What should Cork City be doing?

[The Biz]

I am part of a team from UCC that are working with Brian Lennox to analyse what Cork City FC needs to do to become/stay viable and to be successful.
We have no agenda other than to look at the current situation: people, finances, plans etc.. and to come up with a plan for Cork City FC. As we have no connections to the club and are doing this for free and on a voluntary basis we can say what we like.
We have met with Brian Lennox and some people from Cork City FC and the MFA. We'd really appreciate some feedback from the fans on what you think Cork City FC should be doing to improve their lot. Please be as honest, critical, innovative as you can. The more suggestions we get the better.

[Ali-G]

That's great to hear. There have been many fantastic threads on this messageboard in the past about the club's organisation, marketing, PR, plans etc. I'm sure someone can dig out the threads and re-post them.

It finally looks like City are making an effort to get their house in order.

[pete]

Originally posted by The Biz
I am part of a team from UCC that are working with Brian Lennox to analyse what Cork City FC needs to do to become/stay viable and to be successful.

Well i would have thought you'd first have to decide where the club wanted to be in say 5 years & then devise a plan to get there. You will loads of good simple suggestions on this forum but i rerally think someone needs to details hwat the plan needs to achive.

If the cliub wishes just to stay viable it should continue as its doing already with semi pro players & low costs due to virtually permanent staff.

If the club wants to be successful then IMO it needs to quantify what it means as successful - would this be winning leagues & cups or qualifying for europe?



I'm guessing this is part of one of the business courses at UCC?

[The Biz]

You're right Pete. We are in the final stage of an MBA. Most of our team are in full time employment for well over 10 years and doing this part time.

We will be developing a longer term plan, it is certainly obvous that one is needed, but at this stage we're trying to get input from everyone that has an interested in CCFC. We have heard from Brian Lennox and various other people on what they'd like to see for CCFC. We would like to hear as many ideas as possible from everyone on anything that might help.

We would welcome any feedback!

[dahamsta]

[I dislike responding to requests like this when I don't even know the name of the person involved, or have any proof of their stated involvement; however I'll respond in the hope that the request is genuine; or that if it isn't, someone from the club will read this. FYI, I'm Adam Beecher, the former developer of the corkcityfc.com website. If you are who you say you are, Brian Lennox will know who I am. He will also know the Foot.ie member 'joe', who was the editor of the site.]

The first thing City needs to do - the very first thing - is to reappoint a Chief Executive. Greg Cantillon was a boon to the club last year, even in light of the fact that the job was ostensibly part-time; and that there was an understanding between the club and Greg that his involvement was on a trial basis.

As it happens, I believe that Greg was entirely correct to resign his position, for the simple reason that he was undermined by the Board at every available opportunity. If you are in fact a business student, you will know that the job of a Board is not to run the business, but to oversee the running of the business; to keep an eye on the Chief Executive and his appointees and make sure they're doing their job right.

Greg was doing his job right, in fact he should have received a medal for the extra time and effort he quite obviously had to put in to try and negate the interference of the Board. He put his heart and soul into rebuilding the club, into creating a viable business model. In the end, he was simply unable to handle Board interference, and his only possible option was to resign.

Of course, it has to be accepted that there are exceptions to the rules, and the club is most certainly an exception by it's vey nature. For example, the Club was not in a position to appoint paid managerial positions for aspects of the running of the Club, such as Commercial Manager and PRO, so they were forced to assign these tasks to Board members.

However, it is up to the Board and the Chief Executive to recognise these exceptions and work around them, and in this example it would have been quite simple to draw up a ruleset that separates managerial from Board positions, and ensure that the two do not interfere with each other. It's not a perfect solution, but it's a solution - a square peg forced into a round hole - that would serve temporarily.

The second thing the Club needs to do is give the Chief Executive the power to appoint managers of his choice to the business side of the club; at the very least, a commercial manager and a public relations manager. These managers should suffer no interference from Board level - if the Board is unhappy with their performance, they should discuss it with the Chief Executive. There should be clear separation between owners and operators.

The commercial manager needs to gather up every little detail relating to merchandising and sponsorship and get it tidied up -- it's all over the shop at the moment. And the PRO needs to take a /very/ tough line on communications. In other words, Murphy and his team needs a kick up the ar5e when he talks to the press without permission.

I won't get into the actual football side of the business, but the club could do a lot worse than sacking Liam Murphy. The man is a liability. And that applies to the business side too.

