Germany v Ireland - Post match

[thejollyrodger]

we dont have the players anymore... say goodbye to the Euro 2008 ... only chance we will ever have of qualifying for that is if we host it :D :D :D

[Plastic Paddy]

We were hardly helped tonight by a real "homer" of a ref... :rolleyes:

and I'm yet to be convinced that Schweinsteiger is anything other than German for "pig f*cker". :eek:

:ball: PP

[EnDai]

Watching as a neutral, who couldn't really care if Ireland won 1-0, or lost 10-0:

Ireland were very poor - especially in the midfield. Where was the supposed tallismanic captain? Invisible at best. Shay Given is the sole man on the pitch to be thanked for not losing my any more, lest we forget Germany hit the woodwork twice and firced Shay into several superb saves. What did Ireland make Lehman do?

Doyle looked the more dangerous of the forwards, a difficult task given the service that was being provided by the midfield. Kilbane was poor, O'Shea was worse. Probably the guts of £1,000,000 a week in wages in the English leagues there in green shirts, and couldn't pass the ball - quality!

[DmanDmythDledge]

Staunton proved himself to be an idiot again. Took off Duff for Alan O'Brien. Keane should have gone off as well. He is clearly a man who knows nothing about football.

The performance was shocking. I don't know how Kilbane has managed 37 straight games for Ireland. Nobody had a great game apart from Given, but Kilbane's performance stood out for me.

[Plastic Paddy]

Watching as a neutral, who couldn't really care if Ireland won 1-0, or lost 10-0:

Really? Are you not Irish? :confused:

:ball: PP

[EnDai]

I am. I have my reasons, but going into anything like that here will be way off topic. Merely mentioned the neutral aspect as I was not watching through green tinted lenses.

[Plastic Paddy]

Fair nuff - your call. FWIW I don't think any of us were watching through the oul' green-tinted specs either...

:ball: PP

[Soper]

Hoof hoof hoof, the answer to our problems.Gosh, it was bad enough, but in the last few minutes they didn't even try...near the end our defence were just standing in our box while giving was kicking it up the field.Bad

[theleprechaun]

lads, i will admit that i am a little more than disappointed now. we played badly for most of the game but then we did not get the luck also. and if there is a positive it is that we played with something that resembled spirit for the first 25 minutes. but then again we lost and losing is losing at the end of the day. we are now up against it to qualify.

[Hither green]

Well having polished up my green tinted spectacles especially for tonight I thought I’d be more angry to lose but as it turns out the performance brought back memories of playing under McCarthy. I agree with those that said they’re not sure they could stand much more after half time but then that’s what it was often like under Mick - clinging on to a goal lead or desperately pumping the ball forward for a late equaliser – all hanging on to the edge of your seats sort of stuff. Except, and I never thought I’d say this, but without a Keane – or in fact any midfield at all. We’ve really got to sort out central midfield.

It would have been nice to have seen more composure on the ball, perhaps playing the ball out from the back instead of Given pumping it forward. Not convinced by Finnan on the left, would have rather O’Shea or even Kilbane. Morrison would have been an interesting addition up front, I know he doesn’t have many supporters on this site but unlike the rest of Ireland’s attacking line-up he’s quite good at holding the ball up and I think we lacked that tonight. And yes the ref was a complete “homer”, and the linesmen weren’t much better, but what do you expect?

Duff coming off was a shock but quite pleased to see Staunton bring on players like Alan O’Brien and McGeady – that’s more than Kerr ever risked (although thinking about it I think Alan O’Brien with his speed is better suited to starting a match and we need Duff when we're trying to pick a defence when a team's sitting back defending a lead.

All in all, disappointed but I’m not inclined to call from Staunton’s head yet.

[Soper]

Oh no......

Staunton happy with Irish display
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/internationals/5307024.stm

Jesus wept, when will he learn.

[yablazer]

anyone else worried by stan's post match interview on rte. yes it was an improvement on the dutch game and yes we played with pride and passion, but there is no way you can call that a "magnificent performance". he didnt say one thing about the football, just resorted to overused generalisations about how the lads played with pride, 1 to 14 wer brilliant, the fans wer magnificent etc, tho poor interviewing by con murphy didnt help. stans lack of expierience was v evident in his touch line behaviour, cud really hav done with BR on the touchline tonight. I'm willing to giv him a chance, but 2nite has not done much to convince me he's up to the job.

[brine3]

given - 9
finnan - 7
o'brien - 7
dunne - 8
carr - 6
duffer - 7
kilbane - 5
o'shea - 4
reid - 6
doyle - 8
keane - 6

you won't win matches by playing two central midfielders who aren't central midfielders.

