Great result For Scotland, Strachan out of order though in my view.

[NeilMcD]

Last Updated: Thursday, 11 May 2006, 12:10 GMT 13:10 UK

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Scotland 5-1 Bulgaria

Scotland striker Kris Boyd was on target twice
Rangers duo Kris Boyd and Chris Burke both grabbed two goals on their debuts as Scotland thumped Bulgaria in their opening game of the Kirin Cup in Japan.
Lone striker Boyd put Scotland ahead with a fine strike and although Yordan Todarov levelled with a low finish, Boyd made it 2-1 from close range.

James McFadden added a third with a flicked volley from Gary Teale's cross.

Sub Chris Burke's superb lob put the Scots further ahead and he sealed the win when he tapped in late on.

The inexperience of Walter Smith's team rarely showed throughout an impressive 90 minutes against the side who beat World Cup-bound Japan on Tuesday.

Premier League top-scorer Boyd took just 13 minutes to claim his maiden goal with a fine first-time finish as he latched on to Darren Fletcher's perfectly placed pass to lash in an angled drive.

Bulgarian captain Martin Petrov forced Neil Alexander to stretch to claim his curling free-kick from 20 yards out in the 24th minute.

And, two minutes later, the Bulgarians were level when Valeri Domovchiyski clipped the ball to Svetoslav Todorov and the Portsmouth striker's lay-off to his namesake set up the 24-year-old to slot home from close range.

Boyd, however, put his side back in front two minutes before the break when he was first to react after Stoyan Kolev spilled Russell Anderson's shot following a well-placed cross by Gary Teale.

McFadden replaced Boyd early in the second half and, after hitting the crossbar with a clever free kick, increased Scotland's advantage with 21 minutes to go.

Again Teale was involved, searing down the right wing and sending in a low cross that the Everton striker glanced past Kolev with a deft touch.

Burke came on for Teale in the 75th minute and with his second touch of the ball had also claimed a debut goal for Scotland.

The winger's first touch in international football came when he chested Gary Naysmith's cross into the penalty area and the second saw him lob substitute goalkeeper Nikolay Mihaylov, whose fingertip effort was not strong enough to keep the ball out.

It was to get better for Burke with two minutes remaining when he stabbed the ball home from close range to claim his second and Scotland's fifth.

Scotland face Japan on Saturday and Smith's patchwork squad will be brimming with confidence.

[Stuttgart88]

That's impossible Neil. Scotland are sh1te remember, with no saving graces whatsoever :) (recalling a recent debate on this topic...).

[pineapple stu]

Where does Strachan come into it?

[NeilMcD]

Thats wins away from home for them on the bounce although this one is a neutral venue. They seem to be better out of Hampden. From what I am told Hampden for a midweek friendly is meant to be terrible regarding atmosphere and I have been told LR is much better even though we think its terrible.

[NeilMcD]

Strachan did not let 3 players go from Celtic cause he wanted them for the testimonials for Keane and Shearer. He said that Walter Smith did not mind but Smith came out and said that he did mind and Ferguson said it was terrible that Strachan was putting a testimonial ahead of an international game. Although Ferguson past record on these things is questionable I am not sure he ever pulled someone out for a testimonial. I suspect Strahan did not want his players travelling to Japan and used the 2 games as an excuse.

[eirebhoy]

I found it strange too. Petrov didn't travel either and Naka is back in Japan with an injury. Maybe he genuinly wanted to field his strongest possible team against premiership teams to see what is needed for the CL, that's the only thing I can think of.

Scotland were missing Gordon, Quashie, O'Connor, McNamara, Hartley, Maloney, McManus, Dailly, Beattie, Ferguson and 10 other players for this tournament so the result is a huge suprise (even though Bulgaria played a 2nd string). With all their players back and the SPL probably improving faster than any league in Europe atm Scotland will be flying up the rankings.

[drinkfeckarse]

Strachan did not let 3 players go from Celtic cause he wanted them for the testimonials for Keane and Shearer. He said that Walter Smith did not mind but Smith came out and said that he did mind and Ferguson said it was terrible that Strachan was putting a testimonial ahead of an international game. Although Ferguson past record on these things is questionable I am not sure he ever pulled someone out for a testimonial. I suspect Strahan did not want his players travelling to Japan and used the 2 games as an excuse.

