View Full Version : Soccer in Croke Park
Naitch
16/04/2006, 12:36 PM
Does anybody know if the FAI will be allowed to put buckets seats on the Hill for the qualifiers im just wondering as it will look a bit ridiculous with only 3 sides full then a big open space behind the goal. If they cant put seats into it surely then the FAI should just put a massive tricolour onto it which i think would look pretty good.
De Town
16/04/2006, 1:32 PM
think i read before that the steps are too steep for bucket seats to be put in.
Docboy
16/04/2006, 2:59 PM
No, not as far as I know.
pineapple stu
16/04/2006, 3:00 PM
Temporary bucket seats are banned now under UEFA, which is the whole reason Lansdowne is being redeveloped surely?
$Leon$
16/04/2006, 3:07 PM
Is there any chance we'd be allowed use it as a terrace?
Would be great to see Hill 16 as a terrace for home fans.
pineapple stu
16/04/2006, 3:07 PM
For friendlies, yes. Not for competitive games. But I don't know if the GAA are allowing any friendly games to be played there.
Bucket seats WILL be allowed in Croker.
The FAI original assumed they would not be allowed but a certain type of bucket seating DOES comply with UEFA regulations.
There won't be a full allocation however.
Bucket seats WILL be allowed in Croker.
The FAI original assumed they would not be allowed but a certain type of bucket seating DOES comply with UEFA regulations.
There won't be a full allocation however.
Thats great news... if its true - whats your source?
$Leon$
16/04/2006, 8:37 PM
There won't be a full allocation however.
What do you mean by full allocation?
does it mean we won't be allowed put as many as will fit or that they won't all be sold?
Lets say 8,000 seats can fit there, well they will only erect 5/6000 for saftey reasons or something along those lines.
I was made aware of this after a recent chat with FAI vice President Maurice Fleming
Saint Tom
16/04/2006, 10:38 PM
there are just as many exits on the Hill as elsewhere in the ground and as for for evacuation etc, it is as good as any terrace in the world
There will be no bucket seats. Lansdowne was exception to the FIFA rule.
paul_oshea
19/04/2006, 12:07 PM
its great how all these people know the yes and no, for this, without actually providing any source, this is about the 5th or 6th time in less than a year this thread has been created and all the same answers have been given.
Clipper
19/04/2006, 12:15 PM
Just to confuse evryone further, I understood that bucket seating is allowable for Hill 16 as it will involve a seat bolted to a permanent structure, whereas the buckets in Lansdowne were bolted to a temporary structure, well scaffolding really....
nedder
19/04/2006, 1:31 PM
According to John Delaney ( interview in todays Kilkenny people) , Hill 16 will be used for away supporters, which sorts out segregation issue. Away allocation is 7,000, of which the Germans and Welsh have indicated that they will take up the full allocation.
I'll try and post up the full interview, some interesting stuff in it.
Nedder you are 100 per cent correct.
i have named my source - Maurice Fleming.
and also, here is a quote from croker stadium director peter mckenna: "They (the bucket seating) arn't the same as temporary seating that arn't permitted - they are seats fixed to a permanent structure. They are used in Switzerland and germany and are very popular there."
NY Hoop
19/04/2006, 2:25 PM
For friendlies, yes. Not for competitive games. But I don't know if the GAA are allowing any friendly games to be played there.
Croke Park will be for competitive games only. Source Croke Park themselves!
KOH
eirebhoy
19/04/2006, 2:43 PM
That's great news. Good idea to have the away fans there too.
$Leon$
19/04/2006, 2:53 PM
Croke Park will be for competitive games only. Source Croke Park themselves!
KOH
where are we going to play friendlies?
will they be all played away during the redevolpment (returned favours for all our home friendlies in recent years) or are we playing them in dalymount?
geysir
19/04/2006, 4:52 PM
According to John Delaney ( interview in todays Kilkenny people) , Hill 16 will be used for away supporters, which sorts out segregation issue. Away allocation is 7,000, of which the Germans and Welsh have indicated that they will take up the full allocation.
I'll try and post up the full interview, some interesting stuff in it.
Can you provide a link to the article? I checked out the Kilkenny People's main sports web page, 13/14 articles on hurling, the 14th is on Emily Maher.
Jerry The Saint
19/04/2006, 4:56 PM
Hill 16 will be used for away supporters,.
BOOOOO! Hill 16 is Dublin Only!
