George Best and Ireland

[thejollyrodger]

I have been watching all the tributes of Best on tv and one point that kept re-accuring was the fact that Best was a genius but he was left to his own devices in Manchester and he left football prematurely.

The problems were that there were no structures in place to deal with players of that genius. I just wonder if another george best came along today would the clubs and indeed the FAI be able to cater for him ?

One of George best's wish was for all ireland soccer team. The sad fact remain that Northern IReland were too weak to make it to the finals and if ireland ever produced another player of such quality it might be de ja vu.

The world missed out on his genius and maybe its about time serious thought was put into the whole idea even though the north is not producing world class player at the moment.

[jjppc]

Heard on the radio that George wanted an all Ireland team to play Manchester United as a tribute to his memory. Great idea it could kick start an all Ireland team. God Bless Georgie RIP

[co. down green]

According to Sky news, Man United are planning a tribute game in January/February of next year.

The plan is for a Man U v All Ireland team.

Bestie had always been keen on a single team representing the whole island.
His arguement was that by pooling resources etc.. We would have a better chance of challenging for major honours.

He took quite a bit of stick from n.i supporters following his remarks.

Derek Dougan has also been a long time advocate of an all Ireland team , but again, suffered a great deal of criticism from within the n.i support base.

Dougan even had his image defaced by fans on a mural depicting some of the n.i players of the past in Belfast

[Dawn_Run]

A great idea and a fitting way to salute a hero that has been claimed by both sides of the island as one of their own.

It will allow us to be united as one, if only for 90 mins, but my feeling is that it will open doors, build bridges and lay the foundations for future plans of a united Ireland soccer team, something that I would love to see in my lifetime.

[Jerry The Saint]

Great idea but I wouldn't like to see an Ireland XI vs. Manchester Utd game though - club vs country games are, by default, meaningless testemonial/pre-season friendly type games. Supporters in the crowd would have half-utd/half-Irish scarves and there would be zero intensity to the game.

England are due a friendly on 1 March, and there are already rumours of ROI playing it. Having an All-Ireland team playing England in a World Cup warm-up would definitely be a proper football occasion to do justice to Best. Having it at Old Trafford should minimise the risk of crowd trouble as the locals would (hopefully!) not want to show disrespect.

[livehead1]

Great idea but I wouldn't like to see an Ireland XI vs. Manchester Utd game though - club vs country games are, by default, meaningless testemonial/pre-season friendly type games. Supporters in the crowd would have half-utd/half-Irish scarves and there would be zero intensity to the game.

England are due a friendly on 1 March, and there are already rumours of ROI playing it. Having an All-Ireland team playing England in a World Cup warm-up would definitely be a proper football occasion to do justice to Best. Having it at Old Trafford should minimise the risk of crowd trouble as the locals would (hopefully!) not want to show disrespect.

doesn't matter if its the most awful game ever seen on the planet, it will be a breakthrough and a true legacy to best that it was him who was able to draw thse people together

[eirebhoy]

A NUMBER of Ireland's foremost football stars have joined a call for an all-Ireland soccer team to come together in order to play England - in memory of George Best.

Sports Minister John O'Donoghue has also welcomed the prospect of the game. Paul McGrath, John Giles, Liam Brady and Packie Bonner have all put their backing behind the idea.

Sunday Independent.

[silentbob]

Does anybody know what time the FAI headquaters is staying open until this evening for people to sign the book of condolences?

[Cosmo]

Does anybody know what time the FAI headquaters is staying open until this evening for people to sign the book of condolences?

Was wondering that myself - also anyone know what day the book can be signed up til?

[boysingreen]

Best on a united Ireland team: "I just believe in trying something. If it doesn't work, at least you've tried. I still hope that in my lifetime it happens."

Shame he never lived to see it. Here's hopeing his and many others dream lives.

[silentbob]

Was wondering that myself - also anyone know what day the book can be signed up til?

Received an email back from the FAI saying that the headquaters will be open until 5.30 everyday up until friday.

[livehead1]

in the last couple of days i've had a complete turn around in my opinions on best, and indeed his death. why all the sorrow, why all the sadness, why all the grief? this is a man who for the last 25-30 years as wasted not only his own liver, but someone elses. someone else went without to give best that liver.
he was given a gift from god, a gift he never used to the best of his abilities, he was burnt out by 26.
he was never a good role model to children, not only was he an alcoholic, yes, granted, its an illness. he was also a wife-beater. he managed to marry a beautiful lady in later life, in alex best. how was she treated..like a complete idiot.
when i hear of people dying in car crashes as the result of a head-on collision with a drunk driver, its then i feel sadness...o sorry, best spent time in jail as the result of drink driving.

a gifted footballer yes, but a legend, role model, and hero, far from it, some may call it a disgrace.

