National Anthem

[CollegeTillIDie]

Let's look at the song for a second

God save the Queen
It's a Fascist Regime
It made you a moron
A potential H -Bomb

God Save the Queen
She ain't no human being
There is no future
in England's dreaming

( Lydon/ Matlock/Cook/Jones)(c) Warner Brothers Music 1977

I don't see how any Irish person could have a problem with that song :D

[David]

Such as?

Btw David, it's not a case of selective hearing.

Many many examples of PC in the world, such as parts of England not being able to use the word Christmas. Football is essentially a working class game and rival fans wind each other up, it is all part of the game and as long as there is nothing offensive it is one of the things that makes our game so great. Sure let's all applaud our opponents goal and say "jolly well played there old chap".

[Paddyfield]

National anthems should only be played at international matches.

Spot on Dr.Nightdub. You hit the nail on the head.

[dcfcsteve]

Many many examples of PC in the world, such as parts of England not being able to use the word Christmas. Football is essentially a working class game and rival fans wind each other up, it is all part of the game and as long as there is nothing offensive it is one of the things that makes our game so great. Sure let's all applaud our opponents goal and say "jolly well played there old chap".

Care to name these places in England where you aren't able to use the word Christmas ? :confused: I can picture the word Police prowling the streets of Bradford, Blackburn and Sothall in search of those that dareth utter the forbidden 'c' word..... :rolleyes:

Let's stop kidding ourselves David. Singing God save the Queen, Rule Britannia and The Sash (you left that one out) at games involving fans from a primarily catholic/nationalist community is more than just casually singing songs. It's done to be tribal, offensive and inflammatory. There's 'winding fans up', and there's winding fans up. Arsenal fans singing songs abour Man U fans being dole scrounging northern monkeys is winding them up. Arsenl fans singing songs about Munich isn't. As for singing the 'party tunes' at Belfast derbys : as is often commented on Irish League Forums, the singing of such songs at Blues-Glens games is part of a 'who can out-prod the other' game that is often played-out between both sets of fans.

So let's stop the whol innocent, butter wouldn't melt in yer mouth, 'but they're only wee songs' act. You know damn right what the issue is with them, but you refuse to accept the opposing view. If Linfield fans are so insecure in their own cultural identity that they have to drape themselves in it 24/7 then that says a lot for the psyche of your support. 99.9% of supporters of other clubs around the world don't feel a god-given right, nay necessity, to flaunt their identity in such a painful faux-pride fashion.

[Dassa]

Spot on Dr.Nightdub. You hit the nail on the head.

Very true. I would hate to see the national anthem played at IL matches. I am no fan of God save the Queen and would prefer to see NI with their own anthem. When this happens and I can feel proud to hear a specific Northern Irish anthem , I think it would degrade it to hear it played everywhere and at everything.
The more you see or or hear something the less it means IMHO.

[Roverstillidie]

It seems like some have the attitude that it is only sectarian when Linfield are doing it.

name one club south of yours that has your previous in this regard? or north, east or west?

i dont recall any southern club ever having a no-protestant rule. i have never heard amhrain na bfiann from any LOI fans. even rebel songs are a dying art.

the songs itself are not the problem. the fact is a group of supporters with a strong tradition of racism and bigotry that it claims to be losing sing them with a gusto, especially vocally in the earshot of taigs.

i personally dont have a problem with you lot being militantly british (in fact i cant wait for the day Rovers v Linfield becomes essentially the Irish old firm). it says so on the tin so to speak, but fúck off denying what you are. sing your songs if you want, but sont patronise us by pretending its all an innocent wee tune or two.

[CollegeTillIDie]

Very true. I would hate to see the national anthem played at IL matches. I am no fan of God save the Queen and would prefer to see NI with their own anthem. When this happens and I can feel proud to hear a specific Northern Irish anthem , I think it would degrade it to hear it played everywhere and at everything.
The more you see or or hear something the less it means IMHO.

I remember a rousing song used to boost tourism in the Wee North a decade or so ago " Come On Northern Ireland Come On " . Could be expanded into a National anthem, rousing tune too !

