Weekend Thursday 23rd to Saturday 25th

[sbgawa]

Premier Division

Thursday 23rd 19:45

Waterford v Drogheda

Friday 24th

Galway v Dundalk 19:45
Bohemians v St Pats 19:45
Derry v Sligo 19:45
Shamrock Rovers v Shelbourne 20:00

First Division

Friday 24th (All 19:45)

Wexford v Bray
Kerry v Finn Harps
Cork v Treaty
Athlone v UCD

Saturday 25th

Longford v Cobh 19:30

[sbgawa]

So TV Thursday and Waterford and Drogs get to kick off the weekend, hopefully with a few goals and a decent audience live and on TV.
Can Stephen Kenny make it 3 losses in a row and contimnue his Ireland manger form and luck or will Bohs do the right thing and let him have a first one (it would be the socilist thing to do to be fair).
Rovers with a win over Shels can drag ourselves back into being within a win of top spot and its vital imo. With Europe coming we have to be top and a bit of a leed at that.
Duff will be up for this big time and knows he could strike a potentially fatel blow with a win to go nine points clear.....hopefully our supporters will deign to show up , Mondays crowd of 4041 versus Derry was dissapointing

Atlone v UCD the pick of the matches in division 1, UCD need to be winning these types of matches if theyh are going to challengeCork although even that looks like a lost cause with them 10 clear already

[wonder88]

Good to see Thursday night games back. UCD and Dundalk used to play at this time for a good few seasons, worth a try again perhaps.

[Nesta99]

Reasons Dundalk used to play Thursdays was that the Lilywhite Lounge would have had an extra night busy use eg 21st birthday parties on a Friday, Saturday, regular Sunday crowd and then a match night also which added up to significant income over a season, mostly PT those days. Fridays were also regular nights at Dundalk Stadium, dogs, horses or both. Little GAA on a Thursday bar training maybe. It did occasionally mean a lazy Friday morning at work. Mostly during the old winter season so under the floodlights which I always loved, I was regularly there in the old school uniform so going back a while, Not sure exactly which season became a regular Friday but I think it was a league wide decision with Sligo opting for Saturday evenings after the switch to Summer footy. Thursdays did impact on away crowds but not sure if it was that much tbh on balance with key fixtures sometimes moved to Sunday afternoons. While it'd be novel to be at a game on crisp Thursday night again there are enough midweek games to fill the gap. At the time other slots other than Thursdays saw lower gates, and now I think slots other than Fridays see a fall off in gates, exceptions being say family days v UCD for example...well you wouldnt have a family day in Oriel for a top of table clash with Rovers, Bohs, or even a relegation v Drogs these days.

[sbgawa]

So much for the new manager bounce in Pats. Not even a dead cat bounce at that.. you'd have to think kelliher will bail Kenny out in july anyway in terms of building a squad for a title tilt in 2025. Certainly under no pressure from the owner but another loss to bohs and some of the shine will be going off the appointment

[holidaysong]

Reasons Dundalk used to play Thursdays was that the Lilywhite Lounge would have had an extra night busy use eg 21st birthday parties on a Friday, Saturday, regular Sunday crowd and then a match night also which added up to significant income over a season, mostly PT those days. Fridays were also regular nights at Dundalk Stadium, dogs, horses or both. Little GAA on a Thursday bar training maybe. It did occasionally mean a lazy Friday morning at work. Mostly during the old winter season so under the floodlights which I always loved, I was regularly there in the old school uniform so going back a while, Not sure exactly which season became a regular Friday but I think it was a league wide decision with Sligo opting for Saturday evenings after the switch to Summer footy. Thursdays did impact on away crowds but not sure if it was that much tbh on balance with key fixtures sometimes moved to Sunday afternoons. While it'd be novel to be at a game on crisp Thursday night again there are enough midweek games to fill the gap. At the time other slots other than Thursdays saw lower gates, and now I think slots other than Fridays see a fall off in gates, exceptions being say family days v UCD for example...well you wouldnt have a family day in Oriel for a top of table clash with Rovers, Bohs, or even a relegation v Drogs these days.

