New Manager?

[monutdfc]

Are there any credible candidates on the horizon?

(Please, don't mention Aldridge.) Are Kevin Keegan or Terry Venables still in the running? I could take either of those 2 just about.
I stuck a euro on Alex Ferguson for the hell of it at 100-1, he has since come in to 40-1. He's about the only name I've heard mentioned so far that I'd be pleased about.

Has anyone changed their mind about the sacking of Brian Kerr as no credible successor has appeared?
Does anyone think Delaney is regretting it - he is for some serious flack if he doesn't come up with a good replacement soon.

[pineapple stu]

Are there any credible candidates on the horizon?

(Please, don't mention Aldridge.)
John Aldridge. Apart from that... Everyone else mentioned so far - bar Martin O'Neill, who in other circumstances would unquestionably be interested - seems to be a red herring to make money for the bookies.


Has anyone changed their mind about the sacking of Brian Kerr as no credible successor has appeared?
Nope. If I had to watch another game where we went 1-0 up early, sat back and conceded a late equaliser, I'd have gone mad.

[as_i_say]

Nope. If I had to watch another game where we went 1-0 up early, sat back and conceded a late equaliser, I'd have gone mad.

I think you'll find he learned that trick from watching mick mccarthy away match videos

[Marked Man]

I think you'll find he learned that trick from watching mick mccarthy away match videos
Pity he couldn't have learned the qualifying trick too.

[TheJamaicanP.M.]

I think you'll find he learned that trick from watching mick mccarthy away match videos

Mick was a gentleman and class act (to use one of Dunphy's phrases). I thoroughly enjoyed the football and commitment which the Irish team gave under Mick. He was a different class to Kerr. I really wanted Kerr to succeed because it was a feel-good story for Irish football, but the man was out of his depth at this level. One positive outcome has been that Irish fans are again appreciating what Jack Charton achieved for us. Hopefully, we won't have to listen to any more tripe from bitter old men like Liam Tuohy or Kerr for that matter.

Kerr sniggered at McCarthy and considered himself superior to Charlton. He got brought back down to earth fairly quickly. His ego had become inflated. There's no way Delaney is regretting the decision. In my view anyone would be better than Kerr. The man was simply unable to instill passion into the players.

[Closed Account 2]

No, it was the right choice. We finished 4th in a pretty easy group - a position that will haunt our seedings for years to come. The French were destinctly average for the majority of the matches, the Swiss are a good team but they are beatable, similarly the Israelis. Kerr made too many mistakes, persisted with the likes of Miller (who had barely played a club game for 2 years), kept starting Carr when Finnan was probably a better choice and had been outstanding for the Liverpool in their European Cup campaign).

At the end of the day finishing 4th is simply not good enough. If we had gone out in a playoff, maybe fair enough, even if we had finished 3rd but played well in important games I might have been up for giving him another chance. But 4th is the worst weve finished in a generation, and whats worse is how badly we played as the qualifiers went on. Kerr was out of his depth and as JPM says there was no passion - I'd rather throw the likes of Aldo or John Sheridan into the managerial fray than persist with Kerr.

[HarpoJoyce]

Are there any credible candidates on the horizon?


Bora Milutinovic, http://www.answers.com/topic/bora-milutinovic
http://www.rsssf.com/miscellaneous/milutinovic-cintl.html

World Cup journeyman coach, is available http://www.jadransport.org/articles/2085.html

I think if fans just want to qualify then he's a better choice than most, as he's proved it in the past.

There's a small snob barrier to get past, as he hasn't managed a European nation (it may be considered he has not proved himself with a proper country yet).

[livehead1]

[B]

I think if fans just want to qualify then he's a better choice than most, as he's proved it in the past.

There's a small snob barrier to get past, as he hasn't managed a European nation (it may be considered he has not proved himself with a proper country yet).


and just what, my learned friend, denotes a 'proper country'. I dont think i've heard a ridiculous comment in many's a week on this forum. He has taken countries to major tournaments, indeed without looking at the stats, he has probably taken as many teams to tournaments than all of our managers of our 'proper country' in the history of the sport!

