Highs and Lows last night

[Counting Crow]

Highs:
1. The old Geezer trying to take down the net ( at the Shed end ) when the ref blew with 50 secs left - did anyone else see that. It was a classic. He thought it was all over when the crowd came on the pitch.
2. That 11 minute spell in the second half. Enough said.
3. The constant singing from the Shed. We played our part last night guys..... no argument.
4. The atmosphere in Turners after the match was better than most other GROUNDS.
5. The constant barrage of songs directed @ O'Dowed. Even in the 2nd half when he was down @ the St Anne's end.... "Tony, Tony what's the score?"

Lows:
1. Those stupid female gigglers in the Shed during the minutes silence for Sept. 11th. Didn't they know there was late night shopping on a Friday night........why do they come at all?
2. That the game had to end at all. It was that good.

[Johnny]

Lows:
1)Some ********s in our support shouting Murphy out when we went 2 down. Cup Semi + 2nd in league so far not good enough then ? Next time, stay home and do your homework.

2) Were the Corner Bhoys slagging O'Dowd about his dead brother ? He looked over at them and blessed himself. If they were it is totally unacceptable. I thought only the Dalymount knackers would be prepared to stoop that low.

[pete]

Originally posted by Johnny
Were the Corner Bhoys slagging O'Dowd about his dead brother ? He looked over at them and blessed himself. If they were it is totally unacceptable. I thought only the Dalymount knackers would be prepared to stoop that low.

Only heard about that yesterday (didn't hear during the match) & anyone doing that should be ashamed to call themselves a city fan - no excuse.

[Éanna]

Originally posted by Johnny
1)Some ********s in our support shouting Murphy out when we went 2 down.
I'll be shouting Murphy out, no matter what the score, opposition or result. He must go.

[Johnny]

That's strange, cause I didn't hear anyone shouting it when we went 3-2 up ********.

[Éanna]

Originally posted by Johnny
That's strange, cause I didn't hear anyone shouting it when we went 3-2 up ********.
Nice to see that the Murphy in camp is still resorting the mature tactic of name-calling :rolleyes: At that particular moment, I think I was actually celebrating :rolleyes:

[ccfcman]

Originally posted by Éanna

I'll be shouting Murphy out, no matter what the score, opposition or result. He must go.

theres no pleasing TOSSERS LIKE YOU i dont want to say that but thats the way ur acting just cos uve a grudge against him u want him out??ull find he spent the bones of the summer enticing a certain john o flynn away from the prying hands of $h€l$

[Colm]

I think you'll find that most of these Guntherites havent been to the away games. At home everything looks great and it looks like Murphys doing a good job, but away from home he is shown up time and time again for the useless pri*ck that he is!
I gave him a clean slate at the start of this season but having been at the last few away games ive had to stop and think.
From this season alone heres why i hate the guy:
- he brought on Deccie when we were 4-0 down last night.
- he seems to think that winning our homes games is good enough when it clearly is not.
- he absolutley REFUSED to acknowledge the supporters in Ballybofey despite us having travelled for 7 hours to see city.
-he tried to hang on to the one goal lead against Bohs by playing FourFiveOne despite being caught out doing the exact same thing in the exact same fixture last year.
-as soon as Mulligan comes on he reverts to the hoof even though Mulligan is the smallest player on the pitch.

now can you understand why there is still a considerable amount of us who want him gone.

[Troy.McClure]

Originally posted by COLM
I think you'll find that most of these Guntherites havent been to the away games.

now can you understand why there is still a considerable amount of us who want him gone.

Well I go to the away games. I think that ccfcman has a point. You want him out, yet we have only lost 2 games so far and are in the semi's of the Cup.

Also, what sort of supporter would boo any City player? When Heartigan was brought on for the last 5 min V Brey last year, when we clearly had the game rapped up (2-0) certain fans started to boo him & gunther.

