View Full Version : My view of Eircom League Supporters
Mad Moose
16/05/2006, 4:48 PM
Before I get into this I post this particular thread safe in the knowledge that i'm likely to come in for a certain amount of critisism for doing so but as somebody who for a number of years has followed League of Ireland football these are but a few observations I wish to make. I no longer follow League of Ireland football as such and have only attended a couple of games in the last number of seasons. For the last few years I have gone back to grass roots level (underage football) and Junior football (Mayo League) and I find this a much more pleasant environment to enjoy the game I love and have always loved.
It was after a recent brief encounter with a few Cork City fans in Dublin that I decided my mind was made up on the league. Its unfortunate that I have to mention a club or clubs in relation to this post because this isn't down to an individual club but my experience over the last few seasons has been focused on one particular club,. (not Cork City)
In any case on this particular weekend I was on a weekend training course in Dublin and after a late finish on the saturday night I sat down to a pint with a mate from Drogheda who happened to be a football enthusiast and a regular at Drogheda Utd. We were both keen to see the Setanta Cup final but the station wasn't available so we sat and chatted football. A couple of Cork City fans walked in and one in particular bantered away about the game. The particular Cork City fan we were talking to was very engaging in relation to the game. My mate laughed and joked about Drogheda Utd winning the game.Two Cork City fans who were present heard the conversation and started on my mate about how much of a supporter he was and if he was why he wasn't at the game. I explained to my mate that he didn't need to explain himself and to leave it at that and not to start an argument. They continued to talk down to him in relation to been 'some supporter' in not attending the game. That was the last of the conversation in relation to football and we moved in to join our group in the lobby.
I'm well aware of how poorly supported the League is by the powers that be in this case the FAI and I understand the pride thats involved with supporting your own club and wanting whats best for a league. This becomes that wee bit more defensive when even as a supporter your used to the game been so downtrodden and the work thats required to keep a club and a league afloat. It was however this attitude as taken by these particular supporters that has become, or has perhaps always been, indicitive of Senior football in Ireland. It was like a snobbery of sorts, A 'theirs them and us' attitude. Who are they to talk about football when they dont even attend and get behind the team. The reasons didn't seem to matter. I'm not entirely sure where this comes from and I've a feeling that its an attitude in general associated with the game that believe it or not I've seen in coaching U-10's. It stems from the game in England and how the game developed there. I dont have a problem with rivalry and that, its healthy to a degree and it sustains a club, even can unite and energise a club. It becomes a community thing. Returning to play junior league football has been refreshing. You might get a ribbing from the touchline but you take it with a smile or a grimace and get on with it.
Its with great interest of late I've watched developments at Finn Harps, a club I attended as a supporter for a few seasons. I have always made my voice heard on the wrongs of the club and naturally those associated with the club get defensive and silence me. Thats understandable and fair enough. Its how its done that causes the greatest concern. I've been described as everything from 'deranged' and 'insane' to other unrepeatable profanities. Only today I log on to their forum to hear discussions on 'Racism at Finn Park' to incidents of 'throwing drumsticks at opposing players (Derry City's Sean Hargan), bottle throwing (At Shamrock Rovers keeper a few weeks back), and spitting. I'm not sure if this is standard in League of Ireland football but all I can say is thank god I dont go there anymore and by the looks of it few bother to do so. The manager has critisised the fans recently in the papers for been abusive to his players. In fact whether its been on a public forum or newspapers the press in relation to the club is pretty poor. I've always said and it will always be said that this club looks down its nose at clubs in the county as it is the only Senior Club in Donegal. How those other 'inferior' clubs must chuckle and laugh at the condition the club now finds itself in. No doubt I had pleasant times at Finn Park but these are far outweighed by the negative press consistently emerging from the club. This has been reflected in the numbers who have turned their back on the club, no doubt a few may return with a good cup run but its unlikely to have lasting impact. Certain Harps supporters will come on here and diffuse my arguments by claiming I'm 'obcessed' with the club or to attack me personnally with little references to 'Insanity'. After all I'm not the issue here, if a club will air its consistently dirty laundry in public they dont need me to do it.
