View Full Version : Defeat could be blessing in disguise – Jeffrey
A face
11/04/2006, 4:42 PM
Defeat could be blessing in disguise – Jeffrey
Linfield manager David Jeffrey hopes a rare defeat at the weekend has given his squad have received the necessary wake-up call ahead of their Setanta Sports Cup semi-final clash with Drogheda United on Tuesday night.
The Blues’ 49-match unbeaten run came crashing to a halt at the hands of Lisburn Distillery on Saturday. But far from knocking the team’s confidence, Jeffrey feels the reverse could have given his players renewed focus ahead of the visit of the eircom League leaders to Windsor Park.
Read more at www.eleven-a-side.com (http://www.eleven-a-side.com/setantacup/irish_soccer_detail.asp?newsid=21991)
glentoranfan
12/04/2006, 10:34 AM
That's what I though too, but apparently not.:p TBH, I am slightly surprised their winning run is over and then, getting put out of the Setanta Cup.:eek: I fear we'll feel the backlash on Saturday...:(
As much as pains me to say, don't take anything from this Linfield team. They have been amazing all season long - they are at least a level or two above any Irish League team and on a par, if not better than Eircom league teams - and don't forget, they are all part-time (borrow Peter Thompson who is only full-time a few weeks ago)
dcfcsteve
12/04/2006, 10:55 AM
That's what I though too, but apparently not.:p TBH, I am slightly surprised their winning run is over and then, getting put out of the Setanta Cup.:eek: I fear we'll feel the backlash on Saturday...:(
As much as pains me to say, don't take anything from this Linfield team. They have been amazing all season long - they are at least a level or two above any Irish League team and on a par, if not better than Eircom league teams - and don't forget, they are all part-time (borrow Peter Thompson who is only full-time a few weeks ago)
The Linfield team are good - but to be fair they would only be upper mid-table in the EL. Part-time has nothing to do with it - most EL teams are part-time, and even the ones at the upper end of the league have a mixture of pros and part-timers.
In the Setanta Cup Linfield played 5 games against EL opposition - winning one, drawing 3 and losing one. That's decent form - but certainly doesn't suggest they would be "better then Eircom League teams". On that evidence they'd have finished at best 5th out of 12th in our league last season.
This year's Setanta Cup has really exposed the gap between the IL and EL. It soon became clear that only one IL club was in with any realistic chance of doing well. All 4 EL clubs were in with a genuine chance of group progression until the end.
I do think that in any all-island League Linfield would do incredibly well - they have the fan base and resources to do so. But with over 85% of the teams they play in the IL not offering any serioous challenge to them, they don't have enough competition there to push them on at the moment.
Not Brazil
12/04/2006, 11:09 AM
Linfield Football Club have publicly stated that they have no interest in joining any All Ireland league.
They do welcome and encourage the further develpment of the Setanta Cup.
dcfcsteve
12/04/2006, 11:14 AM
Linfield Football Club have publicly stated that they have no interest in joining any All Ireland league.
They do welcome and encourage the further develpment of the Setanta Cup.
Good for them.
I suspect strongly that without facing some serious competition on a more regular basis - be that in an all-island league, a greatly expanded Setanta Cup, some sort of British League, or an inter-galactic championship - the club will continue to struggle to develop much beyond where it is at the moment. A huge fish in a small pond.
And I bet that if an all-island league started tomorrow without Linfield, it wouldn't take long for that publically stated attitude to alter. If only 2 teams left the IL to join an AIL, the IL would disintegrate.
Derry City are part-time & Linfield did not beat them (didn't lose either). Drogs & Shels are fulltime. Cork City have maybe 12-14 fulltime pros.
Linfield use the part-time excuse too often & i thought Fergusons commenst about "southern teams not respecting us..." was rubbish.
Its fair to say eL sides didn't know what to expect last year & didn't rate the IL. Linfield won in surprise victory. This season Linfield have improved & would be on a par with top eL sides although hard to know how they would cope with amkunt of travel Cork & Derry City need to do. Aside from Linfield it would seem that the other IL sides would struggle at the bottom end of the eL Premier.
