Irish trio score for Sunderland

[mjpcc]

We have all goals on my site from EPL, CCC, L1, and L2 if you want them. www.footballclips.net/forum (Im just theworm2345 there). Just go to the CCC L1 L2 thread and request (I am shameless :o)

Thanks - I'll give it a try.

[Fergie's Son]

why keep picking o shea though when he has been very poor for the last couple of years for ireland ? Oh i forgot he plays for man utd so he must be good

It's not just that. A number of people rate him so it's not just because he "plays for United". But hey, if this makes you feel better then off you go.

O'Shea was very poor today against Arsenal so I'm not sure he should keep his place.

[Stuttgart88]

your having a laugh About what exactly?

You can apply exactly the same arugument, i.e., why keep picking Kav despite good club form, as he's consistently poor for Ireland? That's why I said it's frustrating. May I ask you: how do yiou think Kavanagh did in Cyprus last year? He was playing well for Wigan at the time.

Kav is as talented a midfielder as we have & I've admired him for years (not just since he signed for Sunderland) but I can recall only 2 games where he's done anything of note since Kerr recalled him : home to Brazil and home to Cyprus. You could maybe add that sh1tty friendly against China when he did OK as a sub.

And Carrick was anonymous on Wednesday & JO'S played well when he came on. Nothing controversial there.

As I've said countless times on here I would not pick JO'S in midfield. I've stated my reasoning countless times too. In fact yesterday's second half performance against Arsenal highlighted all my (& everyone else's) doubts about him. He was the main scapegoat among Unitred fans on the R5 phone-in after the game too.

[Stuttgart88]

Back to earth!

From today's Guardian:

With Graham Kavanagh unable to impose himself as he did in the wins at Derby and Leeds, Dean Whitehead a shadow and Liam Miller poor, Sunderland lost the midfield, and there was not enough composure or class to compensate.

[tetsujin1979]

Miller was at fault for the goal too, losing possession and Leicester went down the other end and scored.

[youngirish]

I agree that Kavanagh has had a few bad games for Ireland particularly recently but he's also been good on occassion. He also hasn't been given a decent run in the team. I don't see a problem with trying him in a few games instead of O'Shea who has always (and I mean always) been sh*te for Ireland. Worse than Kav. O' Shea has also got numerous chances to prove me wrong whereby Kav hasn't really got a fair crack.

For what it's worth O'Shea was sh*te for United yesterday. Rosicky had a laugh at him. I fear the worst if he plays next month. Try Reid and Kav in the centre or Reid and Carsely (if he's fit). Or even Reid and J O'Brien if he's back for Bolton.

[NeilMcD]

Reid and Carsley for me.

[Stuttgart88]

Any combination of people who actually play in central midfield would do me!

Despite my disappointment in Kavanagh's recent performances (he wasn't even able to deliver a dead ball well against Holland) we can't afford to disregard him. I'd have him ahead of O'Shea for sure but I doubt very much that management think the same.

4-2-3-1:

Finnan--Dunne--O'Brien --AN Other
---Reid---Carsley
Doyle--Kav--Duff
------Robbie----

[NeilMcD]

Interesting formation stuttgart would not rule it out though.

[zinedineontour]

About what exactly?

You can apply exactly the same arugument, i.e., why keep picking Kav despite good club form, as he's consistently poor for Ireland? That's why I said it's frustrating. May I ask you: how do yiou think Kavanagh did in Cyprus last year? He was playing well for Wigan at the time.

Kav is as talented a midfielder as we have & I've admired him for years (not just since he signed for Sunderland) but I can recall only 2 games where he's done anything of note since Kerr recalled him : home to Brazil and home to Cyprus. You could maybe add that sh1tty friendly against China when he did OK as a sub.

And Carrick was anonymous on Wednesday & JO'S played well when he came on. Nothing controversial there.

As I've said countless times on here I would not pick JO'S in midfield. I've stated my reasoning countless times too. In fact yesterday's second half performance against Arsenal highlighted all my (& everyone else's) doubts about him. He was the main scapegoat among Unitred fans on the R5 phone-in after the game too.

kav was no worse in cyrpus than anyone else .. at least he imposes himself in midfield and is not afraid of the ball like oshea .. his performance in germany was one of the worst i have ever seen in a green jersey . Watch the germany game and count how many successful passes he made and count how many he gave away ..

[ken foree]

Miller was at fault for the goal too, losing possession and Leicester went down the other end and scored.

it was a loose pass but, to be fair, the other sunderland midfielder stopped and put his hand up to apologize to miller for not reading the ball, and in doing so, let the leicester player surge on and create the shooting chance for their striker. very poor play and with a little concentration, the chance could've been snuffed out

[NeilMcD]

kav was no worse in cyrpus than anyone else .. at least he imposes himself in midfield and is not afraid of the ball like oshea .. his performance in germany was one of the worst i have ever seen in a green jersey . Watch the germany game and count how many successful passes he made and count how many he gave away ..

One of the worst, but not the worst as that award goes to Kevin Kilbane who is not a central midfielder and never will be. Time to keep him out on the wing as 3rd choice to Duffer and 3rd choice at left back possibly

[zinedineontour]

One of the worst, but not the worst as that award goes to Kevin Kilbane who is not a central midfielder and never will be. Time to keep him out on the wing as 3rd choice to Duffer and 3rd choice at left back possibly

yet at least kilbane has performed alright for ireland in the last couple of seasons unlike o shea. Why he is getting picked continously for Ireland when everyone can see he is underperforming is beyond me. He can get away with it for manu as he has enough good players around him to compensate for his lack of ability but for Ireland we need more than he can offer.

[NeilMcD]

I agree O Shea and Kilbane need to go from our centre midfield. Simple as that.

[OwlsFan]

I agree O Shea and Kilbane need to go from our centre midfield. Simple as that.

And you put in.......

[Stuttgart88]

And you put in.......

.......central midfielders.

Nobody's expecting a quality central midfield to emerge overnight. Realistically it'll be an underwhelming part of the team until the likes of Ireland, O'Brien & Garvan step into the fold.

But in Carsley, Kavanagh, Miller, Reid, Douglas, McPhail etc. we have guys who've played central midfield all their lives. Ireland has never looked out of his depth to date & Andy Reid is comfortable there (many argue it's where he's best). Yet we persist in a combination of an elegant defender & a hard working winger. Sure, Ryan Giggs plays well centrally, but he's ten times the footballer that Kilbane is.

I actually share your reasonably positive assessment of Germany. Certain players played well and certain aspects of the team functioned well. But without a functional central midfield players like Robbie & Duff will always underperform.

[shakermaker1982]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who doesn't wanna see a central pairing of O'Shea and Kilbane!

I'd be happy enough with the following midfield systems and players:


1: Duff A Reid S Reid MacGeady


2: Duff A Reid Kavanagh S Reid MacGeady/Doyle

system 2 would be how Chelski used to play last season with Keane up top. I cannot space the system correctly in this post for some reason!!! Aston Villa use it at the moment and they have impressed me each time I have seen them play this season.


O'Shea and Kilbane can fill in at left back. Anywhere else and they are a major liability to the team IMO.