All in all this leaves a very sour taste. I found their was always a certain few people (Not many, this is league of Ireland after all) who fronted themselves as a voice of a club and if you didn't conform to their thinking then you weren't welcome. This was particularly the case in rural Donegal and I am not the first to mention that. No doubt in the future I'll dip in and out of games but for now I'm happy watching junior league football week in week out.
Brendan
harry crumb
16/05/2006, 5:06 PM
Don't know that much about the goings on at Finn Harps, but I know that for years things weren't done right.
Is there not a supporters trust or something at the minute trying to get into a new stadium.
Krstic
16/05/2006, 5:08 PM
Junior football's a better standard than Finn Harps after all Brendan:p
Mad Moose
16/05/2006, 5:19 PM
Junior football's a better standard than Finn Harps after all Brendan:p
While you might say that in jest if better standard equates to a much more pleasant standard then I agree. In relation to the facts I have posted in relation to Finn Harps you only need to look at their forum. I know spittin, bottle throwing or throwing drumsticks are pretty paltry if your to consider a Milan derby game but their hugely significant when they occur at games in a small local community. The club may try to paper up the cracks but the cracks are too large and people now see through it. Again I'm not obcessed but I took an awful lot of abuse for speaking out against the club. I was threatened (indirectly) with been barred from the club.I've made the point on their forum (they deleted it) that if they bar any more people from the ground the games will be held behind closed doors. I describe the club currently as a 'little experiment in anti-social behaviour)
Harry I know little or nothing about the ground development.Seemingly its going ahead with a huge value been placed on the current Finn Park for commercial development. A stadium development is all lovely but it needs support and a club actually going somewhere.
Brendan
OneRedArmy
16/05/2006, 6:31 PM
Brendan whilst I agree with a lot of what you say (in relation to a minority of supporters of many clubs) the comparison to junior football is interesting as I would argue some of its supporters are even more elitist.
There is a active element in the junior ranks that generally ignore and rubbish the Eircom League standard and see themselves primarily as feeders for English football for the underage ranks (rather than feeding EL as the next natural progression). You'll also find them referring to players who "could have made it over the water" if it wasn't for their love of a few scoops/pure unadulterated laziness/some other excuse. The fact that they couldn't make it in the highest standard in the country never enters the equation.
If you need proof of this look at the factions within the FAI. The junior reps are renowned for doing their own thing and voting against the EL reps.
Good points OneRedArmy, I'd be interested to hear Harpsbears reaction. I remember a few years ago when Portmarnock had a decent cup run one of their players voicing the opinion inb the papers that his team were as good as most of the teams in the league, the only difference being fitness. Strangely Portmaarnock didn't win the cup that year. In relation to Harpsbear, perhaps he's letting his own personal issues with his club colour his view of the league as whole.
harpskid
16/05/2006, 10:20 PM
In I've always said and it will always be said that this club looks down its nose at clubs in the county as it is the only Senior Club in Donegal. How those other 'inferior' clubs must chuckle and laugh at the condition the club now finds itself in.
:D
A wiser scolar than me once said 'a little knowledge is a dangerous thing' - how right he was!
Finn Harps does not look down its nose at clubs in the county. Where is there evidence of this?
Finn Harps actually has a good relationship with both the Donegal League and teh Ulster Senior League and indeed also the Inishowen and Donegal Youth Leagues.
I suggest you take time out and ask teh clubs their feelings on that. Think you'll be surprised by the outcome.
However, I'm not going to get drawn into another argument on a public forum with someone for whom I have no time and consider their opinion to be worthless, as I have more important issues to worry about - like my college exams.
I've been described as everything from 'deranged' and 'insane' to other unrepeatable profanities
Sure didn't you tell one Harps supporter recently that ye were going mad? :p
Student Mullet
17/05/2006, 12:15 AM
Two Cork City fans who were present heard the conversation and started on my mate about how much of a supporter he was and if he was why he wasn't at the game. I explained to my mate that he didn't need to explain himself and to leave it at that and not to start an argument. They continued to talk down to him in relation to been 'some supporter' in not attending the game.I wouldn't worry too much about that. According to a lot of Cork supporters you can attend games regularly and still not be a propper supporter. I think that it has something to do with how 'ambitious' they percieve your club to be.
