New clubs

[sligoman]

watch out sligoman....you have competition;)Erm, what?:confused:

[harpskid]

Another thing too, the media in Donegal and Derry give great coverage to local footie as well. I think the Donegal League have a rule that each club MUST supply match reports/news etc or they're fined if they don't. Is that still the case???

Funny you should say that Steve. Whenever I chatted with folks in the Ballybofey/Donegal town areas, they always stated that they felt the facilites for football where vastly superior in the north of the county than in the south. For example, St. Columba's College, Stranorlar play their games occasionally in Finn Park but usually in Finn Valley AC grounds 'cos they have no college grounds themselves. Even when schools interprovincials were held up there they also used Drumkeen United and Letterkenny for games as well as Finn Valley and Harps.

Yeah the Donegal League operate that system where a club is fined if no report is submitted, and to be fair, the local media here give fantastic coverage to grass-roots soccer and indeed to Harps.

Also, St Columba's do have a pitch of their own. However, they would play bigger games in Finn Park or, to a lesser extent, the Finn Valley Centre.

The interprovincials are played on those pitches you mentioned - St Patrick's Park, Drumkeen; Finn Park; Finn Valley Centre and they also use Cappry Rovers ground, which is a fine set up and should be taken on board by Junior clubs all over the country to show what some hard work and dedication can yield.

Cappry have a fully floodlit pitch, that is up there with the best of 'em and are currently in the process of building a fine club-house.

Cappry is situated on teh immediate out-skirts of Ballybofey.

Also, Steve: In an above post you mentioned that Fanad was in Inishowen - it aint.

"Fanad" is in fact a peninsula of it's own. The Fanad peninsula is separated from Inishowen by Lough Swilly and has the picturesque Mulroy Bay to the West.

[hamish]

Yeah the Donegal League operate that system where a club is fined if no report is submitted, and to be fair, the local media here give fantastic coverage to grass-roots soccer and indeed to Harps.

Also, St Columba's do have a pitch of their own. However, they would play bigger games in Finn Park or, to a lesser extent, the Finn Valley Centre.

The interprovincials are played on those pitches you mentioned - St Patrick's Park, Drumkeen; Finn Park; Finn Valley Centre and they also use Cappry Rovers ground, which is a fine set up and should be taken on board by Junior clubs all over the country to show what some hard work and dedication can yield.

Cappry have a fully floodlit pitch, that is up there with the best of 'em and are currently in the process of building a fine club-house.

Cappry is situated on teh immediate out-skirts of Ballybofey.

Also, Steve: In an above post you mentioned that Fanad was in Inishowen - it aint.

"Fanad" is in fact a peninsula of it's own. The Fanad peninsula is separated from Inishowen by Lough Swilly and has the picturesque Mulroy Bay to the West.

Is that a new pitch of their own St. Columba's have Harpskid??? or have they always had it.

Never saw Cappry's ground but it's great to hear another club have fine facilities.

I really do laugh when the Dublin media parrots on about poor facilities in football here. Just shows they don't bother their arses finding out what's out there.

Information about club facilities should be part of the FAI website (even good links from the FAI website to well run clubs would be a good idea) and clubs should have their own websites too. I know it can be hard to get people to do sites but with the web becoming more and more important - taking millions from the "traditional" media in adverts - it could be a real selling point for clubs in attracting sponsors. look at the amount of people who come here from every part of the island and planet. In fact, I have made purchases based on information I have gleaned from Foot.ie posts and Foot.ie adverts and I'm sure lots more have too.

There is so much that can be achieved, locally and at FAI level, it drives me mad with frustration sometimes.:(

Even I knew that Fanad was a peninsula.....tut tut Steve. :p LOL:D

[Cosmo]

Derry City v Finn Harps is probably the biggest derby outside of Dublin in terms of generating local media interest and attendance

Drogs V craptown would kick its a**e

'Do people from the rest of Louth (Ardee etc) support Drogheda and Dundalk???'

A good few out the country would, not sure about as far as ardee. A good support in meath aswel ie duleek, slane, navan, etc. For the cup final, 2 buses went from a school in cavan to cheers the drogs on :eek:

[hamish]

'Do people from the rest of Louth (Ardee etc) support Drogheda and Dundalk???'

A good few out the country would, not sure about as far as ardee. A good support in meath aswel ie duleek, slane, navan, etc. For the cup final, 2 buses went from a school in cavan to cheers the drogs on :eek:

That's great to hear Cosmo. Long may that support continue.:)

[CollegeTillIDie]

financial irregularities that would make the italians blush. no-one complained when they asked to be removed.

Shafted by Premier Computers who withdrew their sponsorship 2/3 through a season(1995/96) and sponsored Rovers the next season(1996/97) more like. You need to get your facts sorted!