Want more? Ask me a question.

adam

[Neil]

Myself and a.n.other have already drawn up a "list of things to do" that we believe would only help CCFC commercially and in attracting more people to games etc.

Drop us an email...

[Colm]

The club have got to come up with a strategy to attract more people to games, a good start would be to put up a sign outside the ground giving details of the next fixture. They could advertise the games and maybe run some competitions, promotions etc.

The club should do its best to please and look after the hardcore support because without us the club could not survive.

Im not going to get into the whole Liam Murphy issue as im sure you are well aware of the fans feelings towards him already.

One more thing, the club has got to get the promising young players tied down to long term contracts instead of letting them leave on free transfers.

[Neil]

Originally posted by Vetinari
[i]the club could do a lot worse than sacking Liam Murphy. The man is a liability. And that applies to the business side too.


The divide between the supporters and players and club staff has never been worse. Murphy is a PR nightmare but we are stuck with him for one more season (I think and hope it's only 1, correct?)

[The Biz]

We are a genuine group from the current UCC MBA you can ring up the department of commerce in UCC and speak to the department's administrator to confirm it.

Our remit is to analyse the business of CCFC. We will not be dealing with specific people issues. However will certainly be making recommendations on many topics including the structures, marketing initiatives etc.

We cannot guarantee that any action will be taken when we present our report to Brian Lennox but we will be presenting an analysis of the business as we see it. The more informaiton we get from everybody concerned the more complete our assesment will be.

If anybody has specific information they can share with us, let me know and I will e-mail you directly so we can get in touch.

Thanks for your ideas and support and keep it coming!

[fonzi]

more publicity is required and to try to tept non city faithfull down to the cross.

[Neil]

Originally posted by fonzi
more publicity is required and to try to tept non city faithfull down to the cross.
Obviously, but how? (not being smart!)

[eoinh]

one thing the league needs is more foreign players. this would, i believe, attract more fans to our games. i dont mean of course people like crespo or batistuta which is impossible but players from places like central america, the carribean and the poorer african and south american countries. imagine what a boost to the league if trinidad and tobago had qualified for the wc (they only just missed out). you would have had avery john the bohs man playing. we need more opportunities like this. the next time the african nation qualifiyers are happening (the qualifiers, not the finals) or the gold cup qualifiyerrs are happening, cork city and other clubs should get someone like brian kerr to scout at these matchs for talent for the eircom league. the league can easily match what these players are getting in their home countries. it would add colour, excitement and more interest (and thus revenue) not only to cork but to the whole league!

[Ali-G]

It would be easy to promote the games:

Posters up around Cork. In the pubs, around UCC and CIT. Between the colleges alone, you have around 20,000 people (that's 10,000 lads). 10 strategically placed posters would get the majority of them.

Have ads in the examiner and echo confirming kick-off dates and times. I'm sure any City fan will have a gripe about this thing in the past, matches being rescheduled, zero notification.

Ad's on the Cork radio stations, 96FM, Red FM, Radio Friendly.

[pete]

Turners Cross:
I'm sure the MFA wouldn't mind if the club out a sign out side the cross telling anyone passing its the hme of Cork City FC with date & time of next match. Sure club sponsors Guinness would probably pay for it if could have thier name on.

PA - Improve it cos its very poor - i think its on the todo list though.

Family Enclosure - I think Lennox has proposed this already which is good sign - Visits especially by city fulltime professional to schools or clubs with free tickets for games. Its not as if 6 year olds can go on their own so parents will have to buy their own tickets.

Overall the clubs has to realise it cannot progress virtually completely dependent on gate receipts. Needs to target say 50% of revenue from off field activities or something in 3-5 years.

As many people have said heer before the club basically only exists on match day. Since virtually no paid employees as such its communication to the media & public appears to be amateurish at best. Club either aims to be professional or remains an amateur outlet.

As new Chairman Brian Lennox will get a honeymoon period of i'd say 6 months at most since he not new to the scene.

Remember info here will mainly come from CCFC supporters - the average man/woman on the street will have a much poorer view of the club.

[Neil]

Originally posted by pete
PA - Improve it cos its very poor - i think its on the todo list though.

MFA have no interest in getting new PA system. Said to CCFC that they can get one themselves if they want, but would have to take it away after the games! Crazy!

This is where CCFC will have trouble. The MFA need to be roughed up a bit!

Lennox also wanted to get bands etc. to entertain at half time. MFA refused saying the pitch would be wrecked!