Mad Moose
17/05/2006, 8:17 AM
:D
However, I'm not going to get drawn into another argument on a public forum with someone for whom I have no time and consider their opinion to be worthless, as I have more important issues to worry about - like my college exams.
Something of that 'attitude' I spoke of in there.
Sure didn't you tell one Harps supporter recently that ye were going mad? :p
Who would that be Chris. If I have done it was with tongue firmly in cheek.Something to do with establishing the motive for their been in touch in the first place. No fear of that happening Chris.
Strabane_Harp
17/05/2006, 8:38 AM
the obsession continues :rolleyes:
you would need to take this fella with about the same size of pinch of salt as you will find in the atlantic. Id even say the incident with the cork fans has been imagined in order to turn round and attack harps.
Harps fans treat this person with the respect he deserves, none.
Mad Moose
17/05/2006, 8:39 AM
Brendan whilst I agree with a lot of what you say (in relation to a minority of supporters of many clubs) the comparison to junior football is interesting as I would argue some of its supporters are even more elitist.
There is a active element in the junior ranks that generally ignore and rubbish the Eircom League standard and see themselves primarily as feeders for English football for the underage ranks (rather than feeding EL as the next natural progression). You'll also find them referring to players who "could have made it over the water" if it wasn't for their love of a few scoops/pure unadulterated laziness/some other excuse. The fact that they couldn't make it in the highest standard in the country never enters the equation.
If you need proof of this look at the factions within the FAI. The junior reps are renowned for doing their own thing and voting against the EL reps.
Thats not the situation I'm aware of in terms of my involvement with Junior football. I think you have generalised on the 'feeders for English football' view. I've not come across that. I wouldn't rubbish the standard of football in the EL . I call into question the support however in the Eircom League. Just take for example the incidents I've highlighted in relation to behaviour of supporters at Finn Harps. Bottle throwing, spitting, racist chants (according to a director of the club these chants were directed at a director), drumstick throwing (hitting a Derry City player) and abusive language. Of course Harps supporters dont want these issues highlighted, they dont want them discussed but am I wrong to regard this kind of behaviour unacceptable and a blotch on the Senior football copybook. All this anti-social behaviour is heavily publicised and of course its all in the name of the club.Only last season I was at Finn Park and saw the head steward been attacked (he was hit in the face). Am I wrong to decide I wouldn't turn up at Finn Park ever again to see this kind of behaviour and would I expect a family to do the same. No I wouldn't. Their aren't personal issues. I've been abused at every opportunity when I rightfully raise these issues and since my views are 'worthless' and I dont conform to the views or perceptions the club would like painted of them then my views are removed or deleted. Can somebody correct me if I'm wrong in relation to these recent events at Finn Park.
In relation to junior football take a look at the junior football forum and seek those views out that you percieve them to be.I dont believe them to be.Only recently I attended the biggest game in Castlebar for years in the FAI Junior Cup Semi-Final. The game and support was conducted in the manner the game was supposed to be and it was a pleasure to be there. Having seen both EL for a number of years and junior football I can see the very obvious difference. Its just an opinion and of course its people of different experiences will have different opinions.
Brendan
Strabane_Harp
17/05/2006, 8:51 AM
to clear up the so called racist incident occurred at a game last season, when 3 drunken louts started shouting abuse at our own nigerian defender, none of these 3 were in any harps colours and a director went to speak to them about the racist abuse and drinking in the ground and was assaulted by them. The 3 were then ejected from the stadium and havent been seen since.
As for the drumstick incident i was in liverpool so wasnt there to see that.
