JOHN Gill on radio 1 at 6.30

[geezer]

with Des Cahill. The Dundalk PR Machine is in full swing, By all accounts they have found a "white Knight" in the town of Dundalk and the have plans like no other. They are gonna make the fai squirm for the next few weeks im dyin to see the size of the fine gill will get, scully or any other manager wasnt a patch on the way he lambasted the fai. He reckons nobody in Dundalk had an inkling of whats happening in the league and they went all out to be promoted

[Billy Lord]

In all fairness, it was made transparently clear from before a ball was kicked that there would be no promotion or relegation this season, and that this season's standings would form part of every club's overall application for admission into the new FAI PL.

[Partizan]

Isnt it a coincidence that all the talk about these 'plans' has only emerged in the last couple of days.

Big difference between theirs and our plans is that ours is on paper. Gill and Dundalk FC can blabber on all they want but they signed up to the FAI agreement and must abide by its outcome no matter what.

[GuisaSaigon]

Gill is like a broken record, he's been harping on about not understanding the process all season.It's been explained to him loads of times but he still cant figure it out.I didnt hear the radio interview but he surely shouldnt be trying to influence the IAG decision at this stage.Did Dundalk not make a presentation like everyone else????????????:confused:

[fbtn]

In all fairness, it was made transparently clear from before a ball was kicked that there would be no promotion or relegation this season, and that this season's standings would form part of every club's overall application for admission into the new FAI PL.

100%. Don't know how many times I've posted this over the last few months.

[DvB]

with Des Cahill. The Dundalk PR Machine is in full swing, By all accounts they have found a "white Knight" in the town of Dundalk and the have plans like no other. They are gonna make the fai squirm for the next few weeks im dyin to see the size of the fine gill will get, scully or any other manager wasnt a patch on the way he lambasted the fai. He reckons nobody in Dundalk had an inkling of whats happening in the league and they went all out to be promoted


I have to laught at all these great plans DFC are unveiling at the moment, considering all this proposed devlopment is based on extremely questionable past financial practices i'd hope the powers that be see through the propoganda!
Anyway as pointed out above surely as they willingly signed up to the criteria for the formation of the new league this PR/Propoganda is a futile exercise in relation to that?

Koh

[mcgonigle]

Its funny how the only replies slatting Gill and Dundalk are from fans of teams who didnt do it on the pitch this season (Waterford, Galway), who back the no promotion situation to the gills because neither should be near the Premier on merit.

Dont tell me that if your club was in Dundalks situation they wouldnt be on radio etc. pushing their promotion claim

[mcgonigle]

extremely questionable past financial practices
Koh

Rovers would know all about these, so i guess your the rite man to mention them

[bigmac]

Dont tell me that if your club was in Dundalks situation they wouldnt be on radio etc. pushing their promotion claim

Every club is in Dundalk's position as regards not knowing what will happen when the teams are decided. The question I'd be asking as a Dundalk fan, is why was such effort put into going "all out to be promoted" when everyone knew there wouldn't be promotion. As for Waterford, who didn't do it on the pitch, did it ever cross your mind that the board sat down and decided that with the lack of promotion and relegation, there was no point in throwing money away on gaining a pointless extra place in the final league table. I doubt that in a normal season Waterford would allow players to go on holidays instead of play in the playoff match.

Anyway, if Dundalk's plans are so great, then they'll score very highly in the presentation category and they'll be invited into the new super duper league on merit. Let me ask you this though, if you got in at the expense of UCD, would you refuse to take the place in the interest of fair play? There's no point in Gill giving out about something he signed up to in the first place - only has the effect of making him look a bit stupid.

[Conor H]

Its funny how the only replies slatting Gill and Dundalk are from fans of teams who didnt do it on the pitch this season (Waterford, Galway), who back the no promotion situation to the gills because neither should be near the Premier on merit.

Dont tell me that if your club was in Dundalks situation they wouldnt be on radio etc. pushing their promotion claim

Nobody is giving out about Dundalk doing PR on the radio......every club does it.What's annoying people is that Gill is continously saying it's a joke and that nobody told dundalk what's happening.He/Dundalk know they won't be in it next year and are playing the sympathy card big time.......clutching at straws.