Not that it matters much but where and when did Ferguson say this? While it should always be an honour to represent your country, Strachan did no wrong here as it's not an officially recognised competition.

Technically speaking, what's the point in travelling half way around the world for a couple of bounce games when you can play a couple of bounce games at home??

[NeilMcD]

Its a friendly which is preparation for the qualifiers in September. Smith is trying to build a new team and Maloney is going to be a huge part of that. Celtic did not need to have him but for some reason Strachan wanted to keep him at home.

From BBC

Manchester United manager Sir Alex Ferguson has expressed surprise that Celtic recalled three players from Scotland duty to face his side.
Scotland boss Walter Smith is reportedly angry at the decision by Gordon Strachan, who wanted the players for Tuesday's Roy Keane testimonial.

And Ferguson said: "Gordon Strachan phoned Walter Smith to say he wanted them to play against United.

"I don't know what this game is coming to. But it shows they mean business."

Smith had originally chosen Celtic striker Shaun Maloney, goalkeeper David Marshall and defender Stephen McManus, who would have been earning his first cap, for this week's Kirin Cup matches. Insist? I can't insist on anything

Scotland boss Walter Smith

Ferguson's apparent backing for the view of his former Old Trafford assistant follows newspaper reports that the national boss had broken the "pretence of acceptance" of the situation.

He rejected Strachan's claim that, had Smith insisted on taking the players to Japan, he would have accepted the national call-up.

"In the conversation we had, he stated to me he'd withdraw all Celtic players from the tournament," Smith was quoted as saying.

"That meant the three players I had named, plus Stilian Petrov of Bulgaria and Japan's Shunsuke Nakamura.

"When that is said to you, Scotland have got no right to take a player.

"Insist? I can't insist on anything.

"If somebody phone me up and tells me they're withdrawing them then I have no recourse because they are friendlies."

Smith also warned players who had withdrawn from his under-21 squad that they risked not being chosen for his full squad in the future.

[drinkfeckarse]

And Ferguson said: "Gordon Strachan phoned Walter Smith to say he wanted them to play against United.

"I don't know what this game is coming to. But it shows they mean business."

Ferguson's apparent backing for the view of his former Old Trafford assistant follows newspaper reports that the national boss had broken the "pretence of acceptance" of the situation.

Smith also warned players who had withdrawn from his under-21 squad that they risked not being chosen for his full squad in the future.


I'm sorry Neil but that doesn't say "Ferguson thought it was terrible" to me:confused:

Also on the last point, I hate when international managers come out with that sh!te. Threatening the players even though it's their clubs that have pulled them out. It amounts to nothing less than intimidation and bullying.

[NeilMcD]

RAGING Walter Smith last night warned he is ready to kill the cap careers of kids he believes are deliberately shunning Scotland Under-21 squads.

The Scotland boss is furious that a planned get-together of the Under-21s this week has been shelved because of the number of call-offs.

And with withdrawals at that level reaching epidemic proportions, Smith is determined to stamp it out.

He revealed he will discuss the situation with Under-21 coach Maurice Malpas when he returns from this week's trip to the Kirin Cup in Japan.

Smith said: "In terms of calloffs, the one that is frustrating is the Under-21 situation.

"People who have been closer to it than me over the past few years have stated that it's always aproblem.

"Terry Butcher flagged it up in his programme notes at the weekend. Obviously he listens to Maurice Malpas who has become a bit frustrated with it.

"The Under-21 team seem to have more call-offs. They've had to cancel their training this week because of them.

"Again we've been hit by these call-offs - some of whom Maurice questions because they have never turned up.

"Once we get back it's something we're going to have to look at. Some of the younger ones don't recognise the importance of the games, they think the national side is the level they should be playing at.

"They're maybe seeing young players involved in the full team and think that they don't need to play at Under-21 level - that can't continue.

"If there's a feeling among the staff that players are ducking out then they won't be picked for the national team while I'm the manager."