So what is the capacity of seats at Croke park currently.
jbyrne
19/04/2006, 5:29 PM
So what is the capacity of seats at Croke park currently.
about 70,000. 12,000 on the hill
Thats will look fantastic for a football match,slightly jealous wont get to experience what the atmosphere will be like.
$Leon$
19/04/2006, 6:17 PM
BOOOOO! Hill 16 is Dublin Only!
i think the hill should be for home supporters, let the away fans have the canal end upper.
hill 16 could be the focal / vocal point of the home fans similar to the kop in anfield.
i'm sure the gaa would prefer the hill to be home fans as well, if we were to ever play england i'm sure they wouldn't like to see union jacks flying over the rubble of the easter rising
TheJamaicanP.M.
19/04/2006, 6:48 PM
i think the hill should be for home supporters, let the away fans have the canal end upper.
hill 16 could be the focal / vocal point of the home fans similar to the kop in anfield.
i'm sure the gaa would prefer the hill to be home fans as well, if we were to ever play england i'm sure they wouldn't like to see union jacks flying over the rubble of the easter rising
Will disagree with you on this one $Leon$. There are a number of reasons why Hill 16 should be given to the away fans. Firstly, it is more segregated from the rest of the ground. Because the Hogan, Canal and Cusack stands are continuous, it means that anyone can walk around the ground. It would be difficult to secure away fans in the Canal End and would probably mean empty seats between them and the home support. On the other hand, Hill 16 is not connected to the main stands, which makes is better for security reasons. Secondly, although the roof doesn't cover much seating in Croker, at least it encloses the pitch somewhat. That means that the atmosphere created by the home support will be more likely to stay within the ground, as opposed to Hill 16 where it will drift off into the night skies.
As for the suggestion that away support could be put in the upper deck of the Canal End, this will never happen. As far as I can recall, the last time away support was put in the upper deck was in the West Stand at Lansdowne when we played England in 1995. If trouble breaks out on the upper deck of a stand, it is much more dangerous.
As for the composition of Hill 16, all material was removed a couple of years ago so it is no longer composed of rubble from the Rising.:)
CollegeTillIDie
19/04/2006, 6:53 PM
i think the hill should be for home supporters, let the away fans have the canal end upper.
hill 16 could be the focal / vocal point of the home fans similar to the kop in anfield.
i'm sure the gaa would prefer the hill to be home fans as well, if we were to ever play england i'm sure they wouldn't like to see union jacks flying over the rubble of the easter rising
What Union Jacks? No self respecting Welshman flies that :rolleyes:
Saw an article in a Czech football magazine about the qualifiers. Croker was shown as our home ground. My girlfriend translated the basic details and she informed me that Capacity for soccer shown as 65,000 which seemed to indicate that the Hill would NOT be used in the qualifiers!
$Leon$
19/04/2006, 7:04 PM
Will disagree with you on this one $Leon$. There are a number of reasons why Hill 16 should be given to the away fans. Firstly, it is more segregated from the rest of the ground. Because the Hogan, Canal and Cusack stands are continuous, it means that anyone can walk around the ground. It would be difficult to secure away fans in the Canal End and would probably mean empty seats between them and the home support. On the other hand, Hill 16 is not connected to the main stands, which makes is better for security reasons. Secondly, although the roof doesn't cover much seating in Croker, at least it encloses the pitch somewhat. That means that the atmosphere created by the home support will be more likely to stay within the ground, as opposed to Hill 16 where it will drift off into the night skies.
As for the suggestion that away support could be put in the upper deck of the Canal End, this will never happen. As far as I can recall, the last time away support was put in the upper deck was in the West Stand at Lansdowne when we played England in 1995. If trouble breaks out on the upper deck of a stand, it is much more dangerous.
As for the composition of Hill 16, all material was removed a couple of years ago so it is no longer composed of rubble from the Rising.:)
i wasn't really thinking practically i suppose. personally i don't like the idea of very definite segregation such as the leaving of empty seats. everone there should be there to enjoy the game but as you pointed out the case in 95 just shows that scum will turn up just to cause trouble.
not very big up on stadium accoustics but would the sound not travel towards the canal end and be trapped by the 3 main stands?
as i'm sure you are aware jpm cold air causes sound air to be directed towards the ground as oppose to the sky, hence the fact that sound travels further at night. this would mean that the sound of the crowd on the hill for a night time football international would be alot different to a warm afternoon game of gaa.
keep quiet about the rubble being removed during the reconstruction don't think central council have figured it out yet. it took them long enough to realise that €70million of tax payers money went into the ground and that they better share it with the people who helped build it
TheJamaicanP.M.