[ColinR]

in fairness to dundalk, they are doing exactly what i would want my club if we were in the same situation. they know full well that they are most likely well behind on a number of criteria, but what have they to lose by going on a pr offensive, and putting the maximum possible pressure on the fai.

they probably feel that it wont work, but with the fai in charge, can anybody be sure?

[pete]

Pathetic PR attempt by Dundalk. They will only confuse the public who not aware that Dundalk signed up to a process they knew about in advance. When the FAI don't choose Dundalk the average person on the street won't understand & will cast the FAI & eL in even worse light.

You wouldn't see GAA or IRFU clubs having this out in public like this. Given the nu,ber of managers who were fined this season theres a precedent for Mr. Gill & Dundalk to get a hefty fine too.

[bluemovie]

By all accounts they have found a "white Knight" in the town of Dundalk and the have plans like no other.

Fair play to Dundalk. They should be in a good position for promotion if they win the First Division in 2007. It's a shame they misunderstood what was required of them this year in order to make it to the inaugural 'Premiership'.

[Passive]

By all accounts they have found a "white Knight" in the town of Dundalk and the have plans like no other.

I wonder is this the same "white knight" that shows an interest in Shels every time the taxman comes knocking? :rolleyes:

[Partizan]

Its funny how the only replies slatting Gill and Dundalk are from fans of teams who didnt do it on the pitch this season (Waterford, Galway), who back the no promotion situation to the gills because neither should be near the Premier on merit.

Dont tell me that if your club was in Dundalks situation they wouldnt be on radio etc. pushing their promotion claim


You signed up to the agreement like everyone else.

Kapiche.

[mcgonigle]

The question I'd be asking as a Dundalk fan, is why was such effort put into going "all out to be promoted" when everyone knew there wouldn't be promotion.

Dundalk didnt go all out to get promoted, they brought in a good manager, who got Dublin City promoted, and in turn he brought in the players he could afford and thought would do a job. All within the means of the club. If you ask this question of Dundalk you have to ask it of Rovers and Galway who had bigger squads and made some big signings in the transfer window.[/QUOTE]



I doubt that in a normal season Waterford would allow players to go on holidays instead of play in the playoff match.


Dundalk did the same with arguably our best midfielder Sean Finn, and then Scully for the 2nd leg, cant punish players for booking holidays 5months ago, when there was no mention of a playoff

[passerrby]

the problem here is not dundalk they were very happy to sign up to the process the problem is john ,poor lad ,thick as a plank

[hoops1]

Football matters should always be decided on the pitch IMO
Ok Dundalk signed up but lets be honest did any clubs really have any other
option

[TonyD]

I have a lot of sympathy for Dundalk on this one I must say. People say they signed up to it at the start of the season, and OK, fair enough. But then why were they made to take part in a play off match, which woud have no bearing on the final outcome of whether they got promoted or not ?

[Mr A]

Dundalk didnt go all out to get promoted, they brought in a good manager, who got Dublin City promoted, and in turn he brought in the players he could afford and thought would do a job. All within the means of the club. If you ask this question of Dundalk you have to ask it of Rovers and Galway who had bigger squads and made some big signings in the transfer window.

This does not really tally with what your new owner said when he took over. Then it was all about him having to put money in to cover this season's costs and how he wouldn't be doing so again. The talk was of budget cuts for next year to get the club sorted financially due to how badly run it had been for so long, and there was mention of debts like the bus company that hadn't been paid in years.

[DvB]

Rovers would know all about these, so i guess your the rite man to mention them

Yep, i'm purely basing my posts in relation to DFC on SRFC's past practices!:rolleyes:

Koh

[oriel]

I didnt hear the interview, but have heard some of it second hand.

Personaly speaking I dont think we`ll be invited to the new lge, I reckon we`ll just miss out by coutest of our appaling record 2002 - 04, if it is the case, its not the end of the world, and I`m certainly not going to lose any sleep over it. I think the prize money for nx years first div is 50k, and the winners play lge cup winners for setanta spot and of course auto promotion. There`s a good feel good factor around the club at the moment, maybe best in 10 years, increased attendances, goods structure, decent playing staff, albeit how many will stay is unclear, still we`d have to be confident of winning it next season if we stay where we are.