[brine3]

tho poor interviewing by con murphy didnt help.

murphy did ask why he took off duff.

"to change things" was the answer. great tactical insight there

when are we going to get a manager with some (successful) top level experience

[tricky_colour]

Let's face it, it's not the end of the world, we lost 1:0 a score we would have settled for after the 4:0 drubbing, we were unlucky with the deflection and
I think Kloser may have been marginally offside anyway. There are not many teams in the group who will come away with a better result.

[DeNiro]

We're horrifically poor in centre mid. It's amazing how Staunton can't see that Kilbane is not up to. You can play a player hoping he'll give a good performance. Since the game in Paris he's done nothing in a green shirt - except smile stupidly. Everton haven't sold him for no reason either. The only positive I see out of tonight is we'll have a new man on the line for the next game or two. I hope it's BR. If it's Pat Devlin it goes to show what a shambles it truly is. Imagine Pat Devlin plotting to beat Germany for the last 20 mins or so. Real Bray Wanderers stuff.

Team for Cyprus

Given

Carr (did well tonight it has to be said)

Dunne

O'Brien (seriously needs football)

Finnan

McGeady

Miller (I say this only because Keane will have a profound effect on him)

Reid. (Last chance saloon)

Duff

Keane

Doyle (outstanding tonight)

Options
McPhail and Andy Reid have to come into the picture. We need ball players. John O'Shea has had it. A move from Man Utd and a settled position would benefit him. Alan O'Brien looks an option.

The lack of friendlies during the summer is looking a costly mistake!

[Hither green]

given - 9
finnan - 7
o'brien - 7
dunne - 8
carr - 6
duffer - 7
kilbane - 5
o'shea - 4
reid - 6
doyle - 8
keane - 6

In fairness I'd have Keane slightly higher, yes he missed a few but spent most of the time in midfield trying to do their creative job for them and the Germans were finding him a handful.

And Kilbane, until the commentators mentioned him towards the end I'd actually forgotten that he was on the pitch.


you won't win matches by playing two central midfielders who aren't central midfielders.

Couldn't agree more. But then who else is there. Never thought I'd be pleased to see Carsley make himself available again.

[Emmet]

murphy did ask why he took off duff.

"to change things" was the answer. great tactical insight there

when are we going to get a manager with some (successful) top level experience


Duff's attacking contribution was hardly awe-inspiring ... taking him off was a sound move imo - we're in a bad enough way as it is. We don't need to be carrying anyone's ego or reputation

[brine3]

Couldn't agree more. But then who else is there. Never thought I'd be pleased to see Carsley make himself available again.

well, there's steven reid, who plays centre midfield week in week out for blackburn rovers. we could have played him in the centre, and aiden mcgeady, who plays on the right week in week out for celtic on the right. who would partner reid in the centre? perhaps kavanagh, but i'd go for stephen ireland, a player who puts his foot on the ball, looks up and passes to an open player

is it just me or is being ireland manager not really that difficult but we keep appointing imbeciles? play players in their natural positions!

[-Bray-]

To the third best team in the world on their own patch and to a fluke goal and that makes us **** and shambolic?

Get a grip ffs

[Emmet]

[QUOTE=brine3;527861]
is it just me or is being ireland manager not really that difficult but we keep appointing imbeciles? QUOTE]

:D :D

[Soper]

It wasn't the loss, it was the manner of it, as is clear by most peoples posts.

[-Bray-]

Look at our team. The arrogance of people expecting us to be world beaters. We have an average squad FACT.

[JayC90]

Is that you Steve? No wait, Steve's from Dundalk.

[Emmet]

A lot of the players looked short of confidence which is entirely understandable given what happened last month. My biggest gripe would be with Duff who I think is our most talented player but who is playing well within himself. I think the majority of players put in a lot of effort - a lot more than against the Dutch certainly - and you're right, the goal was a fluke. But the Germans had a lot of other good opportunities and could have scored a lot more. I think a good performance and result against Cyprus could help boost the players' confidence. There's still a long way to go.

[DmanDmythDledge]

You got to look beyond the scoreline. We were crap. The fact that Germany weren't great kept the scoreline as low as it was.

[tricky_colour]

Regarding the free kick, what was Robbie doing where he was? Yes it was a deflection which could have gone anywhere, and found the one uncovered spot, but he was not in the wall and standing where he was was 'inviting' that to happen.