[David]

name one club south of yours that has your previous in this regard? or north, east or west?

i dont recall any southern club ever having a no-protestant rule. i have never heard amhrain na bfiann from any LOI fans. even rebel songs are a dying art.

the songs itself are not the problem. the fact is a group of supporters with a strong tradition of racism and bigotry that it claims to be losing sing them with a gusto, especially vocally in the earshot of taigs.

i personally dont have a problem with you lot being militantly british (in fact i cant wait for the day Rovers v Linfield becomes essentially the Irish old firm). it says so on the tin so to speak, but fúck off denying what you are. sing your songs if you want, but sont patronise us by pretending its all an innocent wee tune or two.


So many holes in that statement. By the way I can totally accept that Linfield have long had a problem with sectarianism in our support and this is something that is being dealt with but to say that we have a strong tradition of racism is absolute nonsense. As for a no Catholic rule, I have not got any idea what you are on about, such a rule has never existed at Linfield FC and indeed Catholics have played for the club throughout our illustrious history. There was admittedly a period during the troubles up here that we did not have Catholics but that was as much down to their understandable reluctance to play for us than anything else. This reluctance was proved to be justified as the first Roman Catholic to sign for us after the period when there was none was beaten up by people in his own community. Indeed I could name you numerous Catholic players who have had problems in their own communities simply because they signed for Linfield.

[David]

I repeat that our supporters sing these songs at every game and not just those against teams that are perceived as Catholic. Who do people think they are telling us what we can and cannot sing. As I have said many times on this thread if a song is sectarian then I will be the first to complain about it but these songs are clearly not (and I include the Sash in that). If others choose not to sing patriotic songs then that is their choice but equally Linfield supporters should be afforded the same choice. As previously said, my personal preference would be for people to sing Linfield songs at Linfield games but ultimately we do not live in a dictatorship and may I suggest that if anyone gets their knickers in a twist over Linfield supporters singing Rule Britannia then it is they who have the problem and not Linfield supporters.

[Poor Student]

I repeat that our supporters sing these songs at every game and not just those against teams that are perceived as Catholic. Who do people think they are telling us what we can and cannot sing. As I have said many times on this thread if a song is sectarian then I will be the first to complain about it but these songs are clearly not (and I include the Sash in that). If others choose not to sing patriotic songs then that is their choice but equally Linfield supporters should be afforded the same choice. As previously said, my personal preference would be for people to sing Linfield songs at Linfield games but ultimately we do not live in a dictatorship and may I suggest that if anyone gets their knickers in a twist over Linfield supporters singing Rule Britannia then it is they who have the problem and not Linfield supporters.

This is why sectarianism will not be eliminated from Windsor. You're an apologist David. Your statement "I'd rather sing Linfield songs" is an admission that you really know that they don't belong there and you'd rather they weren't. It's like someone who has a family member or friend who does something wrong and you know it but you won't come out and admit it. But the sectarianism won't be eliminated until people like yourselves stand up and demand and force a footballing repertoire. That's easier said that done, I know. Rome wasn't built in a day and it's taking a lot and long time to root sectarianism out of Scottish football grounds. That doesn't mean they can rest on their laurels and pat each other on the back because they're doing it. There's a lot more to do.

[MariborKev]

Who do people think they are telling us what we can and cannot sing.

If we had the proper legislation then it would be authorities lashing down a few fines in your direction......

David: Linfield fans don't sing those songs against every team. I have been to see the Blues at Windsor and in other grounds; Stute, Coleraine, Omagh and others and the songs did not appear at every game.

[David]

This is why sectarianism will not be eliminated from Windsor. You're an apologist David. Your statement "I'd rather sing Linfield songs" is an admission that you really know that they don't belong there and you'd rather they weren't. It's like someone who has a family member or friend who does something wrong and you know it but you won't come out and admit it. But the sectarianism won't be eliminated until people like yourselves stand up and demand and force a footballing repertoire. That's easier said that done, I know. Rome wasn't built in a day and it's taking a lot and long time to root sectarianism out of Scottish football grounds. That doesn't mean they can rest on their laurels and pat each other on the back because they're doing it. There's a lot more to do.

