Advice on the Laws of the Game

[rambler14]

The goal scored by Cousin, should this be allowed to stand:
http://videos.sapo.pt/aYJVrc2gZzNVwFuZqu8N

Cause the ref blew the whistle and Marney picked up the ball after it was blown.

Nothing wrong with it.

The ball is dead until it's kicked! So technically Marney could have picked it up and thrown it to the fella who hit the free and then re-placed it.

[TheBoss]

That is what I thought in the first place but something is telling me, once the ref blows the whistle, the ball is in play.

[The Ref]

The goal scored by Cousin, should this be allowed to stand:
http://videos.sapo.pt/aYJVrc2gZzNVwFuZqu8N

Cause the ref blew the whistle and Marney picked up the ball after it was blown.

Goal is legal, Law 13 provides that the ball is not in play until it is kicked and moves. The referee blowing his whistle is nothing more than a signal to inform players that he is happy that the kick may be taken.

[celticlads]

hi i am just wondering what is the story with the jerseys in the munster junior cup, is it the home team or away team that change. not sure about this as i think it is different rules for different competitions.

[The Ref]

hi i am just wondering what is the story with the jerseys in the munster junior cup, is it the home team or away team that change. not sure about this as i think it is different rules for different competitions.

Not familiar with MFA rules so I checked their website.

Rule 5 States "Players in each competing team must wear the registered colours of the club for which they are playing except when opposing teams have similar colours, in which case the visiting team shall have choice. A goalkeeper must wear a shirt or sweater of different colour, provided that said shirt or sweater is of a colour distinctive from that of his opponents. Referees shall have power to instruct a player to change his shirt or sweater if they consider the colours not quite distinctive from that of his opponents. Referees shall have the power to deal with any player refusing to comply with their instruction in this respect."

So according to this visiting teams have choice.

[TheBoss]

A query about the penalty Ireland got, it appears the Georgian player changes his mind about handballing it, so could the ref give a foul for intent to handball or does it not exist, since intent is used for most fouls.

[snams]

Hi The Ref!
Can you give me any idea what's happening after you fill in a form for Referee School of Excellence?
Thanks!

[Jock MIB]

Hi The Ref!
Can you give me any idea what's happening after you fill in a form for Referee School of Excellence?
Thanks!

You have entered the Dark Side and there is no return :D

[rambler14]

Should Stillian Petrov have been sent-off for handling on the line vs Everton in the FA Cup even though Everton scored from the rebound?

I think he should!

[the 12 th man]

Should Stillian Petrov have been sent-off for handling on the line vs Everton in the FA Cup even though Everton scored from the rebound?

I think he should!

I'm not sure the officials spotted it as I think the refs view was obscured.

[rambler14]

I'm not sure the officials spotted it.

What if they did and were just playing advantage?

I know they didn't spot it like!

[the 12 th man]

What if they did and were just playing advantage?

I know they didn't spot it like!


Well if they were playing advantage the ref would have gone and red or at least yellow carded him after the goal.

[daz22]

Could you qoute me the rule about referees and permission to let people enter the field of play??

[The Ref]

Could you qoute me the rule about referees and permission to let people enter the field of play??

In what context,

Is it a player, substitution, physio, manager, spectator?

[daz22]

In what context,

Is it a player, substitution, physio, manager, spectator?


Manager and a person who is an coach who not on the card

[sligo23]

I had a game during the week and at one point a shot was taken from outside the box, our keep wasn't too confident about catching it so he palmed it down infront of him, it bounced once and then he caught it. I taught this was alright but the ref blew up and gave an indirect freekick to them, and said he couldn't do that. Was he right?? Is there a rule on that??

[rambler14]

I had a game during the week and at one point a shot was taken from outside the box, our keep wasn't too confident about catching it so he palmed it down infront of him, it bounced once and then he caught it. I taught this was alright but the ref blew up and gave an indirect freekick to them, and said he couldn't do that. Was he right?? Is there a rule on that??

No.....i'd say that referee was on the take!