[OneRedArmy]

Sirhamish, I think you need to be clear when you describe junior clubs as having great facilities. Ie that you mean they have great facilities for a junior club.

Having been to Pike Rovers when Limerick played there, whilst the club house and changing rooms were fine and the welcome was excellent, the ground is a pitch with a fence around it. No terracing, no concrete and no cover. It brought me back to places like Abbeycarton.

[Roverstillidie]

Shafted by Premier Computers who withdrew their sponsorship 2/3 through a season(1995/96) and sponsored Rovers the next season(1996/97) more like. You need to get your facts sorted!

we were sponsored by Woodies, so its your facts are out son.
PC bailed on the gate after all the bunging came to light and decided to move rovers to tallaght but quickly lost interest. no sponsorship involved.

[hamish]

Sirhamish, I think you need to be clear when you describe junior clubs as having great facilities. Ie that you mean they have great facilities for a junior club.

Having been to Pike Rovers when Limerick played there, whilst the club house and changing rooms were fine and the welcome was excellent, the ground is a pitch with a fence around it. No terracing, no concrete and no cover. It brought me back to places like Abbeycarton.

Good point OneRed Army - I was thinking in terms of future prospects really. Yeah, Pike would not be on my future list because there is already a Limerick EL club anyway and there's rnough work to be done on Hogan Park anyway.

But some of the grounds I mentioned are well on the way to becoming grand stadiums.

For example, Mullingar have a stand and terracing, Manulla and Castlebar both have seated stands.

Should the FAI designate clubs/counties etc there would have to be many criteria which we all know about but it might be useful to have clubs that are already well established facility-wise and could be improved.

Excellent point about facilities being good as regards Junior level but I was kinda pointing a course for the future.

I would imagiine that at the very least a 500 seater stand would be necessary with concrete terracing on the other side and at at least one end of the ground. You know about all the other requirements - finance, fans, parking etc etc. If the FAI could evaluate and designate the projected clubs and then steer any finance towards these clubs/grounds whilst working with the local football organisations we'd have some progress.

At least, if the FAI could come up with some PLAN we might not be debating here up in the air, so to speak. As I stated earlier, the present set up has to be improved before any new clubs/counties join but the planning and projecting could still be done.

Not happy with the way I put all that but you might get an idea of what I'm on about. I'm afraid that if I start to cover all the angles, I'll burn out before midnight and take up too much space here.

I'm really passionate about all this. It's the area (no pun intended) of football that gets me very animated.:D

[LFC in Exile]

Freudian slip?;)

Reminds me - How do you know ET is Cork City Fan?

he looks like one. :)

[Schumi]

Pike Rovers... changing rooms were fine
There weren't any toilets when we played there. The players had to go into the bar to take a pi$$ before the game.

[joey B]

Is that a new pitch of their own St. Columba's have Harpskid??? or have they always had it.

Never saw Cappry's ground but it's great to hear another club have fine facilities.

I really do laugh when the Dublin media parrots on about poor facilities in football here. Just shows they don't bother their arses finding out what's out there.

Information about club facilities should be part of the FAI website (even good links from the FAI website to well run clubs would be a good idea) and clubs should have their own websites too. I know it can be hard to get people to do sites but with the web becoming more and more important - taking millions from the "traditional" media in adverts - it could be a real selling point for clubs in attracting sponsors. look at the amount of people who come here from every part of the island and planet. In fact, I have made purchases based on information I have gleaned from Foot.ie posts and Foot.ie adverts and I'm sure lots more have too.

There is so much that can be achieved, locally and at FAI level, it drives me mad with frustration sometimes

Even I knew that Fanad was a peninsula.....tut tut Steve. :p LOL:D

Yeah the pitch belongs to them always has, but to call it a pitch would be pretty loose,Its more of a boggy field used have great craic playing Rugby on it though

I think they are in the process of developing it at the minute to bring it up to a playable standard.

[Magicme]

There weren't any toilets when we played there. The players had to go into the bar to take a pi$$ before the game.


Pike Rovers bar is nice tho and when we were re-furbishing at CHP I suggested that we adopt a similar structure with the bar and hall divided with doors. Nice people too.

[hamish]

a boggy field used have great craic playing Rugby on it though


Perfect for eggball then.:D

[SunnySweeney]

[QUOTE=sirhamish] Yeah, you had great rivalry betweeb Cork Hibs and Celtic back in the 60s and 70s but Bluebeard you know yourself that you'd end up with one struggling Cork club and the other less successful with resources spread thinner. I'd be very wary about that. A few derbies are fine but generations have passed and I don't know how a second Cork club would fit in right now.


I would love to see HIBS resurrected. I agree with you Hamish that it makes absolutely no sense right now. CCFC is a well-run club, with excellent management and this would not be the right time to endanger all that good work.

