Hooliganism in England and Ireland

[A face]

Lads, a girl called Maeve Farrell who is doing her dissertation on hooliganism in England and how it is becoming more prevalent in Ireland. This is a survey to assertain if it is actually happening, and if so, what are the causes.

The survey is 15 or so questions, in Word document which can be downloaded here (http://www.geocities.com/ifgrounds/survey.doc) (40k Word doc). Can you please send them back to the email address below.

mflfc@hotmail.com

Any questions, just shout away.
And lads, its not about our opinions on the topic, its just a survey to establish across a cross-section of fans if there is actually a problem.

[Risteard]

Done.

Any questions, just shout away.
Seems interesting.
Will she be publishing it?

[Conor H]

How do you actaully take the survey.Do you do it youself on Microsoft and simply copy and paste....then email it to the adress given?Or what?:confused: :o

[Mr A]

I just made the options I chose bold, and then saved the document and attached it to an email to the address given.

[pete]

...and how it is becoming more prevalent in Ireland.

On what facts is that being based?

The eL has almost zero organised hooliganism & violence around games has reduced significantly in recent times.

:confused:

[OneRedArmy]

On what facts is that being based?

The eL has almost zero organised hooliganism & violence around games has reduced significantly in recent times.

:confused:
I tend to agree with you Pete, but presumably the results of the study will show whether your equally baseless assertion is true. Cart before horses and all that...........

[Mr A]

I think the way these things tend to work is that a statement is made, and the the results tell whether it's true or whatever. The best thing to do is to fill out the form and tell the truth!

[Risteard]

Oh ya by the way, i put two stars on either side of the box of my answer.
It'd probably be fairer to take the test before reading any discussion we're about to have on it.

[BohDiddley]

I was going to fill it in, but on reflection I don't think I can honestly answer this questionnaire, because it seems to presume that there is a significant problem.
Here's what I wrote under 'additional comments'.

Violence is not a feature of Irish club football. There is one club to which is attached a well-publicised, semi-organized hooligan, or aspiring hooligan, element, but on the whole such people have little credibility and pose little threat, particularly as they generally have no one to fight against.
I think it is also important to note that many of your questions appear to be premised on the belief that there is a culture of violence in particular around soccer matches, and that this, in turn, can be described as ‘football violence’. There is no such thing as 'football violence' in Irish football. I do not believe that you can isolate a significant phenomenon that can be thus labelled. You will find more violence, or witnesses to violence, in a Friday night survey of pedestrians in O’Connell Street and Temple Bar, than you will in every active Eircom League venue, from Turner’s Cross to the Brandywell, combined.
To illustrate, you might consider that many people, such as members of the hooligan element described above, have the misfortune to suffer from acne, because they are young and immature, and if you look around at the crowd in a football match, you will probably see lots of individuals who suffer from acne. But they haven’t got ‘football acne’. You might also conclude that some of them (though not quite as many as among GAA football fans) also have rather poor fashion sense, but I have yet to hear their predilection for chav-ish clothes blamed solely on football.
Your supplied answers leave little room for nuanced perspectives. For example, there is a very significant difference between ‘occasionally’ and ‘never’. For several of the questions posed, I would have answered ‘rarely’ or ‘don’t know’, but neither option is provided. In particular, the survey may give the impression that serious abuse of players is more prevalent than in other sports. There is no way for the respondent to distinguish serious abuse, such as racist chanting, from the general barracking that is a part of football culture, as it is in other sports.
I think that you and others should take great care with the interpretation of data generated from this questionnaire.