Smith reckons some players believe they should be fast tracked into the full squad but he has clearly had enough and with two friendlies next week, away to Northern Ireland and at home to Turkey, it'll be interesting to see how many call-offs Malpas gets.

Smith added: "The next European Championships are not far away and we've only got two games to play.

"It's an important tournament for the Under-21s and we want to give them as good a chance as possible.

"If they qualify it's something that would benefit any player.

"I have to stress we have got a great number of players who do turn up, it's not fair to say every player is involved.

"But players withdraw for reserve games at club level and that can't be right. It's maybe because they see younger players getting selected for the national team.

"Ten years ago there seemed to be a natural progression from Under-18s to Under-21s to the full squad unless they were an exceptional young player like Paul McStay or Wayne Rooney with England.

"That happens, but for a lot of other boys it's a natural progression. They think they can skip that one."

Smith also hinted that he could do nothing about the withdrawal of Celtic trio Shaun Maloney, David Marshall and Stephen McManus from the Japanese trip.

Celtic boss Gordon Strachan had said that if Smith had insisted upon their presence in the Far East, they would have been allowed to travel.

But Smith refuted that suggestion and said: "Scotland have no right to take a player so Ican't insist on anything.

"If someone phones me up and tells me they're withdrawing them I've got no recourse for that.

"I'd have been interested in seeing all of them playing. I haven't had the benefit of seeing Marsh playing at international level.

"Also we're not well off for centre-halves so it would have been good to see McManus.

"Obviously Maloney is Player of the Year but he hasn't had an opportunity to get a good number of caps because of the injury problems he had.

"Let's not exaggerate the situation, I've had great cooperation from all the clubs including Celtic as far as the national team are concerned. I hope that clears it up."

[NeilMcD]

Mods is this not bad language then.


Gonzo I dont think it was Walter Smith that caused the trouble he picked the players for his squad and and they were pulled out by Strachan for a testimonial game simple as that Surely international football is more important than an end of season testimonials. I know lots and lots of Scottish supporters dont have much time for the old firm anyway but this was taking the biscuit. Fair play to the 2 Rangers guys anywayj who have taken their chance and maybe Maloney will regret not going. He is going to be a top player but he would have gained far more by going to the game in Japan in my view


I know us Irish fans would be ****ed off if any manager pulled out players out of the Ireland squad for testimonial games.

[geysir]

I know us Irish fans would be ****ed off if any manager pulled out players out of the Ireland squad for testimonial games.
I would be píssed off if it happened to the Irish squad, as its Scotland playing on the other side of the planet I couldn't care less.
I would also be píssed off if Stan organized such a trip end of season.

[Poor Student]

Mods is this not bad language then.


It is indeed. Cop on Gonzo.

Strachan's well within his rights to do what he did. Celtic have lost John Kennedy for over a year to an injury picked up on international duty and Paul Lambert picked up a nasty injury for Scotland in 2003. Certainly you only have to look at the amount of Giggs' friendly appearances for Wales to see Ferguson's stance on the issue. I recall Smith himself moaning about call ups back in his Rangers days.

[drinkfeckarse]

Fair play to the 2 Rangers guys anywayj who have taken their chance and maybe Maloney will regret not going.


Neil the way you put it sounds as if Maloney pulled out himself. He didn't, he was prevented from travelling half-way across the world for 2 meaningless games (that are not recognised by FIFA as an official tournament) by his employers so he could play 2 meaningless games over here instead:rolleyes:

[NeilMcD]

I did not say that Maloney pulled himself I said that he may regret not going. As in this was a chance for him to establish his place in the Scotland set up as he has barely played for them at Senior level and Mc Manus has not made his debut for them yet.

Maybe Burke or Boyd has not jumped passed Maloney in the pecking order and he may regret not going. I never said he pulled himself out.

Also they were not meaningless games, they were international friendlies which are used by the international manager to get players together to work on tactic and team morale ahead of the qualifiers. International managers see very little of their players as it is and I think its a disgrace that Strachan would not let his players go on the tour due to 2 testimonials. To show how meaningless those games are, Shearer kicked off one game and then came on at the end to take a penalty which is against the rules of a proper football match. That shows how much of a joke it is in my view. Nothing against Shearer I might add.