The bottle last week was thrown by a local eejit who was immediately reported to the board and barred for life. he was not as previously claimed in some quarters a member of any Finn Harps supporters club. He is apparently known locally as a bit of a headcase.
and Brendan had you been at games this year you might have seen quite a few families are attending, the numbers are as low as they were in other years in the first division when we havent done well. If we start climbing the table they will come back, if the weather is nice they may well come back. We still have one of the highest attendances in the first division
harpskid
17/05/2006, 9:07 AM
Thats not the situation I'm aware of in terms of my involvement with Junior football. I think you have generalised on the 'feeders for English football' view.
Haven't you just generalised with all your above? :rolleyes:
"Hello pot...meet Mr Kettle!!"
You have highlighted isolated incidents:
1 - a drumstick was thrown at a Derry player last year and the person who threw it was barred.
2 - a racist comment was directed towards one of our own players and this chap was barred.
3 - the head of security was hit and this man received a life-time ban as well
4 - the budweiser bottle was thrown by a local hooligan who was also promptly banned
THis is not the norm for supporters of Finn Harps to go around like football hooligans at every given opportunity, and when incidents like the above happen they are dealt with - if you went to teh games you would know this.
Something of that 'attitude' I spoke of in there.
I do apologise for studying last evening when clearly I should have been further disecting your pontifications.
Your posts yesterday were deleted on the Harps forum. I deleted them. Why? Because they had now't to do with the thread you posted on and because I received several PMs from users about your postings.
You are not wanted on our forum. Comprende? You can see that other users who have issues can come on and argue their point and they are not banned. These people still come to games and class themselves as Harps fans. You don't, so no-one cares what you have to say!
harpskid
17/05/2006, 9:14 AM
perhaps he's letting his own personal issues with his club colour his view of the league as whole.
Elementary my dear Watson! :ball:
I think its gas that everry single LOI club has at least one fan who absolutely despises the club they follow. Goes to most/all games (certainly at home) but constantly complains and wants EVERYBODY out
joey B
17/05/2006, 9:30 AM
I think its gas that everry single LOI club has at least one fan who absolutely despises the club they follow. Goes to most/all games (certainly at home) but constantly complains and wants EVERYBODY out
Just to clear something up here Dodge the person who started this thread is NOT a supporter of Finn Harps.
NY Hoop
17/05/2006, 9:38 AM
Brendan whilst I agree with a lot of what you say (in relation to a minority of supporters of many clubs) the comparison to junior football is interesting as I would argue some of its supporters are even more elitist.
There is a active element in the junior ranks that generally ignore and rubbish the Eircom League standard and see themselves primarily as feeders for English football for the underage ranks (rather than feeding EL as the next natural progression). You'll also find them referring to players who "could have made it over the water" if it wasn't for their love of a few scoops/pure unadulterated laziness/some other excuse. The fact that they couldn't make it in the highest standard in the country never enters the equation.
If you need proof of this look at the factions within the FAI. The junior reps are renowned for doing their own thing and voting against the EL reps.
Couldnt agree more. A lot of the junior clubs, not all of them, do not and will not recognise the eircom league. Their players are just barstoolers who kick a ball.
Dont really want to to get into the Harps issue but would banning gargle from the ground stem the incidents your man is on about?
KOH
The serious point in all this is that eL is cometing with other sports and other levels of football for fans - that's reality. In that context, it is a real worry that certain things happen at eL games taht don't happen elsewhere. whatever you think about the game itself, the atmosphere at rugby and GAA is seen by many as being better because you can enjoy the game and the few pints before/after with supporters from all sides without any danger of hassle (there may be exceptions but they're pretty rare).
I'm a regularly CCFC fan for 15 years and while before the incidents were rare but soemtimes serious, there is now a constant low level amount of idiots at a lot of el clubs (us included) who make it hard to enjoy a game and a bit of crack. Don't get me wrong, a lot of clubs are making a big effort (such as Cork's family enclosure to get in parents with young kids) and I'll never stop giong myself, but when "fans" are spitting at refs, linesmen and opposing players or throwng bricks/bottles- and this has happened at most grounds I've been at some stage in the past few years- then they're is something wrong.
