Wayne O'Donoghue gets 4 years!

[Thunderblaster]

I would like to nominate Majella Holohan for Irish Woman of the Year 2006 and it is not even February. Reason being is that she stood up in court and went against protocol to deliver her victim impact statement directly from her heart; not a cosmetically dressed up statement drawn up by a solicitor and I admire for what she has done. Not many people would have the courage to question the Irish Criminal Justice System within a court chamber and I toff my hat to her. The hurt she is going through would remind me of the hurt of the families of the 96 Martyrs of Hillsborough in 1989, and to this day, the Liverpool families have not got the justice they have deserved. The Robert Holohan case would be perfect material for Jimmy McGovern, a Liverpool writer famous for the Cracker and Hillsborough docu-drama films.

[pete]

She could have choosen to take a legal challenge against the Public prosecutors? or even a civil case against the convicted?

I've no reason to defend anyone but does seem cowardly to mention issues that were excluded as facts for a reason...?

[Soko]

I Said on here at the time of the verdict that something didn't seem right about the relationship between robert and wayne and was shot down by the majority of posters I think I've been vindicated you know what they say no smoke without fire



How have you been vindicated? He wasn't convicted of anything bar manslaughter and none of this evidence was even brought into the case by the prosecution.

[Macy]

I Said on here at the time of the verdict that something didn't seem right about the relationship between robert and wayne and was shot down by the majority of posters I think I've been vindicated you know what they say no smoke without fire
Vindicated by a court of law proving your opinion to be the truth? Can you point me to the court case and the verdict please? Ta very much.

[Roverstillidie]

I would like to nominate Majella Holohan for Irish Woman of the Year 2006 and it is not even February. Reason being is that she stood up in court and went against protocol to deliver her victim impact statement directly from her heart; not a cosmetically dressed up statement drawn up by a solicitor and I admire for what she has done. Not many people would have the courage to question the Irish Criminal Justice System within a court chamber and I toff my hat to her. The hurt she is going through would remind me of the hurt of the families of the 96 Martyrs of Hillsborough in 1989, and to this day, the Liverpool families have not got the justice they have deserved. The Robert Holohan case would be perfect material for Jimmy McGovern, a Liverpool writer famous for the Cracker and Hillsborough docu-drama films.

bull****. she threw a temper tantrum because the courts didnt do exactly what she wanted.
then she used the press to label him a paedophile.
she isnt some martyr to the facesless amchine that is the irish justice system, she is a bitter lady with an agenda.

[klein4]

good post. the more I read about it the more I think Mrs Hoolahan in her post verdict comments behaved in a disgraceful way. Altho its hard to be too critical of someone who has been thru so much. very conflicting emotions on this one!:(

[Tired&Emotional]

I Said on here at the time of the verdict that something didn't seem right about the relationship between robert and wayne and was shot down by the majority of posters I think I've been vindicated you know what they say no smoke without fire

You are as bad as the tabloids:mad:

To make a grossly dangerous assumption based on your ignorant opinions is symptomatic of the uneducated, ill-informed and factually-blind people in society....they say "variety is the spice of life" and "everyone's different" but this is ignorance in it's purest form....:mad:

[Tired&Emotional]

I would like to nominate Majella Holohan for Irish Woman of the Year 2006 and it is not even February. Reason being is that she stood up in court and went against protocol to deliver her victim impact statement directly from her heart; not a cosmetically dressed up statement drawn up by a solicitor and I admire for what she has done. Not many people would have the courage to question the Irish Criminal Justice System within a court chamber and I toff my hat to her. The hurt she is going through would remind me of the hurt of the families of the 96 Martyrs of Hillsborough in 1989, and to this day, the Liverpool families have not got the justice they have deserved. The Robert Holohan case would be perfect material for Jimmy McGovern, a Liverpool writer famous for the Cracker and Hillsborough docu-drama films.

You need to look at this from a wide angle as well.

If there is no respect for due process we run a dangerous risk of bringing down the whole judicial system.

The system is not just something that has been thrown together like a government-commissioned health report. It's proceedings are there to see justice is done using a carefully constructed forum.

The addendum to her VIS may only serve to undermine or possibly remove the same opportunity for future victims. If you think that a solicitor draws up the Statement -you're wrong a VIS is supposed to come from the victim(s) - that's why they have been introduced. In the future the court registrar will probably have to read these out as the victim's now cannot be trusted to stay within the confines of this privilige. This may mean that future victims will not be able to speak "from...the... heart" as you put it.

As a state we cannot have a situation where a case is tried with the DPP present (which some people seem to forget:confused: ), a full book of evidence, a jury and a fair trial overseen by a qualified judge and then have nonfactual stories/convictions published about the defendant in the public press. Now which part of due process are you not satisfied with???? If you ever find yourself on the defence side of a case I guarantee you will be the FIRST person who would want to see a fair trial and due process and then, for example, after a conviction have reems of rubbish printed about you!!!!