Define sectarianism though. I, along with others, am working damned hard to eradicate sectarianism. GSTQ and RB (or the Sash for that matter) are NOT sectarian, they are about our identity. Now I personally do not want to express my identity at a football match but I totally accept the right of others to express theirs. Why can't others do the same? It is a democracy.

[David]

If we had the proper legislation then it would be authorities lashing down a few fines in your direction......



For singing our National Anthem or Rule Britannia? Somehow I doubt it.




David: Linfield fans don't sing those songs against every team. I have been to see the Blues at Windsor and in other grounds; Stute, Coleraine, Omagh and others and the songs did not appear at every game.

These songs are sung at every game that there is fans singing at, which is admittedly not all games. They will be sung at the Cup Final, you can bet your house on that, which sort of screws your wee theory that is to rub peoples noses in it.

[MariborKev]

David,

I was referring to your self righteous claim that people have no right to say what should be sung.

If we had the proper legislation in the North then offenders could be properly dealt with.

As regards the game that the songs are sung at I am not going to get into a debate over it. I was at the games, I heard what I heard.

[David]

David,

I was referring to your self righteous claim that people have no right to say what should be sung.

If we had the proper legislation in the North then offenders could be properly dealt with.

As regards the game that the songs are sung at I am not going to get into a debate over it. I was at the games, I heard what I heard.

If the song is sectarian I will agree with you 100% but as I said you need to define what is sectarian and the songs in question could certainly not be classed as that. As for bringing in legislation to deal with sectarianism, again I would totally agree with you.

[lofty9]

What the hell is the point singing Rule Brittania and GSTQ at a football match? GSTQ is a song about an inbred women who has borne a succession of very ugly and moronic children. Other verses depict the usual nonsense about slaying Britain’s enemies, which really has no place in a civilised society never mind a modern society. As for Rule Brittania "Britons will never be slaves"!!! LEAVE THIS IN THE DARK AGES NO IDENTITY WITH A FOOTBALL MATCH.

It's your identity? The Linfield top, red, white and blue scarf - that's your identity. Songs about Linfield's history, about how many trophies you have won and anti Glentoran songs - all about your identity. But singing songs about how you want God to Save The Queen? Then go to church and pray for that.

And whilst I am ranting the same goes for the idiots who sing about a spud famine at matches. I don't want to listen to that either. I've had enough history lessons at school to know about the severities of famine and war - IMO it should stay a history lesson.

[stickyjoe]

going around in circles on this thread.
Have to agree with David on this one though, theres nothing slightly sectarian about GSTQ(except a catholic can`t be the head of the monarchy:o ) and Rule Brittania. It might annoy people but its not sectarian.

I`d agree that I don`t see the point of singing this or any other non football songs at matches but FFS get a grip its an all island competition, what did you expect the Linfield fans to sing? Too much PC nonsense in football these days over songs

[lofty9]

Its not a PC issue for me. It's an issue that highlights the backward society that exists in the North. If people can leave archaic chants and anthems in the past then it can help here politically and socially. Idealistic views, but every little helps.;)

[CollegeTillIDie]

One point David made is accurate. There has never been an active no Catholic policy at Linfield. Catholics were not signed as players ,during the early part of the troubles for their own safety sake, at a time when Loyalist paramilitaries were very active. The club still employed Catholics in off field low profile capacities. The breakthrough from this impasse came in 1988 when Roy Coyle signed two Catholics from Africa, Antoine Coly and Mustafa Kamal. After that Dessie Gorman and Pat Fenlon to name but two went North and played for the club.

[Dassa]

Its not a PC issue for me. It's an issue that highlights the backward society that exists in the North. If people can leave archaic chants and anthems in the past then it can help here politically and socially. Idealistic views, but every little helps.;)

Personally woudnt say that a backward society exists in NI, i would say that people in NI are very defensive but i dont think it is backward.