Still, if we could stick a ground in the northside it is not beyond the realms of possibility of Cork being able to support another club. There is a huge population north of the river. Historically the football grounds have been on the southside and Cork clubs have never FULLY tapped into the Northside public.

I think there is a mentality of - I wouldn't mind heading down to the Box but it's too much of a hike. And, that is fair enough too- transportation links are ok but not great.

Think of how many great players through the years have come from the northside.

Saying that, if people can come from Blarney, Fermoy etc to watch CCFC then surely they can make the trek from the northside as well.

[Schumi]

Pike Rovers bar is nice tho and when we were re-furbishing at CHP I suggested that we adopt a similar structure with the bar and hall divided with doors. Nice people too.
Absolutely. The facilities aren't up to senior football though.

[drummerboy]

Has anybody mentioned Arklow Town, who too have great facilities, but a large stand on one side of the pitch and a superb playing surface.

[NY Hoop]

Has anybody mentioned Arklow Town, who too have great facilities, but a large stand on one side of the pitch and a superb playing surface.

Yeah better than some first division grounds anyway. BTW we played the opening match there in the summer of 92.

KOH

[joey B]

Donegal is the 2nd biggest county in Ireland (after Cork). It is also the most remote, and for its size has the worst road network. Furthermore, its edges are fringed by numerous peninsulas and bays, whilst its interior is full of Highlands. It's therefore a fecker of a county to get around full-stop ! It can take up to about 80mins to drive from Derry to Bundoran, and Carndonagh would add another 20mins or so onto that. Though the new roads round Letterkenny have chopped journey times loads.

.

Donegal is actually only the 4th biggest county in Ireland behind Cork,Galway,and Mayo.

[Magicme]

Absolutely. The facilities aren't up to senior football though.

Well I wouldnt really know much about the toilet and changing facilities....i am not in the habit of hanging around them...well not often...ok not always....:eek:

[citybone]

anyone know much about st. fancis f.c. they are ment to have a 3,500 all seater ground in dublin i know they are a lot of dublin clubs at the mo but they could replace dublin ****y

[Schumi]

Well I wouldnt really know much about the toilet and changing facilities....i am not in the habit of hanging around them...well not often...ok not always....:eek:
:D
The fact that the players had to go into the bar to go to the toilet is what I'm refering to.

[dcfcsteve]

Donegal is actually only the 4th biggest county in Ireland behind Cork,Galway,and Mayo.

I've just checked and you're right Joey B.

D'oh - apologies to the good poeple of Connacht.... :D

[dcfcsteve]

anyone know much about st. fancis f.c. they are ment to have a 3,500 all seater ground in dublin i know they are a lot of dublin clubs at the mo but they could replace dublin ****y

Sweet Lord Citybone - how long have you been following Irish football for... ? :eek:

St Francis joined the Eicom League in 1996, before crashing back out 5 years later in a bizarre 'merger' with St Pats. During their 5 years, they didn't exactly set the league alight - and never made it above an 8th place finish in the First Division. Soccerc would know the full details of the Pats merger - but I have a sneaky suspicion that St Pats own the Francis facilities now (though I could well be wrong). I would also be very surprised if they did have a decent 3,500 all-seater stadium, as that would be better than every ground in the country bar Tolka.

Regardless of all this - the League needs another Dublin club like George Galloway needs another reality TV show....

[Magicme]

Well I would encourage that...gives you a chance to check out their legs while u are sipping on your white wine spritzer....how chav is that!!

[hamish]

[QUOTE=sirhamish] Yeah, you had great rivalry betweeb Cork Hibs and Celtic back in the 60s and 70s but Bluebeard you know yourself that you'd end up with one struggling Cork club and the other less successful with resources spread thinner. I'd be very wary about that. A few derbies are fine but generations have passed and I don't know how a second Cork club would fit in right now.
I would love to see HIBS resurrected. I agree with you Hamish that it makes absolutely no sense right now. CCFC is a well-run club, with excellent management and this would not be the right time to endanger all that good work.
Still, if we could stick a ground in the northside it is not beyond the realms of possibility of Cork being able to support another club. There is a huge population north of the river. Historically the football grounds have been on the southside and Cork clubs have never FULLY tapped into the Northside public.

I think there is a mentality of - I wouldn't mind heading down to the Box but it's too much of a hike. And, that is fair enough too- transportation links are ok but not great.

Think of how many great players through the years have come from the northside.

Saying that, if people can come from Blarney, Fermoy etc to watch CCFC then surely they can make the trek from the northside as well.