A lot of fans downplay it, but it is one of the biggest factors holding the league back IMO. And it can be fixed as well. There are plenty of ties where there is a wonderful atmosphere - I would say between Derry and most clubs is generally recognised as the most good natured, but I've enjoyed great hospitality from Bohs and Pats over the years too.
Sorry for the rant
Strabane_Harp
17/05/2006, 9:55 AM
Drink is banned from Finn Park, but its always possible to smuggle to smuggle in a few bevvies. But the club cant really stop people drinkin before the game. 99.99% of Harps games pass without the slightest incident
A lot of eL fans are fairly young so get very "emotional" about issues.
Passive
17/05/2006, 10:16 AM
Dude, if you don't like the conditions football creates, don't go.
It's the same all over the world so get over yourself.
Shut the door on your way out.
placid casual
17/05/2006, 10:26 AM
FORMER EL FAN DECIDES TO STAY AWAY SHOCK !!
big deal mate.
as passive says if you dont like the conditions done go.
this thread has the aura of someone trying to persude loyal EL fans that if they somehow change their attitude all of a sudden the crowds will come flocking back . me ballix.
most EL fans i know love their club IN SPITE of the hardships they have to put up with ( ****e grounds,crap PA,no media coverage et al).
the points made earlier about the attitude of juinior clubs being akin to the Judean Peoples Front ring true.
NY Hoop
17/05/2006, 10:34 AM
In fact in some clubs the worse it gets, as in our case last year, the more hardcore the fans get!!
KOH
WeAreRovers
17/05/2006, 11:04 AM
For some context to Harpsbear's rantings checkout the Harps message board. He's despised on there and that's good enough for me. He's only on here using the pretext of his views on the league as a whole to have a pop at Harps.
KOH
joey B
17/05/2006, 11:06 AM
You met a couple of ar$eholes Harpsbear. These happened to be Cork fans. Big deal.
Dont you see BohsBohsBohs the thread has nothing to do with eircom league supporters he merely used once again(Yawn!) to highlight his gripe with our club.
Truly tiresome:(
Brendan, you are looking to publicise every negative aspect of Finn Harps that you can get hold of to try and damage the club whether true or not and make out that Finn Park is some sort of Irish Ali Sami Yen.
This has nothing to do with 'eircom League supporters' or Jnr football. It is just another attack on Harps. As you have been barred from our forum for similar false allegations etc you've thought that you'll now try foot.ie. Only a few days ago you embarrasingly hi-jacked a thread about supporters clubs on here to have a go Harps only to have it removed and here you go again.
I have played Junior football for years and your utopian views on it just don't ring true. Maybe Mayo differs a lot from the Donegal League but I doubt it. Enough posters on this thread pointed out there experiences and thoughts on Junior football so I'll not go into it.
A lot of us work hard, very hard for Finn Harps and my patience is starting to wane with your embittered posts and mud slinging. You fell out with one director and stopped supporting Harps. Fair enough, by your own admission your now into Junior football, so how does that suddenly make you an expert on everything that is wrong with not only The Harps but the whole eircom League in general?? As usual your facts are all over the place but don't worry about something as trivial as getting your facts right when you're looking to bad mouth the club at every juncture.
We get the message - you don't like Harps anymore, you don't like the eircom League anymore and we have all read your reasons. Move on and leave us to it then.
For some context to Harpsbear's rantings checkout the Harps message board. He's despised on there and that's good enough for me. He's only on here using the pretext of his views on the league as a whole to have a pop at Harps.
KOH
http://humanities.byu.edu/elc/student/idioms/idioms/images/hit_nail_on_head.jpg
Poor Student
17/05/2006, 12:22 PM
Are Junior Football supporters all that better? I know that the Junior Football forum has been a headache to moderate and has been on the verge of being closed down before. I don't know the ins and outs of it, but I always thought of it as a raving madhouse.
A face
17/05/2006, 1:57 PM
Whatever about the other forum, i think that possibly Harpsbear has blown this out of proportion and as someone said earlier let what happened between him and the club cloud his judgement of the league.
Just a question : Harpsbear, with all the faults that you have found with Harps, have you ever tried to provide a sound workable solution on the issue?