[lopez]

...There is enough political correctness without it taking over football.Damn PC. I think it all started when someone took exception to the playing of 'All Coons Look Alike to Me' at the Jack Johnson and James Jeffries fight in 1910.:rolleyes:

[cheifo]

So we are all agreed gentleman anthem was a bad idea.One of you wordsmiths stick an email through to whoevers responsible.Thank God
Brian Kennedy did'nt sing it.That really would have rubbed salt in the wound.:D

[Lux Interior]

Which would of course would explain why they were sung against Glentoran a few weeks ago. Regardless, imagine football supporters singing a song to wind up opposition supporters, the very thought of it, could be the end of the game as we know it. :rolleyes: As long as there is nothing offensive to other peoples race or religion then it is fair enough. There is enough political correctness without it taking over football.

They are sung during matches with Glentoran to 'out-Prod' the Glenmen. And you know it!

The ironic clapping and wolf-whistling from the Glenmen, in response, would suggest that your supporters are a laughing stock.

Leave it at the door.

[Lux Interior]

the singing of such songs at Blues-Glens games is part of a 'who can out-prod the other' game that is often played-out between both sets of fans.


I would lay off the sweeping generalisations here, stevo.

I ain't never heard the Glenmen sing GSTQ or RB at a Belfast derby.

There are some f**kwits within our support but, by and large, we have knocked the sectarian / cultural stuff on the head.

[dcfcsteve]

Personally woudnt say that a backward society exists in NI, i would say that people in NI are very defensive but i dont think it is backward.

Sweet Lord Dassa - spend a decent amount of time living in any other Western nation and you'll soon change your mind here !!

Northern Ireland is an incredibly old fashioned society in soooo many ways. Attitudes in the province are decades behind the rest of the modern world on a wide range of social issues - such as rascism, homosexuality, religion, divorce, what can and can't be done on a Sunday, the role of women in society, respect for the rule of law etc .The Republic used to be considered socially more backward on issues such as these than the North, but certainly not any more.

Only in Northern Ireland could someone use the word 'darkie' without genuinely meaning any offence, and have no-one bat an eyelid in response. Says it all really.....

[Dassa]

Sorry Steve but what you do is a general sweeping statement of a nation. Anyone I know has alot of respect for differences. I dont think it matters were you live either. I will be moving to england next year, however the past stories i hear about negative attitudes to NI people hasnt made me believe that england as a country is anti NI. Remember what you here in the news is a small fraction, you never hear about good things very often.

[dcfcsteve]

Sorry Steve but what you do is a general sweeping statement of a nation. Anyone I know has alot of respect for differences. I dont think it matters were you live either. I will be moving to england next year, however the past stories i hear about negative attitudes to NI people hasnt made me believe that england as a country is anti NI. Remember what you here in the news is a small fraction, you never hear about good things very often.

Dassa - there is no way to describe 1.7m people without making sweeping generalisations. Generalisations are a form of average - there will always be those who don't fit them, but they can be useful to summarise an overall scenario. Your assertion that Norn Iron isn't backward is also a sweeping generalisation, by the way.

There are people of mixed views everywhere. What in my experience makes Northern Ireland unque is that out-dated notions are still very common, and indeed often the norm, in many if not most circles. Well educated, middle class people will still openly use words like 'darkie' without intending any offence. I have witnessed and been shocked by this myself on a number of occassions. It's not necessarily that they're rascist - it's just that they don't know any better. In the rest of the UK, openly negative remarks (as opposed to those between friends) about people because of their race or sexuality are frowned upon in the majority of social circles and situations. Sure - it still happens, but just not as openly, casually, or as widespread as in NI.

Due to the insularity created in Northern Ireland by the Troubles, we haven't had to go through the education regarding race, sexuality etc etc that the rest of the UK has. Hence our attitudes are still a lot less up-to-date. There is no way to discuss this without makihg sweeping generalisations - and sweeping generalisations are not always inaccurate anyway (he said, making a sweeping generalisation about sweeping generalisations...... :D ).