[daz22]

Any League of Irelands Referees on here?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Im doing a thesis on referees on whether they contribute to home advantage. I need referee assessor sheets from league of Ireland games to measure it for my study? no manes used in study , everything is strictly confidential. please help if can????

[sligo23]

No.....i'd say that referee was on the take!
I was thinking that meself:p:mad:

[The Ref]

Manager and a person who is an coach who not on the card

Manager and coach must stay in the technical area (as if in Junior football)

In the interpertation of the Laws of the Game it provides:

Team officials
If a team official enters the field of play:
• the referee must stop play (although not immediately if the team official does not interfere with play or if the advantage can be applied)
• the referee must have him removed from the field of play and if his behaviour is irresponsible, the referee must expel him from the field of play and its immediate surroundings
• if the referee stops the match, he must restart play with a dropped ball in the position where the ball was at the time when the match was stopped, unless play was stopped inside the goal area, in which case the referee drops the ball on the goal area line parallel to the goal line at the point nearest to where the ball was located when play was stopped

[The Ref]

I had a game during the week and at one point a shot was taken from outside the box, our keep wasn't too confident about catching it so he palmed it down infront of him, it bounced once and then he caught it. I taught this was alright but the ref blew up and gave an indirect freekick to them, and said he couldn't do that. Was he right?? Is there a rule on that??

Back in 1992/3 season when this Law was changed this caused a lot of problems. I remember the referees seminar when John Scanlon explained this rule that he spent over an hour dealing with it. A number of Referee Society branch meeting were taken up arguing about it.

Law 12 provides:

An indirect free kick is awarded to the opposing team if a goalkeeper, inside his own penalty area, commits any of the following four offences:

• controls the ball with his hands for more than six seconds before releasing it from his possession
• touches the ball again with his hands after he has released it from his possession and before it has touched another player
• touches the ball with his hands after it has been deliberately kicked to him by a team-mate
• touches the ball with his hands after he has received it directly from a throw-in taken by a team-mate

If the referee deemed that the goalkeeper released the ball from his possession when he palmed it down i.e. the goalkeeper could have held and was palming it down to waste time, then theoretically a free kick could be given. In practice, from the way you explain it, I wouldn't have given it.

[Subprime]

Back in 1992/3 season when this Law was changed this caused a lot of problems. I remember the referees seminar when John Scanlon explained this rule that he spent over an hour dealing with it. A number of Referee Society branch meeting were taken up arguing about it.

Law 12 provides:

An indirect free kick is awarded to the opposing team if a goalkeeper, inside his own penalty area, commits any of the following four offences:

• controls the ball with his hands for more than six seconds before releasing it from his possession
• touches the ball again with his hands after he has released it from his possession and before it has touched another player
• touches the ball with his hands after it has been deliberately kicked to him by a team-mate
• touches the ball with his hands after he has received it directly from a throw-in taken by a team-mate

If the referee deemed that the goalkeeper released the ball from his possession when he palmed it down i.e. the goalkeeper could have held and was palming it down to waste time, then theoretically a free kick could be given. In practice, from the way you explain it, I wouldn't have given it.

:confused: If as Sligo23 says he "palmed" the ball down, does that not imply that the keeper has 1. controlled the ball, 2. directed it to where he has control and 3. taken the ball back into his control before touching another player? This as opposed to the GK being allowed to bounce the ball from his hands so long as he releases the ball within the 6 second rule!

[sligo23]

What are your toughts on the two CL semi-finals Ref??

[Subprime]

What are your toughts on the two CL semi-finals Ref??

The first ref had a good game. Last night the ref was harsh in the sending off because the Chelsea player tripped over his own feet. Replayed it a number of times and the defender did clip his heel, the attacker moved one step forward and then you can see his right foot connect with his left and down he goes. There was a defender coming from the left who could have intercepted and that makes it a hairline decision for the ref. Both claims for handball were invalid as the law is hand to ball not ball to hand and always the intention has to be taken into account. That's my opinion on the 2 refs. As for Chelsea, they did not play there own usual game and always seemed uncomfortable, fair play to Barca they had what Chelsea lacked - determination to win. :ball:

[renovater]

if a match is fixed for 7pm a team is late due to traffic.
arrives 6.45 on the pitch 7pm is the team entitled to warm up in the interest of the welfare of the players?