Yeah Hibs were a mighty side - average attendance of 10,000 per home game in Flower Lodge. Remember them well. Dave Bacuzzi as manager, Wiggy and so on. I still have a green Cork Hibernians biro Hibs secretary John Crowley sent me when I was a kid.:o

Why is that?? Is it a reverse of the Dublin situation or what?? I always thought Turners Cross was the home of LOI footie in Cork - didn't Cork Celtic play their home games there?? I did hear some Cork fans once saying that it was awkward to get to Turners Cross. I've heard the same kinda thing mentioned about Charlton's Valley ground as well - hard to get to.

I know it's probably me but I always got lost when I drove to a game in Cork -no matter how many times I've been there. Whether it was Bishopstown or the Cross - always got lost - everytime. Back in the 90s Athlone were to play an EL game against City on a p!ssing wet St. Stephen's Day. Hamish leaves Beeslow by car VERY early in the morning, phones Bishopstown at various intervals en route to see if pitch was playable - yep - good condition - referee not arrived but should be ok - Hamish arrives just as (Waterford) referee walks off pitch and calls game off.:eek: AND I had stayed off the drink on Christmas Day (my birthday) so that I'd be clear headed for the long journey south.
Ah, the joys of LOI football.:D

[DonegalJohn]

it is great reading all of this while supposedly at work here in the USA being from Inishowen never once did I or my friends ever think of going to see Derry City play. When not involved in Carn FC games we would go to see the Harps. However as the times that are in it just as Harps need to think of moving to Letterkenny some of the Dublin clubs must come together. It is beleived that 2 clubs from the present situation are to loose EL status. It would be good if these 2 came from Dublin. Also there needs to be something done with both Junior and Intermediate . there is no need for the 2 leagues that exist in Donegal there should only be 1 also the new league there should have a Premier devision where population requirements are needed. this then should be done in other counties so that eventually county premier leagues champions could play regionally .

[SunnySweeney]

[QUOTE=sirhamish]

Why is that?? Is it a reverse of the Dublin situation or what?? I always thought Turners Cross was the home of LOI footie in Cork - didn't Cork Celtic play their home games there?? I did hear some Cork fans once saying that it was awkward to get to Turners Cross. I've heard the same kinda thing mentioned about Charlton's Valley ground as well - hard to get to.

Turners Cross, Flower Lodge and The Mardyke were all on the south side. There is no football ground on the northside.If you are traveling by bus to Turners Cross for instance it is a hike down from the northside. It is also a peculiar mental leap for a lot of northsiders to come down. (I’ll get shot down for saying that)

You could have two viable clubs in Cork if one club ( HIBS Please !! ) had a ground somewhere in the northside - in Blackpool for instance. If CCFC ever moved to somewhere more central their crowds would be much bigger.

[citybone]

sorry i have only being following loi for 4years now
before that i was brainwashed to think that there was no football in ireland
this is the first time i heard of st francis f.c. bottom of the link
http://www.worldstadiums.com/europe/countries/ireland.shtml

[hamish]

[QUOTE=sirhamish]

Turners Cross, Flower Lodge and The Mardyke were all on the south side. There is no football ground on the northside.If you are traveling by bus to Turners Cross for instance it is a hike down from the northside. It is also a peculiar mental leap for a lot of northsiders to come down. (I’ll get shot down for saying that)

You could have two viable clubs in Cork if one club ( HIBS Please !! ) had a ground somewhere in the northside - in Blackpool for instance. If CCFC ever moved to somewhere more central their crowds would be much bigger.

Jaysus, and to think that I used to CYCLE to Athlone (18 miles from my front door). People are so fcuking lazy nowadays.

I think though that it might be best for Cork City to establish themselves even more before a second club might be considered. The EL needs a strong Cork club and I'd hate to see two weak ones instead.

Shame about Hibs though. And, as far as I know, they folded up with not a great amount of money owed - correct me if I'm wrong there. Another disgrace was the losing of Flower Lodge. I thought the AOH were a disgrace the way they treated Cork football, given the amount of money that organisation made out of various Cork clubs, especially Hibs, over the years.

To get back on topic, it's essential that any new EL club have cast iron control over their home ground.

What about the idea of a franchise for new county clubs with the FAI, local leagues etc having control. I'm really only thinking through this at the moment - maybe you folks might like to add your knowledge about this as I'm not au fait with the legal technicalities in this area.:confused:

BTW is your handle related to the famous Cork player Sonny Sweeney?? Just curious.:)

[SunnySweeney]

[QUOTE=sirhamish

BTW is your handle related to the famous Cork player Sonny Sweeney?? Just curious.:)[/QUOTE]

Yes it is in homage to that great LOI midfield dynamo- but like many Hibs and Celtic supporters we follow Cork City now :)

[hamish]

Presuming the Irish League and EL don't ever amalgamate how about this......eh....fantasy league in.........eh.........2012? - based on today's data

Premier
Cork City, Derry City, Shelbourne, UCD, Bohemians, St. Pats., Longford Town, Sligo Rovers, Waterford United, Dublin City, Drogheda United, Bray Wanderers.