However................if we do get selected in a surprise development, how funny will that be especially for the club's place we take and all the anti dlk fc vibe on here ?

All fun and games ahead boy and girls...........

[bigmac]

all the anti dlk fc vibe on here ?



I think you're a bit eager to have the world against you Oriel. Most people are just pointing out that it's a bit rich to be complaining about a process that the club already agreed to. I don't think anyone was really being "anti Dundalk".


I have a lot of sympathy for Dundalk on this one I must say.


the problem here is not dundalk


Fair play to Dundalk.

[pineapple stu]

But then why were they made to take part in a play off match, which woud have no bearing on the final outcome of whether they got promoted or not ?
To decide whether they'd be classified as 13th or 11th in this year's league standings.

In fairness, while the whole criteria thing is clearly the biggest load of nonsense ever seen in footballing circles - and I'm including Shels' claims of imminent investment - it was clearly outlined back in May (week of the FAI Cup Second Round the stuff came out).

Still, best of luck to Gill. Hope he gets the point across about what a mess the FAI have made of the league this year.


Dundalk did the same with arguably our best midfielder Sean Finn, and then Scully for the 2nd leg, cant punish players for booking holidays 5months ago, when there was no mention of a playoff
What were you going to do if you reached the Cup Final?!

[pete]

Given so many people were dismissive of the FAI criteria what alternative would you suggest?

IMO the FAI clearly wanted a strong group of teams to start the league. They will then probably come up with some entry criteria for 1st division teams to get promoted in addition to having to win their league. This is common in many leagues & about time the eL started to actually enforce rules that have been in place for years.

The fact is that Dundalk have not performed on the pitch for years & have one good season all be it through a playoff so its not as if they being refused entry for years.

Is there a good eL citizen portion to the entry crieria? ;)

[pineapple stu]

Given so many people were dismissive of the FAI criteria what alternative would you suggest?
What alternative?! Is that a serious question?!

The league standings, obviously, as always used - here and around the world. Dump the bottom team (Dublin City), promote the top team (Rovers) and swap the play off teams in the First Division teams win (i.e. Dundalk replace Waterford).

Those 12 teams would be subject to strict licencing, and relegation or points penalties applied if necessary. I would have no problems kicking Shels out and docking Cork 8 points if their finances aren't up to date from their last winding up orders. However, if someone in the top 12 meets licencing, they're in the top flight, end of story.

By definition, the 12 best teams in the country is the strongest Premier Division available.

But hey, I'm sure the FAI care about Irish football as much as they tell us they do... :rolleyes:

[harps1954]

Dundalk did the same with arguably our best midfielder Sean Finn, and then Scully for the 2nd leg, cant punish players for booking holidays 5months ago, when there was no mention of a playoff

No mention of a play-off. Shame on the people in charge of your club. The play-off was included in the eircom League's rule-book at the beginning of the season. The play-off was also included in the FAI's merger proposal document that was sent to all clubs and that was on the FAI's website up until a few weeks ago. So to say that the play-off just appeared out of nowhere in the last few weeks is laughable. Didn't your club officials read the rule-book? Did they read the merger document which they voted to accept? It's not a bit wonder John Gill doesn't know what's happening if people felt that the decision to play a play-off game was only decided towards the end of the season. Your club would have voted on the eircom League rulebook at the start of the season and your club voted to accept the proprosals in the FAI merger document. If they done this without even reading the fine detail, shame on them.

[Philly]

This is like a student going on to the radio cyring over how they didn't get into Trinity (premier division) because they didn't understand the points system, and now they have to go to UCD (D1).

They agrred to the procedures. Nothing can change those procedures now. The same criteria are applied to all clubs, and the playoff has very little signifigence in the grand scheme of things.

Cop on Dundalk and await the results just like every other club has to.

I just know that this wholee affair will get messy when things are announced. Some club is bound to go to court.

[holidaysong]

The FAI could have avoided this can of worms by not having a playoff. They were even referring to it as a Promotion/Relegation playoff on the radio for **** sake. Obviously I want to be in the Premier League next season. If it takes putting public ressure on the FAI then so be it. While doing a wee dance on the RSC pitch on Saturday night however it was a bit hollow.

[LukeO]

This is like a student going on to the radio cyring over how they didn't get into Trinity (premier division) because they didn't understand the points system, and now they have to go to UCD (D1).