[dahamsta]

put up a sign outside the ground giving details of the next fixture

See, there's an excellent example of cheap, effective marketing, well done Colm. And there's loads of other examples. Get a rotation of players to go and mingle with the fans after every match, whether they like it or not. Sign an association deal with RedFM (or 96FM, whoever's willing to barter more). Get more involved with the Supporters Club. Expand the merchandise and give some away free - it costs little or nothing anyway - to schools for example. Visit the schools and talk with the youngsters*, try and get them more interested (even involved) in local soccer.

And dare I say it: Set up a website and use it. I'm not the only web developer in Cork, if they don't want to work with me, work with someone else. Offer them a branding association in return for price cuts. But most importantly, work with them, and work with the community. Community is 90% of Irish soccer, because of the failings of the FAI. It needs to be leveraged, and to leverage it, you need to give the community something to get excited about. Involved community is the most exciting (and powerful) form of garnering (free!) feedback and (FREE!) advertising. Make the product sell itself.

They could advertise the games and maybe run some competitions, promotions etc.

This would be best achieved by working with the Supporters Club. It creates separation from the Club proper, and it gives people a warm, fuzzy (somewhat false, but that's not important) feeling that they're getting involved and helping, without having to deal directly with the fact that they are supporting what should by rights be a viable commercial operation.

The club should do its best to please and look after the hardcore support because without us the club could not survive.

Absolutely. The club has failed in this dramatically, mostly because of the arrogance of the Board and Murphy. The Board didn't really want to associate with the riff-raff, when it's pretty much a given that if they had associated with them, they would have increased word-of-mouth marketing appreciably -- there's nothing a fan likes more than being able to talk to the bosses head to head, without feeling belittled. And Murphy's behaviour when he was being larted by the fans was reprehensible, unprofessional, and to some, unforgivable. He actually blamed them, when every Tom, Dick or Harriet knows that when something like that happens, you take it on the chin and try and make it better. Even if you're right and they're wrong, Roy and Mick.

One more thing, the club has got to get the promising young players tied down to long term contracts instead of letting them leave on free transfers.

Although this should really be dealt with at FAI level, I agree, City should take the reins on this one and ride it home. For that matter, Lennox should take the reins on all issues and use this opportunity to demonstrate to both the FAI and the other teams just how an Irish football club should be run. He only has one go at this, he has to get it right. First time, next season, that's it. Derek Mountfield should have been given another year to prove himself, but the opportunity was taken from him. Brian hasn't even got that, he's got to show the fans - particularly the hardcore fans - that he means business this year. And he's got to better himself year-on-year after that.

With a good team, that's possible. And I'm not just talking about the team on the pitch, I'm talking about the one behind the scenes too, and almost as importantly, the team of people the follow the team of players. It's important for Brian to recognise that we want to help him. Hopefully this study, or whatever you want to call it, will be a good start on the road to co-operation.

adam

*I can't believe I said "youngsters". I'm so old.

[RedReb]

one way i think city could attract more CUSTOMERS to games and buy season tickets would be if they could sort out with the F.A.I a scheme wheras all L.O.I supporters with season tickets could apply for tickets for irish internationals. I mean we are the real IRISH SOCCER SUPPORTERS supporting irish soccer. It is the F.A.I"S league after all.. So say a fella is a casual CCFC fan and goes to 6 games a year he might be willing to buy a season ticket for 100 euro if he thinks he has a chance of getting internationa tickets therefore city get the cash and this guy might even go to all the games cause he already has a ticket to do so. If a scheme like this were in place at league of ireland clubs it could benefit them greatly..... :D

[fonzi]

generate publicity by takin out ads in the papers?
doing things in the community maybe?

[A face]

Originally posted by RedReb
one way i think city could attract more CUSTOMERS to games and buy season tickets would be if they could sort out with the F.A.I a scheme wheras all L.O.I supporters with season tickets could apply for tickets for irish internationals. I mean we are the real IRISH SOCCER SUPPORTERS supporting irish soccer. It is the F.A.I"S league after all.. So say a fella is a casual CCFC fan and goes to 6 games a year he might be willing to buy a season ticket for 100 euro if he thinks he has a chance of getting internationa tickets therefore city get the cash and this guy might even go to all the games cause he already has a ticket to do so. If a scheme like this were in place at league of ireland clubs it could benefit them greatly..... :D

Now you're talkin' ....... If that were to happen you would definitely see a change in attendance figures, speaking of attendance figures, City should set an example and publish theirs .... i dont know what implications this would have for the club, but i do know it would appear to be more transparent to fans/public and someone asks this every other week.