First Division North:
Athlone Town, Finn Harps, Monaghan United, Galway United, Dundalk, Meath County, Mayo County, Roscommon County, Mullingar/Westmeath X!.

First Division South:
Cobh Ramblers, Kerry County, Tipperary County, Wexford County, Laoise County, Kilkenny City, Limerick, Shamrock Rovers, Kildare County,

Leave the smaller competitions - Provincial Cups, League Cups for pre-season mini-tournaments to help get clubs match fit for Europe and the upcoming season.
All Divisions: One home and one away game for each club, plus FAI Cup no replays of games in that - on the day results.
Top Two teams in Div. 1 North v Top Two teams in Div 1 South in a mini-league - home and away games.
Top two teams in this mini-league promoted/Bottom two in Premier demoted.
Third and fouth play third and fourth from the Premier in two semi finals and a final. Winner occupied remaining Premier Division spot.

Simple formula and not leaves out an overdose of league games in all divisions.

The above county teams then have six years to improve facilities with the help of FAI and government monies, planning advice from economists, marketeers and with an active role given to the local football associations who'd have local knowledge.

There's a true nationwide league and the new county clubs have the opportunity to play in the FAI Cup too.

Just a thought at 2.50am in the morning but I feel, if the FAI REALLY want to generate a true nationwide league then the above makes it simple for even them to understand.

One last thing, if, say, eg. Tipperary couldnt make it, then you have St. Michael's or Clonmel as an alternative.
Like Australia, this would take leadership from the top, have local associations and clubs in full involvement and cut out the need to drop any club unless that club starts to break the licence rules already established since Genesis.

We're not such a small poverty ridden country that we couldn't rise to that challenge and put away any petty differences to do the above. It's completely achieveable.

[CollegeTillIDie]

we were sponsored by Woodies, so its your facts are out son.
PC bailed on the gate after all the bunging came to light and decided to move rovers to tallaght but quickly lost interest. no sponsorship involved.

Well Alan Mc Grath I think his name was , of Premier Computers was on the board of Shamrock Rovers , and Rovers offices were in the Premier Computers HQ before Joe Colwell became Chairman ,..... so you tell me there was no money involved? Get a grip!

[CollegeTillIDie]

Presuming the Irish League and EL don't ever amalgamate how about this......eh....fantasy league in.........eh.........2012? - based on today's data

Premier
Cork City, Derry City, Shelbourne, UCD, Bohemians, St. Pats., Longford Town, Sligo Rovers, Waterford United, Dublin City, Drogheda United, Bray Wanderers.

First Division North:
Athlone Town, Finn Harps, Monaghan United, Galway United, Dundalk, Meath County, Mayo County, Roscommon County, Mullingar/Westmeath X!.

First Division South:
Cobh Ramblers, Kerry County, Tipperary County, Wexford County, Laoise County, Kilkenny City, Limerick, Shamrock Rovers, Kildare County,

Leave the smaller competitions - Provincial Cups, League Cups for pre-season mini-tournaments to help get clubs match fit for Europe and the upcoming season.
All Divisions: One home and one away game for each club, plus FAI Cup no replays of games in that - on the day results.
Top Two teams in Div. 1 North v Top Two teams in Div 1 South in a mini-league - home and away games.
Top two teams in this mini-league promoted/Top two in Premier demoted.
Third and fouth play third and fourth from the Premier in two semi finals and a final. Winner occupied remaining Premier Division spot.

Simple formula and not leaves out an overdose of league games in all divisions.

The above county teams then have six years to improve facilities with the help of FAI and government monies, planning advice from economists, marketeers and with an active role given to the local football associations who'd have local knowledge.

There's a true nationwide league and the new county clubs have the opportunity to play in the FAI Cup too.

Just a thought at 2.50am in the morning but I feel, if the FAI REALLY want to generate a true nationwide league then the above makes it simple for even them to understand.

One last thing, if, say, eg. Tipperary couldnt make it, then you have St. Michael's or Clonmel as an alternative.
Like Australia, this would take leadership from the top, have local associations and clubs in full involvement and cut out the need to drop any club unless that club starts to break the licence rules already established since Genesis.

We're not such a small poverty ridden country that we couldn't rise to that challenge and put away any petty differences to do the above. It's completely achieveable.

Brilliant....Sir Hamish for the CEO job in the FAI... Delaney out!:D

[CollegeTillIDie]

Well there used to be two LOI clubs in Cork CITY back in the day when there was Evergreen and Cork Athletic who became Celtic and Hibs respectively, and then when Hibs folded in 1976, despite finishing 4th in the table,
( financial mismanagment of a monumental order) they were replaced by Albert Rovers/ Alberts/Cork United who folded in 1982( went bust financially). Celtic were expelled from the League in 1979 ( monumental financial mismanagement...I see a pattern here).