Hate to be them...

[Macy]

The FAI could have avoided this can of worms by not having a playoff.
I suppose potentially it could've made a difference to a clubs ranking. The problem isn't the playoff, it's Dundalk's attempt to use it that's creating the problem.

[WeAreRovers]

What alternative?! Is that a serious question?!

The league standings, obviously, as always used - here and around the world. Dump the bottom team (Dublin City), promote the top team (Rovers) and swap the play off teams in the First Division teams win (i.e. Dundalk replace Waterford).

Those 12 teams would be subject to strict licencing, and relegation or points penalties applied if necessary. I would have no problems kicking Shels out and docking Cork 8 points if their finances aren't up to date from their last winding up orders. However, if someone in the top 12 meets licencing, they're in the top flight, end of story.

By definition, the 12 best teams in the country is the strongest Premier Division available.

But hey, I'm sure the FAI care about Irish football as much as they tell us they do... :rolleyes:

Absolutely 100% spot-on.

While I have no sympathy for Dundalk, I do think that Waterford and to a lesser extent Bray and Bohs totally pulled the pish last season knowing that they were fairly safe in regards to their places in the new league.

That looks bad from the outside looking in. All that Giller is doing is trying to win sympathy for Dundalk based on that. Mind you, he's wasting his time.

KOH

[drummerboy]

Can anyone confirm if Dundalk signed up to this process last summer. I thought everyone signed bar Dublin City but someone very close to Giller is on another chat forum saying that they didn't sign up to this.

[soccerc]

Can anyone confirm if Dundalk signed up to this process last summer. I thought everyone signed bar Dublin City but someone very close to Giller is on another chat forum saying that they didn't sign up to this.

Tbe process was endorsed at a special egm of the eL by an overwhelming majority and raetified by the FAI. All clubs knew what was involved

[Schumi]

This is like a student going on to the radio cyring over how they didn't get into Trinity (premier division) because they didn't understand the points system, and now they have to go to UCD (D1).Ignoring the childish jibe, it's nothing like that. A closer analogy would be the CAO deciding that this year they'd give extra points for where you live, how you did in your 5th year & Junior Cert exams, the number of friends you have, the size of your house and how well you can bull$hit them about what you're going to do in college.

[CharlesThompson]

in fairness to dundalk, they are doing exactly what i would want my club if we were in the same situation. they know full well that they are most likely well behind on a number of criteria, but what have they to lose by going on a pr offensive, and putting the maximum possible pressure on the fai.

they probably feel that it wont work, but with the fai in charge, can anybody be sure?

I agree with this. The FAI, by using a very roundabout way to determine the Premier League participants next season, were always going to leave themselves open to what Gill is going on about now. I'd think that whether it was Dundalk, Rovers, Galway, Limerick we would be hearing the same from whoever from the 1st Division won a play-off.

The FAI should have done away with the play-off this season in order to close the door on the claims of Dundalk (or any other first division side who won a play-off).

[pineapple stu]

This is like a student going on to the radio cyring over how they didn't get into Trinity (premier division) because they didn't understand the points system, and now they have to go to UCD (D1).
Now now! :p

[Philly]

Pineapple Stu is way more fun that Schumi.

Although Shumis way of putting it makes far more sense than my childish, jibe-filled rant.

However, Dundalk did accept those ridiculous proposals. They can't now go wetting their pants over it and saying that they din't read the small print. PR at this stage won't make any difference anyway.

[Poor Student]

I just don't get this line of approach. I think the IAG process is total and utter rubbish and haven't seen any attempt to even jusitfy it but I'm well aware of what it entails and its workings. It's a bit odd but it's not the hardest thing in the world to get a loose grasp of. I can remember posters here pointing out nearly half a year ago how the playoff game was going to be the most meaningless official game in the history of football. Suddenly over time it was hyped back into a proper playoff in the minds of fans and people from the clubs that might be involved in it. I'd be focusing on the IAG process in general, there's no need for it and it has no place in football.

[mcgonigle]

I suppose potentially it could've made a difference to a clubs ranking. The problem isn't the playoff, it's Dundalk's attempt to use it that's creating the problem.