[eirebhoy]

in the last couple of days i've had a complete turn around in my opinions on best, and indeed his death. why all the sorrow, why all the sadness, why all the grief? this is a man who for the last 25-30 years as wasted not only his own liver, but someone elses. someone else went without to give best that liver.
He didn't die because of the liver so most likely would have died if he didn't go back on the drink. Anyway, he thought he would have the power to stay off the drink after the transplant. He was wrong.

[Tired&Emotional]

He did die of his new liver because if he wasn't on so many immuno-suppressant drugs (which he needs so his own body wouldn't reject the new liver) he wouldn't have been so susceptible to infection in his other organs...

[youngirish]

Best was a waster through and through. He could have been the greatest footballer ever but he wasn't no matter all the post death media s**te says. A waste of a unique talent. Why are all the most talented Irish footballers d**kheads in one way or the other:

Keane - troublemaker
Mc Grath - womaniser and alcoholic (could have been even better)
Best - see Mc Grath above
O'Leary - no commitment in his early years (which is why he fell out with Charlton)
Paul Butler - (joke)

[Risteard]

What's wrong with being a womaniser?

I think even big-head Keane would be the first to admit he's not the most talented Irish player ever.

[silentbob]

Best was a waster through and through. He could have been the greatest footballer ever but he wasn't no matter all the post death media s**te says. A waste of a unique talent. Why are all the most talented Irish footballers d**kheads in one way or the other:

Keane - troublemaker
Mc Grath - womaniser and alcoholic (could have been even better)
Best - see Mc Grath above
O'Leary - no commitment in his early years (which is why he fell out with Charlton)
Paul Butler - (joke)

Young Irish - ********

[Plastic Paddy]

Young Irish - ********

Enough already. Attack the post please and not the poster.

:ball: PP

[youngirish]

silentbob I am shocked at the severity of your post. I think its wrong that you should attack my character when I'm only giving my opinion on a footballing matter. If I am prone to such attacks in future I'm not sure its worth adding my thoughts to these forums.

Ah I'm only buzzing ur obviously a ball licker. How come ******** isn't censored on the forums?

[silentbob]

Enough already. Attack the post please and not the poster.

:ball: PP

Usually I would paddy but a post such as that one is so stupid that I believe the poster should be the one to be attacked. To be honest I wish at this stage I didnt make any comment on him as it only means he will get more attention.

[colster]

Best was a waster through and through. He could have been the greatest footballer ever but he wasn't no matter all the post death media s**te says. A waste of a unique talent. Why are all the most talented Irish footballers d**kheads in one way or the other:

Keane - troublemaker
Mc Grath - womaniser and alcoholic (could have been even better)
Best - see Mc Grath above
O'Leary - no commitment in his early years (which is why he fell out with Charlton)
Paul Butler - (joke)

Talk about exaggeration. What about the likes of Giles, Brady, Whelan, Irwin, Duff,Lawrenson etc. They were/are all model pros.

[Duncan Gardner]

His arguement was that by pooling resources etc.. We would have a better chance of challenging for major honours

Aye, but it's a daft argument. We are consistently weak, you are steadily weakening. Combine the two, you get weakness. If the argument was really valid, the Soviet Union would have ben worldbeaters...


Derek Dougan has also been a long time advocate of an all Ireland team , but again, suffered a great deal of criticism from within the n.i support base

Indeed. Every NI fan I know disagrees with him. The idea's a non-starter.


it will open doors, build bridges and lay the foundations for future plans of a united Ireland soccer team

It won't. Bridges are already there. We are not giving up our team to merge with you. Nor anybody else- nowt personal, like...


A NUMBER of Ireland's foremost football stars have joined a call for an all-Ireland soccer team to come together in order to play England

Play England yourselves, if the Gardai let you (1995 not so long ago)...

I
just believe in trying something. If it doesn't work, at least you've tried

We did try, up to the 1920s. You felt it didn't work so you withdrew!

[M@ttitude]

This is a Football website.. Respect Best for his excellent football, because he was one of the greatest footballers who ever lived. Let others judge him but for Gods sake if your anyway a fan of soccer you should remember him for his greatness. George Best, legend, RIP..

[silentbob]

This is a Football website.. Respect Best for his excellent football, because he was one of the greatest footballers who ever lived. Let others judge him but for Gods sake if your anyway a fan of soccer you should remember him for his greatness. George Best, legend, RIP..