Schumi
12/04/2006, 12:16 PM
In the Setanta Cup Linfield played 5 games against EL opposition - winning one, drawing 3 and losing one. That's decent form - but certainly doesn't suggest they would be "better then Eircom League teams". On that evidence they'd have finished at best 5th out of 12th in our league last season.
Those five games were against the first, third and fifth teams in the EL at the moment so logically, you'd expect that they'd do better against the lower teams and probably finish in the top three. I've no doubt that Linfield would be in contention for at least a European place in the current EL.
Not Brazil
12/04/2006, 12:18 PM
Good for them.
I suspect strongly that without facing some serious competition on a more regular basis - be that in an all-island league, a greatly expanded Setanta Cup, some sort of British League, or an inter-galactic championship - the club will continue to struggle to develop much beyond where it is at the moment. A huge fish in a small pond.
Erm...that's why Linfield Football Club welcome and encourage the further development of the Setanta Cup competition.:rolleyes:
We don't do too badly against the other big boys on the island at the minute, as it happens.;)
dcfcsteve
12/04/2006, 3:54 PM
Those five games were against the first, third and fifth teams in the EL at the moment so logically, you'd expect that they'd do better against the lower teams and probably finish in the top three. I've no doubt that Linfield would be in contention for at least a European place in the current EL.
Hang on - you're unlikely to finish in the Top 3 of a league unless you're taking serious points (i.e. wins) against the teams in the Top 5. Beating the same lower teams that everyone else around you in the league beats does not push you to the top of a table.
Teams in the top half of the current EL table have only played 4 or 5 games in the league so far (4 for Derry and Shels) so current positions can't be used for any sort of realistic comparison (sorry UCD.... :) )
It is extremley likely that the Top 6 of the final EL table this year will contain Drogheda, Derry, Shels and Cork. Arguably even the Top 4 will be comprised of those teams in some order. Linfield only managed 1 win in 5 attempts against 3 of those teams - and given how Cork disposed of Drogheda twice in their Setanta group, and what we all know of Cork as a team, I strongly suspect that Linfield would struggle to take any points off them either.
Moot though it all is - they might therefore realistically be in contention for UEFA via the FAI Cup if they were in the EL, or an Inter-Toto slot if they finished 4th and the Cup winners finished above them. But no higher. I believe that they would be at best 5th (4th at an absolute stretch) if they were in the current EL. All we have to go-on in this is the Setanta Cup, and I believe the results support my theory here.
dcfcsteve
12/04/2006, 4:00 PM
Erm...that's why Linfield Football Club welcome and encourage the further development of the Setanta Cup competition.
But for as long as Setanta and European competition remain sidelines for you, you'll struggle in the Setanta. You've got a good team that needs regular higher level competition in order to become even better. unfortunately the Irish League can't offer you this, and a few weeks of Setanta and Europe every year won't either.
Unless you're suggesting a parallel league - Setanta running almost alongside the IL ? :)
We don't do too badly against the other big boys on the island at the minute, as it happens.;)
You call 1 win in 5 attempts "not doing too badly"......? :p
Schumi
12/04/2006, 4:05 PM
I could be wrong but did Derry not manage 1 win in 4 attempts against IL teams in the Setanta? The same argument would have you finishing third or so in the IL.
CollegeTillIDie
12/04/2006, 4:11 PM
dcfc steve
All Linfield would have to do is play defensively against Cork City to cause them to drop points. They don't seem to be able to cope with teams playing defensively against them and all the toys come out of the pram when it happens :D
not involved in setanta, as an unbiased neutral I would say Linfield's participation in the last two seasons has clearly raised standards on the island as a whole, the eircom league is far too incestuous and needed a good competitive outsider to shake it up.
Drogs are jamming a series of narrow 1-0's in all competitions lately - think they'll fall off at the first sign of pressure
dcfcsteve
12/04/2006, 4:22 PM
I could be wrong but did Derry not manage 1 win in 4 attempts against IL teams in the Setanta? The same argument would have you finishing third or so in the IL.
True. Though we're not the ones bigging ourselves up, or being bigged-up, in relation to how we'd do in the IL. We're not even the best in the EL, and we know it.
A 25% success rate is still better than Linfield's 20% one though :D ;)
Linfield are better than Derry.
Speranza
12/04/2006, 4:49 PM
Good evidence there WWS. We dominated Linfield home and away but didn't put away our chances.