AND FOR TWO YEARS FOLKS THERE WAS NO EL/LOI FOOTBALL IN THE REPUBLIC'S SECOND LARGEST CITY.

In 1984 Cork City were formed and in 1985 Cobh Ramblers were admitted to the LOI. Despite Cork City almost going bust on not one but two occasions and Ramblers relying on friendly matches with MAN UTD Youth teams organised by their benefactor old boy Roy Maurice, we have had two teams in Greater Cork for more than 20 years and long may that continue!

As regards new clubs.... has anyone mentioned Navan as a particular venue? They could attract potential support from all over Meath and possibly as far away as South Cavan. To get back to Leeside......

There have been rumours of a second Cork club being formed with former players from both Hibernians and Celtic supposedly fronting various consortia. One was rumoured to be based in Bishopstown and was going to be led by former Hibs and Celtic player Carl Humphries but it didn't make it to the level where they were in a position to apply to join the EL. There was an attempt to relaunch soccer in Thurles in 1986 or 1987 .
Sporting Club Thurles even played UCD Reserves in a Friendly on one of the minor pitches at Belfield, but they were forced to "borrow" three of our lads in order to play the game and the effort fizzled out.

[NY Hoop]

[QUOTE=sirhamish]

Turners Cross, Flower Lodge and The Mardyke were all on the south side. There is no football ground on the northside.If you are traveling by bus to Turners Cross for instance it is a hike down from the northside. It is also a peculiar mental leap for a lot of northsiders to come down. (I’ll get shot down for saying that)

You could have two viable clubs in Cork if one club ( HIBS Please !! ) had a ground somewhere in the northside - in Blackpool for instance. If CCFC ever moved to somewhere more central their crowds would be much bigger.

Hike?! Cork is a hardly a huge city. I always walk out to the x when we're down. IMO dont think there would be a market for 2 clubs. Remember being in Bishopstown in front of 200. All very well saying that now when cork are doing well.........

KOH

[Bluebeard]

Excellent plan Sir Hamish, would be a good basis to build into an... wait for it... All-Ireland League (well, no-one has mentioned it in the last twelve or fifteen posts)


First Division South:
Cobh Ramblers, Kerry County, Tipperary County, Wexford County, Laoise County, Kilkenny City, Limerick, Shamrock Rovers, Kildare County,

One last thing, if, say, eg. Tipperary couldnt make it, then you have St. Michael's or Clonmel as an alternative.


I don't really know too much about the possibility of a Laois team (cannot really imagine it to be honest), but let me be the first to say I don't really know what things are like in Laois football (long may that be the case;) ). I think that Arklow Town or a Carlow Town side might be a better choice. If I remember correctly, Clonmel do seem to have a lot of their stuff in order.

As for Cork Hibs (thanks for the bit of history collegetilidie, btw, any idea why teh other team were they called the Alberts), of course you are right, now is not the time, but I would like to see them back in due course - not at the expense of the other two local sides.... Ahhh, daydreams :o

[hamish]

Thanks CTID and Bluebeard - I mentioned Navan allright - see earlier posts in this thread. I don't know whether you two are winding me up or not though. LOL:D
I'd forgotten Arklow Town's excellent set-up. How would their involvement have on Bray Wanderers - do the latter get any support from Wicklow county?
There used to be a strong club in Carlow town called Barrow Rovers years ago but I don't know what the situation is there now.
Portlaoise has a fine set up in Rossleighan Park on the Tullamore road and could be developed into a fine stadium. They played Home Farm there in an FAI Cup tie many years ago too. Haven't seen the ground since circa 1999 but I believe they've improved it even more since then. I don't know if they could manage an EL set-up on their own TBH - they do have terrific officials as far as I can remember. Before I forget, Portloaise have a groundsman (he plays too) who's the spitting image of Paul McGrath - not as tall but incredibly similar.

I can't understand why the FAI isn't even exploring the avenues I suggested. If I can conjure them up from my experiences, WTF are they doing up there?? Is there any dialogue going on or do the FAI officials only meet local associations at awards presentations dinners??

CTID - you brought it all back when you mentioned the Hibs/Celtic situation and yeah, Sporting Club Thurles - remember all that too.:) Dark days for the league but once Thurles economy took a battering, football there at EL level was doomed.

[Saint Tom]

in reference to kevin doyle sir hamish, he had a hugely succesful spell at Inchicore until his signed contract disappeared when the fat controller went down to "Da Real Capital". mr wallace no doubt had some input in that saga.



the lad was class then btw; still feel agrieved he was poached as soon as dolan left us and moved to cork.

"Dolan's Rent Boy.. Dolan's Rent Boy oh oh oh oh!"

