Irish Presidential Election 2025

[Neish]

Just 3 candidates managed to get the backing to be on the ballot paper come October 24th, this is the lowest number since the 1990 campaign. Names on the Ballot paper will be

Heather Humphreys (Fine Gael)
Jim Gavin (Fianna Fail)
Catherine Connolly (Independent)

Connolly would be getting my vote, and hope she get in as the last thing we need is more FF or FG centre right sway in Irish politicos

[Razors left peg]

I personally like Catherine Connolly, mainly because I met her a few times and she is a genuinely nice person. From a political point of view I also think that shes inoffensive enough, and for me the President should be fairly down the middle while acting as a good ambassador for the country

[Nesta99]

I was about to bemoan the low number of candidates but when you think about who was trying to be on the ballot, setting the bar for nomination quite high was a good thing.

[Razors left peg]

I was about to bemoan the low number of candidates but when you think about who was trying to be on the ballot, setting the bar for nomination quite high was a good thing.

Yeah the last think that was needed was letting McGregor get on the ballot and given a platform to spout his sh1te

[sbgawa]

I wonder will her foot in mouth moment reduce the support from the left parties seem as how none of them backed her up. She needs the shinners and their cash for sure

[nigel-harps1954]

Two horse race between Humphries and Connolly realistically.
Think Connolly is the best candidate out of the three to provide some level of continuity to the job Higgins has done really.

[culloty82]

All of them turned up to her launch party on Monday, which was after the statement, so no lack of commitment there. Connolly's biggest difficulty will be transfers - even if she did get the roughly 40% of FPV that the combined left register in polling, I can't see how she gets over the line once Gavin's eliminated, and his preferences overwhelmingly go to Humphreys.

[Nesta99]

Any opinions of Connolly's comments drawing parallels between rearmament of Germany in the 1930 and Germany's increased military spending today. It wasnt suggesting that Germany was at it again, but it was a bit clumsy I think. She isnt wrong about the policy backing the military industrial complex helping to boost the sluggish German economy. We shouldnt in any way fear putting noses out of joint, but referencing Nazi Germany period if not Nazi directly, and making a comparison to today can be taken out of context and used, drop the word 'some'!?

"They're absolutely championing the cause of the military-industrial complex in Germany, as a booster for the economy ... Seems to me, there are some parallels with the ’30s."

Daily Mail like reporting 'Irish Presidential candidate says there are parallels between Nazi Germany and biggest EU economy'...

[sbgawa]

Connollys coments that Hamas are part of the fabric of Palastinian society and shouldnt be ruled out of being part of the future are just stupid.
On the same basis the Nazis should have been allowed be part of the West German Government after WW2.

Its that kind of stupidity we could do without in a President.
Higgins would have been to smart to say something like that.

[tetsujin1979]

You'd think that paper would be ok with those parallels, given their history

[Razors left peg]

Connollys coments that Hamas are part of the fabric of Palastinian society and shouldnt be ruled out of being part of the future are just stupid.
On the same basis the Nazis should have been allowed be part of the West German Government after WW2.

Its that kind of stupidity we could do without in a President.
Higgins would have been to smart to say something like that.

Im probably going to write this clumsily so my apologies if I dont make my point well. Vastly different versions of the IRA were part of the future of Ireland after conflicts. After the Treaty in 1921 the IRA were involved in the future, and after the Good Friday Agreement the likes of Martin McGuinness who were in IRA were part of the process moving forward.

Would that not be more of a correct parallel to Hamas instead of the comparison to Nazi Germany?

[pineapple stu]

I was going to post the exact same thing.

Additionally - who the **** are we in the west, who have stood by and watched Israel bomb Palestine for decades, and even supplied weapons to them, to tell the Palestinians who to vote for? The west has a bad history of getting involved in democracy and generating resentment by overthrowing democratically-elected candidates. Let's maybe learn from our lessons?

You would of course hope that, if there is a free Palestine (which is a long way off) and if Hamas got elected, that they would moderate their conduct or be voted out.

But it's not for us to tell Palestinians how to vote. Or at least be consistent and tell Israelis they can't vote for Likud.

[pineapple stu]

Yeah the last think that was needed was letting McGregor get on the ballot and given a platform to spout his sh1te
I'd place McGregor slightly above Hamas on my Christmas card list - which isn't saying a huge amount - but I actually disagree with the way McGregor was blocked from standing.

To be clear - he shouldn't have been allowed to stand. He's a convicted rapist. That alone should bar him. But, bizarrely, it didn't.

Instead, he was effectively blocked because of what he wanted to stand for. That's not democracy for me.

There's a glaring rift growing in Ireland lately over issues such as housing, immigration and climate change in particular, and Fianna Fáil/Fine Gael have shown they have no intention of addressing any of those. It's appalling from them.

But now we have a case where someone goes to stand on a populist view directly opposite Fianna Fáil/Fine Gael, and they then to all intents and purposes stop him from running. The problem with that is it blocks debate, and leads to more polarisation. Let him stand, let him have his say, let him not get in, let FF/FG realise that their actions are in danger of costing them power and adjust their views (as we've seen with changes to refugee views in Europe lately) - that's democracy. Not "We don't like your views so we're going to silence you"

And again, McGregor specifically still shouldn't be allowed stand because he's a convicted rapist. But apparently criticising mass immigration is a worse crime.

[culloty82]

There are at least 10 TDs at present who were elected precisely because they are anti-immigration (Independent Ireland, Aontú, Mattie McGrath, Carol Nolan, Verona Murphy, and Noel Grealish), so McGregor's problem was that he was too feckless to check the constitutional rules on how to campaign for the presidency, didn't bother to canvas the councils, and his drug-addled boorishness made him toxic to members of the Oireachtas. As for Maria Steen, rather than the establishment circling ranks, it was similarly deciding to stand at the last minute, not meeting all her potential target names, and setting Sharon Keogan's Twitter following on Senators who were on the fence that ultimately put paid to her chances.

[Razors left peg]

I'd place McGregor slightly above Hamas on my Christmas card list - which isn't saying a huge amount - but I actually disagree with the way McGregor was blocked from standing.

To be clear - he shouldn't have been allowed to stand. He's a convicted rapist. That alone should bar him. But, bizarrely, it didn't.

Instead, he was effectively blocked because of what he wanted to stand for. That's not democracy for me.

There's a glaring rift growing in Ireland lately over issues such as housing, immigration and climate change in particular, and Fianna Fáil/Fine Gael have shown they have no intention of addressing any of those. It's appalling from them.

But now we have a case where someone goes to stand on a populist view directly opposite Fianna Fáil/Fine Gael, and they then to all intents and purposes stop him from running. The problem with that is it blocks debate, and leads to more polarisation. Let him stand, let him have his say, let him not get in, let FF/FG realise that their actions are in danger of costing them power and adjust their views (as we've seen with changes to refugee views in Europe lately) - that's democracy. Not "We don't like your views so we're going to silence you"

And again, McGregor specifically still shouldn't be allowed stand because he's a convicted rapist. But apparently criticising mass immigration is a worse crime.

The rules for getting on the ballot have been in place long before McGregor. He didnt try to work within those controls like every other past and present candidate , instead he just tried to shout loudly and bully his way in. If nothing else, it shows the method set in place for getting on the ballot is a great thing

[pineapple stu]

I agree McGregor is hardly a shining light of intelligence.

But so what? Let him stand and let him get nowhere. Instead, there's potentially the image he's been silenced because of what he was saying. I think that's actually unhelpful.

[Razors left peg]

I agree McGregor is hardly a shining light of intelligence.

But so what? Let him stand and let him get nowhere. Instead, there's potentially the image he's been silenced because of what he was saying. I think that's actually unhelpful.

In the US you have to be nominated by your party to get on the ballot for the Presidential election (unless you are throwing money away as a 3rd party candidate). We arent the only ones that have controls

[pineapple stu]

Let's not go taking the US as beacons of democratic functions in fairness!

They can barely be said to be a democracy, with just two parties and the fact of Presidents winning despite getting less votes than the loser.

In any event, McGregor would have been an effective third party candidate (as is my understanding), so let him throw his money away.

[Razors left peg]

Yeah the US isnt something to strive to be, I was just making the point that we arent the only ones that control who can get on a ballot

[pineapple stu]

No, it's fair - and by calling for him to be banned from standing for being a convicted rapist, I'm also in favour of controls of who can go on the ballot.

I just don't think the way it's happened is at all helpful, strangely.

[Razors left peg]

No, it's fair - and by calling for him to be banned from standing for being a convicted rapist, I'm also in favour of controls of who can go on the ballot.

I just don't think the way it's happened is at all helpful, strangely.

If these were new measures that were put in place to block McGregor Id agree with you, but he needed to do the same canvassing work as everyone to get on and he couldnt even be bothered to try that. Thats on him

[pineapple stu]

Oh I know what happened was within the rules - but that's why I disagree with the rules here

[Razors left peg]

If McGregor did manage to get on the ballot, does anyone think there would be possibility that there would be enough yahoos in the country that would vote him in? Id like to think no, but I never thought Brexit would get voted for and I never thought Trump would get elected once never mind twice!

[pineapple stu]

He was polling in single digits when he was being mooted as a candidate. If he was one of four (as in, him and the three others), then that would probably increase. But it's a long way from single digits - with a lot of people very opposed - to winning.

[Nesta99]

You'd think that paper would be ok with those parallels, given their history

That was partly my point, they'd love it, pounce on it and have a pop at the EU indirectly also, Germany in Many ways being the lead the EU so the leader of the EU is Nazi....so says the (possible) Irish head of state.

There is part of me that would want to see McGregor at a presedential debate on tv, the curious mischief part, and part of me would have been abhored by him having any platform. I think a little bit of me would be embarressed that he was able to get on the ballot and while he wouldt have won, I dont think he'd have polled as badly as people would hope, getting low double digits. I know too many people that dismiss his conviction for being a civil case, ask them about admitted drug use and you get a bunch of whataboutery and evasion, or a simple well I like what he says (on immigration). He didnt turn up for a number of council meetings he was scheduled to canvas at. All in all I think Im glad that he hadnt a clue about the process, even if how it happened gives oxygen to the being silenced type claims his supporters would make. People who were elected at local, Dail and Seanad making nominations on our behalf is just about acceptible to me. Maybe they should be allowed a free vote without risk of losing the party whip, as a middle of the road?!

[Razors left peg]

That was partly my point, they'd love it, pounce on it and have a pop at the EU indirectly also, Germany in Many ways being the lead the EU so the leader of the EU is Nazi....so says the (possible) Irish head of state.

There is part of me that would want to see McGregor at a presedential debate on tv, the curious mischief part, and part of me would have been abhored by him having any platform. I think a little bit of me would be embarressed that he was able to get on the ballot and while he wouldt have won, I dont think he'd have polled as badly as people would hope, getting low double digits. I know too many people that dismiss his conviction for being a civil case, ask them about admitted drug use and you get a bunch of whataboutery and evasion, or a simple well I like what he says (on immigration). He didnt turn up for a number of council meetings he was scheduled to canvas at. All in all I think Im glad that he hadnt a clue about the process, even if how it happened gives oxygen to the being silenced type claims his supporters would make. People who were elected at local, Dail and Seanad making nominations on our behalf is just about acceptible to me. Maybe they should be allowed a free vote without risk of losing the party whip, as a middle of the road?!

I deleted a mate of mine that Id known since we were kids off social media around St Patricks day when McGregor was at the White House. Cant remember what exactly sparked the conversation between us but what he said to me was that " I think both McGregor and Trump are horrible cnuts and are criminals, but at least they are getting rid of woke so I'd vote for either of them given the chance."

