Move to Belfield Bowl confirmed

[DmanDmythDledge]

Good news for the club. I'm looking forward to the move. Does anyone have an estimated time the work will last?

[Student Mullet]

Also, I noticed that the planning report took its attendance figures from foot.ie.

[adamcarr]

What will the capacity be. Any drawings?

[Schumi]

1500 seats, not sure about standing.

[DmanDmythDledge]

From Bord Pleanala;

"The hours of operation of the floodlights shall be confined to between 0900 hours to 2200 hours, Monday to Saturday inclusive and to between 0900 hours to 2100 hours on Sundays and Bank Holidays. Floodlighting shall not be provided outside these hours.

Reason: In the interest of residential amenity."

What would happen if a cup game went to extra time?

[Student Mullet]

1,500 hard standing aswell. There are drawings on the county council website here:
http://dms.dlrcoco.ie/Exe/ZyNET.exe?ZyAction=ZyActionS&User=ANONYMOUS&Password=anonymous&Client=planning&SearchBack=ZyActionL&SortMethod=h&SortMethod=-&MaximumDocuments=15&ImageQuality=r75g16%2Fr75g16%2Fx150y150g16%2Fi500&Display=hpfrw&DefSeekPage=f&Toc=&TocEntry=&TocRestrict=&QField=Ref_No%5ED06A/0045&UseQField=Ref_No&IntQFieldOp=1&ExtQFieldOp=1&SearchMethod=1&Time=&Index=Planning+Archive+1%7CPlanning+Archive+2%7CPl anning+Ext%7CPlanning+Int&FuzzyDegree=0&Query=&IntQFieldOp=1&ExtQFieldOp=1

[CollegeTillIDie]

From Bord Pleanala;

"The hours of operation of the floodlights shall be confined to between 0900 hours to 2200 hours, Monday to Saturday inclusive and to between 0900 hours to 2100 hours on Sundays and Bank Holidays. Floodlighting shall not be provided outside these hours.

Reason: In the interest of residential amenity."

What would happen if a cup game went to extra time?


Probably play those at 5:15 on Sunday :D

[CollegeTillIDie]

I am amazed that only 1,500 seats will be in the Bowl. Last year's League Cup Final against Derry attracted 400 more punters than that figure alone.
And if attempts to increase our core support through parents of Soccer Camp participants are in any way successful over the next five years even 1,900 would not be enough for some games.

[Schumi]

What would happen if a cup game went to extra time?It'd be rare enough that that would come up. The last last time we had extra time in Belfield that I can remember was the play-off. It might be possible to apply for special permission for cup replays just in case.

[Schumi]

There's standing room too don't forget. I can't see 3,000 capacity being restrictive for a while and if we do need to, it shouldn't be too difficult to expand the capacity with some terracing behind a goal or on the far side.

[DmanDmythDledge]

I am amazed that only 1,500 seats will be in the Bowl. Last year's League Cup Final against Derry attracted 400 more punters than that figure alone.
And if attempts to increase our core support through parents of Soccer Camp participants are in any way successful over the next five years even 1,900 would not be enough for some games.
Are you mad? We're only averaging 600 odd at the moment. The Derry crowd was that high because it was the League Cup Final. There wasn't 1,900 in Belfield against Derry this season.

[pineapple stu]

In fact, the highest crowd was 950 against Bohs; admittedly a very poor highest crowd.

[Poor Student]

You have to build a ground in line with your average attendances, not hypothetical rare high attendances. It's a waste of exdenditure and maintainence. 1,500 is more than enough and is only being built to satisfy minimum criteria. If the Soccer Camp stuff is in any way successful then you'd be looking at a couple of hundred extra at games.:confused:

[pineapple stu]

What if the game is delayed because no ref is appointed?

[DmanDmythDledge]

Just looking at the documents there and only the current stand will be covered. 420 uncovered seats will be added to either end of the stand.

[ifk101]

Just looking at the documents there and only the current stand will be covered. 420 uncovered seats will be added to either end of the stand.

