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ThatGuy
11/01/2006, 3:56 PM
I was talking to someone in my family about the whole Mary O'Rourke "worked like blacks" shenanigans today, and in fairness I think that what she said was 100% wrong and stupid, I am disappointed that she hasn't apologised over it. That has been dealt with here already though.

However, I was told a stoy of someone in work who when asked about a time to bring the office post to the post office commented that it would be "black with people" at the time it was mentioned. She got given out to because what she said was "racist". That to me is absolutely ridiculous, it is a phrase taken out of an Irish translation which is as old as the hills. Nothing to do with black people. Absolute madness. If I said that in work and I was reprimanded for it I wouldn't stand for the implication of me being racist and I would pursue it. Ridiculous.
Risteard
11/01/2006, 4:00 PM
:D :D :D
Your manager is just a fool.
That is not a racist phrase.
Your manager is a fool for thinking it was.
Mary O'Rourke is a fool for saying what she said.
Bald Student
11/01/2006, 5:01 PM
On a similar topic, I'm confused by the new word 'non-national'. Is it now racist to call someone foreign?
Dodge
11/01/2006, 10:31 PM
Not rascist. Just a media buzz word. Oh and apparently it shouldn't be called rascism, its racialism. My ex boss was involved in some sort of campaign group whilst I was busy working like a ....
dahamsta
11/01/2006, 10:37 PM
Racism and racialism mean exactly the same thing. Only racists use the word racialist to try to differentiate themselves (and prove how ignorant they are in the process).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racialism

adam
Bald Student
11/01/2006, 10:44 PM
Racism and racialism mean exactly the same thing. Only racists use the word racialist to try to differentiate themselves (and prove how ignorant they are in the process).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racialism

adamI think you're wrong. Ali G uses the term Racialist and he is black.
Macy
12/01/2006, 7:27 AM
On a similar topic, I'm confused by the new word 'non-national'. Is it now racist to call someone foreign?
I really hate that too. Also, people must be from some nation? Was it a McDowell phrase from around the time of the referendum?
Dodge
12/01/2006, 11:41 AM
There are peopl classified as stateless macy but I get your point
Macy
12/01/2006, 1:08 PM
There are peopl classified as stateless macy but I get your point
So is it purely supposed to be used for asylum seekers then? Just wondered, as I thought it was just a catch all for anyone not Irish. Or is that just the way the media, gards etc have taken up to use it?
Dodge
12/01/2006, 1:50 PM
Well, its not a "real" term in that it doesn't hav one universal meaning. In this country its used (by the media) to describe anyone who's not Irish (in real terms, they usually mean non-white)

The term "stateless" in international terms has loads of uses; people from Kosove, Latvian/Lithuanian/Estonian "Aliens" (there's a few more but I won't bore you) Its genrally somebody who is not entitled to a full passport in any country.
Hither green
12/01/2006, 3:20 PM
One of the latest ones is Scotland Yard's Black museum, which is Victorian and obviously refers to London's murky and gory crimes. They've apparently had a complaint that it's a negative use of the word black. Fine prohibit sayings if they have historical origins that are now offensive but don't start redefining words.
Dublin12
12/01/2006, 3:26 PM
One I heard from London..some pub changed their menu from Shepards pie to Workers pie as it was deemed as sexist lol:o
noby
12/01/2006, 3:38 PM
Can women not be shepherds?
Shepherdess perhaps?
(Actually, that's another pet hate of mine: manageress and the like.)
John83
12/01/2006, 3:41 PM
(Actually, that's another pet hate of mine: manageress and the like.)
Interesting. I have the opposite problem, "She's not a bloody actor, she's an actress." :)
Hither green
12/01/2006, 3:47 PM
Interesting. I have the opposite problem, "She's not a bloody actor, she's an actress." :)

I agree. What's wrong with differentiating between the sexes? It's not saying one's better than the other, just that they're different. "A female actor" is an annoying one I've heard. Frankly I feel like becoming a world famous actor just so that I can insist on being described as a male actress.
noby
12/01/2006, 3:53 PM
What's wrong with equality?
Why the need to always differentiate?
A nurse is a nurse. A musician is a musician. Why do we need to know if a manager is male or female?
Student Mullet
13/01/2006, 2:20 AM
What's wrong with equality?
Why the need to always differentiate?
A nurse is a nurse. A musician is a musician. Why do we need to know if a manager is male or female?You need to know if someone acting is male or female when casting a part though.