Open your eyes to the FULL FACTUAL story before making emotional statements that are not based on fact. Every victim will always have unanswered questions but due process must be at the top.

[Block G Raptor]

Vindicated by a court of law proving your opinion to be the truth? Can you point me to the court case and the verdict please? Ta very much.

I am referring to FACT that semen was found on roberts body
the reason this FACT was not permissable as evidence as there was not a 100% certainty that a DNA match to w o'd could be made. This has been confirmed on radio 1 by a representative of the DPP.
I feel vindicated because I raised the issue of someone of waynes age having a close friendship with an 11 yr old as suspicious and was practically laughed of the thread it now appears that -and i know its circumstancial evividence-I may well have been right

[ColinR]

I feel vindicated because ....I may well have been right

not quite a conclusive vindication then :confused:

[Roverstillidie]

I am referring to FACT that semen was found on roberts body
the reason this FACT was not permissable as evidence as there was not a 100% certainty that a DNA match to w o'd could be made. This has been confirmed on radio 1 by a representative of the DPP.
I feel vindicated because I raised the issue of someone of waynes age having a close friendship with an 11 yr old as suspicious and was practically laughed of the thread it now appears that -and i know its circumstancial evividence-I may well have been right

you are implying there was sexual contact between them, something even the DPP and fuzz didnt believe.
the amount of semen was inconsistant with sexual contact, more likely he used a towel that someone had dried off with after a shower and left residue on.
bear in mind he wasnt in WO'D's bedroom at 7.30am as was alledged (and again on the steps of the court by ms hoolihan) it was 7.30 pm as the kid had entered the time wrong into his new phone.
you are sensationalising with facts that were disproven/irrelevant.

[Block G Raptor]

I dont think the questions raised by majella holohan are irrelevent and they have never been proven or disproven as they were not strong enough for court, that doesn't mean that the evidence was not there to start with
when I said I felt vindicated it was because when I suggested this on a previous thread I was damn nearly ridiculed, and I think with majella's comments it shows that there is certainly a suspicion of abuse about the incident which was not apparent at the time the verdict was announced

[Block G Raptor]

DPP and fuzz didnt believe.
the amount of semen was inconsistant with sexual contact, more likely he used a towel that someone had dried off with after a shower and left residue on
where did you get this information from? a spokesperson for the DPP speaking
on morning Ireland on rte radio 1 last week stated that the evidence was not admissable as they could only get a DNA match in the high 80% bracket with WOD. and to permit the evidence would have unfairly influenced the Jury,as with DNA evidence 80-95% matches are considered to be low

[Dr.Nightdub]

BGR, the only fact not in dispute in relation to semen was that there was some on his hand. However, whose it was and how it got there could not be conclusively proven one way or the other, hence it wasn't offered as evidence. I defy you to find a reference to "no smoke without fire" in the Rules of Evidence applied by our courts.

[Roverstillidie]

I dont think the questions raised by majella holohan are irrelevent and they have never been proven or disproven as they were not strong enough for court, that doesn't mean that the evidence was not there to start with
when I said I felt vindicated it was because when I suggested this on a previous thread I was damn nearly ridiculed, and I think with majella's comments it shows that there is certainly a suspicion of abuse about the incident which was not apparent at the time the verdict was announced
so you are saying its an acceptable tactic to try and enter evidence deemed too flimsy or irrelevant by the leagal pros via a victim impact statement and then call him a paedophile to the press?
you cant be serious

[pete]

I feel vindicated because I raised the issue of someone of waynes age having a close friendship with an 11 yr old as suspicious and was practically laughed of the thread it now appears that -and i know its circumstancial evividence-I may well have been right

Strange logic there. Vindicated by circumstancial evidence... :confused:

[Clifford]

There was absolutely no evidence of physical abuse on Rob's body. Enough said let it lie I say.

[Block G Raptor]

I am being seriously mis -interpreted. the point I was trying to make was that when I suggested -after following the case closely- that some of the issues raised in the trial made me feel uneasy about the relationship between robert and wayne as something didn't seem right about it I was laughed off this site.
now with the information that has been revealed in the victim impact statement it seems that I maybe wasn't quite so mad to think this thats all I'm trying to say. Of course the evidence should not have been admitted as the jury would have natrually been influenced by it whether or not the sample could be proved to have come from WOD or not the insinuation would have been there. I was just trying to make the point that maybe my gut feeling at the time wasn't so crazy after all

[Lionel Ritchie]

You need to look at this from a wide angle as well.

If there is no respect for due process we run a dangerous risk of bringing down the whole judicial system.

The system is not just something that has been thrown together like a government-commissioned health report. It's proceedings are there to see justice is done using a carefully constructed forum.