Well said

[gustavo]

O'Leary - no commitment in his early years (which is why he fell out with Charlton)

O Leary was 30 when he had his disagreement with Charlton

[livehead1]

interesting article from forest supporters site
David di Tommaso, a former French youth international who played for Dutch side FC Utrecht died in his sleep on Monday night of a suspected heart attack. Brendan O’Connor, a Middlesbrough fan who had travelled to Holland to see his team play AZ Alkmaar in the UEFA Cup, was stabbed to death in Amsterdam after the game last week. And Marios Melakos, a Cypriot policeman who was on duty at the AEL Limassol v APOEL Nicosia match at the weekend, died of a heart attack after supporters rioted outside the stadium. Of course, you probably wouldn’t have heard about these untimely deaths over this weekend, due to the coverage of another premature demise from the world of football.

Maybe if I was born 25 years earlier, I might have been more upset about George Best’s passing. The trouble is, for anyone of my generation he is simply the man who made a drunken fool of himself on Wogan; the man who offered incomprehensible ‘analysis’ on Soccer Saturday (a show on which the producers allegedly had Clive Allen on standby every week in case Best didn’t show up. I seem to remember seeing rather a lot of Mr Allen); the man who drank his way through not only his own liver, but someone else’s too.

The only thing we have to connect him to the world of football is memories of those older than us, and mostly grainy footage of him scoring against Benfica, those six goals at Northampton and kicking the ball out of Gordon Bank’s hands for Northern Ireland. This is not to say I was happy when he died, but I fail to see why I should be quite as devastated as the blanket media coverage suggests I should be. Why should I be anymore upset about the Belfast Boy croaking than the more ‘low profile’ football related deaths I mentioned at the start?

As far as the (mainly tabloid) press were concerned, up until a few weeks before his death, Best was the sad drunk that I remember him as, who treated those around him badly (but only “when he’d had a drink” we’re told). Indeed, his ex-wife created a minor media career for herself out of the fact that she was the put-upon, maligned former Mrs Best. However, as soon as the somewhat morbid countdown to his last breath began, the papers hauled up every aged hack they could find to tell us all about the time they saved up all their shillings to see Georgie Boy play, and how bewitched they were.

Eamonn Holmes offered the most baffling eulogy on Saturday, telling of the time Best disappeared (to the pub, of course) from a specially arranged tribute show for ‘El Beatle’ himself, causing huge amounts of disruption and annoyance for all concerned. Except that is, from Holmes, who still spoke of him with misty-eyed reverence, claiming that he “loved him nonetheless”.

Here was a man who let people down with infuriating regularity, who essentially threw away a second chance at life – put yourself in the place of someone a few spots down on that donors register – and who squandered a talent that most of us would give our own liver for. And I know that alcoholism is a disease, but it is not necessarily a fatal one – it is one that can be beaten if one is so inclined.

One of the reasons why is he is remembered so fondly is the hypocritical way the off-field activities of players of Best’s era are seen in comparison with today’s stars. The drunken antics of players past are treated with a nudge and a wink and a ‘Oh he was a jack-the-lad, wasn’t he?’, whereas the tales of Rio, Frank, Kieron, et al, are disgraceful, disgusting and a sad indictment of the youth of today. I remember reading about a player – I think it was Stan Bowles – in the seventies who was found at 2:45 on a Saturday afternoon in the pub, clad in his kit. If Wayne Rooney did that today then he would be strung up.

It was probably for this reason that Best’s alcoholism was indulged, and almost celebrated. He made a good earner when his playing days were over through after-dinner speaking arrangements, an environment where drunken tales of drunken adventures are exactly what the crowd wants.

The only reason – the only reason – that George Best is remembered so fondly is that he, by all accounts, was a genius with a football. He could head, tackle, dribble, finish, nobody was sure which foot he was strongest with, and the most brutal defenders seemed to bounce off him… I’m told. But is that enough? Should someone who was simply better than most at kicking a ball around be revered so? In a few day’s time, the names David di Tommaso, Brendan O’Connor and Marios Melakos will be forgotten. George Best will not.

[thejollyrodger]

here this thread wasnt meant to degrade into a slaggin match. I was meant to post a proper reply earlier on but didnt have the time.

Basically what I was trying to say is that should another George Best come along (these things seem to come in cycles) the footballing circles should be properly set up and ready to cater for him. A good example is man utd. Fergie and that generation put in the structures in place to deal with players who have amazing natural ability but screw up big time with life.

We dont have the structures in place here (north or south) to properly develop player so that when they do go to the big clubs its a natural progression and the players are well able to deal with the jump into the bigger pool and deal with the limelight. Best was fine when he was at home with his fellow kind and playing for Northern Ireland. HE just wasnt ready for the high life in England and it was a terrible shame.

We (the footballing community and government) have to continue to reform the FAI and devlop the league clubs here as far as they can be.

The way things stand, if N.Ireland were to produce another Best then he woud be doomed to play at european level and never likely to play at a world cup or european championship. If they merged with the republic then they would have a realistic chance. It would be for the benefit of everyone invovled, the player and the two parts of the isles.