P.S. I wouldn't worry about the atttudes of the English towards Norn Irish people. In 15 years of living here, I've only encountered one incident of negativity towards me that I can solely ascribe to the fact that I was Irish (and that was in 1992). The English are also bizarrely poor at differentiating between a northern and southern Irish accent (he said making another sweeping generalisation... :) ), so most don't even differentiate between the 2 parts of the island. To them, we're all just Irish, and the Irish are actually quite popular these days in England. The wimmin in particular love the aul' accent...... :)

[Schumi]

Well educated, middle class people will still openly use words like 'darkie' without intending any offence. I have witnessed and been shocked by this myself on a number of occassions.

How about phrases like "worked like blacks"?

[OneRedArmy]

Personally woudnt say that a backward society exists in NI, i would say that people in NI are very defensive but i dont think it is backward.Can I reword that slightly.

There's no more backward society that puports to be civilised than NI.

We have spent years killing each other over something that happened 400 years ago, which we continue to celebrate/revile, yet we all have a hearty chuckle at the anachronism that is Basil Fawlty when he tells us "not to mention the war" and makes a few anti-German quips.

South Africa, as a comparison, has huge problems, but it has made more progress in 10 years than NI has in the last 30/40 years.

Why do you think most reasonable thinking people with half a brain gets out of the place as soon as they can?



Originally Posted by David
Who do people think they are telling us what we can and cannot sing.
"They" shouldn't need to. But hey, sing what you want to sing, march where you want to march, blah, blah, blah. If you can't see the futility of it all, there's no point trying to reason.

[CharlesThompson]

Eenie meenie miney mo
catch a ****** by the toe
if he squeals, let him goe
Eenie meenie miney mo

Has anyone ever heard that in the playground. This was part and parcel of 1970's National School Playground play when I was going to National School. I'd like to think that I hadn't a feckin clue what the bloody thing meant, but it was used to pick all sorts of teams back then.

Ireland of today is under a lot of scrutiny regarding racism and its attitudes to everything regarding politically and social and moral ideals. I would like to think that we have moved markedly from this innocent yet racist schoolyard ditty toward a more tolerant society wich imbues consideration for others.

From my own perspective, I do not see how GSTQ and Rule Brittania has anything to do with the history of a football team. Believe it or not, some people I know are offended when they hear these songs and I doubt that the singers of these songs are totally unaware that they can be viewed by a sizeable amount of fellow football supporters as being offensive. While I am more inclined to consider the singing of these songs with more a sense of amusement than anything else, I can't see for the life of me the day when I go to a football match and sing Amhran na bFhiann as a vocal gesture in support of my team. It just doesn't fit.

[Dr.Nightdub]

One easy solution, which ought to leave everyone happy and cheesed off in equal measure: next time anyone playing Linfield gets the hump from them singing God Save The Queen, just sing the Pistols' version back at them. :D

[thomas]

The Nay Feiners pretty much sum Ireland up.

[David]

.

From my own perspective, I do not see how GSTQ and Rule Brittania has anything to do with the history of a football team. Believe it or not, some people I know are offended when they hear these songs and I doubt that the singers of these songs are totally unaware that they can be viewed by a sizeable amount of fellow football supporters as being offensive. While I am more inclined to consider the singing of these songs with more a sense of amusement than anything else, I can't see for the life of me the day when I go to a football match and sing Amhran na bFhiann as a vocal gesture in support of my team. It just doesn't fit.

Can you please explain to me what anyone could possibly find offensive about either song?

[Not Brazil]

I can't see for the life of me the day when I go to a football match and sing Amhran na bFhiann as a vocal gesture in support of my team. It just doesn't fit.

Seems to fit in ok at Parkhead....ironically a British football stadium.

[gspain]

The eenie meeny ryhme is still used in playgrounds - at least in my daughters now it is

"Catch a tigger by the toe" i.e. the Winnie the pooh character.

As for the songs, I don't find GSTQ or RB to be offensive. They are certainly provocative and the fans around me in Tolka took offence to the RB chants. "All Ireland champions" didn't go down well either.