BohDiddley
17/05/2006, 2:13 PM
There is a active element in the junior ranks that generally ignore and rubbish the Eircom League standard and see themselves primarily as feeders for English football for the underage ranks (rather than feeding EL as the next natural progression). You'll also find them referring to players who "could have made it over the water" if it wasn't for their love of a few scoops/pure unadulterated laziness/some other excuse. The fact that they couldn't make it in the highest standard in the country never enters the equation.
If you need proof of this look at the factions within the FAI. The junior reps are renowned for doing their own thing and voting against the EL reps.
That rings true. Damian Duff syndrome.
It's hilarious when you the otherwise sane manager of an u-11 F-league team (all wearing EPL shirts as civvies) dismiss the top level of the game in the country, without a hint of irony.
Mad Moose
17/05/2006, 3:52 PM
Now how could I possibly get an opportunity to respond to all that. Some pretty damning posts of me and the posts have sought to seriously discredit me. Did I expect anything less. As I expected these things are easily twisted. I stand over my post in relation to the happenings at Finn Harps. These incidents happened as they have been confirmed. Am I wrong to highlight that these incidents did and do happen and have I not got a right to express my opinion of disgust at this. No I didn't make up the story of the two Cork City fans. On the one hand people are been told to take me with 'a pinch of salt' and on the other hand the detail of my posts are confirmed. Of course my opinion will now be considered worthless because I dont pay through the gate, buy the soup etc, and its on the basis of this that my opinion is considered worthless. I haven't come on here to attack anybody personnally.I've raised a few opinions and some truths in relation to what I have seen and what I dont consider acceptable. I called this my 'view'. It doesn't mean its everybody elses view. Having an opinion doesn't make me insane, mad or whatever else I've been described.
B
Speranza
17/05/2006, 4:47 PM
It does make you very naive though. Football matches can only be policed to a certain extent and if you are looking for good craic without the natural occurances at a football match then I suggest croquet.
Is the Harps fan who fired the drumstick still barred from Finn Park? Does he post regularly on your forum about matches he has attended?
Mad Moose
17/05/2006, 5:07 PM
Is the Harps fan who fired the drumstick still barred from Finn Park? Does he post regularly on your forum about matches he has attended?
The bottle-thrower (bud) is barred, the racist chanter is now barred, the person who assaulted the head steward is also barred. Oh and The Observer (as he now calls himself) / drumstick thrower made a very emotional apology in the Democrat/Press and I think the tears were enough for the Harps board to spare him a life-time ban. I don't think they could afford to bar any more fans in fairness.
B
Sniffer
17/05/2006, 5:18 PM
The bottle-thrower (bud) is barred, the racist chanter is now barred, the person who assaulted the head steward is also barred. Oh and The Observer (as he now calls himself) / drumstick thrower made a very emotional apology in the Democrat/Press and I think the tears were enough for the Harps board to spare him a life-time ban. I don't think they could afford to bar any more fans in fairness.
B
:D Nice one!
In every case mentioned the club has taken prompt action against the persons involved.
To focus on just those negative incidents gives a very unbalanced view of what attending eL and in particular Harps games is actually about. What about the sense of belonging, the craic, the noise and colour, the funny moments and the emotional ones, seeing young players on the the team who until a few years ago travelled on our buses and stood on the terrace with us? Yes there's the odd unsavoury incident, but you get that everywhere- including junior football. To take those isolated incidents that have occurred over many months as representative of the eL experience (especially when they all occurred after you'd stopped going!) means that it's inevitable that people will consider that you're just bearing a grudge rather than making any actual coherent point about the state of the league.
Mad Moose
17/05/2006, 5:25 PM
In every case mentioned the club has taken prompt action against the persons involved.
To focus on just those negative incidents gives a very unbalanced view of what attending eL and in particular Harps games is actually about. To take those isolated incidents that have occurred over many months as representative of the eL experience (especially when they all occurred after you'd stopped going!) means that it's inevitable that people will consider that you're just bearing a grudge rather than making any actual coherent point about the state of the league.