.....i knew there'd be an excuse in there somewhere.....
if your better, beat them in competitive football until than keep schtum
Speranza
12/04/2006, 5:21 PM
Ok so using your failed thinking....you have contradicted us as they haven't beat us.
Not Brazil
12/04/2006, 5:22 PM
You call 1 win in 5 attempts "not doing too badly"......? :p
Hang on...Linfield topped the "Group of Death"
Derry City failed to qualify from it
End of story.
Jeeez, those Derry City chips.
BleusAvantTout
12/04/2006, 7:59 PM
Ok so using your failed thinking....you have contradicted us as they haven't beat us.
As a spokesperson for also rans, "keep up the good work (spin)!":D
Lux Interior
12/04/2006, 11:33 PM
True. Though we're not the ones bigging ourselves up, or being bigged-up, in relation to how we'd do in the IL.
Yes, you are.
You're talking about Linfield finishing 5th (maybe 4th - at a push) presumably behind Derry who managed 1 win - in 6 group games - against our ****-for-players pub outfit. And, like us, failed to qualify.
Ive no idea where Linfield or Glentoran would finish in an A-IL but I won't be using Setanta results to form a prediction either.
David
12/04/2006, 11:44 PM
The oul Derry City stuff coming out on this thread. Derry failed to beat Shels, failed to beat Linfield so using the logic on here I would assume that they would be relegation contenders?
dcfcsteve
13/04/2006, 1:12 AM
The oul Derry City stuff coming out on this thread. Derry failed to beat Shels, failed to beat Linfield so using the logic on here I would assume that they would be relegation contenders?
And likewise Linfield failed to beat Derry. And so the merry-go-round continues..... :)
And likewise Linfield failed to beat Derry. And so the merry-go-round continues..... :)
The FACT is, Linfield did not suffer from not beating Derry. Unlike some, we do not get caught up on whether or not we beat any one team. We topped the group and qualified, you went out.
lofty9
13/04/2006, 10:05 AM
We went out because we failed to raise our game against a very poor team in Glentoran at the oval. A problem for Derry City over the years unfortunately, in that we can play well against the best and terrible against the worst. :mad: I don't give a stuff whether we should have beaten Linfield or Shels, we played well end of story. That abject abysmal performance on a Baltic Monday night at the oval p issed me right off. I couldn't care less if we played Linfield again and hopefully if we qualify I hope they are in a different group. After watching Linfield in this tournament both live and on the TV I don't want watch that type of football, I've seen it first hand with Dermot Keely's Derry team and Mr Matthews Longford - it doesn't appeal to me. Don't get me wrong - good at what they do, but just not for me.
A little question: When Linfield play at the Oval have they hit any of the planes that take off from Belfast City airport with one of their passes to Ferguson and Thompson?
Not Brazil
13/04/2006, 10:06 AM
And likewise Linfield failed to beat Derry. And so the merry-go-round continues..... :)
There is no merry-go-round.
Linfield topped the "Group of Death" that Derry City could only finish one from bottom in.
If you don't believe me, read the Derry Journal.:cool:
Krstic
13/04/2006, 10:16 AM
At the ned of the day lads, Linfield in an All-Ireland league would become bigger and stronger.
They have the potential to be the biggest club in Ireland, they have the fan base and the Ground.
So if they moved to a league where they had to be full-time and try harder (which, in the Belfast & District league they don't have to) you would see a much stronger and competitive Linfield.
They certainly wouldn't get it as easy as they do now, but they would be amongst the top teams every year.
dcfcsteve
13/04/2006, 12:00 PM
Yes, you are.
You're talking about Linfield finishing 5th (maybe 4th - at a push) presumably behind Derry who managed 1 win - in 6 group games - against our ****-for-players pub outfit. And, like us, failed to qualify.
Ive no idea where Linfield or Glentoran would finish in an A-IL but I won't be using Setanta results to form a prediction either.
Lux - that was in response to all the slabbering that Linfield fans are making themselves, or other fans are making on their behalf. I merely stated my view on where I think they'd finish in the Eircom league at the moment. That's what forums are for, you know...
It's all moot, as unless and until Linfield play regularly against EL teams, we'll never know. Until then, however, the only evidence we have is the Setanta - and there's no reason why that shouldn't be used to support a viewpoint. Just cuz Glentoran had a good-awful run in it this year doesn't change that.