[Subprime]

if a match is fixed for 7pm a team is late due to traffic.
arrives 6.45 on the pitch 7pm is the team entitled to warm up in the interest of the welfare of the players?
In Clare they don't allow any late start, referee can pick up the ball and walk away. It has happened to us on a couple of occasions when teams were late arriving.

[gunner1]

if a match is fixed for 7pm a team is late due to traffic.
arrives 6.45 on the pitch 7pm is the team entitled to warm up in the interest of the welfare of the players?

if a match is fixed for 7.00pm then that is the starting time, the rest is down to the referees discression.

[celticlads]

lads just wondering can we be forced to play a cup final in the oppositions home ground. we are in 2 cup finals and agreed to play in said venue if we could play the 2 games there but as this was not accommodated we said we want it neutral, can we be forced to play in their home?

[murphs jewels]

Lads if a player has picked up 2 yellow cards in previous games and ends up getting sent off for two yellow cards in the next game, is this now counted as 4 yellow cards for the season and does he then go back to scratch. And therefore if he is suspended for the sending off should he serve a further game for 4 yellow cards, or does he only get credited for 1 yellow as a result of the dismissal :confused: :confused:.These circumstances would refer to the Mayo League rules, in case you were wondering.

[girlinblack]

Hiya lads,

Unfortunately, both of your questions relate to league rules, rather than the Laws of the Game. Neither situation is something the referees have any control over or can get involved in.

In the case of the cup game, while we would all say that this situation is not ideal, the administrators may be well within their rights. Request a copy of the rules pertaining to this cup competition from your league secretary (or from the FAI if it is a national cup).

In the case of the yellow cards, the referees just give them & then report it. What happens after that in Disciplinary Committees etc does not involve us. Again, get a copy of the league rules from your secretary.

In both cases, if your leagues have websites, the rules may be available for download there.

HTH!
GiB

[The Ref]

What are your toughts on the two CL semi-finals Ref??

Roberto Rosetti who refereed the Man Utd v Arsenal game had a fine game - except for tthe Darren Fletcher incident. Massive mistake, perfect challenge - if a coach ever wants to see a perfect challenge to show his players that was it.

Tom Henning who was in charge of the Chelsea v Barcelona had a couple of big calls;

The sending off, the referees assistant had a better view and he can be seen asking the assistant off? as he makes his way to the player.

Pique's handball - in my view the ball hit his chest and then his hand, not deliberate - no penalty

Eto's handball - raised his arms, ball hit his side and his raised arm - not deliberate - no penalty

Ballacks handball - ball to hand - not deliberate - no penalty

In saying that when I saw the two Chelsea shouts at first, I thought they were penalties.

[The Ref]

if a match is fixed for 7pm a team is late due to traffic.
arrives 6.45 on the pitch 7pm is the team entitled to warm up in the interest of the welfare of the players?

This is down to league rules, common sense would say allow players have a warm up, but most leagues don't actually provide for this, therefore the referee is quite entitled to walk away at the kick-off time if both teams aren't ready.

[The Ref]

Lads if a player has picked up 2 yellow cards in previous games and ends up getting sent off for two yellow cards in the next game, is this now counted as 4 yellow cards for the season and does he then go back to scratch. And therefore if he is suspended for the sending off should he serve a further game for 4 yellow cards, or does he only get credited for 1 yellow as a result of the dismissal :confused: :confused:.These circumstances would refer to the Mayo League rules, in case you were wondering.

As Girlinblack said, its league rules, but this interpretation is fairly common around were I referee.