Muppets. (not neccessarily you Colm)

Things are going well (not perfectly) but enjoy it while it lasts

[Éanna]

Originally posted by Troy.McClure
Also, what sort of supporter would boo any City player? When Heartigan was brought on for the last 5 min V Brey last year, when we clearly had the game rapped up (2-0) certain fans started to boo him & gunther.
I take it you are referring to a number of people who booed when hartigan was broguht on in that game? I was one of them. I was not booing Noel Hartigan, I was booing Liam Murphy for being idiotic enough to bring him on. I have nothing against Noel, I'm sure he's a nice guy, and he's a good centre half. Murphy however is incompetent.

[Éanna]

certain fans started to boo him & gunther.

Muppets. (not neccessarily you Colm)




theres no pleasing TOSSERS LIKE YOU


That's strange, cause I didn't hear anyone shouting it when we went 3-2 up ********.


So as usual, the only argument that the "Murphy-In" camp can come up with is that the "out" camp are either "tossers" or "********s", or not real fans.

Here's a challenge to you so lads: come up with a list of valid reasons why Liam Murphy is a good manager and why he should stay at City. Argue your point against every one of the reasons that Colm listed above why he should go (All of which I agree with), and provide a valid, plausible reason to keep him in charge.

If your going to sling names around, save it for the dubs will ye.


OUT! :mad:

[SÓC]

Originally posted by Éanna

So as usual, the only argument that the "Murphy-In" camp can come up with is that the "out" camp are either "tossers" or "********s", or not real fans.

First lets not tar every Murphy-In supporter with the same brush now Éanna.



Here's a challenge to you so lads: come up with a list of valid reasons why Liam Murphy is a good manager and why he should stay at City. Argue your point against every one of the reasons that Colm listed above why he should go (All of which I agree with), and provide a valid, plausible reason to keep him in charge.

-Bringing Deccie on when we are 4-0 down with 20 minutes to go, IMO a good idea, we were not going to get back into the match and Deccie could get a taste of compeditive action after being out for so long
-It's fairly obvious from his comments in the Echo that he is not happy to be just winning at home, he was fairly critical of the preformence
-Refused to acknowledge the fans- Bad form he should do so, hardly a sackable offence but bad form not the least.
-4-5-1 away from home for the last 15 minutes again IMO a good idea, George was not up to anything in that game and Bohs were all over us since the start of the half better to bring on a midfielder to tighten things up than a striker who is doing nothing.
-Hoofing to Mulligan, that I cannot explain, Devine and Sir Hoofalot do waste alot of possetion hoofing however they do have their plus sides too, Deccie provides leadership which has been missing since Napier got injured and Devine well he is the best keeper in the league.

Now lets have a look at the plus side
-Signings, Gunther has made some amazing signings over the past two years.(O'Grady, John O'Flynn, George, Billy, Gaz, Warren, Rennie, Andrews)All players who have improved our squad. For the first time ever we have options.
-Excellent, extertaining and passing football, even in away match but not to the same extent as at home
-Youth players, he's has brought throught some great youth players and seems to be able to bring more in (Carey, Bennett, Colin P, Lordan, McNulty)
-More Full time players- He adds more fulltimers each year which can only be a good thing.
At the end of the 1st series of games we are 2nd in the League and in a cup Semi. I'd have taken that at the start of the season.

Gunther has his faults, Im not going to say he hasn't. He also had alot of goodthings going for him even Éanna and Colm will admit that.

IMO as Bertie Ahern said, alot done, alot more to do.

[City Hero]

Originally posted by SÓCcfc

-Signings, Gunther has made some amazing signings over the past two years.(O'Grady, John O'Flynn, George, Billy, Gaz, Warren, Rennie, Andrews)All players who have improved our squad. For the first time ever we have options.

These are without doubt some great signings and all of them were freebies. But for how long have we heard that Billy or Gaz wanted to come back to Cork. John O'Flynn, George, Warren, Andrews are all Cork lads who returned from England (I'm sure Dublin was not high on their choice of return destination & Cobh didn't have chance). I think some of these players chose Cork rather than Gunther chose them. I will however give Murphy credit for Conor & Rennie.