The addendum to her VIS may only serve to undermine or possibly remove the same opportunity for future victims. If you think that a solicitor draws up the Statement -you're wrong a VIS is supposed to come from the victim(s) - that's why they have been introduced. In the future the court registrar will probably have to read these out as the victim's now cannot be trusted to stay within the confines of this privilige. This may mean that future victims will not be able to speak "from...the... heart" as you put it.

As a state we cannot have a situation where a case is tried with the DPP present (which some people seem to forget:confused: ), a full book of evidence, a jury and a fair trial overseen by a qualified judge and then have nonfactual stories/convictions published about the defendant in the public press. Now which part of due process are you not satisfied with???? If you ever find yourself on the defence side of a case I guarantee you will be the FIRST person who would want to see a fair trial and due process and then, for example, after a conviction have reems of rubbish printed about you!!!!

Open your eyes to the FULL FACTUAL story before making emotional statements that are not based on fact. Every victim will always have unanswered questions but due process must be at the top.

Excellent post T&E.

The system is not perfect but I think the system and the society that put it there is a better and more mature one for applying the principle that it's better to let a potentially guilty person go unpunished than risk punishing an innocent party.

[Roverstillidie]

I am being seriously mis -interpreted. the point I was trying to make was that when I suggested -after following the case closely- that some of the issues raised in the trial made me feel uneasy about the relationship between robert and wayne as something didn't seem right about it I was laughed off this site.
now with the information that has been revealed in the victim impact statement it seems that I maybe wasn't quite so mad to think this thats all I'm trying to say. Of course the evidence should not have been admitted as the jury would have natrually been influenced by it whether or not the sample could be proved to have come from WOD or not the insinuation would have been there. I was just trying to make the point that maybe my gut feeling at the time wasn't so crazy after all

so you are saying you feel vindicated by in your insinuation of an innapropriate/sexual relationship by evidence that, in your own words "should not have been admitted " because it the "insinuation would have been there"!?!

the fact that its not accurate or relevant evidence proves you are right to believe its true?
you krazy

[Block G Raptor]

I simply raised the possibility on the previous thread and was treated with as much disdain as if id said the pope was really elvis pressley or something equally ridicilous all I'm saying now is that my gut feeling (and I'll admit I do think wayne abused robert, but thats just my opinion) doesn't appear to be quite so ludacrious as people thought at the time
nothing more nothing less




so"should not have been admitted " because it the "insinuation would have been there"!?!

the evidence was not 100% conclusive and there by not admissable
in lay mans terms it was obviously WOD's but there was an infinitly remote chance that it wasn't and that was enough for reasonable doubt

[John83]

the evidence was not 100% conclusive and there by not admissable in lay mans terms it was obviously WOD's but there was an infinitly remote chance that it wasn't and that was enough for reasonable doubt
There was a hell of a lot more than that. The FBI described that particular test as hypersensitive and doesn't allow its use internally, and an Australian DNA testing expert called it suspect too. If it was as likely as you are suggesting, it would have been admissible.

[Dr.Nightdub]

I'll admit I do think wayne abused robert, but thats just my opinion

That's still your opinion despite the State Pathologist (i.e. a PROSECUTION witness) stating in court that there was no evidence of sexual assault?


in lay mans terms it was obviously WOD's but there was an infinitly remote chance that it wasn't

No, in layman's terms, it was someone's and they couldn't prove one way or the other whose. You seem to be taking your suspicions as a starting point and then looking for evidence to back that up. The way the courts operate (or should, at least) is to examine the evidence objectively and then draw conclusions from it. There's a big difference.


and that was enough for reasonable doubt

And reasonable doubt leads to a not guilty verdict, except in trial by media where you don't have to worry about such trifles as reasonable doubt.

[Block G Raptor]

And reasonable doubt leads to a not guilty verdict, except in trial by media where you don't have to worry about such trifles as reasonable doubt.
exactly why the prosecution decided not to use the evidence in pursuit of a guilty verdict. No?

[Block G Raptor]

DPP to appeal the leniancy of the sentance
http://www.rte.ie/news/2006/0220/odonoghuew.html

[Macy]

He should probably get the sentence reduced in light of the media coverage since the witness impact statement.

[Clifford]

It is being appealed on the basis that his hiding of things and mis leading Gardai. Not as the sensationalists would hope, thankfully.

[joeSoap]

The appeal by the prosecution into the leniency of this case started yesterday, and has been put back for a few weeks for deliberation.

Majella Holohan has, I believe, done her case no favours with her victim impact statement, and the defence have used this to their advantage. (http://www.unison.ie/irish_independent/stories.php3?ca=9&si=1662114&issue_id=14429)

[Roverstillidie]

why dont the snouts just charge him with obstruction seperatley so we dont have to listen to block g raptors ramblings agan?