I was asked once for a straight red instead of a second yellow as the player would serve a one match ban for the straight red, but two for 5 yellows and one for the red card (which he knew he was getting)

[Jock MIB]

Roberto Rosetti who refereed the Man Utd v Arsenal game had a fine game - except for tthe Darren Fletcher incident. Massive mistake, perfect challenge - if a coach ever wants to see a perfect challenge to show his players that was it.


i bet you if your were in his shoes at that moment of time to make the call you will give penalty 9/10 times so call it a massive mistake is a bit over the top, a misjudgement yes but not a massive mistake

[The Ref]

Roberto Rosetti who refereed the Man Utd v Arsenal game had a fine game - except for tthe Darren Fletcher incident. Massive mistake, perfect challenge - if a coach ever wants to see a perfect challenge to show his players that was it.



i bet you if your were in his shoes at that moment of time to make the call you will give penalty 9/10 times so call it a massive mistake is a bit over the top, a misjudgement yes but not a massive mistake

My initial reaction to the Darren Fletcher incident was excellent tackle, he clearly got the ball as it can be seen moving in a different path.

Watch here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSGPP_zk4AY&feature=related

Still think it was a massive mistake.

[Jock MIB]

My initial reaction to the Darren Fletcher incident was excellent tackle, he clearly got the ball as it can be seen moving in a different path.

Watch here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSGPP_zk4AY&feature=related

Still think it was a massive mistake.

I said his shoes, look at his position yours as a viewer on tv is different, his was virtually directly behind. And this clearly got he ball was the smallest of touches it just touch his toe, he put in a stupid challenge that didn't need to be done. I will stick by my statement you would have given 9/10 if you were in his shoes

[The Ref]

I said his shoes, look at his position yours as a viewer on tv is different, his was virtually directly behind. And this clearly got he ball was the smallest of touches it just touch his toe, he put in a stupid challenge that didn't need to be done. I will stick by my statement you would have given 9/10 if you were in his shoes

Yes the referee was virtually straight behind, here is a great view of what happened and the referees position. He could clearly see that the ball moved to the right and the most probable way was Fletcher's tackle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5TraopMTew&feature=related

2m17s in.

And no, I would not have given a penalty.

[Jock MIB]

Yes the referee was virtually straight behind, here is a great view of what happened and the referees position. He could clearly see that the ball moved to the right and the most probable way was Fletcher's tackle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5TraopMTew&feature=related

2m17s in.

And no, I would not have given a penalty.

Jesus if you could have seen darren get the slightest toe touch from directly behind you must have x ray vision and must never get a call wrong when your officiating... you should go for uefa standard they need perfect refs like yerself

[gunner1]

Jesus if you could have seen darren get the slightest toe touch from directly behind you must have x ray vision and must never get a call wrong when your officiating... you should go for uefa standard they need perfect refs like yerself

i have to agree, hindsight is a great thing.but as a ref you have a split second to make up your mind.

[gunner1]

Yes the referee was virtually straight behind, here is a great view of what happened and the referees position. He could clearly see that the ball moved to the right and the most probable way was Fletcher's tackle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5TraopMTew&feature=related

2m17s in.

And no, I would not have given a penalty.

and you would have been wrong,.yes he got a touch on the ball, but he then proceeded to take the player down and stop a goal scoring opportunity.take off your red glasses and look at it as a referee........

[The Ref]

and you would have been wrong,.yes he got a touch on the ball, but he then proceeded to take the player down and stop a goal scoring opportunity.take off your red glasses and look at it as a referee........

A penalty is a direct free kick for an offence that occured in the defenders own box.

For a direct free kick to be awarded he must commit one of the ten listed offences. The one in this case:

tackles an opponent to gain possession of the ball, making contact with the opponent before touching the ball

In this instance, Darren Fletcher touched the ball before touching the opponent, therefore there is no offence. Jock MIB did not disagree (I think)with me on that point, he was arguing that referee could not have seen the touch.

[The Ref]

Jesus if you could have seen darren get the slightest toe touch from directly behind you must have x ray vision and must never get a call wrong when your officiating... you should go for uefa standard they need perfect refs like yerself

Jock MIB, I get plenty of decissions wrong, I think that the ball moved enough for the referee, or at least his Assistant, to see it.