Also I'm sure that Deccie will be needing as much match practice as he can get in the run up to getting his first team spot back???????????? (Check the threads - how many people are talking about Deccie in their ideal back four for this season.)

[SÓC]

Im not saying that Deccie should be in the ideal back four or anywhere near it but at 4-0 the game was over, neither side really competing, just like a friendly game. Better to give Deccie a run out there rather than the last 20 minutes of a match when we are holding on to a slender lead.

As we have seen with Ollie and Derek players from or based in Cork will jump at the chance to go play in Dublin if the money is there so Gunther must get some credit for getting the lads to sign for us.

[Hecko]

Well said SOC - its about time we had a bit of realism about Gunther and how we're doing. The bottom line is that we would all have taken this at the start of the season. What I find amazing is how the Gunther Out camp seem to think that things were better before him or think it would be better with someone untested (Caulfield or Dave Hill were mentioned???). Lets remember that Davey might have been our best ever player but we played a lot more hoofball when he was there. How do you rate a manager? Look at Gunther this season

Results - Best start for years
Signings - SOC has said it all - a lot of other clubs would have offered more money for JOFY or GOC, Rennie and O'Grady are great signings, Billy IS better than Ollie this year, Derek was a hoofer and is no loss.
Football - At home we have never been more entertaining - full houses, one of the highest goal averages in Europe. For teh first time in years the ball is on the ground a lot (I agree we should play more like that away too)

As for tactics, we'll alwys argue about what decisions should be made in tight games, but do Eanna etc. not remember the 2-1 game against PAts at the cross under Davey when everyone in eth ground was screaming at teh bench that Pats had dropped someone behind the front two at the start of teh second half and he destroyed us - Dave made no change and we lost. Calling for Gunther to resign because he brought on Deccie when we were already well hammered is ridiculous, its not even nearly the same thing.

At the end of the day I'd hate to be going to City games hoping for City to do badly so I could be proved right. Fair enough if you don't like the bloke personally - but I don't think he's doing that bad a job...we still have a lot less money than the Pale clubs so tell me which City manager did better???

[Colm]

Id really prefer not to argue these points but I feel compelled, so here goes:
Billy wanted a move back to City anyway- he lives and works in Middleton.
Georgie turned down a number of offers in England because he wanted to come home to Cork- who else was he going to play for.
Andrews was dissillusioned with English football so he was back in Cork anyway.
I dont know about the rest.

What about all the players that Gunther shafted because they dared to cross him?
Steve O'Flynn?
Tony Tynan?
He almost got rid of two of this seasons first team regulars, Greg and Colin T!

I gave the guy a clean slate at the start of the season but as far as im concerned the sooner we see the back of him the better.

btw, im now expecting some Gunterite to call me a tosser or a ******** etc because i know the level that some of them have to stoop to in order to get their point across.

[James]

Originally posted by SÓCcfc
-Bringing Deccie on when we are 4-0 down with 20 minutes to go, IMO a good idea, we were not going to get back into the match and Deccie could get a taste of compeditive action after being out for so long


why not bring on Killian Lordan then
a player who is playing very well for the U21's for a while now, deccie has little or nothing to offer the team, this season or more importantly in the long run.. killian does.. why not give a taste of first team action??

[Éanna]

Originally posted by SÓCcfc
First lets not tar every Murphy-In supporter with the same brush now Éanna...........................IMO as Bertie Ahern said, alot done, alot more to do.

Ok, fair enough, I'm just fed up of the majority of the Murphy-In crowd saying that we're only idiots and ingrates.