Also you might remember Student that Paul Lambert missed a crucial game against England due to injury in a tackle in an old firm game the week before in 1999. Injuries happen in football whether it be international or club and he could have got injured in Old Trafford or training.


I know we would all be up in arms if players were pulled out of the Chile game due to testinmonial matches.

[Poor Student]

I did not say that Maloney pulled himself I said that he may regret not going. As in this was a chance for him to establish his place in the Scotland set up as he has barely played for them at Senior level and Mc Manus has not made his debut for them yet.

I think the decision damages McManus and Marshall a lot more than Maloney. Maloney is one of the most, if not the most talented Scottish player around.


Maybe Burke or Boyd has not jumped passed Maloney in the pecking order and he may regret not going. I never said he pulled himself out.

I think they are Scotland's hottest young talents along with Webster, Gordon and a few of the Hibs lads. I think they should all hope to figure regularly within a year.


Also you might remember Student that Paul Lambert missed a crucial game against England due to injury in a tackle in an old firm game the week before in 1999. Injuries happen in football whether it be international or club and he could have got injured in Old Trafford or training.

Celtic pay the player's wages though Neil.



I know we would all be up in arms if players were pulled out of the Chile game due to testinmonial matches.

I would indeed. But as an Ireland fan I can be quite guilty of self interest and hypocrisy.:o

[klein4]

It is indeed. Cop on Gonzo.


I'm lost....is ****ed less of a naughty word than ****?????????? enlighten me to how this childishness of telling teacher on other ODPs works..

and as for the scotland thing. I would have said celtic were using it as preparation for the champions league next season so they were entitled. rangers upped the bar for them this year so they will be expected to get out of the group stages. I wouldnt care less if people were pulled from the chile freindly. freindlies are meaningless.

[Poor Student]

I'm lost....is ****ed less of a naughty word than ****?????????? enlighten me to how this childishness of telling teacher on other ODPs works..



Common sense Klein. If Adam deemed it unworthy or becoming a filtered word, then it should not be used here. Yet again you pick up on something Neil has done.

[dahamsta]

klein4, I understand that this isn't the first time you've been warned. Mind your business please, and if you have a problem with another poster (or posters), add them to your Ignore List (click on their username). Either way, this is the last time you'll be warned: if you don't stop acting the maggot, you'll be banned permanently from the site.

[klein4]

if thats how ya feel ban away.....:)

[NeilMcD]

[QUOTE=Poor Student]I think the decision damages McManus and Marshall a lot more than Maloney. Maloney is one of the most, if not the most talented Scottish player around.



I think they are Scotland's hottest young talents along with Webster, Gordon and a few of the Hibs lads. I think they should all hope to figure regularly within a year.



Celtic pay the player's wages though Neil.


I think the last comments is true however. If that is the argument for every international game then where is the future of international football. Maybe I am biased cause I love international football and I really only watch club football in order to check on the progress of those for international football so my bias is there. I think the integrity fo international football should be kept.

If Celtic are allowed to pull players out of an international squad why should other clubs not be allowed to do it also. Scotland would have been then left with non entity of a team Also Strachans line that if Walter Smith insisted that they should he would have let them go is rubbish. Smith was in no position to insist as it was a friendly and not a competitive game.

The old firm clubs are not too popular with the Tartan Army as it is and this does not help. This is for many reason but mainly due to the fact that many Celtic fans do not support Scotland but support Ireland and many Rangers fans support England instead of Scotland. I have been told of cases of Scotland fans getting physically and verbally abused by residents of Glasgow from boths sides of the footballing divded due to the fact they are wearing Scotland jerseys on the way to a home game. This is mind boggling to get abuse for supporting your own in your own country. The thoughts of that happening in Dublin woudl sicken me. I think Strachans are not helpful in this context. By the way I am not blaming Strachan for this viewpoint been held by the Old Firm supporters.