We switched to Friday at the start of the 2009 season after getting promoted. I recall at the time that the FAI had put pressure on for us to change.

[TonyD]

So much for the new manager bounce in Pats. Not even a dead cat bounce at that.. you'd have to think kelliher will bail Kenny out in july anyway in terms of building a squad for a title tilt in 2025. Certainly under no pressure from the owner but another loss to bohs and some of the shine will be going off the appointment

Two difficult games for him in fairness, with little time to prepare. Way too soon to be making any judgments on SK. We did ok in parts of both games, but obviously big improvements needed. Ironically we were very good out in Tallaght in the first game post Jon Daly, and I think the same team should have been kept. Aaron Bolger in particular can feel hard done by not to keep his place. I think we need him and Lennon in the middle for some solidity.

[Another Bohemia]

Two difficult games for him in fairness, with little time to prepare. Way too soon to be making any judgments on SK. We did ok in parts of both games, but obviously big improvements needed. Ironically we were very good out in Tallaght in the first game post Jon Daly, and I think the same team should have been kept. Aaron Bolger in particular can feel hard done by not to keep his place. I think we need him and Lennon in the middle for some solidity.

I think you're going to see a lot of chopping and changing in the next few weeks as Kenny tries to figure out the squad and his long term plans. Reynolds is doing/has done the same for Bohs recently and I fully expect to see a few players out the door for Bohs come July. It's one of those things that us fans will have opinions on players based on the games played so far but the change in tactics, role, responsibility, fitness requirement etc will mean some players who played well may not be a fit moving forward or Kenny already has Bolger in his plans and wants to see what's behind him for depth. I think it's an important part of the process but really messes with results early on.

[D24Saint]

Two difficult games for him in fairness, with little time to prepare. Way too soon to be making any judgments on SK. We did ok in parts of both games, but obviously big improvements needed. Ironically we were very good out in Tallaght in the first game post Jon Daly, and I think the same team should have been kept. Aaron Bolger in particular can feel hard done by not to keep his place. I think we need him and Lennon in the middle for some solidity.

There should no judgement on SK until next season imo. He has inherited a badly balanced cobbled together squad. Hopefully he can shift a few out and get some in during the window. Its looking like there could be no European football next season which would be a big blow. The priority for us is a decent right back and a striker. The right back position has been a disaster this year as we have one that's made of glass and two that aren't up to standard.

[Nesta99]

We switched to Friday at the start of the 2009 season after getting promoted. I recall at the time that the FAI had put pressure on for us to change.

As late as 2009?! I really have blocked out a good chunk of 1st Division days rather than joking about it!!

[JC_GUFC]

I think you're going to see a lot of chopping and changing in the next few weeks as Kenny tries to figure out the squad and his long term plans. Reynolds is doing/has done the same for Bohs recently and I fully expect to see a few players out the door for Bohs come July. It's one of those things that us fans will have opinions on players based on the games played so far but the change in tactics, role, responsibility, fitness requirement etc will mean some players who played well may not be a fit moving forward or Kenny already has Bolger in his plans and wants to see what's behind him for depth. I think it's an important part of the process but really messes with results early on.

One problem with the "multi-year contracts" is what happens when you can't find a suitor for one of the lads you expect to be out the door?

You can't just stop paying lads (which would have been the tactic 30 years ago), so need to find a solution that works for both, otherwise they're just being paid for not even sitting on the bench!

[pineapple stu]

There should no judgement on SK until next season imo. He has inherited a badly balanced cobbled together squad. Hopefully he can shift a few out and get some in during the window.
This seems a common view among Pat's fans, and I've no real reason to doubt it. But how did it come about in the first place? Is part of Mathews' role not player recruitment (or am I mixing his role with Fenlon's at Bohs)?

Probably Kenny has a better eye for a player than most in the LoI - I think he's shown that down the years - but as ever when a manager gets sacked, you have to wonder if it was solely the manager's fault or if there's some wider issues too.

[Another Bohemia]

One problem with the "multi-year contracts" is what happens when you can't find a suitor for one of the lads you expect to be out the door?