Negatives:
- Deccie, ok, maybe not a bad idea to give another guy a taste of the action in a game thats gone; but surely better to go for Lordan or Andrews. Deccie really past it by now.
- His comments in the Echo, probably first real cricitism of team I've heard from him, but he still won't accept that he may have made mistakes.
- Can't agree with you re 4-5-1 being a good idea, it has never got us a good result.
- Refusing to acknowledge fans- need I say more.
- Away form.
- Treatment of certain players Tynan, S O'Flynn etc booted out.

Positives:
- His signings have been excellent, only a fool would deny that.
- Football at home is excellent, away from home we lack direction and leadership. Yet Murphy makes no changes in formation or starting line-up away, nor does he try and direct from the bench.
- Young players, more full-timers- agree with that too.

I agree with Conor74, about comparing him to Mick. Someone said a week or two ago that we are where we are despite Murphy, not because of him.

As for what Hecko said, I take his point, but i never had a great deal of time for Dave barry's management. He was like Jack Charlton- he had plan and it improved us, but it only lasted so long, wonderful and all as it was.

Not saying he's the worst manager in the world, but I don't think he's going to improve us as much as a better man could, and i think we deserve better as the biggest club in Ireland.

[Johnny]

I don't like resorting to name calling of other City fans, especially those on the internet, as they are obviously true fans as they are taking the time to air their views and don't just appear at big games. However, some people's constant sniping at the manager is just ****ing me off. I wonder how people like you would react if you followed Limerick. They are at the bottom of the first, playing in a decrepit ground in front of a 100 people every week.

City are playing good football at home. Away(for the record I've been at the 3 away league games) its not as good, but remember it still is only 3 games. They should have got something out of the Drogs game also.
It made sense to bring on Daly the other night to give him a run. No manager could reverse a 4-0 away from home anyway. Not acknowledging fans is hardly a hanging matter. If some choose to give u stick, why would u wave at them :confused:

7 out of 10 clubs in the league play in the greater Dublin area. It is conceivable that some team could only have 3 "real" away games if the fixtures fell their way. With each passing season it just gets harder for us and Derry with travelling.

[dalo]

Originally posted by Éanna



Not saying he's the worst manager in the world, but I don't think he's going to improve us as much as a better man could, and i think we deserve better as the biggest club in Ireland.

at this stage eanna's dislike of gunther is not to be taken totally seriously, it's almost a parody at this stage like gunther is not so much a real person as so much as some sort of cartoon figure or ironic catch cry -GUNTHER OUT!!!!, GEORGE OUT!!!! , DALO OUT !!! etc etc. i don't even think eanna can be taken too seriously when he goes on like this

to be honest i wouldn't be taking much of this pro and anti gunther stuff too seriously anymore, it's all a bit childish and at times veers on the slightly obessive.:rolleyes:

[patsh]

Originally posted by Johnny
I wonder how people like you would react if you followed Limerick. They are at the bottom of the first, playing in a decrepit ground in front of a 100 people every week.
It's interesting to bring up Limerick.
I, and a few hundred other pathetic souls, stood and watched City play the league cup match against Limerick out the cross a few short months ago, 10 of Feburary I think. It was, imo, the most abject, spineless, diabolical performance ever by any City side. During the game, I watched Gunther a lot, to see what he was doing, how he was reacting to the events on the field. His reaction was ...... ZERO. NOTHING. NOT A WORD.
He stood looking at the game without speaking, encouraging, shouting instructions. He stood there as if he was a spectator, with nothing to contribute.
Afterwards, he blamed the FANS for the defeat.
I think Murphy has done some good things for the club, made some good signings and I actually think he is a decent man who really tries hard. I am delighted with the clubs position at the moment, and would have been delighted to take this at the start of the season. In an off season thread about the future, I even predicted top 3 in the league and cup semis at least.
However, the Liam Murphy who stood on the line at that Limerick game is the same Liam Murphy standing on the line at the games now.
Face up to it, City are doing well in spite of Murphy, not because of him.