Sounds like a great return on the grant money .... How much did UCD get again?

[DmanDmythDledge]

Sounds like a great return on the grant money .... How much did UCD get again?
A bit more than one million.

[Poor Student]

Just looking at the documents there and only the current stand will be covered. 420 uncovered seats will be added to either end of the stand.

That's below minimum requirement to the best of my knowledge. Bald Student or Mullet, do either of you know what the stadium criteria are?

[Student Mullet]

That's below minimum requirement to the best of my knowledge. Bald Student or Mullet, do either of you know what the stadium criteria are?One third of your seats must have a roof.

[CollegeTillIDie]

I think 1,500 seats is too few. Given that the League Cup Final last year had more than 1,800 people at the game. What happens if the club's efforts to tap into the residential support bears a lot more fruit in the next few years than it has done in the past?

For example we will be way closer to Clonskeagh in the Bowl than at present. Walking distance in fact. This alone could draw a few more regulars to games in the Bowl.

I'm not just thinking in soccer terms either. After all a few short years ago the Rugby club had Brian O'Driscoll playing for them. What will happen when the next young rugby superstar gets a scholarship and joins the John McClean Rugby academy?

What happens if UCDAFC manage to attract another player with the appeal of Jason Sherlock? There would be insufficient capacities for these contingencies not to mention our next foray into European football.

[Student Mullet]

1,500 is nearly tripple our current crowds. Including standing we'll have room for 3,000 which is more people than have ever watched UCD in the league. It's plenty for the next year or 2.

His evilness had a pre-planning meeting with the county council last March about upping the total seated capacity to 4,400 over 5 years. If crowds improve beyond this (which I seriously doubt) they'll provide the cash for more capacity to be built.

[CollegeTillIDie]

Student Mullet

Ah yes you are thinking in terms of the here and now. But when the big clubs ( bar Bohemians) all go belly up financially, it will leave UCD and Bohs as the big two Dublin clubs until Rovers get a ground :D

P.S. Our record league attendance that was officially counted was 3,750 in a First Division fixture at home to Derry City in December 1986.

[CollegeTillIDie]

Are you mad? We're only averaging 600 odd at the moment. The Derry crowd was that high because it was the League Cup Final. There wasn't 1,900 in Belfield against Derry this season.

You'll never attract 2,000 people into a ground that won't hold them:rolleyes:


You have to build a ground in line with your average attendances, not hypothetical rare high attendances. It's a waste of exdenditure and maintainence. 1,500 is more than enough and is only being built to satisfy minimum criteria. If the Soccer Camp stuff is in any way successful then you'd be looking at a couple of hundred extra at games.:confused:

There is something like a minimum seat capacity requirement of 1,200 for starters. And you cannot legislate for some other club being mega successful at drawing crowds( say for example Bohs when the money comes through) and starting to bring huge travelling support to Dublin Derbies.

I have been at UCD V St. Pat's games in Belfield when they were winning Leagues and there were more than 2,000 at some of those games.

If you don't put the capacity in for this kind of potential, you can never fulfill it. I don't think 2,500 seats would be in any way over the top given that we got 1,900 for a League Cup game last year.

If we had won the League Cup and qualified for the Setanta we could well have had gates of 2,000 against one or two of the Northern Clubs you'd never know.

And Poor student the soccer club got more than €1.25 million for ground upgrading... that is the ONLY thing the club is allowed to spend that allocation on.

[Student Mullet]

Student Mullet

Ah yes you are thinking in terms of the here and now. But when the big clubs ( bar Bohemians) all go belly up financially, it will leave UCD and Bohs as the big two Dublin clubs until Rovers get a ground :D

P.S. Our record league attendance that was officially counted was 3,750 in a First Division fixture at home to Derry City in December 1986.Then we'll have to play a couple of games up the road in the RDS for the few months it takes to put in more terracing to accommodate the thousands that are following us. Thay would be no hassle as a gate of over 3,000 will bring in over 40,000 euro in one game, quickly paying for the upgrades which will be needed.