[Donegalcelt]

I think it's well known that Strachan and Stan Petrov are not geting on and in pulling him out of the Bulgarian squad, he also pulled the other three out of the Scottish panel. Maybe he's being pig headed on the Petrov issue but he has already said the team are a bit light and maybe inexperienced for the Champions League next season. I know they were only testimonials but it did give the likes of Maloney and especially McManus, Wilson etc some sort of (limited) experience of playing games out of Scotland in decent atmospheres instead of trekking half-way across the world

[NeilMcD]

Come are you trying to say that playing Man Utd and newcastle in testimonials is any preparation for Champions League. You must be having a laugh.

Internatinonal managers get very little time with their players to work on set pieces tactics, team morale etc. That is why any time you get with the players is important in my view. Its one of the reason I am fully behind Staunton taking the players to Portugal for that purpose. Club managers are working with their players week in week out. If Ferguson can let Fletcher go to Japan instead of playing in Keanes testimonial why cant Strachan do the same with is players.

In my view it was a 2 fingers to the SFA for not giving him the job. He was letting the fact that he did not get the job in the way in my view.

[Donegalcelt]

Maybe. I'm all for people playing for their country and it used to really peeve me off when club managers complained about, for example Nobby Solano lining out for Peru. But from Strachan's point of view, letting his better young players go to Japan to play Bulgaria is a totally lose-lose situation. And i only mentioned the testimonials as it was something Strachan himself brought up. Basically, I think he used that as back up if you know what i mean

[NeilMcD]

Well if it is a lose lose situation for the club, why should Rangers FC have to let their players go like Boyd and Burke or Man Utd have to let Ferguson go or Everton let Mc Fadden go. Why should Celtic FC feel that their players do not have to go on this trip and all the others do with the exception of Hearts who have the Cup Final.

[Donegalcelt]

Well if it is a lose lose situation for the club, why should Rangers FC have to let their players go like Boyd and Burke or Man Utd have to let Ferguson go or Everton let Mc Fadden go. Why should Celtic FC feel that their players do not have to go on this trip and all the others do with the exception of Hearts who have the Cup Final.


They didn't have to. Nobody is better at having players withdrawn from internationals, especially meaningless ones, than united. I'm sure the SFA or smith or whoever could've arranged something closer to home or even a Stan type training camp. I don't see the sense in Japan and obviously, neither does strachan

[NeilMcD]

Thats hardly a way forward for international football that the managers dont have to release their players is there. I see nothing wrong with the Scotland trip and neither did the thousands of Scotland supporters that went over too and seeing their team win 5-1. I agree about Ferguson and the point I would make is that even he let his player go for the game and did not withdraw him. that shows how bad Strachan has got. In my view he let his failture of getting the Scotland job get in the way in the international careers of Mc Manus Marshall and Maloney.

[dahamsta]

if thats how ya feel ban away.....:)Hilarious. God loves a smartarsé, but I don't. Bye bye. If you want back in, feel free to apologise for your idiotic behaviour.

[Junior]

Neil,

1) Do Celtic get some kind of preferential treatment with regards to being allowed to withdraw players from the Scotland squad? No the same rules apply for all.

2) Strachan bitter at not getting the Scotland job? I think he has enough concerns with a forthcoming CL campaign and squad strengthening to be getting on with, He's managing a massive club with massive expectations,I doubt he's that petty.

3) Whilst I can see that you clearly have some empathy with the Tartan Army and how they are so hardly done by Celtic & Rangers. TBH It didn't feel that way when Celtic players were regularly getting booed by the wonderful Tartan Army, if indeed Celtic players were lucky enough to be noticed by the SFA.

[NeilMcD]

I do not support Celtic Rangers or Scotland so I have no bias here other than my declared bias for love of international football. #

How many Celtic fans have posted on this thread and declared that they are Celtic fans.


1) Celtic dont get preferential treatment, but there manager has decided to withdraw them whereas other managers have not withdrawn their players. So it seems that Strachan does not regard the national side as important.


2) I have not doubt that Strachan is happy with his current role and is getting better paid than he would be if he was manager of Scotland. However he did apply for the Scotland job and was turned down and was not too happy about that. I would not rule out the possibility that he does not have much time for the SFA after that.