[niamh]

Some really excellant suggestions...makes you wonder why no one listened to supporters before. At least it might make people realise that the fans do have the best interests of the club at heart.

The club needs to be promoted better locally, among the community. There is a football supporting crowd in Cork, City just need to tap into it.

[eoinh]

Originally posted by niamh
Some really excellant suggestions...makes you wonder why no one listened to supporters before. At least it might make people realise that the fans do have the best interests of the club at heart.


yeah a lot of good suggestions. sometimes though you get the feeling that the management at nl clubs seem to think that their supporters are morons.

clubs really have to learn to become part of the community, the way many gaa clubs have done.;)

[Colm]

Originally posted by eoinh
nl clubs seem to think that their supporters are morons. Yeah, thats the impresson I get aswell.
They should, at least, take the time to just listen to the suggestions of the hardcore supporters. Many of us have some good, intelligent ideas which would benefit the club.
What many directors, chairmen etc fail to realise is that very often the supporters have the clubs best interests at heart more than they do.

[Troy.McClure]

One thing thats SO easy, almost every kid can do it, is to give the squad set numbers (like in every other league on the planet + Shels & Pats) and print the players names on the shirts. This makes it much easier for a newcommer to a match to get to know the players by face and name which creats a bigger bond between the supporters and the players and it looks so much more profesional. It would be great to see kids (young and older) with WOODS 7 written on their City shirts which intern raises the profile of the club & its players. When you only get the option of seeing players 1 to 16 line out every week, it looks like a sunday league team (although areguments could be made for that).

[Colm]

Good point Troy. It is unprofessional not to have squad numbers, its like a schoolboy or amatuer team. Kids (and big kids!) cant get a players name on the back of their jersey because your never sure what number a player is going to wear. Even if a player usually has a certain number somebody else will wear that number if the player is injured/suspended or dropped.
Putting players names on the shirts is just one of the many small and simple things that the club could and should be doing.

[dahamsta]

A dumb question, no doubt, but do other clubs do this? (I think it's a great idea, I'm just curious.)

adam

[Colm]

Yeah, Shels and Pats do it (maybe Bohs?) and it looks much better and more professional. Its easy to do all it costs is the price of putting a name on the back of about 20 jerseys. It would probabley only cost less than a tenor per jersey so their hardly going to break the bank.

[The Biz]

There has been some excellent ideas and responses on this. Thanks for you feedback.


Myself and the rest of the group working on this project would like to be able to meet up with a group of you to get your insights 'first hand'.

Adam may be able to facilitate setting up the meeting?

We will definitley be including much of what you have suggested in our report to CCFC. It would be very helpful if we could get to discuss your ideas with you so that we could expand on them and do them them justice in our report.

What do you think?

[Neil]

There is a C.C.I.S.A. meeting on Monday week (I think?) That might be an oppurtunity for people to get together?

[pete]

I don't particularily like the squad numbers like a lot of diehards but theres no doubt since the Sky era it looks more professional for some reason. It would also mean we not have to answer stupid questions from one game a season wonders about who the no.10 is that everybody calling skippy.

:eek:

My motto for the club/board would be 'speculate to acumulate'. Doesn't mean club has to go broke trying to improve things but some moderate investment in basic promotion would be a good start.

[A face]

Originally posted by The Biz
There has been some excellent ideas and responses on this. Thanks for you feedback.


Myself and the rest of the group working on this project would like to be able to meet up with a group of you to get your insights 'first hand'.

Adam may be able to facilitate setting up the meeting?

We will definitley be including much of what you have suggested in our report to CCFC. It would be very helpful if we could get to discuss your ideas with you so that we could expand on them and do them them justice in our report.

What do you think?

I dont think you are getting everyones ideas, you should wait till the season starts and then everyone will be back on here.

[Casegrande]

Originally posted by A face
you should wait till the season starts and then everyone will be back on here.
A lot has to be/should be done BEFORE the season starts (and that is only three weeks away). The CCISA meeting sounds like a good time to get a few people together, inluding 'The Biz', and we can start putting some stuff down on paper.

[The Biz]

Where and when (this Monday) is the CCSIA meeting?

[James]

details here (http://foot.ie/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3520)