I vote we wait untill our league crowds surpass 2,500 before taking this option so that in the unlikely event that it doesn't happen, we won't have ****ed money away on a white elephant.

[Poor Student]

CTID, you've been following UCD far longer than any of us. You know it's not realistic to expect a move of 1km to suddenly result in a rapid increase in crowds. You're talking about making expensive plans for extremely rare contingencies. If one could even guarantee one crowd of 3,500 a year and the rest to be 1,000 or under then it would not be worth the expenditure.

[Poor Student]

And Poor student the soccer club got more than €1.25 million for ground upgrading... that is the ONLY thing the club is allowed to spend that allocation on.

I'm well aware of that and I assume what you see in the plans is as far as that money can go.

You cannot waste money on unlikely events. It's not our responsibility to build an extra large stadium to accomodate the fans of a single well supported club for an odd season. You can say if, if, if but the reality is that we have only won one major trophy in our history and only qualified for Europe twice. The club must be pragmatic and realistic.

[CollegeTillIDie]

I'm well aware of that and I assume what you see in the plans is as far as that money can go.

You cannot waste money on unlikely events. It's not our responsibility to build an extra large stadium to accomodate the fans of a single well supported club for an odd season. You can say if, if, if but the reality is that we have only won one major trophy in our history and only qualified for Europe twice. The club must be pragmatic and realistic.

The fact remains that we have had crowds in excess of 2,000 on several occasions down through the years in Belfield Park, not as often as we would like,but never the less and if with the terracing in the bowl we can accomodate that figure then fine. We may have won 1 F.A.I. Cup but in the past five years alone we have come close to adding a League Cup, which nowadays brings Setanta Cup qualification, on 2 occasions reaching the final.

For someone like me who witnessed 21 seasons of never getting out of the First phase, that takes some getting used to. But we hosted the League Cup Final second leg in 2001 and the Final (one leg) last year.
When we played St. Pat's in that Final the crowd was around 2,500.
The League Cup may not be a MAJOR TROPHY but being in the Final does draw crowds.
And as long as we keep reaching Finals , we are eventually going to nick the trophy.


In fact, the highest crowd was 950 against Bohs; admittedly a very poor highest crowd.

Not only is it a very poor highest crowd, it's a disappointing crowd even for that particular fixture. This has been a sh1t season for crowds generally in the EL. Even Cork City's crowds are down on last year!

[CollegeTillIDie]

CTID, you've been following UCD far longer than any of us. You know it's not realistic to expect a move of 1km to suddenly result in a rapid increase in crowds. You're talking about making expensive plans for extremely rare contingencies. If one could even guarantee one crowd of 3,500 a year and the rest to be 1,000 or under then it would not be worth the expenditure.

We are effectively moving to Clonskeagh. There is a greater density of residential housing there than on Foster Avenue. The potential for "local" support is greatly increased. It is more easily accessible than Belfield Park. The car park is closer to the ground.
It's in a very well recognised location to the student population being in the general area of the Sports Centre. The 11B bus stop is a very short walk from it. People from Goatstown, Dundrum etc will be able to reach the vicinity by buses which pass the Clonskeagh gate. People from Donnybrook direction can get off at RTE and walk down past the old biddy's house, to get access.
We may be able to attract additional students/graduates/staff members who play other sports to a few games,simply by being closer to the Sports Centre. We should be aiming to average 1,000 a game at League games in the New John Delaney Super League which will be wonderful cause the superbly organised FAI are in charge ;)

We should maximise the potential capacity, of being more accessible, while we have the grant aid.
Don't forget the Rugby club got the same amount as us. Meaning there is €2 million plus for ground upgrades.
Both clubs can only use this money to upgrade facilities. So while we( both the AFC and RFC) have the cash we have to splash it on the Bowl. This opportunity of grant aiding a sports facility in UCD for the soccer( & rugby) club(s), may not occur again for decades.


