Where is Ireland's real level?

[osarusan]

With all the talk of the crapness of the manager and the players and the structure of the FAI, it is difficult to find any answers to questions.

My question is - "With a competent manager in place, given what he needs from the FAI to do the job properly, and with the best squad of players we can produce (from whatever leagues), where is the real level of the Irish football team?

[pineapple stu]

We can probably select a starting XI of players starting one of the top leagues in Europe. I refuse to believe such a team should settle for anything less than a very good chance of qualification (i.e. top two), with success maybe every other campaign on average.

Notions that "We don't have the players" are nonsense.

[eirebhoy]

With a decent proven manager in place and a full squad of players available I'd put us on par with the Czechs. The only position we're really weak in now is Richard Dunne's partner but hopefully McShane will live up to his potential.

[Jerry The Saint]

"With a competent manager in place... where is the real level of the Irish football team?

Being competitive in every single match we play, regardless of the opposition. Having the ability to qualify in our own hands right up until the final minute of the qualification campaign.

[PaulB]

Being competitive in every single match we play, regardless of the opposition. Having the ability to qualify in our own hands right up until the final minute of the qualification campaign.

Brian Kerr, last Qualifying campaign?

[cavan_fan]

Realistically we are a coutnry with a small population where football is the number 3 sport.

On that basis we should be weaker than e.g. Finland/Iceland

I'm sure this will annoy some people but the 2 things whcih have helped our team are:

The 'extra' population provided by Irish abroad
The fact that we have a strong league on our doorstep which has had a bias towards signing our players.

So we should be a weak team (not much better than Cyprus), but the players we have are in the 10th-20th in Europe range.

[deadman]

Realistically we are a coutnry with a small population where football is the number 3 sport.

On that basis we should be weaker than e.g. Finland/Iceland



iceland ??? give me a break. nonsense
iceland has less than one tenth of our population (300,00 roughly)

anyway, surely a more appropriate figure is the number of people playing the sport in any particular country

[Ceirtlis]

It doesnt matter what population you have in a country it is the players you have at your disposal. Ireland have the players at the moment to at least challenge for qualification. I think realistically we should be the third team in any group, a threat to the big nations. That is what we have been for the last 15 years anyways. I dont see that the quality of players that we have now are any worse than what we had in the last 15 years when we were challenging

[Dodge]

Can't find the link anywhere but in terms of participation football is BY FAR the No 1 sport in Ireland, The fact that its not no 1 in terms of spectators is what keeps this board active

In the UEFA ranking, Ireland is ranked 35th. They rank by clubs

[endabob1]

It's not just Ireland that suffer from the Champions League Whore syndromme though, most of the England team fall into the same category, Lampard, consistently crap for country but great for club, same for Gerrard, Ferdinand, Joe Cole etc..... It's a part of modern football which is turing the old fashioned fan away.
God I sound like an old man, in my day...... :)

[Emmet]

Our players are weak (relatively) in key positions - mostly centre-midfield but also centre-back too. That's pretty much the spine of any team and we are lacking in both areas. We do have some very good players: Given, Finnan, Duff, Keane and there are some good youngsters who will - in time - be in the same bracket as those guys. Right now however, we are in a bit of a mess and it has in part been created because we lack players in those crucial positions.

[Emmet]

It doesnt matter what population you have in a country it is the players you have at your disposal. Ireland have the players at the moment to at least challenge for qualification. I think realistically we should be the third team in any group, a threat to the big nations. That is what we have been for the last 15 years anyways. I dont see that the quality of players that we have now are any worse than what we had in the last 15 years when we were challenging


The side of the early 1990s were very very good - far better than this bunch. They underperformed spectacularly ... how they did not qualify for Euro 92 I'll never know - we were easily good enough to win that tournament.

[Jerry The Saint]

Can't find the link anywhere but in terms of participation football is BY FAR the No 1 sport in Ireland, The fact that its not no 1 in terms of spectators is what keeps this board active


Delaney talked this up again today, stating that the sport has 450,000 participants making it #1 in the country. As far as I'm concerned, that figure is about as meaningful as the number of people who own a bike is to our prospects of winning the Tour de France. With the rise of provincial rugby, soccer is now firmly established as the No. 4 spectator sport in Ireland. Most people treat football as a recreational activity, like yoga or aerobics, or as something to watch on TV and use as an excuse for an occasional weekend away.

[Billsthoughts]

. As far as I'm concerned, that figure is about as meaningful as the number of people who own a bike is to our prospects of winning the Tour de France. .