[Éanna]

Originally posted by dalo
at this stage eanna's dislike of gunther is not to be taken totally seriously, it's almost a parody at this stage like gunther is not so much a real person as so much as some sort of cartoon figure or ironic catch cry -GUNTHER OUT!!!!, GEORGE OUT!!!! , DALO OUT !!! etc etc. i don't even think eanna can be taken too seriously when he goes on like this
ooh get you :p OK, I accept, I went a bit over he op and personal re gunther before, but I've set out a list of reasons why I believe Murphy should not be city manager, and hardly any of you have managed to come up with answers to them, with the exceptions of Hecko and SOC.

[dalo]

Originally posted by Éanna

ooh get you :p OK, I accept, I went a bit over he op and personal re gunther before, but I've set out a list of reasons why I believe Murphy should not be city manager, and hardly any of you have managed to come up with answers to them, with the exceptions of Hecko and SOC.

i don't think gunther is the greatest thing since sliced bread (despite what what some people try to maintain). so far things have gone ok this season - no more no less. if we don't finish the season with a bit of acheivement then I think murphy should do the honourable thing and step down. to be honest he has in my view done ok enough, no more no less.

in first season with the club when dm got sacked he brought a lot of stablity to the club and a bit of pride back. last season things were pretty poor and i wonder how close was he to going were it not that lennox may needed some continuity.

i think liam's strengths are in man motivation and the training ground. he has done wonders with the youth setup but is obviously weak in the tactical area of things and does seem to have a tendacy to fall out with players. those that did get shunted out were in my view lightweights and were bringing the club no-where and are no great loss. however if say JOF was forced out then one would have to wonder what is going on

however I do reckon this will be his last season anyway and may call it a day next feb. he should certainly be kept on in the club in some meaningful capacity and i feel lennox may see it like thsi aswell.

until then i give 100% backing because the fact of the matter is there is no there is no alternative.

[patsh]

Originally posted by Éanna
Nice to see that the Murphy in camp is still resorting the mature tactic of name-calling :rolleyes:
That's quite funny really, Eanna.
Coming from a man who refers to an Irish player as a "knacker".:(

[dalo]

Originally posted by oddboy

That's quite funny really, Eanna.
Coming from a man who refers to an Irish player as a "knacker".:(

who would that be? Gary Breen:D

[Dricky]

Coming from a man who refers to an Irish player as a "knacker".

Well in fairness to Eanna a knacker is a trade and therefore a useful thing.


Gunther is not the manager, we need to bring the club through to being a full time outfit, he doesn't treat everyone the same, if he has a problem with a person/ team/ fans he should deal with it, we should be making money from the players he wants rid of. If he could act like a manager ALL the time and not be afraid to try things admit mistakes and learn from them he might have us on his side more.

What bugs me is the Murphy in people only pipe up when we lost.
I don't think we have been gifted with good managers, we had one chance with rico and granted he f*cked off but now is the time to move the club forward as a business, the saying should be reversed for CCFC
Employ monkeys and get peanuts

we want silverware instead thank you very much.

[Éanna]

Originally posted by oddboy
That's quite funny really, Eanna.
Coming from a man who refers to an Irish player as a "knacker".:(
I was discussing someone's behaviour when i made that comment, and it has nothing to do with this. Yet again it shows that most of the Murphy-In brigade have little to offer indefence of Gunther when they resort to picking people up on their comments rather than focusing on the topic.

I agree very much with what Dalo said- he certainly has qualities. I think the guy is an excellent coach, but not a good manager. He needs somebody over him to sort things out when they get sticky. I hope he can win some silverware this season and then quit at the top, that way we'll all be happy.

[James]

well from what i heard he could be gone regardless of results this season..