Then we'll have to play a couple of games up the road in the RDS for the few months it takes to put in more terracing to accommodate the thousands that are following us. Thay would be no hassle as a gate of over 3,000 will bring in over 40,000 euro in one game, quickly paying for the upgrades which will be needed.

I vote we wait untill our league crowds surpass 2,500 before taking this option so that in the unlikely event that it doesn't happen, we won't have ****ed money away on a white elephant.

So in that event we will move from one rugby ground to another.. I suppose I could live with that:D

[Schumi]

CTID, if you want to reply to more than one post at the same time, please do so in just one post. It's very annoying to have several posts in a row by the same person.

[pineapple stu]

I think 1,500 seats is too few. Given that the League Cup Final last year had more than 1,800 people at the game. What happens if the club's efforts to tap into the residential support bears a lot more fruit in the next few years than it has done in the past?
Did you just bring up the same argument you made on another thread, even though it was roundly disproved by everyone else?!

Capacity in the Bowl is 3000. If we get average gates of 3000, that'd make us the biggest team in the country. Do you really think that scenario is just around the corner?!

[pineapple stu]

You'll never attract 2,000 people into a ground that won't hold them:rolleyes:
The Bowl will hold them. Let's get 2000 to games before we start planning for more.


There is something like a minimum seat capacity requirement of 1,200 for starters.
There are 1500 seats.


I have been at UCD V St. Pat's games in Belfield when they were winning Leagues and there were more than 2,000 at some of those games.
The Bowl will hold that.


I don't think 2,500 seats would be in any way over the top given that we got 1,900 for a League Cup game last year.
Irrelevant. The ground holds 3000 including standing capacity. Which part of this is confusing you?


If we had won the League Cup and qualified for the Setanta we could well have had gates of 2,000 against one or two of the Northern Clubs you'd never know.
This despite the fact that Setanta attendances have been average enough - i.e. we'd be doing well to get 1000 at a game.

Seriously, the plans for the new ground are perfectly satisfactory. There is scope for improvement if needs be. It marks a 77% increase in seated capacity and a 58% in overall capacity on Belfield Park. It's grand.

[CollegeTillIDie]

CTID, if you want to reply to more than one post at the same time, please do so in just one post. It's very annoying to have several posts in a row by the same person.

Am I the only person who does that?:rolleyes:

[pineapple stu]

Yes..

[CollegeTillIDie]

Yes..

You will find if you examine all the threads in the UCD section alone, that you are greatly mistaken.

[DmanDmythDledge]

You will find if you examine all the threads in the UCD section alone, that you are greatly mistaken.
Give an example then to prove you're right.

[CollegeTillIDie]

Give an example then to prove you're right.

Pineapple stu had two back to back [#30 & #31 ]in this very thread
but then there are none so blind as those WHO REFUSE to see.

[DmanDmythDledge]

Pineapple stu had two back to back [#30 & #31 ]in this very thread
but then there are none so blind as those WHO REFUSE to see.
I just asked you to back up what you said.

[CollegeTillIDie]

Besides people are more likely to read two short to medium sized posts than a HUGE one !

[Buller]

now now kids, stop your incent bickering... your both right! :D
regardless of only having 1500 seats the bowl will definatly be a step up from that kip, "dont worry be happy"... besides, in the plans there looks like there's plent of room for expansion should need ever arise...

[CollegeTillIDie]

Nice of you to notice Buller

And we look forward to visiting Tallaght... one day :D

[Schumi]

Pineapple stu had two back to back [#30 & #31 ]in this very threadThat's because they were originally in different threads but I moved a load of posts about the Bowl and attendances from another thread and they coincidentally ended up together.


Besides people are more likely to read two short to medium sized posts than a HUGE one !I know I rarely read a second post by the same person in a row, and certainly not a third or subsequent one.

[CollegeTillIDie]

So has there been any more developments on the Bowl front?

[pineapple stu]

I think there's a decision next week to decide the exact timetable for the improvements.