[Emmet]

Was there anything from tonight we can take comfort from? That was near enough our strongest team ...

[DmanDmythDledge]

Kilbane will be dropped.

[Scratchy]

We didn't lose by 4 or 5.

[brine3]

it wasn't our strongest team, we had a failed left-winger and a failed centre-back as a midfield partnership

however, there are positives:

- we only lost 1-0 away to germany
- the defensive partnership of dunne/o'brien did the business
- we have a world class goalkeeper
- in kevin doyle we have a striker can hold on to the ball
- carr is not as bad as i thought he would be, although he wasn't really tested
- finnan did o.k. at left back
- mcgeady looked good when he came on

negatives:

- we have a manager who is building a midfield partnership around o'shea and kilbane
- we can't pass the ball around properly (due mostly to o'shea and kilbane in midfield)
- the manager said everyone was magnificent, when o'shea was at sea and kilbane was average

there's really only one negative point to take away from this match, and the manager can't see it, which is worrying

[tricky_colour]

On another point I notice there were no replays of contraversial decisions which went against the Irish players, I presume this was because it was a German 'video feed' and they didn't what to show anything 'embarassing'?

[tricky_colour]

If it was a home match we probably would have won!! The Germans will be kacking their Lederhosen at the though of the return leg :D

[joema]

Positive: Kevin Doyle - top class tonight

[JayC90]

To the third best team in the world
They are obviously not the third best in the world. I assume you are basing this bold claim on their World Cup performance, the World Cup they were hosting, and discarding the numerous factors that enabled them to reach the semi finals. Having the home support and the easier side of the draw certainly counts for a lot. You can't judge a team on their performance in one tournament. Performances change for every match, but I suppose you would say that Lithuania drew with the best team in the world tonight, so therefore they are joint best teams, yeah?


on their own patch
We had 12,000 fans out there and I don't know about you, but I thought the atmosphere was brilliant. If that doesn't lift the players from a disgraceful, lifeless performance, then I don't know what will. But don't worry, you seem to have reassured me that we will beat them on our 'own patch'.


to a fluke goal
Germany had countless chances, including hitting the woodwork twice. They deserved to get a goal (although not against Given, who I feel will need to be on top form for every single match we play in this campaign) and if they hadn't got a goal there, they would have pushed on for one until they did. We got 2 chances at best, couldn't keep the ball. Any time the ball came near Dunne he just thumped it away to start another German attack. Staunton took off Duff and gave his reason as "you have to change things when you are chasing a game". Just one spark from Duff would have turned the game, and he had already got two of their players booked and created our best free kick of the match. The man is a joke for the reasons Dunphy pointed out, and kicking the bottles to make it seem like he was doing something was just sad to see.

A loss is a loss, 1-0 or 3-0, it doesn't matter. Our performance was appalling, and it's nonsense to say we have average players and accept the defeat. Our whole team plays in the Premiership, we should be beating teams like Germany and Czech Rep. Not putting a gloss on a terrible display. Apparently though we shouldn't be depressed - our performance was "magnificent".

[JayC90]

The fact that Doyle played so well, meaning we shouldn't see Clinton Morrison back for a while is the only positive I can find. Shay Given too, but he's not going to win us matches on his own, only stop us from losing them.

[Student Mullet]

Does anyone else object to Duffers agent being stand in Ireland manager?

[brine3]

On another point I notice there were no replays of contraversial decisions which went against the Irish players, I presume this was because it was a German 'video feed' and they didn't what to show anything 'embarassing'?

it's the same whenever germany play at home. against argentina in the world cup ballack made a blatant handball in the box, no replay. if you don't do any replays it doesn't get analysed at half/full time either

i thought the tv direction was awful. they hardly showed the match at all. when ireland had the ball all we got was shots of the crowd and replays of german shots

[sligoman]

Kavanagh should have been in for O'Shea in centre mid. At least he's a midfielder, O'Shea is clearly not. The incident where Staunton kicked the bottle, I do agree it should have been a penalty or (at least) a free from just before it.

Shay Given should be captain, he's the only player who consistently performs for us and keeps us in so many games, legend! Very unfortunate to have conceded tonight after pulling off some brilliant saves.