[pineapple stu]

He said "it may be considered that" - i.e. it may be other people's opinions, though not necessarily his own.

[gustavo]

Mick was a gentleman and class act (to use one of Dunphy's phrases). I thoroughly enjoyed the football and commitment which the Irish team gave under Mick. He was a different class to Kerr. I really wanted Kerr to succeed because it was a feel-good story for Irish football, but the man was out of his depth at this level.
Did you think that McCarthy wasnt out of his depth after his first full campaign?

[TheJamaicanP.M.]

Did you think that McCarthy wasnt out of his depth after his first full campaign?

In tactical terms, I would suggest that McCarthy was out of his depth after his first term. However, in terms of motivating players and improving the team, he certainly proved his capabilities. Mick had to make do with a poor squad. He relied on strikers such as Connolly, Jon Goodman and even David Kelly during that first qualifying campaign. In contrast, Kerr had the luxury of putting 11 Premiership players on the field for most of the games. He was able to leave a European Cup winner on the bench. Unlike McCarthy who was willing to acknowledge his mistakes (such as 3 at the back and Keane as sweeper), Kerr never accepted he was wrong and never learned from his mistakes. The team continued to score early goals and sit back and defend. I'm glad that Kerr is out of the job. I'd take Mick McCarthy back in an instant. His Irish teams had character. At least he would have the ability to instill the right attitude in the players.

[klein4]

I thought macarthy was a muck manager and that is been borne out at sunderland were he is hopelessly out of his depth. a P.R. man blaming his players in public as if he had nothing to do with their performances. anyone could have qualified on the third attempt. and it was more down to keanes perfomances at home to holland and potugal that got us through rather than any genius on macarthys part. he then managed to send his best player home and get knocked out by a spannish team who were there for the taking. terrible manager who was out of a job until a totally unexpected result against the dutch at home. still managed to lose away to iran anyway. people always look back with the oul rose tinted glasses cause he got us to ONE tournament at the third attempt but to me he was always a rubbish manager.any other country would have gotten rid of him after two **** poor qualifying campaigns were ireland threw away qualification eventho all events conspired in our favour. At the world cup ireland were totally clueless against spain. we got TWO penos, had an extra man and spain had more than one goal disallowed. anyone who looks back nostalgically at "the macarthy" era obviously didnt have to sit thru any of the great days of scrapping for results against iceland, lithuania,andorra,belgium and of course the brilliant macedonia. kerr was ten times the manager that macarthy was.millwall couldnt beleive their luck that they got rid of the useless waster and I'd say sunderland fans are thinking along the same lines now.....if he ever got the ireland job again I wouldnt ever support them again til he was gotten rid of. god even thinking about all them crap performances and crapper excuses is making me vomit.

[TheJamaicanP.M.]

I thought macarthy was a muck manager and that is been borne out at sunderland were he is hopelessly out of his depth. a P.R. man blaming his players in public as if he had nothing to do with their performances. anyone could have qualified on the third attempt. and it was more down to keanes perfomances at home to holland and potugal that got us through rather than any genius on macarthys part. he then managed to send his best player home and get knocked out by a spannish team who were there for the taking. terrible manager who was out of a job until a totally unexpected result against the dutch at home. still managed to lose away to iran anyway. people always look back with the oul rose tinted glasses cause he got us to ONE tournament at the third attempt but to me he was always a rubbish manager.any other country would have gotten rid of him after two **** poor qualifying campaigns were ireland threw away qualification eventho all events conspired in our favour. At the world cup ireland were totally clueless against spain. we got TWO penos, had an extra man and spain had more than one goal disallowed. anyone who looks back nostalgically at "the macarthy" era obviously didnt have to sit thru any of the great days of scrapping for results against iceland, lithuania,andorra,belgium and of course the brilliant macedonia. kerr was ten times the manager that macarthy was.millwall couldnt beleive their luck that they got rid of the useless waster and I'd say sunderland fans are thinking along the same lines now.....if he ever got the ireland job again I wouldnt ever support them again til he was gotten rid of. god even thinking about all them crap performances and crapper excuses is making me vomit.