I wonder how much of that sort of crap would there be if McGregor did get on the ballot, an anti establishment vote that would bring out people who wouldnt normally care to vote

[sbgawa]

Im probably going to write this clumsily so my apologies if I dont make my point well. Vastly different versions of the IRA were part of the future of Ireland after conflicts. After the Treaty in 1921 the IRA were involved in the future, and after the Good Friday Agreement the likes of Martin McGuinness who were in IRA were part of the process moving forward.

Would that not be more of a correct parallel to Hamas instead of the comparison to Nazi Germany?

I think comparing ther IRA to the bestiality of HAMAS is very harsh on the IRA. The ira killed probably 1500 people over 30 odd years HAMAS raped and killed roughly the same amount virtusly all civilians in a single day. Connolly is just wrong and the fact that her own "backers" didnt endorse her views says it all.
How long before she drops a clanger if she was elected??

[Nesta99]

I deleted a mate of mine that Id known since we were kids off social media around St Patricks day when McGregor was at the White House. Cant remember what exactly sparked the conversation between us but what he said to me was that " I think both McGregor and Trump are horrible cnuts and are criminals, but at least they are getting rid of woke so I'd vote for either of them given the chance."

I wonder how much of that sort of crap would there be if McGregor did get on the ballot, an anti establishment vote that would bring out people who wouldnt normally care to vote

I was thinking about that possibility myself, that people would vote for him as protest vote. Many people I know who voted for Brexit said there were p1ssed with the government of the day and just voted against the establishment, and now moan that they didnt realise that a lot of others were doing the same. I was probably over estimating this but I am getting an impression that there were too many that could have voted in a similar pattern. It was similar in the GE before last when a lot of people gave preferences to SF that they wouldnt usually. So there is a disillusionment that could have fueled support. I find myself more and more feeling like I am voting for least worst candidates rather than what I would consider good candidates, inluding UK elections also. The last 2 presedential elections are arguably the last 2 that I was fine with, voting for what I thought was a strong candidate.

[sbgawa]

Keeping populist nutters out of the race is important. In the dumbed down social media world we live in if micky D had run against the winner of strictly come dancing he would probably lose. I think the current bar is ok as you need to get serious people to nominate you. But id probably put in another bar against people with criminal records.
The dumbing down of politics with the likes of Trump , Farage, boris johnson etc getting elected should make us all worried.

[pineapple stu]

Who decides what views are populist and shouldn't be allowed though?

[Nesta99]

The people by giving their proxy to those they'd already elected? Maybe parts of the system that elects to the Seanad like NUI/TCD/+TUs. Convene citizen's assemblies in the year before. Allow public nominations to each council which secures x amount of the vote? There are certainly simple enough ways to change things up a bit but currently the 1st point on giving proxy votes by virtue that we have already elected these people that we are able to trust to represent us totally. Ban people with criminal backgrounds, and allow free voting (anonymous?) for parlimentarians.

We should have a referendum on the same day as the election to change the rules to open up the ballot and annoy those that missed out!

[pineapple stu]

The people by giving their proxy to those they'd already elected?
You could argue that the elections offer a very narrow range of views you can vote on.

FF/FG are practically the same thing these days, and their popularity has probably never been lower. The political climate has never been more fragmented with increased number of random independents suggesting a growing frustration at FF/FG, yet no-one seems able or willing to come in and take over from them.

[samhaydenjr]

I reckon McGregor knew full well that he had no chance of being nominated, and only put his name forward so that he could pull the trick of complaining about how "They" blocked him. He was talking about "standing up to the government" like he had no understanding of the actual role, or believed his supporters had no of it.

[John83]

FF/FG are practically the same thing these days, and their popularity has probably never been lower. The political climate has never been more fragmented with increased number of random independents suggesting a growing frustration at FF/FG, yet no-one seems able or willing to come in and take over from them.
That's on the people in opposition. It's not good enough to offer change because the incumbants are sluggish. Governments around the world have ruined their own countries for the purposes of personal enrichment, ideology, or just plain old incompetence. If you can't even form a credible political party, why is anyone to trust you with a whole country?