No point in having an argument over a public fourm, PM if you want to continue this debate.

[Jock MIB]

A penalty is a direct free kick for an offence that occured in the defenders own box.

For a direct free kick to be awarded he must commit one of the ten listed offences. The one in this case:

tackles an opponent to gain possession of the ball, making contact with the opponent before touching the ball

In this instance, Darren Fletcher touched the ball before touching the opponent, therefore there is no offence. Jock MIB did not disagree (I think)with me on that point, he was arguing that referee could not have seen the touch.

My point is the referee couldn't see him touching it but what he saw was a player putting in a stupid meaningless tackle from slightly behind that if you had the same situation you would call 9 times out of ten a penalty. So i'm saying in hindsight it would be a slight misjudgement but not the blown up massive mistake that you made it out to be

[The Ref]

i have to agree, hindsight is a great thing.but as a ref you have a split second to make up your mind.

I agree hindsight is a great thing and he had a split second to make up his mind, an honest decision but incorrect.


My point is the referee couldn't see him touching it but what he saw was a player putting in a stupid meaningless tackle from slightly behind that if you had the same situation you would call 9 times out of ten a penalty. So i'm saying in hindsight it would be a slight misjudgement but not the blown up massive mistake that you made it out to be

Would you have given a penalty if you had the TV view? I suspect not.

I believe it was a massive mistake from Darren Fletchers and Manchester United's perspective, but see above, I do believe it was an honest mistake.

[Jock MIB]

I agree hindsight is a great thing and he had a split second to make up his mind, an honest decision but incorrect.



Would you have given a penalty if you had the TV view? I suspect not.

I believe it was a massive mistake from Darren Fletchers and Manchester United's perspective, but see above, I do believe it was an honest mistake.

I believe that the referee called it spot on as the circumstances showed it self that night, i believe darren was unlucky but was stupid to make such a pointless tackle... i dont and will never have use of tv for decisions as a ref so that is a pointless question.

[The Ref]

I believe that the referee called it spot on as the circumstances showed it self that night, i believe darren was unlucky but was stupid to make such a pointless tackle... i dont and will never have use of tv for decisions as a ref so that is a pointless question.

What I was really trying to get at, having seen everything television replays etc, do you think it was a penalty?

As for Darren Fletcher, a player who has made a career in the professional game is a winner, their instinct is to make that tack regardless whether it 3:0, 1:1 or 1:5. They don't think of it as being stupid or pointless, its just their instinct to win.

[francesco_1]

He got a touch of the ball alright but its after it he connected with cesc and who is to say he wouldnt of scored if fletcher didnt bring him down after the touch...its a pen then isnt it?

[The Ref]

He got a touch of the ball alright but its after it he connected with cesc and who is to say he wouldnt of scored if fletcher didnt bring him down after the touch...its a pen then isnt it?

I believe that there was no foul before he touched the ball, the touch was first then his momentum took him down.

[Subprime]

I believe that there was no foul before he touched the ball, the touch was first then his momentum took him down.
Aw Ref!!! Usual shout from the sideline! Page 33 "A penalty kick is awarded if any of the above ten offences is committed by a player inside his own penalty area, irrespective of the position of the ball, provided it is in play." and after Fletch (I follow Man Utd so was disappointed with ref) knocked the ball away with his heel, he then, in a seperate action, commits a foul by using his other leg to catch the back of his opponents boots and hold him up and the player goes down(as you would expect). Guidelines state "Disciplinary sanctions • A caution for unsporting behaviour must be issued when a player holds an opponent to prevent him gaining possession of the ball or taking up an advantageous position", not sending off! It's good to talk as it gives arm chair refs an understanding of what split second decisions refs have to make!

[gaiscíoch]

I was just hoping for a couple of views from you refs over the a handball penalty.

Attacker is crossing the ball(with great force), the defender is half a yard away, the ball hits the defender on the chest/bicep.

No goal scoring chance was there as there was no body in the box. and the ball would most likely have went out for a throw in.