While I wouldn't agree with the sentiments in RB I enjoy a non racist and non sectarian chant that winds up opposition fans and must admit that was certainly a good one.

However The Billy Boys is clearly offensive and sectarian and needs to be stamped out or at least modified.

[David]

The eenie meeny ryhme is still used in playgrounds - at least in my daughters now it is

"Catch a tigger by the toe" i.e. the Winnie the pooh character.

As for the songs, I don't find GSTQ or RB to be offensive. They are certainly provocative and the fans around me in Tolka took offence to the RB chants. "All Ireland champions" didn't go down well either.

While I wouldn't agree with the sentiments in RB I enjoy a non racist and non sectarian chant that winds up opposition fans and must admit that was certainly a good one.

However The Billy Boys is clearly offensive and sectarian and needs to be stamped out or at least modified.

Agree totally with your last point but what the hell is the problem with All Ireland Champions? :confused:

[Jerry The Saint]

Only in Northern Ireland could someone use the word 'darkie' without genuinely meaning any offence, and have no-one bat an eyelid in response. Says it all really.....

This isn't a NI thing, it happens everywhere especially with older people. My dad, for example, he's not as cosmopolitan or as educated as me and it can be embarrasing. He doesn't understand all the new trendy words - like he'll say "poofs" instead of "gays", "birds" instead of "women" or "darkies" instead of "coloureds".

[Schumi]

the fans around me in Tolka took offence to the RB chants.But not to Billy Boys strangely. :rolleyes:

[Poor Student]

"darkies" instead of "coloureds".

Coloureds is an acceptable term?:confused:

[Speranza]

It's a line from The Office. Genius.

[Poor Student]

It's a line from The Office. Genius.

Ahhhh.:o

[lopez]

Can you please explain to me what anyone could possibly find offensive about either song?Britannia rules the waves? Who the f*ck said Britannia could rule anyone? Britons never being 'slaves' would be fine if this courtesy was extended to other people. GSTQ mentioning the Scots isn't exactly inclusive, is it? but I'd be a hypocrite if found this offensive, especially as the Scots haven't exactly done much to break the union in the last 400 years. True this is all in the past, blah, blah, and we all know that in the six counties the past is one thing that isn't dwellt on :rolleyes:.

Seems to fit in ok at Parkhead....ironically a British football stadium.Well they seem to have their own version there. Don't remember 'The Soldier's Song' mentioning el Papa. Still, offensive to Irish unionists - 'Saxon foe' etc. - I wouldn't dream of even attemtpting to argue it wasn't, even though, obviously, I personally find nothing offensive in it to me.

[Speranza]

Not Brazil, what does Celtic fans songbook have to do with Irish football?

[CollegeTillIDie]

Britannia rules the waves? Who the f*ck said Britannia could rule anyone? Britons never being 'slaves' would be fine if this courtesy was extended to other people. GSTQ mentioning the Scots isn't exactly inclusive, is it? but I'd be a hypocrite if found this offensive, especially as the Scots haven't exactly done much to break the union in the last 400 years. True this is all in the past, blah, blah, and we all know that in the six counties the past is one thing that isn't dwellt on :rolleyes:.

Reminds me of a joke I heard when I was young ... passenger plane landing at Belfast International Airport.... announcement by Stewardess
" Ladies and Gentlemen we are now landing at Aldergrove Airport,please return to your seats, and make sure your seatbelts are fastened , and turn your watches back 300 years " :D

[David]