19/04/2006, 7:05 PM
Saw an article in a Czech football magazine about the qualifiers. Croker was shown as our home ground. My girlfriend translated the basic details and she informed me that Capacity for soccer shown as 65,000 which seemed to indicate that the Hill would NOT be used in the qualifiers!
Do the Czechs realise that we won't be playing them in Croker? That game is fixed for Lansdowne.
TheJamaicanP.M.
19/04/2006, 7:07 PM
as i'm sure you are aware jpm cold air causes sound air to be directed towards the ground as oppose to the sky, hence the fact that sound travels further at night.
No, I actually didn't realise that.:D
nedder
19/04/2006, 9:02 PM
Can you provide a link to the article? I checked out the Kilkenny People's main sports web page, 13/14 articles on hurling, the 14th is on Emily Maher.
Doesn't seem to be on website yet, but the website is a bit hit and miss anyway. I'll summarise it later if I get a chance
CollegeTillIDie
19/04/2006, 10:02 PM
Do the Czechs realise that we won't be playing them in Croker? That game is fixed for Lansdowne.
Article predated fixtures meeting...
NeilMcD
20/04/2006, 11:26 AM
I think John Delaneys article answer a lot of the questions anyway. I think it makes sense to have the away support on Hill 16 and the block bookers getting the 32,000 or so tickets with 10,000 going to premium and 7,000 to away fans. That leaves about 20,000 tickets for people on the waiting list, Eircom League Fans and the general public. I am just glad I will have my 2 anyway for those games. I wonder how they will distribute the tickets. Will block bookers be in one area etc. I would be great if we could have an end where the majority of people are there just to stand and sing for the whole game and not have kids and old guys etc telling you to sit down. Not giving out about these people but the majority of people who sing songs are Ireland games are aged between 18 and 50.
Forever Dreamin
20/04/2006, 12:05 PM
I think John Delaneys article answer a lot of the questions anyway. I think it makes sense to have the away support on Hill 16 and the block bookers getting the 32,000 or so tickets with 10,000 going to premium and 7,000 to away fans. That leaves about 20,000 tickets for people on the waiting list, Eircom League Fans and the general public. I am just glad I will have my 2 anyway for those games. I wonder how they will distribute the tickets. Will block bookers be in one area etc. I would be great if we could have an end where the majority of people are there just to stand and sing for the whole game and not have kids and old guys etc telling you to sit down. Not giving out about these people but the majority of people who sing songs are Ireland games are aged between 18 and 50.
I agree with the above, and think that they should offer The Canal End as the singing end, and make it very clear when applications come out. As a west upper ticket holder i would prefer to be in the canal end, but id never give up my west upper tickets unless i got a swop for the north or south terrace guaranteed!
Hopefully all block bookers will be offered a choice of seats in croker but with a recommendation of Canal and Cusack for the singers and the Hogan for the quiter supporters etc.
joema
20/04/2006, 12:21 PM
That means that the atmosphere created by the home support will be more likely to stay within the ground, as opposed to Hill 16 where it will drift off into the night skies.
Exactly, leave the away support on the hill. I was on the hill for All Ireland final 3 years ago and the atmosphere was pathetic. IMO it is extremley difficult to create a good atmosphere with no roof - I mean how many of us have stood on the North or South terrace and sung our hearts out for 90 mins, then when we go home to see the match on tv you cant hear a thing.
Good articl in the people with Delaney, it should be up oin the website before next wednesday (thats what usually happens anyway)
Difficult for me to summarise it, but he calls himself a Kilkenny man:eek:.
Also, he blows his own trumpet a fair bit but in fairness he has done a much better job than his predecessors - e.g in 1998 ther was only TWO people in coaching development but by the end of this year there will be 71.
About tickets he said that the block bookers will be notified and that SOME people on the waiting list would be sorted.
He also spoke about the importance of having strong el clubs in Dublin, Limerick, Cork, GAlway and Kilkenny - "afterall, it is a City"
joema
20/04/2006, 12:23 PM
I agree with the above, and think that they should offer The Canal End as the singing end, and make it very clear when applications come out. As a west upper ticket holder i would prefer to be in the canal end, but id never give up my west upper tickets unless i got a swop for the north or south terrace guaranteed!