[Neish]

Completely forgot about the TV debate last night, from what I heard Connolly seemed to come off the best from it

[culloty82]

Connolly's FPV will be intriguing, given this'll be the first time the opposition will have united over an election campaign, so the parties will know (a) what the collective benchmark could be in each constituency for the next GE, and (b) how many candidates will accordingly be viable per party in each area.

[joey B]

And then there was 2! Id say Jim Gavin would give back one of his All Ireland's just for the chance to go back and not enter this election!

[CraftyToePoke]

The auld rough & tumble isn't for everyone, renters though on the other hand would be more used to it. Ironically.

Not a great day for Meholes hand picking credentials either.

[Razors left peg]

I did find it a nice change to see someone step aside for something relatively minor compared to what our great leader in the US gets away with on daily basis. A nice sign that Ireland isn't ready to accept what could have been if McGregor got involved

[pineapple stu]

To be honest, the idea that Gavin has stepped aside over this - a €3k matter from 15 years ago that to be honest the tenant can't have exhausted their options over either - is a triumph of muck-raking over real politics, which can only be damaging for the country.

I'd no intention of voting for him - but really the bigger focus where FF are involved should be the party's overall position as the party of the lecherous landlord and the obsession with property prices, despite the obvious detriment this has caused the next generation. But not this. Deal with the matter (with penalties for late payment if required), get a sense of perspective and move on

[CraftyToePoke]

What a mess, the ballot papers are gone to the printers, so he'll be on the ballot regardless and we now have people asking if people still vote for him, are their second and third preferences still valid ? Or are they spoiled votes ? And if he were to ( unlikely ) win on second preferences or vote transfers, we'd have a constitutional conundrum. Surely the fix has to be to somehow, however inconvenient, reprint the paperwork here, but so far, computer says no.


To be honest, the idea that Gavin has stepped aside over this - a €3k matter from 15 years ago that to be honest the tenant can't have exhausted their options over either - is a triumph of muck-raking over real politics, which can only be damaging for the country.

I'd no intention of voting for him - but really the bigger focus where FF are involved should be the party's overall position as the party of the lecherous landlord and the obsession with property prices, despite the obvious detriment this has caused the next generation. But not this. Deal with the matter (with penalties for late payment if required), get a sense of perspective and move on

I am surprised at you on this, thought you'd be more law and order above all. In terms of options exhausted it seems like Gavin is the one who exhausted all his, avoiding the person and his debt to him, rather than vice versa, all the way & as far as he could push it & then bent the truth on national airwaves for a finale.

[pineapple stu]

I am surprised at you on this, thought you'd be more law and order above all.
Fair - but let's be honest, if this case went to court, it'd be thrown out immediately for being way beyond any statute of limitations. Gavin isn't required to have kept any documentation which could clear his name (accounting info has to be kept at least six full years plus the current one, unless there's an active legal case), and if he can't clear his name, then it's not a fair case.

That said, while the case against Gavin can't be proven in court, I do think it happened for the reasons you say. The "We all partied" tone of his denial is ******. The other option is that he genuinely didn't have a clue about the guy of course, and just confessed up rather than deny it and be shown to be wrong. Bit like an alco apologising for something they fear may have happened the other night, even though they've no recollection of it.

But equally I despise stories which have a clear one-sided bias, and this one does. This case seems to be because a rent Standing Order went through twice when it should have been cancelled. If I was the tenant, I'd have been straight into the bank the first instance it happened asking them to reverse the transaction. Like, was it cancelled or not? Then there's other options if Gavin didn't reply - the Residential Tenancies Board, the Small Claims Court (maybe the amount is too high though - or go after one month's payment at least), or there's the media. Like, if you're going to say "The Pres owes me money" as has happened now, why not - 16 years ago - say "The Dublin GAA manager owes me money?" Equally newsworthy.

So based on the facts as outlined so far, my view is if it wasn't worth resolving in the last 16 years, then you don't get to raise it now. And I don't think it's a matter that requires Gavin to stand down.