[soccerc]

Soccerc would know the full details of the Pats merger - but I have a sneaky suspicion that St Pats own the Francis facilities now (though I could well be wrong). I would also be very surprised if they did have a decent 3,500 all-seater stadium,

What merger Steve? you mean that stupidity of 2001 that saw St Francis leave the league to form a so called SPAISFFC. Don't make me laugh.

As for Pats owning the St Francis facilities, not a chance it it stillowned lock stock and barrell by the club whi are on the ascendency competing with 13 teams in schoolboy football and two sides in the LSL.

BTW John Hyland Park doesn't even have one spectator seat never mind 3500.......................

[hamish]

in reference to kevin doyle sir hamish, he had a hugely succesful spell at Inchicore until his signed contract disappeared when the fat controller went down to "Da Real Capital". mr wallace no doubt had some input in that saga.



the lad was class then btw; still feel agrieved he was poached as soon as dolan left us and moved to cork.

"Dolan's Rent Boy.. Dolan's Rent Boy oh oh oh oh!"

Remember that well Saint Tom but I was really honing in on his Wexford roots and the viability of a county team there with players of his class coming from under age "soccer" there.:)

[bigmac]

How about a bit of blue sky thinking. Let's take Tipperay for example, How about if a Tipperary County team playing games in Clonmel, Cooke Park and Peake Villa's ground in Thurles? Register the three of them as home grounds. Peake are doing great work in improving their set up while Clonmel and St. Michael's already have fine grounds.
Ditto a Mayo County team playing in either of the Castlebar grounds, Ballina, Ballyglass and Manulla - all amazing grounds.
Offaly County could play in Tullamore while Kerry County could alternate between Tralee and Killarney.
Laoise County could base themselves in Portlaoise while Wexford County could use their best grounds in Wexford, New Ross and Enniscorthy.


It sounds good and the principle is sound enough, but is there really the population in the southeast for example to have a friday night where there are EL games on in Waterford, Clonmel, Kilkenny and New Ross, all within 45 minutes of each other? There's barely enough there to support Waterford and Kilkenny at the moment, without adding in another 2 teams.




When Athlone were in the premier Division in the 90s we played Northend United from Wexford in the Leinster Cup and had a devil of a job beating them. I was amazed at the fine players they had and can't understand why a few of them weren't snapped up by say, Waterford, Bray or Kilkenny. (Kildare County didn't exist then).

Let's just say that some of the people involved in Wexford soccer are not fans of Waterford United at all, but that's another story.
The main problem here as I see it, is that the junior leagues are not funnelling players into the EL. Every junior league club should have a link with a nearby senior club, preferably an EL one, but until the two systems are linked, football won't progress in this country. Before we start talking about senior teams and expanding the EL, it's vital that we start to gather schools, underage, junior league, senior league, EL and FAI under one roof and set out a plan whereby the best young players are actively pointed at the EL as the apex of soccer in Ireland. This will only happen is links are developed from an early age and kids grow up wanting to play for their local EL team.

[hamish]

It sounds good and the principle is sound enough, but is there really the population in the southeast for example to have a friday night where there are EL games on in Waterford, Clonmel, Kilkenny and New Ross, all within 45 minutes of each other? There's barely enough there to support Waterford and Kilkenny at the moment, without adding in another 2 teams.


Let's just say that some of the people involved in Wexford soccer are not fans of Waterford United at all, but that's another story.
The main problem here as I see it, is that the junior leagues are not funnelling players into the EL. Every junior league club should have a link with a nearby senior club, preferably an EL one, but until the two systems are linked, football won't progress in this country. Before we start talking about senior teams and expanding the EL, it's vital that we start to gather schools, underage, junior league, senior league, EL and FAI under one roof and set out a plan whereby the best young players are actively pointed at the EL as the apex of soccer in Ireland. This will only happen is links are developed from an early age and kids grow up wanting to play for their local EL team.

First paragraph - I can only guess that people will gravitate to their local side Bigmac. I suppose the fixtures could arranged to avoid too many local matches/teams clashing at the same time, My proposal is of course not next nigh or near perfect just an idea as to how the EL could be expanded. I mean, Longford is only about 45 minutes from Athlone and vice versa but 99% of Longford fans will support Longford and ditto Athlone. Galway and Athlone are an hour apart - same story.

Second paragraph - I emphasised that expanding EL would involve those in junior and all levels of football - see other posts I made above where I made those points so I totally agree with you. I have no doubt that funnelling young players towards their local club is far better than fecking them of to the UK at 14 or 15. I know one parent around here who brought his 14 year old son to a number of English clubs a few years ago - drove over via the ferry and went from club to club hawking him around the place. I fcuked him out of it for doing this. Needless to say, the young lad's hopes were dashed and he doesn't play anything now.