Seriously the attitude on here is rapidly changing my views towards an all Ireland League. Such intolerance is unbelievable. People are now starting to quote verses from GSTQ that some people may find offensive. Do Linfield supporters sing these verses, no they dont. Indeed I have never heard my National Anthem sung in its entirity anywhere. Cliftonville supporters have on occasions sang the Irish National Anthem at games and you know what, I am not at all offended by it because I can tolerate other peoples beliefs. Now what I would find offensive is people singing the name of a guy who planted a bomb around the corner from where I live, killing people that I knew which is reportedly what Derry City supporters did against Glentoran in the Setanta Cup but sure it is only Linfield supporters that are sectarian. I am as keen as anyone to rid the game of sectarianism but I am clear in my mind what songs are and are not a problem and just because I do not like some songs does not mean they are sectarian or offensive. As I said a bit of tolerance is certainly what is needed. By all means complain about the likes of the Billy Boys, I will gladly back you up but if people want to be patriotic at a football match by singing songs that nobody could possibly find offence in then that is their right and it is not sectarian just because you feel it is wrong to sing them at a football match. If you do not want to sing patriotic songs, that is up to you, but equally give others the same choice without demonising them for doing so.

[JW.]

David, you cannot equate the (wrong) decision to play the Irish anthem before the Setanta final with Linfield singing GSTQ and Rule Britannia. I imagine the anthem was played to add to the sense of occasion, for all that it was clearly an ill-judged decision.
The issue of Linfield fans going to Tolka and singing Rule Britannia is a totally different matter. I've no problem accepting you as British, so why should the only British fans that would even think about singing that have to hail from Northern Ireland? Rule Britannia is a triumphalist song that was sung at Tolka and other places purely for reasons to do with provocation. The more you wave the flag, the more you emphasise insecurities regarding your identity.

[dcfcsteve]

Now what I would find offensive is people singing the name of a guy who planted a bomb around the corner from where I live, killing people that I knew which is reportedly what Derry City supporters did against Glentoran in the Setanta Cup but sure it is only Linfield supporters that are sectarian.

What the f uck are you talking about David ??? You're seriously losing the plot here.

Derry City fans have a long tradition of not singing sectarian songs. End of story.

A small number of people wearing Cliftonville regalia somehow got tickets for our section of the Oval during our Setanta game against the Glens there. I have no idea of what particular songs they sang, but they were made unwelcome by the Derry fans around them. They then proceeded to start fights with the same Derry fans at the end of the game. This has been well-documented on both the Derry City forum and ILF.

Ironically, the very few problems I have ever been aware of in the 20 years we've been back in business have all involved Cliftonville fans - either against our fans with their Shamrock Rover buddys, mixing in with our fans to try to abuse other teams, or in the case of the Glens game - both mixing in with our fans and then causing trouble against them. Even in the EL it seems we can't escape the sh!t that goes on in theg Irish league....

Perhaps we should have just chanted songs like "if you hate the f*cking Fenians clap your hands...", like the best fans in Ireland... :rolleyes:

Take yer head out of yer arse with your petty "reported" accusations. Nobody buys them here fella.......

[Anto McC]

Seriously the attitude on here is rapidly changing my views towards an all Ireland League.

Good thing its not up to you so...

I dont give a f*ck who sings what,it's only a song,if your gonna be sensitive enough to be offended by a song,then you deserve to be!!

I used to care about things like that but i realised it not worth it,not over a song anyway!

[Speranza]

I will gladly back you up but if people want to be patriotic at a football match by singing songs that nobody could possibly find offence in then that is their right and it is not sectarian just because you feel it is wrong to sing them at a football match. If you do not want to sing patriotic songs, that is up to you, but equally give others the same choice without demonising them for doing so.

I alike every other el fan will keep "patriotic" songs well away until Ireland matches. Glentoran fans who from the most part come from the loyalist areas of East Belfast feel absolutely no need to be "patriotic" at domestic games but I'm sure they are still proud of their identity. What place has GSTQ or RB got in domestic matches?

[CollegeTillIDie]

I alike every other el fan will keep "patriotic" songs well away until Ireland matches. Glentoran fans who from the most part come from the loyalist areas of East Belfast feel absolutely no need to be "patriotic" at domestic games but I'm sure they are still proud of their identity. What place has GSTQ or RB got in domestic matches?

I would argue that Rule Britannia has no role whatsoever in any football match at any time. GSTQ is fine at the start of an international match involving England but other than at that point no role whatsoever. Amhran na bhFian should only be sung at the start of international matches involving the Republic by the same token!