Yeah thats the problem Macy :rolleyes:

Sounds like someone works for the FAI :)

[Cosmo]

Without sticking up for craptown and siding away from the gill interview a bit.

Does anyb ody else think the whole process is a pile of jock? For me, it should be on the pitch - and the only criteria important after that is being financially sound?

On another point if the FAI want to bring in stuff like infratructure, they have some cheek unless theyre prepared to help assist clubs with the finances for this? (though thankfully we'll have our new stadium soon :) )

Though the plus side is that craptown stay down for their 6th consecutive season!

[pete]

Does anyb ody else think the whole process is a pile of jock? For me, it should be on the pitch...

The process has been a success to date. It lead to the demise of Dublin City which 99% of eL fans approve of.

It could be argued that the process is a little flawed as will likely keep UCD in the Premier.

[Schumi]

Pineapple Stu is way more fun that Schumi.I'll take that as a compliment. :)

However, Dundalk did accept those ridiculous proposals. They can't now go wetting their pants over it and saying that they didn't read the small print. PR at this stage won't make any difference anyway.I agree with this though, there isn't much point moaning now, hopefully it'll make the FAI squirm though.

[gotaroundbetter]

Pity some of the wizz kids in the FAI, didn't think to re-label the games from a play-off, which conjures up the traditional image in the media and in the publics perception.
To something more in line with what they were,meaningless.
Can some of you remember the banner in the back of one of your coaches during the Geoff mac Namarra play-off's??
"We DON'T POTEST, WE PLAY BALL"
Maybe someone on Dundalk's board should be talking to John and asking him to
"stop protesting and play ball", as you sighed up to this for better or worse.

[Billy Lord]

Clubs need to be run properly, and that's the bottom line. Compare Derry City's love-in with licencing to Shels/Ollie's contempt for the Revenue and tax in general. The former points to a structured and sustainable future while the latter screams of stupidity and pointless short-termism.
Should Irish football clubs be like the chaser of a Lotto dream, or the careful saver who builds slowly but consistently?

[Frankfurt Hoop]

The whole point of the restructuring was to get rid of ICBINHF. Ever since Seery realised this and folded his tent, the whole idea of restructuring the league in order to get rid of one Dublin club has grown ever more ridiculous.

Aside from moaning about the Failure And Incompetence getting it all wrong, does anyone remember them ever doing anything right?

[Mr A]

I think that linking this process to the demise of Dublin City is a bit tenuous in fairness. They were an accident waiting to happen regardless of this.

And it's all very well to say it should all be about on the pitch, but for the good of the league financial responsibility should be implemented at clubs. If they can't do it themselves it has to come from above. I don't think the IAG process is anything like what it should be, and would be redundant if licensing had been better implemented from the start, but it's here now and it must be made to work transparently and openly.

And that for me is the big question- will it be open and transparent?

Somehow, I doubt it. But then the majority of the clubs will be in the premier, so there'll be no chance of a revolt anyway, so the FAI can do what they want basically.

[CollegeTillIDie]

I didn't get into Trinity because I didn't know how to Integrate the Square root of a ducks arse diced cubed to the power of six divided by ....

I ended up in UCD and was spared having to follow Trinity's football team :D

The only function the Play-offs served was to provide the team with extra points in the 4 year record criteria ( 50% of the IAG requirements) to sort out their ranking as outlined by pineapple stu in an earlier posting in this thread.
Apparently by winning the second leg. Dundalk got 10 extra points for the process.
All this would be fine and dandy if the Chinese whispers going round Suirside, during the year hadn't effectively guaranteed The Blues Premier Division status in 2007, league position or no League position.

[CollegeTillIDie]

The whole point of the restructuring was to get rid of ICBINHF. Ever since Seery realised this and folded his tent, the whole idea of restructuring the league in order to get rid of one Dublin club has grown ever more ridiculous.

Aside from moaning about the Failure And Incompetence getting it all wrong, does anyone remember them ever doing anything right?


Well if they screw up the League next season they have one less layer of bureaucracy to hide behind. It really will be JOhn Delaney's fault :D

[passerrby]

Well if they screw up the League next season they have one less layer of bureaucracy to hide behind. It really will be JOhn Delaney's fault :D

how nieve no he will not he will say years of mismanagement by clubs can not be undone in one or two years and you know something he s proberly right