...
You mean the end of civilized sport scenario where the GAA ends up with a franchised club/county registration scheme with mercenary players kissing a different club badge every 2 years or however long it states in their contract. :D :D just like soccer.

[Dodge]

exactly

[OneRedArmy]

Interesting to see how the GAA react to this as they have never had it put up to them to such an extent before (to the extent that this and the Govt's position on Tallaght can be construed as "putting it up to them").

I expect plenty of wailing and gnashing of teeth from the GAA-friendly elements of the fourth estate who will remind us how the GAA is different to other sport and pretty much was responsible for the foundation of Ireland as a nation and other such tripe.....

Lets hope FF stand their ground.

Does anyone know have any of the other parties stated a position on Tallaght/Govt funding and all things GAA?

[Jerry The Saint]

You mean the end of civilized sport scenario where the GAA ends up with a franchised club/county registration scheme with mercenary players kissing a different club badge every 2 years or however long it states in their contract. :D :D just like soccer.

"Commercial enterprises" the lot of them. No benefit to the community any more. Tom Humphries has a gallon of red diesel and a lighter at the ready. :)

[paul_oshea]

I have to say I don't agree with funding ( of any kind ) for G.A.A players from the government.


Interesting to see how the GAA react to this as they have never had it put up to them to such an extent before (to the extent that this and the Govt's position on Tallaght can be construed as "putting it up to them").

Can someone send me an official document where the G.A.A publicly endorsed the tallaght thingie?! Or has the definition of the word "them" changed since I last looked at the dictionary?

Finally, very good point the G.A.A do fear about amateurism, its the beauty of the game, if it turns professional you would have the likes of schevenko being bought to play for Roscommon by Sean Mulryan. Hold on a sec, that would be deadly :D

[Dodge]

The Dublin county board backed Thomas Davis. There's a press release about if you have access to the internet ;)

[Macy]

making who rich? the GAA? and what if they are rich, its not a share scheme with dividends paid out to members! id love if the FAI were rich, that way facilities up and down the country could be improved no end - to name just one benefit!
Are there any financially poor administrators in Croke Park? Football facilities up and down the country would match the GAA if we weren't spending any money on players, put any wages we did spend on administrators, and had the political support that gave such capital grants as the GAA gets.

WAR - I do get that, but the point is he's still effectively paying the players wages out of tax payers money.

[paul_oshea]

The Dublin county board backed Thomas Davis. There's a press release about if you have access to the internet


G.A.A HQ ;)

everyone knows the county boards act independently, heck if the Roscommon county board didnt do what they did, we would having been watching wales in anfield :)

though these smiley things are great dodge aren't they ;)

[paul_oshea]

Are there any financially poor administrators in Croke Park? Football facilities up and down the country would match the GAA if we weren't spending any money on players, put any wages we did spend on administrators, and had the political support that gave such capital grants as the GAA gets.


I don't know about this, and I dont think you do either, as who knows how much of a difference a said money would make, more importantly we havent seen the accounts of individual clubs from either code, I will admit though it certainly would have made a difference :) Anyway do the FAI play individual players wages? :)

OH and, I cant answer about any other county, but the grants handed out this year to association football clubs in roscommon far outweighed those to the G.A.A clubs.

[OneRedArmy]

Paul the GAA as an entity is not just Central Council, it is also the members, clubs, county boards and provincial councils.

Also, I think its a fairly safe assumption to make that if soccer was amateur its facilities would be better.

[WeAreRovers]

paul o'shea, here's two links where Nickey Brennan himself put his 2 cents in over Tallaght. Be under no illusion that GAA HQ aren't behind this land grab.