[WeAreRovers]

[QUOTE=BohDiddley]
There is one club to which is attached a well-publicised, semi-organized hooligan, or aspiring hooligan, element, [QUOTE]

And did you actually name the BSC in your reply? :rolleyes:

KOH

[rebs23]

To illustrate, you might consider that many people, such as members of the hooligan element described above, have the misfortune to suffer from acne, because they are young and immature, and if you look around at the crowd in a football match, you will probably see lots of individuals who suffer from acne. But they haven’t got ‘football acne’.
Football acne. I must remember that one for the next time shels visit!:)

[bigmac]

Lads, a girl called Maeve Farrell who is doing her dissertation on hooliganism in England and how it is becoming more prevalent in Ireland. This is a survey to assertain if it is actually happening, and if so, what are the causes.



Just wondering A-Face, do you know what level the dissertation is at (undergrad, Masters, PhD?) as the questionnaire is not particularly well constructed. I would assume that Maeve is some form of Sociology student, and perhaps it would be worth her while sitting down with her supervisor and discussing the methodology requirements for such a study. As BohDiddley mentioned, the study makes no distinction between racist abuse and verbal taunting of players, which leaves most respondants a little confused as to the nature of the question. There is always verbal abuse directed at players, (frequently from "home" fans) and the referee, yet I have rarely seen or heard racial abuse or personal remarks clearly designed to cause trouble (e.g. remarks heard at a GAA game from one player to another regarding a recent close family death). But the question as it is phrased in the questionnaire is at best vague, and at worst misleading.

[A face]

Lads ... i cant get to this now, i will later on hopefully ... can you email Maeve with your opinions ... i'd agree with ye from what i can see there. It'd be good for her to heard our side of it too.

[Jaime]

..:o..

[CharlesThompson]

Good spot BohDiddley. I'd be interested in contributing to the questionaire providing I don't think it's a loaded document.

[sonofstan]

Wrote much the same as BD in the additional comments box - the questionnaire does rather assume that there is a hoolie problem and then seeks to quantify it, rather than first ascertain if there is any perception of a problem among the football going public in the first place. Also, in her second qustion, she asks if you've witnessed verbal abuse of players and then as an explanatory note 'racist/ abusive' ..... now leaving aside the tautology of decideing what 'abusive abuse' might be, I pointed out that I, along with I would bet nearly everyone here, would happily abuse a player on the basis of hair colour/ length, weight,height, personal and professional history and so on; anything EXCEPT race .... and, in the last few years anyway, I think I've heard maybe 2 instances of racist abuse at EL grounds ( I was at the the Wayside game in Bray for which we were fined for racist abuse, but didn't hear it) I accept that much gets said that i don't hear - see 'Jim Roddy' thread - but I genuinely don't think racism is a problem in Irish football.

All that said ...... the amateurism of the cops, the disregard of health and safety issues in stadia and so on means that if football did start to attract bigger crowds with a potential for more complex security issues - say in the context of an all ireland league or expanded setanta cup - then we might find ourselves with a problem and no experience in dealing with it.

[pete]

IMO a poorly put together survey & I have studied market research at college & done commercial research.

Too many questions assume hooliganism exists so if I believe it does not exist no option in answers for me to choose.

[Dr.Nightdub]

Got about half way through the questionnaire then realised that the person who drafted it has never been to a football match in their life. Total waste of time.

[CollegeTillIDie]

Football acne? Is that not a rash assertion? :D

[feo123]

its not that big in ireland! you hear about incidents once or twice a season, but thats about it!

[Raheny Red]

Yeh it's not that big but there is still an element of hoolies in the eL...........

[CollegeTillIDie]

Not so much at EL games just at protest marches in the City centre.......................

[pete]

its not that big in ireland! you hear about incidents once or twice a season, but thats about it!

Hooliganism assumes some organisation of which there is virtually none in the this country. Couple of lads slapping each other does not count as hooliganism.

[A face]

Surely there's enough material already on this for a :rolleyes: 1000 dissertations........

Gonzo, can you show me where to find 500 surveys on this issue, all asking the same questions as this girl? As we can see, some of the questions aint worded the best or ask the right questions but its a survey none the less.