[dynamo kerry]

I don't hve any problem with stan subbing duff. damien isn't playing so well that it makes me mad he is taken off. big deal. are you all the same folk who didn't know who he was prior to his sub appearance v. portugal in 2001?

point is stan made a judgement call which is his right as manager. at least he's trying something different. to be hoenst I expected this team to lose by the odd goal tonight.. it's the hardest tie for them in the group and it's over. let's move on.

yoou are right on one thing though.. it was sad to see him so ****ed off at the end and kicking bottle

as for duff: he does win frees but have you noticed that the best wingers in the world don't just get fouled - they get past people and put crosses in.. duff hasn't been getting by people for a while. lets be honest.. maybe he just isn't as good as we all hoped/thought (me included)

edit: we should be beating germany and czech rep? what a competley ludicrous statement. we shoul dbe compteing perhaps but to assume victory. sorry for this but you are making comments more usually associated with muppets.

[as_i_say]

so he'll be helping us to draw more games then?

slovaks beating cyprans 6-1 is ominous, as i say.

[plasticpitch]

Thought steven reid played well when he moved into the middle.
he is the only midfield player we have that is not afraid to put himself about.
also he went looking for the ball when he moved into midfield.
i think we played better when the germans scored not cause they sat back but because reid moved into the middle
the o brien lad from newcastle has great pace.
disappointed but not down hearted.
ps stans left foot looks like its still in good working order:D

[pete]

Positive: Kevin Doyle - top class tonight

Anyone else notice how Ray Houghton biased against him & seemed to be nit picking in direct contrast to Liam Brady?

Ireland lucky not to lose 3-0.
No shot on target in 90 minutes.
Lot of huff and puff, long balls, no real obvious plan.

[pete]

Bizarre is the only way to describe.

Duff - McGeady
Kilbane - O'Brien
Doyle - Elliot.

I know Duff wasn't have a great game but he did have 3 germans on him each time (every manager now knows how to kill irish attacks) & if changed tactics could have made space for him.

Doyle was one of the better players & O'Brien was clueless when he came on.

:rolleyes:

[Dodge]

Only reason I can thnk of for taking off Doyle was he was tred after working his nuts off the entire game. i doubt it but its the only possible thing I can think off.

[eirebhoy]

Ireland lucky not to lose 3-0.
No shot on target in 90 minutes.
We may not have had a shot on target but Keane and Dunne should easily have scored from 2 free headers.

[Schumi]

Bizarre is the only way to describe.

Duff - McGeady
Kilbane - O'Brien
Doyle - Elliot.

Agreed. Bringing McGeady and Elliot on were the right moves but Reid and Keane should have come off. Neither were doing anything and Doyle and Duff looked like they had the potential to make something happen. O'Brien coming on was last throw of the dice type move so I don't have any real quibble with that and Kilbane was useless anyway.

I'm a little more optimistic than most here (probably the atmosphere at the match made it seem better). The defence was quite solid with Dunne and Given superb. The midfield was awful and that stopped us from being able to do anything going forward as there was no supply. A midfield of Reid and maybe Kavanagh if he improves on the Dutch performance might do better against the weaker teams in the group; enough to give Doyle and Keane some chance of scoring anyway.

[pete]

Given 9
Carr 7
O'Brien 7
Dunne 8
Finnan 7
Reid 4
O'Shea 4
Kilbane 4
Duff 6
Doyle 8
Keane 6

Subs barely touched the ball.

Yes only losing 1 nil in Germany looks good but only looking at the scoreline will delude you. Getting sent off in an international match is idiotic - who will sit on the bench for the next games?

Why no friendly on wednesday? We have yet to play an away friendly with Staunton.

[German_Tim]

Good game and great atmosphere from both sides. Ireland started well and had a good scoring opportunity by Robbie Keane...but couldn't continue to play on this high level, as Germany found its rhythm and stepped up the pace.

I think it was a big mistake from Steve Staunton to start with O'Shea & Reid in the central midfield, as they never could create real pressure on this new German defence! IMO the better choice for this position would have been Robbie Keane & Reid or McGeady & Reid. You have to improve your attacking performance for the next quali games, then you surely have got a good chance to defeat the Czechs and Slovakians! It seems to me that you need some kind of a playmaker and I think that Robbie Keane or Aiden McGeady would be the right choice.

Unfortunately the Czechs reached a lucky, late win against Wales...but nothing is lost for you yet! Good luck for the next matches!

[DeNiro]

Why no friendly on wednesday? We have yet to play an away friendly with Staunton.[/QUOTE]

Good point. I see Wales are playing Brazil on Tuesday. Surely we could have got Argentina seeing as they are in London at present. I think issues like this only highlight how wrong Staunton is for the job. It's a full time job so he's getting paid to look after the team, I suspect this would include mentioning possible friendly games. I remember in 2003 we organised a game v Turkey at relatively short notice (maybe a month or so before)!