[Qwerty]

interesting article from forest supporters site
David di Tommaso, a former French youth international who played for Dutch side FC Utrecht died in his sleep on Monday night of a suspected heart attack. Brendan O’Connor, a Middlesbrough fan who had travelled to Holland to see his team play AZ Alkmaar in the UEFA Cup, was stabbed to death in Amsterdam after the game last week. And Marios Melakos, a Cypriot policeman who was on duty at the AEL Limassol v APOEL Nicosia match at the weekend, died of a heart attack after supporters rioted outside the stadium. Of course, you probably wouldn’t have heard about these untimely deaths over this weekend, due to the coverage of another premature demise from the world of football.

Maybe if I was born 25 years earlier, I might have been more upset about George Best’s passing. The trouble is, for anyone of my generation he is simply the man who made a drunken fool of himself on Wogan; the man who offered incomprehensible ‘analysis’ on Soccer Saturday (a show on which the producers allegedly had Clive Allen on standby every week in case Best didn’t show up. I seem to remember seeing rather a lot of Mr Allen); the man who drank his way through not only his own liver, but someone else’s too.

The only thing we have to connect him to the world of football is memories of those older than us, and mostly grainy footage of him scoring against Benfica, those six goals at Northampton and kicking the ball out of Gordon Bank’s hands for Northern Ireland. This is not to say I was happy when he died, but I fail to see why I should be quite as devastated as the blanket media coverage suggests I should be. Why should I be anymore upset about the Belfast Boy croaking than the more ‘low profile’ football related deaths I mentioned at the start?

As far as the (mainly tabloid) press were concerned, up until a few weeks before his death, Best was the sad drunk that I remember him as, who treated those around him badly (but only “when he’d had a drink” we’re told). Indeed, his ex-wife created a minor media career for herself out of the fact that she was the put-upon, maligned former Mrs Best. However, as soon as the somewhat morbid countdown to his last breath began, the papers hauled up every aged hack they could find to tell us all about the time they saved up all their shillings to see Georgie Boy play, and how bewitched they were.

Eamonn Holmes offered the most baffling eulogy on Saturday, telling of the time Best disappeared (to the pub, of course) from a specially arranged tribute show for ‘El Beatle’ himself, causing huge amounts of disruption and annoyance for all concerned. Except that is, from Holmes, who still spoke of him with misty-eyed reverence, claiming that he “loved him nonetheless”.

Here was a man who let people down with infuriating regularity, who essentially threw away a second chance at life – put yourself in the place of someone a few spots down on that donors register – and who squandered a talent that most of us would give our own liver for. And I know that alcoholism is a disease, but it is not necessarily a fatal one – it is one that can be beaten if one is so inclined.

One of the reasons why is he is remembered so fondly is the hypocritical way the off-field activities of players of Best’s era are seen in comparison with today’s stars. The drunken antics of players past are treated with a nudge and a wink and a ‘Oh he was a jack-the-lad, wasn’t he?’, whereas the tales of Rio, Frank, Kieron, et al, are disgraceful, disgusting and a sad indictment of the youth of today. I remember reading about a player – I think it was Stan Bowles – in the seventies who was found at 2:45 on a Saturday afternoon in the pub, clad in his kit. If Wayne Rooney did that today then he would be strung up.

It was probably for this reason that Best’s alcoholism was indulged, and almost celebrated. He made a good earner when his playing days were over through after-dinner speaking arrangements, an environment where drunken tales of drunken adventures are exactly what the crowd wants.

The only reason – the only reason – that George Best is remembered so fondly is that he, by all accounts, was a genius with a football. He could head, tackle, dribble, finish, nobody was sure which foot he was strongest with, and the most brutal defenders seemed to bounce off him… I’m told. But is that enough? Should someone who was simply better than most at kicking a ball around be revered so? In a few day’s time, the names David di Tommaso, Brendan O’Connor and Marios Melakos will be forgotten. George Best will not.

You make a valid and interesting point but history doesn't remember average joe's like us, it only remembers the famous and the infamous. While the families of the other men you mention will be grieving a lost loved one, Best's family may be relieved he has gone.

[gspain]

here this thread wasnt meant to degrade into a slaggin match. I was meant to post a proper reply earlier on but didnt have the time.

Basically what I was trying to say is that should another George Best come along (these things seem to come in cycles) the footballing circles should be properly set up and ready to cater for him. A good example is man utd. Fergie and that generation put in the structures in place to deal with players who have amazing natural ability but screw up big time with life.




Remind what they did for Paul McGrath. I thought they tried to force him to retire and then shipped him off to Villa. :(

[Lionel Ritchie]

Remind what they did for Paul McGrath. I thought they tried to force him to retire and then shipped him off to Villa. :(

...where despite rather than because of Fergies help he played much of the best football of his career.