Hopefully all block bookers will be offered a choice of seats in croker but with a recommendation of Canal and Cusack for the singers and the Hogan for the quiter supporters etc.
Great idea - I think we should all e-mail the fai to show tats what we want
info@fai.ie
Schumi
20/04/2006, 12:25 PM
Exactly, leave the away support on the hill. I was on the hill for All Ireland final 3 years ago and the atmosphere was pathetic. IMO it is extremley difficult to create a good atmosphere with no roof - I mean how many of us have stood on the North or South terrace and sung our hearts out for 90 mins, then when we go home to see the match on tv you cant hear a thing.
Never been in the place but my impression is that the roof in Croke Park doesn't cover many of the seats so we could have the same problem.
NeilMcD
20/04/2006, 12:26 PM
Yeah if we can all e mail that to the FAI saying we want the canal end to be a singing end I think it could work there is not reason why it could not work. At least then kids and people who want to sit down wont be bothered by people who are singing and standing up.
Yeah if we can all e mail that to the FAI saying we want the canal end to be a singing end I think it could work there is not reason why it could not work. At least then kids and people who want to sit down wont be bothered by people who are singing and standing up.
Im going to set up a new thread on this in order to get more peoples attention
Never been in the place but my impression is that the roof in Croke Park doesn't cover many of the seats so we could have the same problem.
Yeah your right there Schumi - the roof doesnt extend that far - suppose we'll need to be right at the back. A lot of farly open stadiums can still have excellent atmosphere though - e.g Nou Camp - I know its much bigger but still it doesnt have a large roof either
jbyrne
20/04/2006, 1:14 PM
Never been in the place but my impression is that the roof in Croke Park doesn't cover many of the seats so we could have the same problem.
have been in croke park plenty of times and given the right match the atmosphere in the stands can be brilliant. Last year I was in the canal end for dublin v tyrone replay and during the 15 mins or so Dublin were coming back into the game in 2nd half the noise was deafening.
singing section for the whole of the canal end is a super idea
http://www.foot.ie/showthread.php?t=35330
Here is thread for designated singing area - leave this thread for discussing bucket seats in croker.
I think if we get enough people to email the fai with our suggestion the will have to respond
dublinred
20/04/2006, 2:11 PM
Any chance of the GAA getting their finger out and using the money they are getting to finish Croke park ?
Any chance of the GAA getting their finger out and using the money they are getting to finish Croke park ?
As far as i'm aware they're never going to develop hill 16 because:
1. Historical.
2. The railway track would have to be moved.
nedder
20/04/2006, 3:22 PM
Any chance of the GAA getting their finger out and using the money they are getting to finish Croke park ?
That's the type of ignorant attitude that annoys GAA people. Don't forget its their stadium and we are the tenants.
Forever Dreamin
20/04/2006, 4:58 PM
The GAA have decided to keep the Hill as a terrace as is their right and personally I think they are right. Why should they make the ground all seater when plenty of people prefer to stand. Personally I stand at all internationals until i get fed up with someone behind saying sit down. (That said at away games they can p*** off - i'm standing and singing or shouting)
As for covering the Hill the cost is prohibitive and given the majority of GAA games are in the Summer they would be mad to do so and have to increase ticket prices to pay for whats not wanted by the GAA supporter who in fairness is their priority.
geysir
20/04/2006, 5:27 PM
Wasn't it the plan to have all seater then the GAA just ran out of money, then they listened to the arguement to retain the terrace.
jbyrne
21/04/2006, 8:46 AM
Wasn't it the plan to have all seater then the GAA just ran out of money, then they listened to the arguement to retain the terrace.
original plan was for all seater but fans wanted a terrace. Hill 16 cost something like €25m to build and can accommodate 11,000 fans. cost per fan = €2,272. seated areas costed €180m or €2,500 a seat (72,000 seats). Not much difference there. the terrace design allows for future installation of seats
Docboy
21/04/2006, 11:10 AM
There's never been any problem with the atmosphere on the Hill for the Dubs games so I don't think it' the roof or lack thereof which is the problem. IMO people sing freer on a terrace as they feel more anomyous.
fergalr
21/04/2006, 12:41 PM
The best thing about having the away fans on the hill is that they can push the pitch right up against the canal end to ensure that all of us home fans won't need binoculars.
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