Yep, we're on the same wavelength alright but the most serious thing is that the FAI doesn't seem to have any plan whatsoever on this. That amazes me. I have a report from the FAI here FROM 1972 which advocated similar plans so my idea is not exactly a new idea - only they went more for towns rather than counties. David Andrews TD and suchlike were involved with this -must dig it out and have a gawk at it again.:)

Sad to hear about the Waterford/Wexford situation - even more reason for Wexford to have their own club perhaps.

[anto eile]

the idea of deliberately using 3 home grounds is ridiculous

[monkey magic]

yeah have to say, for some kind of stability, a club would need to be bedded into its local community, cant see this happening if the club was playing games all over the place...
but there is definately potential for clubs in some of the towns mentioned such as castlebar, clonmel, tralee and carlow, but as for mullingar, hmmm.. its only a half an hour from here(meaning longford of course) and about the same from athlone and while i would welcome another derby, you would have to say there are other areas where el football has no presence and these would have to get priority in any kind of expansion

[Martinho II]

longford town are making a very strong effort to get supporters from other counties-eg west co cavan mullingar rathowen, carrick on shannon,mohill,roscommon,castlerea,strokestown,tul sk.

our major problem at the moment is gettin the townies out of their barstools-a good support base would be all over co longford but not the town itself!

interesting to see if the attendances improve over the cumin season!

[hamish]

the idea of deliberately using 3 home grounds is ridiculous

Why?? It's done here in Gah and rugby. isn't it?? I think there are cases in Europe where it happens too. Panathinaikos, Lille among others do it. You'd be amazed how people will not travel out of their "own patch" to see a game.
For example, the Galway Gaelic teams play many of their matches in Pearse Stadium. Before that, games were shared between Tuam (football) and Beeslow/Loughrea (hurling and football). Crowds have dipped since they based themselves in Salthill.

It's a new idea for Ireland ok but we have to open ourselves to new ways - espacially when we're talking about newly formed clubs with no tradition of having a home base.

[hamish]

yeah have to say, for some kind of stability, a club would need to be bedded into its local community, cant see this happening if the club was playing games all over the place...
but there is definately potential for clubs in some of the towns mentioned such as castlebar, clonmel, tralee and carlow, but as for mullingar, hmmm.. its only a half an hour from here(meaning longford of course) and about the same from athlone and while i would welcome another derby, you would have to say there are other areas where el football has no presence and these would have to get priority in any kind of expansion

I honestly would doubt if Tralee/Clonmel/Carlow could survive on their own unless the club had a county name like Kildare County.
Trouble with Mullingar is that it's a very divided soccer town - two clubs who don't like each other, mentor wise.

[monkey magic]

I honestly would doubt if Tralee/Clonmel/Carlow could survive on their own unless the club had a county name like Kildare County.
Trouble with Mullingar is that it's a very divided soccer town - two clubs who don't like each other, mentor wise.

the point i was making was that a new club would need to be rooted in a local area.. this is much harder to do with what your proposing hamish, as martinho said, longford town, despite being called longford TOWN have been drawing their support from all over county longford and surrounds over the past few years, i know of one man who travels from strokestown co roscommon for the home games, and my cousins and their dad travel from right on the cavan/longford border to most matches. i think the idea of them bearing the name of their county would definately benefit them, im just saying that for stability the moving around thing might not work

[hamish]

the point i was making was that a new club would need to be rooted in a local area.. this is much harder to do with what your proposing hamish, as martinho said, longford town, despite being called longford TOWN have been drawing their support from all over county longford and surrounds over the past few years, i know of one man who travels from strokestown co roscommon for the home games, and my cousins and their dad travel from right on the cavan/longford border to most matches. i think the idea of them bearing the name of their county would definitely benefit them, I'm just saying that for stability the moving around thing might not work

Yeah, maybe you've a point there MM. I suppose having games at even two different venues would p!ss fans off but I was thinking of Tipperary where it's a big county and maybe "spreading" the games about a bit. Would it also give host clubs/associations/businesses an incentive to upgrade facilities etc.
Great to hear about those travelling from all over the place to Longford Town too.:)
Mots county teams too wouldn't need more than one venue would they??

You just reminded me of something. Remember that bloke a few years ago who brought a load of full timers to Mullingar Town FC? I think some might have gravitated to Longford Town??
I think a Mullingar outfit would have a right battle with Tullamore, Athlone, Longford and even Portlaoise nearby = that's why I emphasized the county bit.
Like, wouldn't Offaly folks - from Banagher, Birr etc - be more inclined to support Offaly United and travel to Tullamore for EL rather than if the club was called Tullamore?? People can be very parochial but you did mention that Longford attract folks from loads of places outside the town.
I also recall that when Finn Harps first entered the LOI, two blokes from Athenry took a shine to them and followed them all over the country.:D