[dalo]

Originally posted by James
well from what i heard he could be gone regardless of results this season..

tell us more james:D yeah i do get the feeling it will be his last season alright

[patsh]

Originally posted by Éanna
I was discussing someone's behaviour when i made that comment, and it has nothing to do with this. Yet again it shows that most of the Murphy-In brigade have little to offer indefence of Gunther when they resort to picking people up on their comments rather than focusing on the topic.
Read the thread, Eanna. I have already made my thoughts clear on the topic of Liam Murphy.
You appear to be making a distinction that is all right to call people disgusting names like the one you used, when discussing someone's behaviour, but not discussing a topic ??
How do you work that out ?
You rightly condemed the chants directed at Tony O'Dowd about his brother. Would you feel it ok to chant that he is a "knacker" ?
It is ok for you to point out peoples comments, but not to be picked up on your own ?
I am one of the Murphy-in people ??
Pray tell how you arrived at that deduction?

You are very fast with accusations and deciding on what camps people are in. I'm very happy to discuss anything with you, as I think you are one of the more articulate people on the board, but sometimes think before you type

[pete]

Originally posted by James
well from what i heard he could be gone regardless of results this season..

Is Murphy in the last year of his contract? Can anyone remember? I thought he got a 2 year extension after the initial good run he had when he took over from DM?

If he is in the last year of his contract would he not be offered an extension before it finished if he was to stay?

[Éanna]

Originally posted by oddboy
You rightly condemed the chants directed at Tony O'Dowd about his brother. Would you feel it ok to chant that he is a "knacker" ?
During a game chanting at someone that they're a knacker (particularly the likes of o'dowd) would not offend me greatly. I accept (and i think I pointed it out earlier) that I had been over the top in my comments about gunther previously, but I think I rectified that. As for the other individual- I was (and still am) angry enough with him to feel full justification in calling him a knaker and worse.

[patsh]

Originally posted by Éanna
As for the other individual- I was (and still am) angry enough with him to feel full justification in calling him a knaker and worse.
Well that tells me a lot more about you than all your posts on this board. (The term you use, btw, would be subject to the same sanctions as terms like '******' etc.)

[Troy.McClure]

Id tatally agree with what Dalo said a few posts back.

I think that the main flaw in the "Murphy Out" camp is that they have no-one to replace him. We have heard things like "Someone like Stephen Kenny" in the past, which Im sure everyone would be happy with, but the fact is, there is only one Stephen Kenny and he will not leave Bohs for Cork until structural and financial changes are made. We're not going to get Pat Dolan for obvious reasons. The only recognised manager available is Damien "on a break from football" Richardson, who talks the talk but has won sweet FA with very good Cork, Shels and Rovers sides (ie the guy is not a winner). If some one can suggest someone who is better than Gunther, then Id listen, but until then we might as well let the guy finish what he started and keep on our upward progression.

[Éanna]

Originally posted by oddboy
Well that tells me a lot more about you than all your posts on this board. (The term you use, btw, would be subject to the same sanctions as terms like '******' etc.)

I'm not someone who would feel that much anger towards someone for any trivial reason, but in that particular case I felt it was fully justified. As for saying that word "knacker" is somehow equivalent to "******" - where did that come from? ****** is a racist insult, which I would never dream of using. Knacker isn't.

[James]

as for a replacement
i'd go with Rico

at least the managers notes in the programme would be a good read, and would bring extra income to the club through increased sales. ( now finding someone who could then understand or translate the said notes from Rico, would be an entirely different matter :) )

[Troy.McClure]

Originally posted by Éanna
****** is a racist insult, which I would never dream of using. Knacker isn't. :confused: :confused: :confused:

Ethnic insult maybe?

[Troy.McClure]

Originally posted by James
as for a replacement
i'd go with Rico

at least the managers notes in the programme would be a good read, and would bring extra income to the club through increased sales. ( now finding someone who could then understand or translate the said notes from Rico, would be an entirely different matter :) )

Well Inside Cork manages to translate it (although Im not too sure about understanding the guy).

He definatly sounds like a good manager, but he aint a winner. If we were happy enough to settle with 2nd or 3rd + Cup semis every year then fair enough, but I dont think that we are.

He's also the guy who moved Billy to left back, and Gaz into the centre (although theres only one person silly enough to keep him there) :p