Myself and other people predicted that the IL teams would struggle in this year's Setanta, and they did. That prediction was based on an ubnderstanding of the teams involved, and their relative merits. The same understanding can also inform expected performances over a longer period.
Not Brazil
13/04/2006, 1:30 PM
At the ned of the day lads, Linfield in an All-Ireland league would become bigger and stronger.
They have the potential to be the biggest club in Ireland, they have the fan base and the Ground.
So if they moved to a league where they had to be full-time and try harder (which, in the Belfast & District league they don't have to) you would see a much stronger and competitive Linfield.
They certainly wouldn't get it as easy as they do now, but they would be amongst the top teams every year.
Linfield Football Club have publicly stated that they do not want to join an All Ireland league.
They certainly will not be breaking away from the IPL to join one.
What part of that do you not understand?
More players will move to a full time contract in the coming months.
Linfield Football Club has proven itself to be one of the premier clubs on the island of Ireland.
We won the Setanta Cup last year, and topped a group consisting of two of the Eirecom Leagues so called better teams this year.
Linfield Football Club's support of, and commited participation in, the Setanta Cup will see this position maintained.
I look forward to the club contesting the Gibson Cup for many years to come.
Krstic
13/04/2006, 2:19 PM
Linfield Football Club have publicly stated that they do not want to join an All Ireland league.
They certainly will not be breaking away from the IPL to join one.
What part of that do you not understand?
.
Calm yourself paranoid boy.
Where did I say 'Linfield' will or want to join an AIL.
I stated that in a more competitive league they would be well equiped to cope with EL teams.
They are 'POTENTIALY' the biggest club in Ireland, but in the Irish league they don't have to try too hard.
What part of my post did you not understand???
Lux - that was in response to all the slabbering that Linfield fans are making themselves, or other fans are making on their behalf. I merely stated my view on where I think they'd finish in the Eircom league at the moment. That's what forums are for, you know...
It's all moot, as unless and until Linfield play regularly against EL teams, we'll never know. Until then, however, the only evidence we have is the Setanta - and there's no reason why that shouldn't be used to support a viewpoint. Just cuz Glentoran had a good-awful run in it this year doesn't change that.
Myself and other people predicted that the IL teams would struggle in this year's Setanta, and they did. That prediction was based on an ubnderstanding of the teams involved, and their relative merits. The same understanding can also inform expected performances over a longer period.
So you are now happy to use the Setanta as a basis of who are the best sides? Therefore last May were Linfield the best team in Ireland, north or south?
dcfcsteve
14/04/2006, 1:48 AM
So you are now happy to use the Setanta as a basis of who are the best sides? Therefore last May were Linfield the best team in Ireland, north or south?
Arguably yes. But one swallow doth not a Summer make. Porto were once Champions of Europe - but were they ever genuinely the best side in the continent ??
Consistency is the key. You were far from the best in Ireland this year. And I suspect you won't be either next year. Or the next year. Consistency is key, and only time will tell....
Arguably yes. But one swallow doth not a Summer make. Porto were once Champions of Europe - but were they ever genuinely the best side in the continent ??
Consistency is the key. You were far from the best in Ireland this year. And I suspect you won't be either next year. Or the next year. Consistency is key, and only time will tell....
So in other words you will use the Setanta Cup to back your argument only when it suits you and completely ignore when Linfield are successful. You still can't hide that old Linfield hatred eh?
Not Brazil
14/04/2006, 9:11 AM
Calm yourself paranoid boy.
Where did I say 'Linfield' will or want to join an AIL.
I stated that in a more competitive league they would be well equiped to cope with EL teams.
They are 'POTENTIALY' the biggest club in Ireland, but in the Irish league they don't have to try too hard.
What part of my post did you not understand???
Linfield are well equiped to deal with EL teams.
We won the Setanta Cup last year, and won the "Group of Death" this year.
More of our players will make the transition to Full Time in the coming months, with the resultant benefits that will bring.
The records would show that Linfield Football Club have not dominated the IPL in recent years...this season we have a particularly good team and our main competitors have been particularly poor.