:D :D

[backstothewall]

Top Level

England, Italy, Germany, France, Holland

Below them, above us

Sweden, Czech Rep, Portugal and Spain

Our Level

Romania, Belguim, Greece, Switzerland, Denmark, Norway, Bulgaria, Croatia, Scotland, Serbia, Ukraine, Poland, Russia, Turkey

Level below us

Finland, Austria, Slovakia, Israel, Slovenia, Iceland, Northern Ireland, Wales,

With only 16 places we have our work cut out to qualify, assuming the 9 teams definately better than us qualify then at least 15 teams i can think of at "our level" are scrapping for 7 places left, but we are under performing nonetheless. Our seeding definately didn't help either

[KarlosMendosa]

Top Level

England, Italy, Germany, France, Holland

Below them, above us

Sweden, Czech Rep, Portugal and Spain

Our Level

Romania, Belguim, Greece, Switzerland, Denmark, Norway, Bulgaria, Croatia, Scotland, Serbia, Ukraine, Poland, Russia, Turkey

Level below us

Finland, Austria, Slovakia, Israel, Slovenia, Iceland, Northern Ireland, Wales,

With only 16 places we have our work cut out to qualify, assuming the 9 teams definately better than us qualify then at least 15 teams i can think of at "our level" are scrapping for 7 places left, but we are under performing nonetheless. Our seeding definately didn't help either

Englans arent top level. Theyre ****ing useless

[Marked Man]

Not sure how we're at the same level as Switzerland, as they've dealt comfortably with us every time. Also, England above the Czech Republic?? Why?

[Qwerty]

Some straight talking from Paul Doyle, I pretty much agree with everything he says.

http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/sport/2006/10/11/ireland_relight_their_fire.html

Tonight's performance shows that we need to pick hungry commited players like Douglas and McShane, Kelly. It's time to drop O'Shea from the first team. I also wanted to drop Duff before the Cyprus match, he has earned a reprieve for his performance against the Czechs. I've wanted to see Douglas in the team ahead of O'Shea and Kavanagh.

Alan O'Brien's presence is still a head scratcher??

If it wasn't for the Cyprus debacle I would have felt we could still qualify, we are competitive. We just need a few home wins agaisnt decent opposition to get rolling again.

[ramondo]

...We just need a few home wins agaisnt decent opposition to get rolling again.

And when was the last time that happened?

[ainsie]

Maybe stupid but maybe compare them to another team , say England with a point per better player and 1/2 for equal.

Goalie... Given v Robinson (Given 1 point Ireland)
RF ...... Finnan v Neville ( Finnan 1 Point Ireland)
CB ....... Dunne V Ferdinand ( 1/2)
CB ....... Mc Shane v Terry (1 point England)
LF........ Cole V O Shea (1 point England)
RM ...... Gerrardv Mc Geady (1 point England)
CM....... S Reid v Micheal Carrick ( 1 Point Ireland)
CM ...... Lee Carsley V Frank Lampard (1 point England)
LM ....... D Duff V Joe Cole ( 1 Point Ireland)
F..........Robbie Keane V Crouch ( 1 Point Ireland)
F .........Kevin Doyle V Wane Rooney( 1 point England)
M .........Steve Staunton V S mc Claren( 1 point England)

Total 5 1/2 Ireland 6/1/2 England.

I know I probably will get slagged of for this but its based on potential form not current. Strikers will go through confidence problems etc.
Also based on Irish team I see the strongest at the moment with maybe the exception of O Shea
I know Mc Claren is not proving himself to be much at the moment but at least he has experience and therefore wins that one.
I dont rate Ferdinand or Carrick and I would barley give the one point to A cole over O shea as I think he is a product of the English press/ over rated.


So based on this with a good manager and all our players available I really think we should be higher in the world right up there in the rankings.

On last night , Adrenaline is a wonderfull thing and can make you over achive.
I thought it was fantastic the way we did over achive with these young players, but unless we A. Get a new manager or B a live, healthy assistant that will not sit in the stands but like Venabales sit beside the manager and help him.... we are still fooked , good result or not.

Anyhow slate away on my opinions.

BTW. EL people i have no EL players in my list because I think the above are better.

[an_ceannaire]

Given,
Finnan,
McShane,
Dunne,
Harte,
Duff,
Reid,
Carsley,
McGeady,
Keane,
Doyle

Dunne as captain. And Robbie, for the love of god, stay away from the touchlines and keep your eye on the f****n ball!!

[Qwerty]

And when was the last time that happened?

I know, I know, but we're not that far away. I firmly believe that we have the players, we just need to pick the right ones and get the gameplan right and execute as say in the NFL.