You can't just stop paying lads (which would have been the tactic 30 years ago), so need to find a solution that works for both, otherwise they're just being paid for not even sitting on the bench!

Absolutely. It's a double edged sword. I know Bohs have used the optional years clause to mitigate that in some deal but there are always going to be players who want concrete deals for x number of years. You can't blame them for that either as football is a job after all and you don't know what contract is going to be your last.

[Another Bohemia]

This seems a common view among Pat's fans, and I've no real reason to doubt it. But how did it come about in the first place? Is part of Mathews' role not player recruitment (or am I mixing his role with Fenlon's at Bohs)?

Probably Kenny has a better eye for a player than most in the LoI - I think he's shown that down the years - but as ever when a manager gets sacked, you have to wonder if it was solely the manager's fault or if there's some wider issues too.

They also have Ger O'Brien as a director of football. I'd imagine signings were a bit of a committee between Matthews, O'Brien and Daly. Whether SK will want it to be different is still to be seen.

Fenlon certainly has a hand in recruitment at Bohs but from what I've heard he's not the be all and end all. The manager also has a say in who comes and goes. The hope for Bohs is that since Reynolds and Fenlon have worked in this dynamic before they can settle in quickly and sign from the same hymn sheet which would be in stark contrast to how Devine and Fenlon worked.

[pineapple stu]

Fenlon certainly has a hand in recruitment at Bohs but from what I've heard he's not the be all and end all. The manager also has a say in who comes and goes.
Yeah, Fenlon (or O'Brien if he's DoF at Pat's as you say) wouldn't be the be all and end all - but I guess the idea in theory is two or three heads should be better than one and should allow you double-check a potential signing and not end up with the criticisms that seem to be aimed at the current Pat's squad.

But evidently that's not happened, for whatever reason.

[2 Year Contract]

This seems a common view among Pat's fans, and I've no real reason to doubt it. But how did it come about in the first place? Is part of Mathews' role not player recruitment (or am I mixing his role with Fenlon's at Bohs)?

Probably Kenny has a better eye for a player than most in the LoI - I think he's shown that down the years - but as ever when a manager gets sacked, you have to wonder if it was solely the manager's fault or if there's some wider issues too.

No Matthews isn’t involved in identifying players for recruitment. Right back in particular has been the main pain point in Daly’s recruitment. He signed 3 for this season, McLaughlin (crocked and can barely play more than 2 games without getting injured), Freeman (also had injury problems but to be honest he’d probably help the side by being injured more often, hopeless footballer who I have no idea how he played so many games at SPL level) and Sjöberg (probably the best of the 3 but the most crocked of all, can barely finish a game without coming off injured since he signed last year).

All of this while there hasn’t been a second choice natural left back for the last few years. Luck has meant Breslin has been virtually every present up to now but that seems to have now run out with him having to go off at half time on Monday and may be out for Friday now.

The amount of players that have either started at RB/RWB or moved there during games this season is truly mental. You’ve McLaughlin, Sjöberg, Freeman, Bolger, Lennon, Turner, Redmond, as well as Deans and Pettifer in LSC games. Absolutely mad stuff that is massively hampering the team not just defensively but also none of those names have much threat going forward so it’s been easy for teams to nullify a threat from that side. Night and day stuff really from the levels Sam Curtis was showing last season

[Another Bohemia]

Yeah, Fenlon (or O'Brien if he's DoF at Pat's as you say) wouldn't be the be all and end all - but I guess the idea in theory is two or three heads should be better than one and should allow you double-check a potential signing and not end up with the criticisms that seem to be aimed at the current Pat's squad.

But evidently that's not happened, for whatever reason.

Just for clarity it's not me saying it :D it's mentioned here in the article announcing Stephen Elliot as head of academy

https://m.independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/ex-ireland-striker-stephen-elliott-appointed-as-head-of-academy-at-st-patricks-athletic/a991540254.html

Weirdly I couldn't find an article announcing his promotion to that position but It could just be an oversight.

[pineapple stu]

Ah I'll trust you're not just making random stuff up!

[TonyD]

They also have Ger O'Brien as a director of football. I'd imagine signings were a bit of a committee between Matthews, O'Brien and Daly. Whether SK will want it to be different is still to be seen.