Maybe you should be concerning yourself more with what Derry City need to do to qualify from Setanta Cup groups?:cool:
dcfcsteve
14/04/2006, 10:39 AM
So in other words you will use the Setanta Cup to back your argument only when it suits you and completely ignore when Linfield are successful. You still can't hide that old Linfield hatred eh?
I don't hate Linfield David. Whilst you're not my second or third team on the island, I like to see ANY Irish team do well. I was pleased when you qualified a round in Europe this year. Believe it or not, if you played Celtic in Europe I'd rather see Linfield win - which is this country's version of Norman Tebbit's cricket test, I guess. I support Irish football in all its forms - the only teams I hate are certain English and Scottish ones.
As for Setanta - the comparison between it and the Champions League is perfectly fair. Porto won that 2 years ago. On paper that made them the best team in Europe that year, but in reality they weren't. I don't expect Porto to win the CL again for some time either, and they can only truly claim to be the bext team in Europe when they are performing in that competition consistently.
Likewise, the Setanta also combines a group and knock-out element, which makes it a better measure of performance than your average straight knock-out tournament. But you have clearly been far from the best on the island this year, and have struggled to register results against EL teams (1 win in 5 - hardly championship form). Your win last year can't be taken away from you - but like the CL, only consistency in the competiton will allow you to claim to be one of the very best sides on the island. If Linfield never win another Setanta, are you still going to be harping on about 2005 in 10 years time ?
As for your response to Krstic re Derry City - we KNOW we've still got a long way to go. We're far from the best in the EL, let alone the Setanta. But we're not the ones with the over-inflated view of our own importance and standing - hence why we're not getting the type of criticism that Linfield is.
Speranza
14/04/2006, 12:39 PM
But Gonzo they are going full time so it's ok.......No it isn't because it will only widen the already huge gap between Linfield and the two bit clubs. I am happy to let them seek glory in winning a non-competitive competition because I couldn't be arsed with the hassle of playing against Linfield.
I like playing against teams were sectarianism doesn't come into it EVER. Stupid pointless debates about songs, flags, conspiracies e.t.c don't enter the equation in the EL and that suits me.
David
15/04/2006, 10:42 AM
Know where yer coming from & realise the problems of Derry C. playing Linfield on a regular basis. However, with respect if they can play Cliftonville & , er, Glentoran, then surely Derry wouldn't be a problem.
Understand the 'sectarian' angle & am cynical too about some aspects of the 'peace dividend', but if we are to move on, without political unity, we should at least try to widen the scope of common ground.
& if Northern Prods.can come to Dublin for egg-chasing, why not an AIL?
Personally I am in favour of an all Ireland League and have been for some time now but surely Linfield, or any other club for that matter, are entitled to take whatever stance they want on it without being accused of lack of ambition or whatever. We play in a league for our country, just like clubs all across Europe. Would Lyon be criticised for not wanting a joint French/German league?
the Derry fans are clearly smarting that they failed to beat Linfield in two attempts - and doubtless thought their improved professionalism and standing in the el last season would translate in results on the pitch versus an IL team - it didn't happen (cos in reality theres nothing really between the them )
I've seen plenty in Linfield that el teams could learn from and adopt in our own league which is in danger of becoming stultifyingly boring - check out the lack of goals this season!
dcfcsteve
17/04/2006, 3:28 AM
the Derry fans are clearly smarting that they failed to beat Linfield in two attempts - and doubtless thought their improved professionalism and standing in the el last season would translate in results on the pitch versus an IL team - it didn't happen (cos in reality theres nothing really between the them )
Care to explain this off-the-cuf remark ?
So it's ok for Linfield fans to come onto EL forums giving it the big 'I am', but as soon as any Derry fans (and why is it the Derry fans who you single out - hmmmm) point out that 1 win in 5 is not a world beating performance, all of a sudden it's swept under the carpet as 'chips on our shoulders'.
To clarify WWS - we're not the ones who were going around making huge claims of ourselves. Did our Manager and our fans blame the referee, the linesmen, the weather, the supposed full-time set-up of the opposition, or Buddha himself when we faield to beat Linfield ? No. Now ask youself the same question regarding Linfield.