That is an absolutely stupid post that lacks any balance at all. What are you talking about McCarthy being out of a job until he got an unexpected result against the Dutch.? We were unbeaten in the group before that match against the Dutch. Without bringing the whole Keane issue to the surface again, you neglected to mention that Keane didn't travel to Iran for a game on the Thursday coz he had a game for ManU two days later. During the same campaign, Mick soldiered on with his team after his father had just passed away. He sent his best player home from the World Cup because there was no other alternative. I think you'll find that the other 22 players were more than happy. McCarthy might have had bad days against some poor teams but how you can tell me that Kerr is "ten times" better I don't know. McCarthy beat teams like Croatia, Yugoslavia and Holland in competitive games. Kerr managed to beat Georgia and Albania and conspired to finish fourth in the group. Unlike Mick, Kerr left the team in a worse position than when he took over. Kerr is an arrogant pr!ck who had notions above his station. It was Kerr who was the PR man who used the Irish media to get the job.
As for McCarthy at Sunderland, I think you'll find that the fans understand the difficult situation he's in. He has a woeful squad and no money to spend. It's actually a miracle he got them promoted (another fact you casually neglected to mention). Mick criticised his players a few weeks ago (something he'd never done in his career prior to that). He did it to see if he could get a reaction out of them. Compare that to Kerr who went on the Late Late Show and begged to stay in the job. On the show, Kerr said that the Irish squad wasn't good enough and he'd done his best.
I hope Kerr gets a job with Dublin City or some other parochial backwater of a club. That's just about his level.

[klein4]

nope.
I thought all along that macarthy was a brutal manager.
couldnt beleive the revisionism that went on after one result.(holland at home)
keane dominated that qualifying tournament. hence the unbeaten run. left to their own devices they always struggled. andorra home and away anyone?
had kerr been given the leeway macarthy got then I am sure he would have got us to a tournament. dont try and convince me otherwise by quoting selective facts. I saw it with my own eyes. to me your post on macarthy was pure revisionist rubbish.

[Stuttgart88]

Keane didn't travel to Iran for a game on the Thursday coz he had a game for ManU two days later. During the same campaign, Mick soldiered on with his team after his father had just passed away.


to me your post on macarthy was pure revisionist rubbish.

Nothing revisionist about Mick leaving his father's deathbed to manage Ireland though. I think those people who direct vitriol at him at every opportunity would be well served to remember the circumstances under which Mick took the team to Cyprus in March 2001. He has my respect as a person. As a coach / manager? Curate's egg. Good in parts.

[klein4]

absolutely irrelevant point about his father.
crap manager who made ridiculous decisions.too many to list here.
better state than he found them in? ireland away to russia and ireland at home to swiss were two of the worst tactically inept performances ever.
what has keane not going to Iran got to do with macarthys ability as a manager? what are you on about???? kerr was also unbeaten before france game. it didnt go his way and he was out the door. the same threat hung over macarthy at the time of the dutch game. most people thought they would lose and a third failure to qualify would not have gotten him another chance.classic irish inferiority complex is the root of a lot the vitriol directed at kerr.

[klein4]

and if you are so obsessed with statistics why dont you quote the statistics for macarthys results without keane as opposed to the ones with keane.

[gustavo]

I like both Mick and Brian as managers however i feel the only differences between their tenures as manager was luck

[Stuttgart88]

Wim Janssen was picked out of the crowd on TV at the Stoke vs Leicester match. Credible candidate for the Ireland job?