Fenlon certainly has a hand in recruitment at Bohs but from what I've heard he's not the be all and end all. The manager also has a say in who comes and goes. The hope for Bohs is that since Reynolds and Fenlon have worked in this dynamic before they can settle in quickly and sign from the same hymn sheet which would be in stark contrast to how Devine and Fenlon worked.

Get O’Brien was head of the Academy until recently when Stephen Elliot came in, so I doubt he had a hand in player recruitment. I’d take an old fashioned view there. A manager has to be given a completely free hand to identify and bring in the players he wants. Then he lives and dies by those choices. On paper Joh Daly seemed to have signed pretty well in the off season, but it just shows you never can tell. Agree about the right back. Sjoberg looks good, but can’t stay injury free. Similar with McLaughlin, and Freeman just looks like a poor signing.

[D24Saint]

This seems a common view among Pat's fans, and I've no real reason to doubt it. But how did it come about in the first place? Is part of Mathews' role not player recruitment (or am I mixing his role with Fenlon's at Bohs)?

Probably Kenny has a better eye for a player than most in the LoI - I think he's shown that down the years - but as ever when a manager gets sacked, you have to wonder if it was solely the manager's fault or if there's some wider issues too.

AFAIK even if it was others jobs to bring recommendations to the previous head coach he had the right to ignore suggestions and did. He had the right to sign who he liked.

[oriel]

There should no judgement on SK until next season imo. He has inherited a badly balanced cobbled together squad. Hopefully he can shift a few out and get some in during the window. Its looking like there could be no European football next season which would be a big blow. The priority for us is a decent right back and a striker. The right back position has been a disaster this year as we have one that's made of glass and two that aren't up to standard.

Really? Why is that, give him a free ride for the rest of the season, even he wouldn't accept that. He inherited the guts of a 2 in a row FAI cup winning squad, yes the 7 losses before was not of his doing, but if he loses v Bohs that will be one of the first times he has lost 3 in a row in the league. Thinking back to his last win actually with Ireland, not sure who that was against, possibly Gibraltar.

5.5 years contract though, that was some negotiating on his behalf, he'll be 58 when that's up, sorted financially either way.

[Glen Of Aherlow]

Really? Why is that, give him a free ride for the rest of the season, even he wouldn't accept that. He inherited the guts of a 2 in a row FAI cup winning squad, yes the 7 losses before was not of his doing, but if he loses v Bohs that will be one of the first times he has lost 3 in a row in the league. Thinking back to his last win actually with Ireland, not sure who that was against, possibly Gibraltar.

5.5 years contract though, that was some negotiating on his behalf, he'll be 58 when that's up, sorted financially either way.

1. It was'nt two in a row.
2. 7 of the players who featured in last years cup final have left the club , all of whom the club would have wanted to keep if it was possible.

[oriel]

1/ I stand corrected, forgot about Derry winning cup in 2022

2/ Still think the current Pats squad start of season was strong enough to have made last euro spot.

[Another Bohemia]

1/ I stand corrected, forgot about Derry winning cup in 2022

2/ Still think the current Pats squad start of season was strong enough to have made last euro spot.

On #2 squad turnover is a disaster for predictability. It's why Rovers are consistent year to year, they retain many more than they lose and can bring in 1 or 2 players to try to improve. Shels as well have been good in that regard. They added a couple this off season but outside JR Wilson and Brian McManus I can't think of who they lost. Pat's losing 7 starters is a big challenge especially someone like Mark Doyle who had a frustrating habit of piping up with crucial goals.