[Razors left peg]

Whats the back story to this? Has the tenant being sitting in the wings waiting for the day that Gavin ran for public office to bring this out? It is all a bit weird

[SkStu]

But equally I despise stories which have a clear one-sided bias, and this one does. This case seems to be because a rent Standing Order went through twice when it should have been cancelled. If I was the tenant, I'd have been straight into the bank the first instance it happened asking them to reverse the transaction. Like, was it cancelled or not?

Exactly the first question that came to my mind when the story broke...bank should be on the hook if they didnt follow the customers request. Gavin not making him whole is shady as fook but he could have poker faced it. Better PR firm and maybe he would have. Agree with Razor too... it is all a bit weird.

[CraftyToePoke]

Whats the back story to this? Has the tenant being sitting in the wings waiting for the day that Gavin ran for public office to bring this out? It is all a bit weird

He'd been walked on by Gavin & probably wrote it off grudgingly & then the guy who dumped all over him was suddenly very publicly vulnerable, probably didn't expect the opportunity to come with such high profile attached but he didn't Adam Idah the chance, he absolutely Haalanded the bejaysus out of it didn't he. Emphasis on grudgingly there obviously ;)

Its not about the money, well it is, but with interest at this stage, a high rate too.

[pineapple stu]

Whats the back story to this? Has the tenant being sitting in the wings waiting for the day that Gavin ran for public office to bring this out? It is all a bit weird
Is the Dublin GAA manager not a public enough office though?

[CraftyToePoke]

Like, if you're going to say "The Pres owes me money" as has happened now, why not - 16 years ago - say "The Dublin GAA manager owes me money?" Equally newsworthy.

Newsworthy, yes. Not equally newsworthy IMO & nowhere near the same amount of damage infliction available. He wouldn't have lost the Dubs job over it, I would wager.

There is a pile on today, and interestingly some FFers piling on, on RTÉ Radio too. About the process, its limited scope, duration & consultation. About front benchers who'd never met Gavin being told they were doing promo shoots with him tomorrow. Its all coming out.

It also has just enough of that whiff of that old FF nepotism to put the wind up them properly. And Micheál so close to it does not help at all in that regard. He is a child of that era FF after all. He needed to be much more careful. I wonder how much fallout will various agendas try to see land on him too ?

We can argue all week here, the law, the expiration of certain rights over time, the opportunistic timing of the tennant, it all has merit.

None of it happens if Gavin had his house in order & he didn't & that's that. You owe, you should pay. You should see to it particularly, if you're a public figure that you don't leave people unmarked from corners like he did. That's on him & he knows that now.

[SkStu]

He'd been walked on by Gavin & probably wrote it off grudgingly & then the guy who dumped all over him was suddenly very publicly vulnerable, probably didn't expect the opportunity to come with such high profile attached but he didn't Adam Idah the chance, he absolutely Haalanded the bejaysus out of it didn't he. Emphasis on grudgingly there obviously ;)

Its not about the money, well it is, but with interest at this stage, a high rate too.

while Gavin was playing the long ball, this lad was playing the long game.

[Razors left peg]

I dunno, reading between the lines this seems like it could be a bit of tip of the iceberg thing, did he step aside before the real sh1t comes out? I said earlier that its kinda nice that Ireland still has this bit of "morality" when it comes to the elections, but thinking about it more I cant see how this could be a big enough scandal in itself to rule him out of the race. Agree with Stu that any PR firm worth its salt could have just brushed this aside and moved on.

[pineapple stu]

Newsworthy, yes. Not equally newsworthy IMO & nowhere near the same amount of damage infliction available. He wouldn't have lost the Dubs job over it, I would wager.
Losing his job isn't the name of the game here though. Getting paid is the aim. It mightn't be equally newsworthy, but it would still be newsworthy enough I'd say.

And the tenant had plenty of other chances in the past 16 years to pursue a claim.

I completely agree none of this happens if Gavin has his house in order. I disagree that it's worth stepping down from the Presidency race over. And I don't think muck-raking from 16 years ago is really all that beneficial in the greater scheme of things.