3) I dont have any empathy but I do know that Scotland fans have been beaten up and get abused regularly on their way to Hampden from people who live in Glasgow. This is fact and has nothing to do with empathy. I did not know about Celtic Player been booed while playing for Scotland by the Tartan Army. If this is the case well then that is a disgrace also. Again it was probably an Rangers element that support Scotland. Most Scotland supporters do not like to see Old Firm prejudice brought into supporting Scotland.

[drinkfeckarse]

2) However he did apply for the Scotland job and was turned down and was not too happy about that. I would not rule out the possibility that he does not have much time for the SFA after that.


My understanding was that the SFA spoke with him among others but that he hadn't actually applied for it. I could be wrong though.

[Gather round]

I agree with Neil McD. International football, even if friendly, must take priority over friendly testimonial club games. If it doesn't, then clubs will simply pull out players on a whim. (Overall, internationals are more important than club games, but to be reasonable you can compare like for like. If Steve Archibald was still playing, you wouldn't expect him to miss Barcelona's cup final to star for Scotland in Japan).

They shouldn't use the 'we pay their wages' argument to avoid criticism. National FAs do pay, both in fees to the players plus insurance costs against injury etc. And ultimately, part of any club's 'contract' with FIFA/ UEFA etc. is that they accept the authorities' rules. One of the most fundamental being the importance of internationals.

As others say, Smith and perhaps Ferguson are hypocrites. Yes, but that dosn't lessen that Strachan is too. Either the players involved weren't needed for the Shearer-Keane love-in, so they could have gone, or they played and might have been injured. The likelihood of which is as real at St James' Park as against Bulgaria's fringe players.

[Junior]

I do not support Celtic Rangers or Scotland so I have no bias here other than my declared bias for love of international football. #

How many Celtic fans have posted on this thread and declared that they are Celtic fans.


1) Celtic dont get preferential treatment, but there manager has decided to withdraw them whereas other managers have not withdrawn their players. So it seems that Strachan does not regard the national side as important.


2) I have not doubt that Strachan is happy with his current role and is getting better paid than he would be if he was manager of Scotland. However he did apply for the Scotland job and was turned down and was not too happy about that. I would not rule out the possibility that he does not have much time for the SFA after that.


3) I dont have any empathy but I do know that Scotland fans have been beaten up and get abused regularly on their way to Hampden from people who live in Glasgow. This is fact and has nothing to do with empathy. I did not know about Celtic Player been booed while playing for Scotland by the Tartan Army. If this is the case well then that is a disgrace also. Again it was probably an Rangers element that support Scotland. Most Scotland supporters do not like to see Old Firm prejudice brought into supporting Scotland.

I didn't declare I was a Celtic fan, but its fairly obvious from this and many other threads I have posted on.

Im a Celtic and Ireland fan and Im not trying to defend Strachan as like you I don't like the international game being belittled by this or other issues, such as choosing your nationality based on career progession etc......

I just don''t see that this particular instance is any worse than the numerous other examples of it that go on throughout a season and I really can't see how you can make a judgement on Strachans view of the SFA or indeed playing for Scotland based on it. Strachan gained 50 caps for Scotland and features in the Scotland hall of fame. Personally I reckon he fully understands the pride young Shaun, Marshall and McManus would have featuring for Scotland.

[eirebhoy]

Could Scotland be rapidly catching up with Ireland in international terms? Or even overtake us again? Their U19s knocked out the holders France, Belarus and Bulgaria to win their group and qualify for the finals for the first time in 20 years. The squad contained 6 of the double winning Celtic squad, Charlie Grant was voted player of the tournament by UEFA officials.

[NeilMcD]

I would say they have been ahead of us as they have a better record over the last 2 qualifying terms we finisehd 3rd and 4th they finished 2nd and 3rd.

[Stuttgart88]

As said right at the start of this thread, if we had players performing like some of theirs are, we'd be very excited. That said, I don't think the core of their side is as goods as ours: Given, Duff, Finnan, Robbie. There does seem to be a lot of good happening in Scottish football though.

On a bit of a tangent, but it's of note for our qualifying group, Wales beat a Basque XI at the weekend. Useful result.