Indo - "There is the question of whether Tallaght would be used for juvenile matches but that's not really a solution to it. So obviously we are disappointed. I don't want to say too much in relation to Tallaght situation because it is the subject of legal proceedings but yes we have expressed our disappointment."

http://www.unison.ie/irish_independent/stories.php3?ca=37&si=1788136&issue_id=15333

GAA press release - "The President, Nickey Brennan, confirmed that he had met with the Minister for Arts, Sport and Tourism, Mr John O’Donoghue. He said that he had raised issues such as Grants for GAA players, the Development at Tallaght, Lansdowne Road and Abbotstown with the Minister. He stated that he had been informed that planning permission for Lansdowne Road was expected by the end of July."

http://www.gaa.ie/plugins/matchfeed.cgi?rm=content&plugin_data_id=12923

KOH

[kingdom hoop]

Paul the GAA as an entity is not just Central Council, it is also the members, clubs, county boards and provincial councils.


So won't those mentioned have a say in where the €5m is diverted? Especially as if the money comes in it'll be in a different account, as JO'D says;


"This funding can be provided either through the existing Sport Capital Programme in respect of prioritised infrastructural projects or through additional funding by the Irish Sports Council in respect of games development. A combination of both may also be applied and the GAA have been aware of this position for some time."

'Reimbursing' inter-county players won't come under those headings. It very much looks like the GAA were just chancing their arm. As it stands they've bought themselves plenty of time. Delaying the inevitable though probably. But they'll just manage to screw the GPA now somehow.

[Jerry The Saint]

Can someone send me an official document where the G.A.A publicly endorsed the tallaght thingie?!

http://www.unison.ie/irish_independent/stories.php3?ca=95&si=1615267&issue_id=14049


Tallaght talks fall short

GAA president Nicky Brennan's first meeting with Sports Minister John O'Donoghue has failed to advance the GAA's cause in relation to the proposed use of the new Tallaght stadium.

Brennan and a number of GAA officials met with O'Donoghue in Croke Park but the Minister remained steadfast in his opinion that Tallaght should be preserved as a home for Shamrock Rovers and should not be accessible to local GAA teams in the area.

A judicial review of South Dublin County Council's decision to make Tallaght a soccer only ground is expected in June.

The GAA declined to expand on their meeting with O'Donoghue but are known to be disappointed with the outcome. St Patrick's Athletic have been touted for a possible ground share with Shamrock Rovers at Tallaght but there is mounting opposition in Inchicore to that proposition. Over 2,000 signatures opposing any such move have been procured by a movement called 'Pat's for Richmond'. :D :D :D

The ground share concept for Dublin based eircom league clubs comes under the remit of the Genesis report and Tallaght has been earmarked for that.


Good article that.

[geysir]

Did the good folks at St Pats eventually get to learn how to use a spirit level and even out that slope at Richmond pk?

Theres a couple of interpretations to that opening article contained in Dodge's post. Nicky Brennan isn't exactly enamoured with the GPA. He has received an undertaking from the GPA that if the Gov. turn down the proposals then that's it, end of story, the GPA shut up.
The other interpretation is that this Gov statement
'I have indicated that I am prepared to make funding available, on an annual basis, which will facilitate the GAA in freeing up existing monies within the Association to meet the additional costs of agreed player welfare supports in the event that an agreement is reached between the GAA and the GPA on the issue of additional player welfare supports.'

means the Gov. will pay you the money you need, in another way.

It's not just Corkies who are being ridden rock solid :)

[blackholesun]

JOD has no choice, paying the GAA mens and not paying their ladies or camogie or hokey or basketball or rugby will open an explosive can of worms ...

Good man John, stick to your guns!

Amatuer games my arse!

bhs

[pete]

The government is going to pay the GAA players, they just want it dressed up as different funding to protect themselves from claims by other sports. :( :rolleyes:

[paul_oshea]

pete, ya thats it its just a grant and let the GAA sort it out for themselves. it really is going to open up a can of worms.

[Ash]

Finally, very good point the G.A.A do fear about
amateurism, its the beauty of the game, if it turns professional you would have
the likes of schevenko being bought to play for Roscommon by Sean Mulryan.
Hold on a sec, that would be deadly :D

Not if your opponents bought John O'Shea, seeing that he has more league goals than Schevenko this season :eek:

[Lim till i die]

Football facilities up and down the country would match the GAA if we weren't spending any money on players, put any wages we did spend on administrators, and had the political support that gave such capital grants as the GAA gets.


Why sir, you make the rather daft assumption that football in this country is run competently