No matter what way you look at it, 1 win in 5 is not championship material. Neither was Derry's 1 win in 4 - but we're not the ones who've been going around slabbering about how great we are versus everyone else. Wakey wakey, WWS... :rolleyes:
I'm not gonna point out individual posts but you are the one who's banged on and on about gulfs in class etc
Jeffries bleatings are no more than any manager when a microphone is stuck under their mush - compare and contrast Pat Fenlon, Paul Doolin and heaven help us Pat Dolan and Roddy Collins - its par for the course - even no mark gareth farrelly is at it now - talking nonsense is what managers do when they dont win!
Care to explain this off-the-cuf remark ?
So it's ok for Linfield fans to come onto EL forums giving it the big 'I am', but as soon as any Derry fans (and why is it the Derry fans who you single out - hmmmm) point out that 1 win in 5 is not a world beating performance, all of a sudden it's swept under the carpet as 'chips on our shoulders'.
To clarify WWS - we're not the ones who were going around making huge claims of ourselves. Did our Manager and our fans blame the referee, the linesmen, the weather, the supposed full-time set-up of the opposition, or Buddha himself when we faield to beat Linfield ? No. Now ask youself the same question regarding Linfield.
No matter what way you look at it, 1 win in 5 is not championship material. Neither was Derry's 1 win in 4 - but we're not the ones who've been going around slabbering about how great we are versus everyone else. Wakey wakey, WWS... :rolleyes:
One win in five is a nice way of putting it to put your slant on things. How about 1 defeat in 5 against EL clubs this seasonand two wins in 3 games against EL clubs last season? Makes things look a bit different eh? Just shows how the way things are worded can change things but people can quote all the stats they want about Linfield, fact is that we topped a group with two of the top EL clubs in it. Yes we went out narrowly in the semi final and fair play to Drogheda, I hope they go on and win it.
dcfcsteve
18/04/2006, 1:28 AM
I'm not gonna point out individual posts but you are the one who's banged on and on about gulfs in class etc
Jeffries bleatings are no more than any manager when a microphone is stuck under their mush - compare and contrast Pat Fenlon, Paul Doolin and heaven help us Pat Dolan and Roddy Collins - its par for the course - even no mark gareth farrelly is at it now - talking nonsense is what managers do when they dont win!
I think you'll find we've generally been talking about the gulf in class between the 2 leagues. Which is a completely valid point - highlighted starkly by this year's Setanta tournament results.
Why you have to try personalise this as a Derry v Linfield thing is beyond me.... :rolleyes:
dcfcsteve
18/04/2006, 1:31 AM
One win in five is a nice way of putting it to put your slant on things. How about 1 defeat in 5 against EL clubs this seasonand two wins in 3 games against EL clubs last season? Makes things look a bit different eh? Just shows how the way things are worded can change things but people can quote all the stats they want about Linfield, fact is that we topped a group with two of the top EL clubs in it. Yes we went out narrowly in the semi final and fair play to Drogheda, I hope they go on and win it.
Ok, ok - you're right. Yee's are feckin marvellous.
Cork/Drogheda fans - do you mind calling Saturday off and just letting Linfield keep the trophy again for at least one more year. We all know they're the best really - let's stop kidding ourselves here...:rolleyes:
Why you have to try personalise this as a Derry v Linfield thing is beyond me.... :rolleyes:
Ok, ok - you're right. Yee's are feckin marvellous.
Cork/Drogheda fans - do you mind calling Saturday off and just letting Linfield keep the trophy again for at least one more year. We all know they're the best really - let's stop kidding ourselves here..
cough cough splutter splutter
dcfcsteve
18/04/2006, 12:18 PM
cough cough splutter splutter
If you genuinely fail to see how the two posts above fit in with the flow and context of the overall thread, then you're beyond help I'm afraid...
If a fan of Derry gives their opinion that the Irish League is weaker than the EL, and that Linfield would finish around about 4th in the southern league - a view based on the performances from this year's Setanta, rather than pure personal opinion - then you try to make that out as being driven by some sort of anti-Linfield Derry attitude. No attempt to accept that the opinion may have some footballing validity in itself.
But when other EL fans say similar things, you don't accuse them of likewise having an attitude against Linfield. So why the double-standard WWS ? I suspect you're lazily seeing what you hope/want/expect to see, whether it's there or not....