Did you not break a window in a pub in Cobh after a league trip a few seasons back. I can safely assume you got a life time ban from that pub. Very acceptable and responsible behaviour. I dont of course have a grudge against you but I was around at that time. Not everything occured after I stopped going.
B
Did you not break a window in a pub in Cobh after a league trip.
That is 100% untrue.
Some craic- one minute you're giving out about what people say about you, the next you make a totally untrue allegation against me.
Mad Moose
17/05/2006, 5:37 PM
Credit to ya your fairly certain of that. Might I offer my apologies.
Brendan
BohDiddley
17/05/2006, 5:57 PM
You'll be offering more than apologies if a defamation lawyer sees that.
harpskid
17/05/2006, 6:19 PM
Brendan, you should really get your facts right you know!
Were you present in Cobh when the window was broken? na, thought not. :rolleyes:
redgav
17/05/2006, 7:03 PM
hmmmm..seems very very one sided in this attack on the EL-
only last week a junior league final had a mass brawl between the teams,damage to the dressing rooms and a player and manager assaulted,
I've personally witnessed adults beating 7 shades of sh!te out of each other on the touchlines due to perceived insults to someones son missing a chance,I've seen referres turning up to ref a game ,without protection, having to get a neutral spectator to step in to save him from a beating and call the guards due to a perceived wrong decision ,seen "managers" on the touchline using language that has no business at a underage game with young kids present ,and have witnessed the aftermath of young people dying due to incompetency regarding goalposts - yet you claim to witness this utopian football lala land where everyone loves each other and daisy's grow on the sidelines ....Time to stop reading Roy of the Rovers methinks
Dr.Nightdub
17/05/2006, 9:52 PM
Two points:
1. Don't generalise from the particular - a few isolated incidents at Finn Park and the whole League is awash with mindless thuggery? If anything, Finn Park is one of the few grounds in the League where away fans DON'T complain about constant incidents. Methinks the gentleman doth protest too much.
2. There is almost nothing any club can do in advance to stop lone nutters doing something daft. All the can do is prevent it recurring by barring the lone nutters in question. As you pointed out yourself, Harps have already done that. So what's your beef?
corkharps
17/05/2006, 10:01 PM
He's dead right, ye are all a crowd of denim wearing leftie B*****ds! I'll never go to another match!David Ike lives!
anto eile
17/05/2006, 10:09 PM
The serious point in all this is that eL is cometing with other sports and other levels of football for fans - that's reality. In that context, it is a real worry that certain things happen at eL games taht don't happen elsewhere. whatever you think about the game itself, the atmosphere at rugby and GAA is seen by many as being better because you can enjoy the game and the few pints before/after with supporters from all sides without any danger of hassle (there may be exceptions but they're pretty rare).
I'm a regularly CCFC fan for 15 years and while before the incidents were rare but soemtimes serious, there is now a constant low level amount of idiots at a lot of el clubs (us included) who make it hard to enjoy a game and a bit of crack. Don't get me wrong, a lot of clubs are making a big effort (such as Cork's family enclosure to get in parents with young kids) and I'll never stop giong myself, but when "fans" are spitting at refs, linesmen and opposing players or throwng bricks/bottles- and this has happened at most grounds I've been at some stage in the past few years- then they're is something wrong.
A lot of fans downplay it, but it is one of the biggest factors holding the league back IMO. And it can be fixed as well. There are plenty of ties where there is a wonderful atmosphere - I would say between Derry and most clubs is generally recognised as the most good natured, but I've enjoyed great hospitality from Bohs and Pats over the years too.
Sorry for the rant
disagree strongly.
Ireland probably has the least amount of hassle at games of any league in Europe.(the low crowds is one reason,but the general nature of the fans that attend games is another) theres trouble regularly everywhere in Europe, but by and large it doesnt stop people going to games
A face
17/05/2006, 11:46 PM
Did you not break a window in a pub in Cobh after a league trip a few seasons back. I can safely assume you got a life time ban from that pub. Very acceptable and responsible behaviour. I dont of course have a grudge against you but I was around at that time. Not everything occured after I stopped going.