My own pet hate is the word 'ombudsperson'.
ThatGuy
13/01/2006, 7:35 AM
You need to know if someone acting is male or female when casting a part though.

My own pet hate is the word 'ombudsperson'.
What's more annoying, 'linesperson' or 'assistant referee'!!!!!
Peadar
13/01/2006, 8:49 AM
This have gotten way out of hand!
Soon it will be considered racist to say Packie Bonner. :(
tiktok
13/01/2006, 9:26 AM
However, I was told a stoy of someone in work who when asked about a time to bring the office post to the post office commented that it would be "black with people" at the time it was mentioned. She got given out to because what she said was "racist". That to me is absolutely ridiculous, it is a phrase taken out of an Irish translation which is as old as the hills. Nothing to do with black people. Absolute madness. If I said that in work and I was reprimanded for it I wouldn't stand for the implication of me being racist and I would pursue it. Ridiculous.

Along a similar line
Niggardly (http://www.adversity.net/special/niggardly.htm)
cheifo
13/01/2006, 12:26 PM
This have gotten way out of hand!
Soon it will be considered racist to say Packie Bonner. :(:D
I remember loony leftie Lambeth council banning black bin liners in the early nineties because of their negative conotations.
My favourite quote regarding first lady "linesperson" Wendy Thoms came from Joe Royle."I am sure she can do the job but has she ever been taken fron behind by a big defender."Poor Joe
hamish
13/01/2006, 1:31 PM
Soon it will be considered racist to say Packie Bonner. :(


LMAO:D

Peadar you crack me up you do.

Here's a handy list.
http://www.newspeakdictionary.com/ns-pi.html

A friend of mine back in the 80s here played bass for a small band I was involved with ( the lads called me Groupie inspector:D). He was a phsychiatrist in the local mental hospital. One night I asked him was he availabe to play on Friday night coming and he replied, "Nah Hamish, working in the madhouse all weekend". eek:
He was from Singapore.

I wonder will future editions of Lord of the Rings replace Dwarves with "vertically challenged people"??
paul_oshea
13/01/2006, 2:00 PM
i thought fat was being replaced with ultra nourished/salad dodger
Dodge
13/01/2006, 7:18 PM
What's more annoying, 'linesperson' or 'assistant referee'!!!!!
They're all c.unts
pineapple stu
13/01/2006, 8:38 PM
I was accused of being racist today for calling someone (not the person who called me a racist) a knacker. :)
Dodge
13/01/2006, 8:45 PM
They're right.
pineapple stu
13/01/2006, 8:46 PM
Is "knacker" a race?

If I call you Irish, am I being racist?

Didn't think I'd have to explain that one!
Bald Student
13/01/2006, 8:48 PM
I was accused of being racist today for calling someone (not the person who called me a racist) a knacker. :)You should have invited him along to the 'Member of the travelling community drinking extravaganza'.

(There was a knacker drinking extravaganza banned in UCD because it was racist so the students involved organised a member of the travelling community drinking extravaganza the following week)
lopez
14/01/2006, 3:31 PM
I'm generaly in favour of this PC malarky until a woman at work managed to get someone a two year caution for referring to her as 'a bird.' 'Tart' I could understand...

I was accused of being racist today for calling someone (not the person who called me a racist) a knacker. :)You are! (using the new regulations obviously) And if Ireland follows the path of Britain the only forums you'll be allowed on in future are ********** and Follow! Follow! ;)
Marked Man
16/01/2006, 3:25 PM
Is "knacker" a race?

If I call you Irish, am I being racist?

Didn't think I'd have to explain that one!

Yeah, calling an Irish person Irish is exactly analagous to calling a traveller a knacker. Are they teaching you anything out in Belfield at all?
John83
16/01/2006, 4:52 PM
Yeah, calling an Irish person Irish is exactly analagous to calling a traveller a knacker. Are they teaching you anything out in Belfield at all? And the Dublin use of "knacker" is as a synonym for "scumbag" or whatever you use for agressive, antisocial people and petty criminals in NY. I tend to associate "knacker" with traveller about as much as I associate it with a bloke who take horses to the glue factory (or C&E before it burnt down).

Don't heap your preduces and slang on us.
Marked Man
16/01/2006, 9:54 PM
And the Dublin use of "knacker" is as a synonym for "scumbag" or whatever you use for agressive, antisocial people and petty criminals in NY. I tend to associate "knacker" with traveller about as much as I associate it with a bloke who take horses to the glue factory (or C&E before it burnt down).

Don't heap your preduces and slang on us.

Thanks for the lesson on Dublin slang. Based on the context of P.Stu's original e-mail where he drew an analogy between using the term 'knacker' to refer to knackers and the term 'Irish' to refer to Irish, it's pretty clear that your use of the term is not his.
And your associations notwithstanding, did you ever stop to wonder about the origin of the use of the word knacker to refer to "scumbag" or "aggressive, antisocial people"?
pineapple stu
16/01/2006, 10:29 PM
Yeah, calling an Irish person Irish is exactly analagous to calling a traveller a knacker.
Show me where I called a traveller a knacker?

If a person's a knacker, they're a knacker. That's fact of life, and referring to them as such does not constitute prejudice based on racial discrimination (i.e. racism). If a person's Irish, they're Irish. That's also fact of life, and referring to them as such does not constitute prejudice based on racial discrimination (i.e. racism).

Good God. Certainly didn't think I'd have to explain it twice!
Dodge
16/01/2006, 10:46 PM
So would you call a white person a ******?
pineapple stu
16/01/2006, 10:51 PM
Um...no. Why would I?
Dodge
16/01/2006, 10:59 PM
Same reason you'd call a non traveller a knacker
pineapple stu
16/01/2006, 11:06 PM
I'm using "knacker" in the context of "scumbag" here. I don't know where travellers came into it; I certainly never mentioned it or non-travellers (I know knacker is a word used for travellers, but that's not the way I'm using it).

Does that clear things up or make things worse?
Dodge
16/01/2006, 11:33 PM
Well I'd associate the word with travellers first, and then "scumbags" being a reference to that.

BTW I've used the word so I'm not trying to be preachy here, just pointing out that it could be construed as rascist
Marked Man
17/01/2006, 4:18 AM
Show me where I called a traveller a knacker?

If a person's a knacker, they're a knacker. That's fact of life, and referring to them as such does not constitute prejudice based on racial discrimination (i.e. racism). If a person's Irish, they're Irish. That's also fact of life, and referring to them as such does not constitute prejudice based on racial discrimination (i.e. racism).

Good God. Certainly didn't think I'd have to explain it twice!

My apology to you if that's not how you meant it. WHen you threw in the analogy with an identifiable ethnic-cultural group, it seemed to suggest you were using the word to refer to an ethnic-cultural group.

Given the term's origins though, you shouldn't be so surprised that people see it as an expression of prejudice.
ccfcman
17/01/2006, 8:00 AM
I'm sick to fu*k of all this Traveller's rights businness, now by all means if they wish to live the way they do, which IMHO is like ani8mals, then go for it, but the stigma of a traveller robbing and being a general tumor on society has its founding.

I'm very sceptical of Travellers Association which, not unlike those prisoner type groups seem to paint pictures and such! They are the first to jump in and say Hey Hey don't blame us etc. Whereas during Christmas some pavy kid DID try to rob me.

Too many pikeys and too few travellers if you ask me.
pineapple stu
17/01/2006, 6:59 PM
My apology to you if that's not how you meant it. WHen you threw in the analogy with an identifiable ethnic-cultural group, it seemed to suggest you were using the word to refer to an ethnic-cultural group.

Given the term's origins though, you shouldn't be so surprised that people see it as an expression of prejudice.
Fair enough. Never really thought of it that way. Should point out that travellers had nothing to do with the conversation and my meaning was quite clear (given context, etc,. which you can't really put in a random written internet post), so my initial point stands!