David
18/04/2006, 10:56 PM
If you genuinely fail to see how the two posts above fit in with the flow and context of the overall thread, then you're beyond help I'm afraid...
If a fan of Derry gives their opinion that the Irish League is weaker than the EL, and that Linfield would finish around about 4th in the southern league - a view based on the performances from this year's Setanta, rather than pure personal opinion - then you try to make that out as being driven by some sort of anti-Linfield Derry attitude. No attempt to accept that the opinion may have some footballing validity in itself.
But when other EL fans say similar things, you don't accuse them of likewise having an attitude against Linfield. So why the double-standard WWS ? I suspect you're lazily seeing what you hope/want/expect to see, whether it's there or not....
So you work out that on the basis of this year's Setanta results we would finish fourth when only one team in the Eircom League was able to beat us and that is the team currently occupying top spot? Strange logic there.
dcfcsteve
18/04/2006, 11:12 PM
So you work out that on the basis of this year's Setanta results we would finish fourth when only one team in the Eircom League was able to beat us and that is the team currently occupying top spot? Strange logic there.
Not at all. It would be foolish to put any significant emphasis on the position of teams in ANY league when they're only 5-6 games into a season.
Did Hearts end-up Scottish champions this year ? Did Wigan qualify for the Champions League....?
As the new season is still very young and there was little significant transfer activity over the Winter, last year's final EL table is much more reflective of the relative standing of our teams than a table after only a handful of games 5 months later. Particularly when you follow a league closely and have the understanding of the clubs involved to back that judgement up.
And I went throught the trail of logic that led me to predict you'd finish 4th earlier in the thread. Have a look back over it again.
Not at all. It would be foolish to put any significant emphasis on the position of teams in ANY league when they're only 5-6 games into a season.
Did Hearts end-up Scottish champions this year ? Did Wigan qualify for the Champions League....?
As the new season is still very young and there was little significant transfer activity over the Winter, last year's final EL table is much more reflective of the relative standing of our teams than a table after only a handful of games 5 months later. Particularly when you follow a league closely and have the understanding of the clubs involved to back that judgement up.
And I went throught the trail of logic that led me to predict you'd finish 4th earlier in the thread. Have a look back over it again.
But you used Setanta results this season as a basis and justication for your prediction that we would finish fourth. Who all would be ahead of us using the Setanta as a basis given that only one EL club has beaten us. Where would Shels finish? Where would your beloved Derry finish? Remember to use the Setanta results this season as a basis for your prediction.
dcfcsteve
20/04/2006, 1:17 AM
But you used Setanta results this season as a basis and justication for your prediction that we would finish fourth. Who all would be ahead of us using the Setanta as a basis given that only one EL club has beaten us. Where would Shels finish? Where would your beloved Derry finish? Remember to use the Setanta results this season as a basis for your prediction.
If you had done as I requested and gone back through thre thread you would be fully aware of the basis on which I came-up with my view on where Linfield would finish.
In summary - in Setants you lost to last year's 4th-best EL team, beat the 3rd-best EL team once in 2 attempts, failed to beat the 2nd-best EL team in 2 attempts, and though you didn't play Cork - from what I've seen of them and yourselves I predict they would confidently beat you if you played tomorrow. That suggests that at-best you'd come 3rd or 4th in the league. And as you seem to be a bit of a bogey team for Shels, I've given them the benefit of the doubt and put you 4th. If you disagree - fine. But that's how I reached my conclusion.....
If you had done as I requested and gone back through thre thread you would be fully aware of the basis on which I came-up with my view on where Linfield would finish.
In summary - in Setants you lost to last year's 4th-best EL team, beat the 3rd-best EL team once in 2 attempts, failed to beat the 2nd-best EL team in 2 attempts, and though you didn't play Cork - from what I've seen of them and yourselves I predict they would confidently beat you if you played tomorrow. That suggests that at-best you'd come 3rd or 4th in the league. And as you seem to be a bit of a bogey team for Shels, I've given them the benefit of the doubt and put you 4th. If you disagree - fine. But that's how I reached my conclusion.....
Yet you fail to answer where would Derry finish given that you failed to beat the team that you predict would finish 4th, failed to beat the third best team in the EL and finished two places behind the team that you predict would finish 4th? (Not to mention getting beat by a team that we beat 6-0)
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