That is 100% untrue.
Some craic- one minute you're giving out about what people say about you, the next you make a totally untrue allegation against me.
Credit to ya your fairly certain of that. Might I offer my apologies.
Moderation :
Galways Harps hasn't reacted to this but i have to step in here.
Harpsbear, that is totally out of order. I am actually stunned you came out with that as it has nothing to do with the debate. Its my opinion at first glance that you have accused Galway Harps of this to try and sway the opinion in the thread. That is below the belt and totally out of order. Please do not do anything like that again.
I would think that the thread has come to an abrupt end now as a result, but it has run its course anyway i would have thought but just in case, is there anything else to be added ?
I'd just like to add that of course I'm fooking certain! I did nothing of the kind- and as far as I remember it may well have turned out to have been a local or something (am not too sure on this, it was a while ago and I wasn't there when it happened). In any case I wasn't involved in that incident, nor have I ever been involved in anything like it.
Sometimes you just have to laugh really :)
Mad Moose
18/05/2006, 8:47 AM
Moderation :
Galways Harps hasn't reacted to this but i have to step in here.
Harpsbear, that is totally out of order. I am actually stunned you came out with that as it has nothing to do with the debate. Its my opinion at first glance that you have accused Galway Harps of this to try and sway the opinion in the thread. That is below the belt and totally out of order. Please do not do anything like that again.
I would think that the thread has come to an abrupt end now as a result, but it has run its course anyway i would have thought but just in case, is there anything else to be added ?
As i posted in response to Galway Harps I asked the question and I got my answer promptly and again I apologise. What has been my intention is to throw into the public domain the subject of their been an undercurrent of to put it mildly generally considered anti-social behaviour associated with the league. I accept as somebody has pointed out that such behaviour can be found in any league.Only a couple of seasons ago I remember a junior club in Donegal landing itself in hot water after locking a referee into a dressing room. I do however find less of the unsavoury stuff associated with junior football, possibly alot to do with profile. I did mention only a fraction of incidents, the kind of incidents that the average football supporter does not attend games to see. If we are to take the example at Finn Harps for example such poor publicity as has been prevalent in local press does nothing to endear anybody to the game. I'm not sure what happened to the drumstick thrower.According to their own forum it wasn't his first offence and was he not the one time commercial manager of the club? As I say this does nothing to endear people to the game and Its reflected in the attendances. I'm sure this club for example is particularly aware of this.
Brendan
harpskid
18/05/2006, 8:54 AM
If we are to take the example at Finn Harps for example such poor publicity as has been prevalent in local press does nothing to endear anybody to the game
And what of the good publicity...for example, did you hear John Breslin's show on Highland yesterday by any chance? :rolleyes:
There's a lot more positives than negatives I think you'll find. Then again, you wouldn't want to know about any of that now would you?!
Na, again didn't think so! You focus on the negatives solely without at all mentioning positives.
Sure there's problems - we didn't need you to tell us that - but the incidents you have mentioned have been dealt with.
You are intended to solely focus on the negativity - an extremely small amount might I add - and blow it up as if, as Rodney put it, Finn Park is like an Irish version of the Ali Sami Yen! f:mad:
Mad Moose
18/05/2006, 9:06 AM
There's a very good reason I wouldn't return to watch Finn Harps. Now I realise you'll turn around and tell me that since I no longer go to Finn Park my opinion is worthless and to go away, all the regular shut up stuff. For me and my point is the negatives particularly in relation to Harps far outweigh the positives. That is why I would never return. For example consider the impact on as equally as small a community as Ballybofey when the schoolboys of their league were turned away by their own league secretary who happens to be commercial manager/treasurer and paid official of Finn Harps. That hasn't just impacted on me. It wasn't that they couldn't have been accomodated at Finn Park, it was purely an attitude and an individual ego. Chris that didnt just impact on me, it impacted on a small junior club and community. Can any Eircom League Club afford to display such an attitude. In my opinion. No.
Brendan
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