[pineapple stu]

Shels as well have been good in that regard. They added a couple this off season but outside JR Wilson and Brian McManus I can't think of who they lost.
Jack Moylan too (last year's Premier top scorer)

But yeah, turnover in the LoI is a problem for probably all clubs at one time or another. Do Pat's dip into loan market more than others? Thinking keeper in particular, and that's not gone well this year while before they had solid options (like Jaros)

[Another Bohemia]

Jack Moylan too (last year's Premier top scorer)

But yeah, turnover in the LoI is a problem for probably all clubs at one time or another. Do Pat's dip into loan market more than others? Thinking keeper in particular, and that's not gone well this year while before they had solid options (like Jaros)

Yeah you are correct. Don't know how he slipped my mind as I only listened to a podcast with him on it last week. Still significantly fewer than most clubs

[2 Year Contract]

Jack Moylan too (last year's Premier top scorer)

But yeah, turnover in the LoI is a problem for probably all clubs at one time or another. Do Pat's dip into loan market more than others? Thinking keeper in particular, and that's not gone well this year while before they had solid options (like Jaros)

Yeah the loan keepers have been a feature for Pats the last few years and largely have worked out well until this year. Anang was excellent in 2022 but left straight after Europe which is another risk with loan keepers. Jaros in 2021 was brilliant too, on the topic of him, he’s just won the league and cup double in Austria with Sturm Graz ending Red Bull Salzburg's reign of dominance and is apparently in with a shout of making the Czech squad for the Euros this summer. Pitaluga was very poor in his early season games and certainly justified being dropped, while Rogers has been a big improvement in the position since regaining the number 1 spot. I don’t think the loan keeper is something that Kenny will persue in the years going forward. For a team with ambitions of challenging at the top end of the table it’s too much of a risk year on year to be taking with such an important position

[RealJohn91]

He had a poor game against Bohs the other day but the likes of Pat's and Rovers should be breaking the bank trying to get McGinty in after his loan ends.

[RealJohn91]

Clarke, Flores, Matheson and Rooney all out for Bohs tomorrow night apparently. Kenny should be getting his first win.

[joey B]

Bad goal for Waterford to concede,1 straight ball from the keeper done them…

[Nesta99]

I ws about to sing the praises of Waterford, how they look to have composure and ability that they could be higher up the table and then they implode with a route 1 ball and defenders asleep or banking on an offside flag. So hence the defensive frailties that Bohs fans would suggest was an issue with Long coached sides still pops up. Waterford look like they can score but the tight pitch suits Drogheda, 1st goal is very defendable.

Total aside, as a Dundalk fan and you know you are losing your main striker whose strength is holding up the ball, bringing midfielders in to attack, and sheer physical presence bothers teams, Pierrot would probably be a more cost effective recruit than paying a fee for Gullan (may yet be worth it as he is improving, better a wide player in a front 3 though). Even with the rumoured budget issues at Dundalk Pierrot was in our scope. Hatstands are at a premum in the league and he was one that a good few could have found useful.

[2 Year Contract]

Lovely finish by Bawa for Drogheda around 20 seconds into the second half

[joey B]

Fantastic finish that ….

[joey B]

13 minute hat trick from Padraig Amond! Bad collapse from Drogheda though…

[2 Year Contract]

4-2 now, some horrendously bad pieces of defending from Drogheda contributing to this collapse

[Another Bohemia]

Terrible defending for all 6 goals tonight

[Nesta99]

Bad collapse from Drogheda though…

There is no such thing!

[TonyD]

Yeah the loan keepers have been a feature for Pats the last few years and largely have worked out well until this year. Anang was excellent in 2022 but left straight after Europe which is another risk with loan keepers. Jaros in 2021 was brilliant too, on the topic of him, he’s just won the league and cup double in Austria with Sturm Graz ending Red Bull Salzburg's reign of dominance and is apparently in with a shout of making the Czech squad for the Euros this summer. Pitaluga was very poor in his early season games and certainly justified being dropped, while Rogers has been a big improvement in the position since regaining the number 1 spot. I don’t think the loan keeper is something that Kenny will persue in the years going forward. For a team with ambitions of challenging at the top end of the table it’s too much of a risk year on year to be taking with such an important position

Danny Rogers is not on loan as far as I know. Maybe not a world beater, but a solid enough keeper. Pats did lose some players who tuned out o perhaps be more important than they seemed at the time. Obviously Lyness, Sam Curtis and Adam Murphy were going to be big losses, but Conor Carty, Lonergan and Particularly Mark Doyle are proving to be losses as well. Mark Doyle was unappreciated by many, me very much included, but he did have a happy knack of getting important goals. Of those we’ve brought in, Aaron Bolger has been good, Brandon Kavanagh ok, Ruairi Keating has been a disappointment you’d have to say, although in fairness he probabl6 needs more support up f4ont with him. Ciann Kavanagh hasn’t seen many minutes, and hasn’t done much when he has got on. Same for the Palmer lad. Freeman just doesn’t look up to it.