Show me where to find this and i'll take it down. And for the record, S***s.& B**s. weren't even mentioned till you brought it up!?! :eek:

[The Sheliban]

Hooliganism – Irish Style

I cannot understand those fans
Who end up bundled into vans.
I’m perfectly prepared to say,
“Our team was worse than yours today.”
I do not feel the urge to fight
To show the other fans I’m right.
Just once I bowed to football violence,
When farting in the minute’s silence.

[Colm]

There is no real football hooliganism in Ireland.

[padjoe]

Gonzo, can you show me where to find 500 surveys on this issue, all asking the same questions as this girl? As we can see, some of the questions aint worded the best or ask the right questions but its a survey none the less.

Show me where to find this and i'll take it down. And for the record, S***s.& B**s. weren't even mentioned till you brought it up!?! :eek:

hey A face contact aido b he conducted a thesis last year and he had some comprehensive results i think or it could've been bull**** either way it was convincing.

[A face]

hey A face contact aido b he conducted a thesis last year and he had some comprehensive results i think or it could've been bull**** either way it was convincing.

Nice one !!

[padjoe]

Nice one !!

can you keep posted as to what her findings are? maybe publish her paper here on foot.ie

[A face]

can you keep posted as to what her findings are? maybe publish her paper here on foot.ie

She said she would anyway !!

[padjoe]

She said she would anyway !!

good stuff!!

[Macy]

Yeh it's not that big but there is still an element of hoolies in the eL...........
There's a few pretenders alright, but if you (or indeed they) think they're the real thing you're living in dream world.

[Raheny Red]

I never said they were the real thing, but there is an element, it doesn't matter how organised they are. Once they go about in an unruly and destructive behaviour it makes them a hooligan.........

[aido_b]

hey A face contact aido b he conducted a thesis last year and he had some comprehensive results i think or it could've been bull**** either way it was convincing.

It was all truth Peej!

[Drumcondra Red]

There's a few pretenders alright, but if you (or indeed they) think they're the real thing you're living in dream world.

Coming from a battle hardend hoolie no doubt??? RR you're dead right!

[anto eile]

Just wondering A-Face, do you know what level the dissertation is at (undergrad, Masters, PhD?) as the questionnaire is not particularly well constructed. I would assume that Maeve is some form of Sociology student, and perhaps it would be worth her while sitting down with her supervisor and discussing the methodology requirements for such a study. As BohDiddley mentioned, the study makes no distinction between racist abuse and verbal taunting of players, which leaves most respondants a little confused as to the nature of the question. There is always verbal abuse directed at players, (frequently from "home" fans) and the referee, yet I have rarely seen or heard racial abuse or personal remarks clearly designed to cause trouble (e.g. remarks heard at a GAA game from one player to another regarding a recent close family death). But the question as it is phrased in the questionnaire is at best vague, and at worst misleading.

she sounds like some dizzy culchie youngone who never attends football. she should steer clear of the topic because i doubt she has any idea what shes on about

[anto eile]

hey A face contact aido b he conducted a thesis last year and he had some comprehensive results i think or it could've been bull**** either way it was convincing.
it was convincing was it?wow.
you can write anything and some people will always think its convincing. the herald and indo are proof of that

[Drumcondra Red]

she sounds like some dizzy culchie youngone who never attends football. she should steer clear of the topic because i doubt she has any idea what shes on about

Hahaha!!! Well said fella!!!

[aido_b]

it was convincing was it?wow.
you can write anything and some people will always think its convincing. the herald and indo are proof of that

If you're planning on questioning something I've written I'd rather you take it up with me anto, cheers

[anto eile]

didnt question what you wrote.
i merely made an observation.and a valid one too. you will agree if youve seen the sh!te that irish newpapers have come out with in the last few days

[CollegeTillIDie]

Have seen lots of pictures of perpatrators of last weeks riots. Loads of Celtic Shirts and Ireland scarves could only recognise one Shamrock Rovers shirt.