[gustavo]

Whats he done apart from come first in a two horse race one season about 8 years ago ?

[Stuttgart88]

Good track record at Feyenoord. Don't know about the rest. That's why I asked the question.

[klein4]

he was rated fairly highly in holland at the time. I remember cruyff said he was best manager about. why did celtic get rid of him? did he not put an end to 9 seasons without a league at celtic? was it not more of a political thing that he didnt get on with brown or something. any celtic fans know anything about him?

[Jerry The Saint]

I hope Kerr gets a job with Dublin City or some other parochial backwater of a club. That's just about his level.

This type of comment shows why Kerr was under pressure from Day 1. Some people view the League of Ireland as a "parochial backwater" and felt that Kerr was getting above his station by thinking he could manage an international team. Because of this he wasn't given the same allowances to make mistakes and time to learn that someone who's been through a proper football system like they have in England would.:rolleyes:

The sad thing is that this view is shared by the current Chief Executive of the FAI. :mad:

[Stuttgart88]

Janssen resigned from Celtic because he couln't work with Brown as far as I remember.

[Stuttgart88]

This type of comment shows why Kerr was under pressure from Day 1. Was he really under pressure from day 1? Quite the contrary I'd say. I remember hearing talk that Kerr had "worked miracles" to get us back into contention in that group simply because he had got 10 out of 12 points against Albania & Georgia. I think Kerr had a very long honeymoon period and most people I know were itching for him to succeed.

Any criticism I have of Kerr is based on what I saw of Ireland's competitive performances in the last 3 years, and nothing whatsoever to do with where he learnt his managerial skills.

Ultimately I think the FAI made the right decision but, and it's a big but, I'm sure that Delaney's decision was not purely based on merit.

[lofty9]

I heard the FAI were looking to chat to Paul Le Guen re the Ireland job. I know very little about him though.

[geysir]

I get fed up with the juvenile hyperbole directed at McCarthy and Kerr.
Talking about old managers I read that Liam Tuohey was given some sort of an honour before the Swiss game.I guess that was at Kerr's behest.
When he managed Ireland he was also managing Shamrock Rovers plus a full time job as a milkman (of sorts). He definitely qualifies as Ireland's hardest working manager

heard the FAI were looking to chat to Paul Le Guen re the Ireland job
Where did you hear this one Lofty?

[geysir]

Whats he done apart from come first in a two horse race one season about 8 years ago?
Does winning a 2 horse league title race carry more or less kudos than winning a 1 horse race? Wim can dine out on that one for the rest of his life even with that hairstyle. He is not on the betting radar for the Irish job.
Cruyff called for the Dutch FA to give the job to Jansen after Van Gaal resigned. I assume that reference carries some weight on any cv.
After some time in Japan I think he is back with Feyenoord now in some capacity.

[livehead1]

felt that Kerr was getting above his station by thinking he could manage an international team.

...but it's been proven he couldn't, results were not good enough, book stops with the manager, hes expendable, the players aren't

[Stuttgart88]

book stops with the manager

You sure you're studying law?

[livehead1]

You sure you're studying law?

yeh, quite enjoyable as well. in the sense of my comment, i feel that, not always rightly, the book has to stop with a manager, the players will be around when he is gone, especially in a nation with such a short supply of real quality players. i mean if robbie keane had performed so poorly for ireland in a managerial role as he has done in the last few games then people would be calling for his head, yet in the next ireland match he will be touted as our main threat, if you see my point.

[geysir]

Maybe, as long as we have a nation with such a short supply of real quality books.

[Stuttgart88]

yeh, quite enjoyable as well. in the sense of my comment, i feel that, not always rightly, the book has to stop with a manager, the players will be around when he is gone, especially in a nation with such a short supply of real quality players. i mean if robbie keane had performed so poorly for ireland in a managerial role as he has done in the last few games then people would be calling for his head, yet in the next ireland match he will be touted as our main threat, if you see my point.

Was only drawing attention to the fact that the expression is "the buck stops here" though obviously you have a knack for phonetic spelling which isn't to be sneered at :)

A copy of "Eats, Shoots & Leaves" is on its way to you for Christmas!

[livehead1]

sh*t , sure i must have books on the mind! too much christmas spirit one feels

[Noelys Guitar]

Hiddink an outside chance for new manager conducts some training sessions with the Aussies over the web! A live link up with 2 assistants taking the sessions with Hiddink still in Holland. My point being would it be better to have an excellent club manager working part-time as Ireland manager rather than an average Joe as full-time manager?

[klein4]

just having a manger no matter who the hell he was at this stage would be a start...

[Hither green]

just having a manger no matter who the hell he was at this stage would be a start...

Anyone know where we're at? Things have gone a bit quiet and some of the papers over here in england have been claiming that the FAI have put off a decision until the summer.

[geysir]

Is there not anybody who has a half decently sourced rumor? Has Delaney gone to ground? even Salmon Rushdie came up for air from time to time.
You would hope that all those who we do not want are also not wanted by the FAI. If any of them were found suitable then you would think that the appointment would be made already.
Though, I am still haunted by the mistrust arising from the time FAI had to select between Charlton and Bob Paisley. I remember watching that news item on the evening news in absolute shocked disbelief. We had all known that Bob was up for the job and were already planning world domination.

[klein4]

givens in paper at the weekend reckoned appointment would be made in early jan as nobody has spoken to him bout taking over as caretaker........altho that could just be due to FAI incompetance....I have to say I find the lack of leaks refreshing...maybe for once they do know what the are doing...

[Kingdom]

I would prefer if we had a new manager appointed as soon as possible. I think waiting to the summer before someone gets appointed would be a disaster. A manager needs time to view his players in action, unearth hidden gems etc.
Anywho, I'm sure there are plenty of viable candidates. I just don't see why if we're not gonna pick an Irishman why we have to appoint a Briton. Like its not as if there are too many highly regarded ones sitting around.

Paul le Guen would be a fantastic appointment, if it was possible. as would be Gus Hiddink. Not sure his supporters would be as fanatical as the Koreans though.....

[Paulie]

The new manager needs to be appointed by 27/01/06 which is when the qualifiers for the 2008 European Championships will be drawn. A meeting will be held shortly after that between the football governing bodies of each nation in the group. In the time between the draw and the meeting the new manager will need to work out exactly when he wants to play each team and try to work towards that, hence the need for the appointment to be made by the above date.

[Tenderloins]

The manager story has gone dead for a while cos the papers can fill their pages with reviews of the year, Keane going to Celtic, the demise of Man utd and so. Wait til theres a slow news day and the papers will have another name linked to the post.
I cant even think who it'll be, of those interested, wouldn't want any of them. Hopefully Givens won't be in charge of the Sweden game and will be got rid of as Under 21 manager too, as soon as possible.

[Junior]

Some stuff on Jansen, he seems to have disappeared off the planet after Celtic. Definitely in Japan in 2002.

WIM JANSEN

Wilhelmus "Wim" Marinus Anthonius Jansen (born October 28, 1946, Rotterdam) is a former Dutch Football player and manager.
He spent most of his playing career with his hometown team, Feyenoord, between 1965 and 1980. At Feyenoord, Jansen won four League Championships, one Dutch Cup, and one UEFA Cup. He also won the European Cup in 1970 when Feyenoord defeated Celtic 2-1 in Milan. Jansen would later manage Celtic. He also won 65 international caps with Holland and played in both of the Dutch sides which lost the 1974 and 1978 World Cup Finals.
Jansen signed for the American side Washington Diplomats in 1980, but after playing only 27 games for them, he returned to the Netherlands to sign for Ajax. Jansen stayed at Ajax until 1982, when he returned to Washington for a season, before retiring from playing in 1983.
He began his management career at his old club Feyenoord, where he worked as a coach, and then as assistant manager, between 1983 and 1987. After a season as manager of Belgian club SC Lokeren, he was appointed as Technical Director at second division SVV Dordrecht, where he won the league alongside his manager - future Rangers manager Dick Advocaat.
In 1991, he returned to Feyenoord as manager, winning the Dutch Cup in 1991 and 1992 and taking them to the semi-finals of the European Cup Winners Cup in 1991/92. He became Technical Director in 1992, with Hans Dorjee being appointed as manager, but Dorjee became ill and Jansen was forced to take over as manager again. Dorjee later resigned and was replaced as manager by Jansen's old team mate, Wim van Hanegem. Feyenoord won the Dutch Championship in 1993 and the Dutch Cup again the following season, but after a dispute with the executives of the club, Jansen left to work as assistant manager of Saudi Arabia alongside Leo Beenhakker. Between 1994 and 1997 he also managed Japanese side Sanfrecce Hiroshima.
On July 3, 1997, Wim Jansen was appointed as Head Coach of Celtic, replacing the sacked Tommy Burns. His appointment was notable as he was the first ever foreign manager to take charge of a top-flight Scottish football club. He went on to become a legend in the history of Celtic Football Club by guiding Celtic to their first League Championship in 10 years - end Rangers attempt to win 10 consecutive Championships. Yet, despite winning the League and the League Cup in season 1997/98, Jansen left the club less than 48 hours after the title was secured with a 2-0 home win over St Johnstone.
Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wim_Jansen"


This one is in Dutch but you can decipher it - roughly

http://www.beijen.net/frank/cvs/jansen-w.htm

[geysir]

Some stuff on Jansen, he seems to have disappeared off the planet after Celtic. Definitely in Japan in 2002
As I mentioned earlier in the thread he is back with Feyenoord now in some capacity.

[Irish_Praha]

The new manager needs to be appointed by 27/01/06 which is when the qualifiers for the 2008 European Championships will be drawn. A meeting will be held shortly after that between the football governing bodies of each nation in the group.

This may be true. Does anyone know if the top seeded teams get a higher priority deciding the fixture dates? If so, we are fourth seeds so we are not going to have a major influence on the fixture setup, with or without a manager.

[feo123]

Theres no chance we will have someone appointed by then!!

[gustavo]

This may be true. Does anyone know if the top seeded teams get a higher priority deciding the fixture dates? If so, we are fourth seeds so we are not going to have a major influence on the fixture setup, with or without a manager.
no as far as i know its just open negotiation . i remember that mick went into the negotiation for the 02 qualifiers with the though that he wanted to get a certain combination of games either first or last cant rightly remember but i'm sure someone will pick me up on it.

[Junior]

As I mentioned earlier in the thread he is back with Feyenoord now in some capacity.

Indeed he is, 'Technical Advisor'

http://www.feyenoord.com/domains/default/pages/content.asp?content=12770000000085_2_1000000000165 1&contentcode=STICHTING_ORGANISATIE&navid=12770000000010_12770000000046

[geysir]

Indeed he is, 'Technical Advisor'
Nice pictures but a pity there is not of Wim, I wonder how is hair is doing.

[Stuttgart88]

Still very poodle-esque. He was on TV at the recent Stoke vs Leicester game, in the stands as a guest of Johan Boskamp.

The longer the manager saga drags along the more I am sure it'll be O'Neill.

Burley is now at S'hampton so that's him out of the race. Hiddink will go to a top European club after the WC I reckon, maybe MUFC. I think O'Neill's stock in England isn't as high as a few years ago and I reckon the MUFC opportunity has passed him by. No other PL club with a managerial vacancy is likely to tempt him in my opinion, unless Villa's new Irish owners offer him a load of £££££.

O'Neill, Ranieri & then Aldridge are now the three most likely in my opinion, with each being palatable in their own way, though Aldridge is clearly the poor man's option.