[Knocklyonhoop]

Massive game in Tallaght tomorrow.

a Shels win and I’m not sure Rover’s can claw back a 9 point deficit even with nearly half a season left. Would want to be winning almost every week but that’s a big turnaround from season to date, even accounting for injuries

[2 Year Contract]

Danny Rogers is not on loan as far as I know.

I know he’s not, sure he’s here nearly 2 years now. I was more so mentioning the improvement in goalkeeping since he returned to the team compared to how shaky and error prone Pitaluga was early in the season. As you say Rogers isn’t a world beater but he’s steady enough and doesn’t worry me week to week like other keepers have in the past for us

[ger121]

Massive game in Tallaght tomorrow.

a Shels win and I’m not sure Rover’s can claw back a 9 point deficit even with nearly half a season left. Would want to be winning almost every week but that’s a big turnaround from season to date, even accounting for injuries

But, if you win….

[Nesta99]

Massive game in Tallaght tomorrow.

a Shels win and I’m not sure Rover’s can claw back a 9 point deficit even with nearly half a season left. Would want to be winning almost every week but that’s a big turnaround from season to date, even accounting for injuries

Its a must not lose game for Shels more than Rovers, and they probably have to win as theyll need the buffer for European football for when Rovers drop out of CL QR1(?), 9 points is certainly chasable with other on a 2 or 3 game a week schedule + travel.

[Dermobohs]

Big win for Waterford, up to fourth now.

[placid casual]

Its a must not lose game for Shels more than Rovers, and they probably have to win as theyll need the buffer for European football for when Rovers drop out of CL QR1(?), 9 points is certainly chasable with other on a 2 or 3 game a week schedule + travel.
Shels will most likely be out of Europe after one game,with Rovers out after the two minimum games.
Rovers should win tomorrow as they have the better players,but duff has made Shels a tough nut to crack. I can't see shels having an inferiority complex over Rovers like derry clearly have,so a draw could be the most likely outcome.

[Dermobohs]

Would agree, this has draw all over it.
Think pats may beat bohs, we have just too many key players out atm.

[TonyD]

Would agree, this has draw all over it.
Think pats may beat bohs, we have just too many key players out atm.

I’m probably being stupidly optimistic, but I also think we might win this one. We certainly need to start picking up some wins sooner rather than later. Nine defeats already in the season is horrendous, and only five wins. What worries me is that we look pretty toothless in attack most of the time. I’d play both Melia and Kavanagh, and bring back Bolger in midfield for either Forrestor or Leavy. Not sure what’s wrong with Chris this season, but he’s been off the boil. Leavy is very talented and works his socks off, but tends to run into blind alleys and doesn’t release the ball quickly enough at times

[Straightstory]

Big win for Waterford, up to fourth now.
Deja-vu for Drogheda winger Bawa. Scored against Galway, then fluffed a great chance to make it 3-1. Scored against Waterford, then fluffed a great chance to make it 3-0. Selfishness played a part in both incidents. Two defeats when really it should have been two wins. Drogs in big trouble now. I expect a bounce from Dundalk after Daly appointment.

[bohsmug]

Would agree, this has draw all over it.
Think pats may beat bohs, we have just too many key players out atm.

Yeah, the match preview was a painful read. Most likely a Pat's win tonight. If Bohs come out of it with a draw I'll be happy.

[osarusan]

Cork 1 up on Treaty early on from a penalty.

It seemed harsh to me - a Treaty player facing his own goal tried to hook away a Cork cross over his shoulder but it came off his arm. Maybe that's the law these days though.

[Nesta99]

May have another keeper clanger candidate from ED Park. Ominous for the bottom 2 as things stand and especially of St Pats go ahead too.....and there we go:rolleyes: