UEFSA Coefficients Thread

[pineapple stu]

There's a few countries there in the mid 20's who could be set to take a fair coefficient hit over the next few years.
On the Bert Kassies site, you can see current standings for as far ahead as 2009 (http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method3/crank2009.html), which only count this year and last year. We're currently 30th, though a couple of countries (Denmark, Poland, Switzerland, Bulgaria, etc.) have yet to play any games this year, though of course, we're not finished ourselves yet either. It's about as good a way as you have of looking into the future. In 2008, we're 38th, so once we get the three poor years out of the way (and assuming we continue to have the same success), we should start moving up a nice bit.

[eirebhoy]

On the Bert Kassies site, you can see current standings for as far ahead as 2009 (http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method3/crank2009.html), which only count this year and last year. We're currently 30th, though a couple of countries (Denmark, Poland, Switzerland, Bulgaria, etc.) have yet to play any games this year, though of course, we're not finished ourselves yet either. It's about as good a way as you have of looking into the future. In 2008, we're 38th, so once we get the three poor years out of the way (and assuming we continue to have the same success), we should start moving up a nice bit.
Whats interesting is if the country seedings on Bert's site went to 2010 we'd be 1st. :)

http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method3/ccoef2006.html

[swinfordfc]

Well done shels last wednesday now its cork and longford turn next week and hopefully shels can get another win too that be class :D

[Slash/ED]

Well, still unbeaten and another draw to the co-efficent with Cork and Longford hopefully adding to it tomorrow. We have now offically beaten last years effort co-efficent wise, we'll hopefully have topped the 2000/2001 with minimum five more games to come by tomorrow.

[pete]

I can't speak for any other club but i think that assuming City make next round i think we are good for some more points no matter who we draw. Even when we couldn't get results away from home we usually get something from home games.

[Slash/ED]

There is nobody in that draw Cork should fear, they should be looking at the first round proper. So hopefully alot more points to come.

[gspain]

Shels draw last night has moved us up ahead of Belarus in the ranking.

This is a key move as our champions are now in line to be seeded in next season's champions league again. This would depend on no team below them having a club coefficient.

However it is still very very tight. Both Belarus clubs have home games tonight against teams they've beaten away so Cork and Longford must at least match those results.

Note if Shels were to win the league they would most likely be seeded thanks to their club coefficient.

[swinfordfc]

Shels draw last night has moved us up ahead of Belarus in the ranking.

This is a key move as our champions are now in line to be seeded in next season's champions league again. This would depend on no team below them having a club coefficient.

However it is still very very tight. Both Belarus clubs have home games tonight against teams they've beaten away so Cork and Longford must at least match those results.

Note if Shels were to win the league they would most likely be seeded thanks to their club coefficient.

Yes just ahead of Belarus but now its up to Cork and Longford tonight to get 2 wins and push up to the Iceland and pass these to. then in the next round, then who knows!!!! Shels did ok last night and hopefully they might do something in the away leg - well at least they wont lose like ******!!!!

[gspain]

Good news as such

MTZ RIPO (BLS) 1 Ferencvaros 2.

Belarus side through but defeat means no coefficient points albeit chance in the next round.

[gspain]

BATE are 3-0 up in the first half so safe to say a win and a defeat tonight for Belarus. 2 teams left in europe.

Now come on Cork and Longford. We n eed both through and ideally a min of a draw each to ensure we remain ahead of Belarus. A couple of wins would give us nice breathing space.

I wonder do they realise in Belarus how avidly fans on the other side of Europe are watching a game between BATE and Torpedo Kutasi.

[gspain]

BATE now 5 up in the first half.

[eirebhoy]

for those that don't want to go googling or looking on the UEFA site to see the names of the teams for each country, this livescore site has the country name in brackets:
http://www.soccerstand.com/

[gspain]

Good one actually I'm using

http://www.footienews.com/uefacupresults.html

but your one looks bettwer for europe anyway.

[swinfordfc]

Now we back down to 40th placed again in the rankings belarus gone above us again :o

[pineapple stu]

Updated (http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method3/crank2006.html) after tonight's games. We're still in 40th with only Cork left. Belarus have two teams left, so it looks like 40th place next year.

Think this means if Cork or Derry win the league, they'll be unseeded in the CL, which would be a blow, but not exactly insurmountable. The UEFA Cup will be touch and go. However, if we can get another 1.5 next year, we'll be up to about 5.000 (assuming Cork get no points this year), and then be seeded in both competitions which would be a massive boost. If we get seeded, there's no reason we can't keep the seeding, get more draws like the last two years (and make more of them...) and get more glamour games. Can only be good for the league. Think the next three years, we're going to move up fairly quick, to be honest.

And hey, if Cork can get a win and a draw to get through the UEFA, and then get a draw in the First Round - happy days! :)

[pete]

I think even 1 win for City this season may not be enough for CL seeding for ourselves or Derry in the 2006 CL.

However progression to the 1st round proper & even a draw there would ensure Cork City would get seeded.

Its hard to calculate though as a lot depends on whether teams with their own club ranking points win their leagues.

[A face]

Its all up to City now .... doing well makes it easier next year ..... even more incentive to win this year.

[Poor Student]

It's not a total disaster if Cork can't get seed for them or Derry in next year's CL. All the seeded sides in the 1st round are beatable by either of them if you ask me unless we have some Liverpool like situation again.

[gspain]

Despite Cork's fantastic result and performance no change in the seeding.

Belarus side MTZ-RIPO drew at home to Teplice and realistically between themselves and BATE they will pick up enough to keep ahead of us.

However the big incentive for Cork now is to get through to the first round. Any result in the first round would give Cork a club coefficient and most likely give them 5 years of seeding in either the champions league or UEFA cup.

[thejollyrodger]

Good result by Cork. We got the 1.666 that the league has been pushing for. It didnt seem that hard this year and even longford contributed something.

If we get the same points for the next 3 years we jump 10 places :eek: thats pretty impressive IMO. Then the league is just 5 places off getting a by into the second round. But it all depends on the draw, we could get very tough opposition in the second round.

I dont know if Cork can get into the next round or not. As Richardson says, their chances are only about 50/50. A couple of draws in the next round and its another 1 to CCFC co-efficent and I dont know what it would add to Ireland co-efficent..

[gspain]

Good result by Cork. We got the 1.666 that the league has been pushing for. It didnt seem that hard this year and even longford contributed something.

If we get the same points for the next 3 years we jump 10 places :eek: thats pretty impressive IMO. Then the league is just 5 places off getting a by into the second round. But it all depends on the draw, we could get very tough opposition in the second round.

I dont know if Cork can get into the next round or not. As Richardson says, their chances are only about 50/50. A couple of draws in the next round and its another 1 to CCFC co-efficent and I dont know what it would add to Ireland co-efficent..

The problem however is that we got good results this year because Shels and Longford were both seeded. Our champions won't be seeded now unless Shels somehow win the league or Cork get through another round and get a result (eg at least a draw in one leg). Being unseeded means you get a tougher draw and it is much harder to get points.

[pete]

Has anyone got the latest rankings? Berts site doesn't seem to be updated since the 6th?

[thejollyrodger]

i hate to be a realist but i cant see shels winning the league >< , there are too many problems with the club IMO. we havent been firing on all cylinders all season and i dont think we will start now.

A more realistic option is for CCFC to win the league and beat Durjgardens in Turners Cross in two weeks time. Thats still a tall order but hopefully we will all be in Europe and seeded next season.

So how much co-efficent points does CCFC have to make up so that the EL clubs are seeded next season ??

Most of the teams that are seeded in the first round of the Champions League and UEFA Cup qualifiers arent exactly world beaters anyway so it might not be that big of a loss.

[tiktok]

So how much co-efficent points does CCFC have to make up so that the EL clubs are seeded next season ??

Assuming Shels get into UEFA they will I think be seeded because of their club coefficient. Hopefully a City win in the home leg would then be sufficient to get the coefficient up to a level where the other UEFA participant (could still be CCFC) is also seeded.

The only hope now IMO of seeding in the CL is for Cork to get past Djurgarden and pick up some club points in the first round proper. If Derry win they will certainly be unseeded in the CL.

[pineapple stu]

Assuming Shels get into UEFA they will I think be seeded because of their club coefficient.
Longford were seeded in the UEFA this year, don't forget. I think the two Irish teams - even if Shels aren't one - will be borderline seeded. Possibly split like this year.

CL - we need to gain another two places or so, I think? A win for Cork in the First Round is needed realistically.

[thejollyrodger]

As you say the big thing is seeding. If we can get seeded and hold on to it, it makes a big difference in trying to pick up the points in the 1st round qualifier.

Were up to 35th in this but it doesnt take account of corks draw last night

http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method3/crank2009.html

Cork have another 1.5 co efficent points to get for seeding so they need to draw or win the next game followed by result that makes up the difference should they get into the 1st round proper.

If they could win against Djurgardens it would be fantastic. Still feet on the ground they could lose it shels style :D

[Slash/ED]

If Cork do get through you'd back them to at least pick up some kind of result in the next round, which would give them a club co-efficent and get them seeded if they win the league, wont it?

[thejollyrodger]

in a nutshell .. yes

1.5 co-effient points to get. Next round points are doubled so I really hope they make it through !! for shels benefit of course. speaking of shels .. we really have to make 2nd spot.

[bigmac]

If Cork do get through you'd back them to at least pick up some kind of result in the next round, which would give them a club co-efficent and get them seeded if they win the league, wont it?


Not if they were to draw one of the top seeds. Can you see them getting a result against Roma, Sampdoria, Everton, Middlesborough, Bolton etc? Would be good draws for getting money but bad for a chance of getting through to the group stages.

On that point btw, Does anyone else think that getting to the group stages of the UEFA cup might be a more realistic target for Irish teams than getting to the Champions League groups?



Seedings (http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/seeduc2005.html)

[Slash/ED]

Not if they were to draw one of the top seeds. Can you see them getting a result against Roma, Sampdoria, Everton, Middlesborough, Bolton etc? Would be good draws for getting money but bad for a chance of getting through to the group stages.


We got one off Lille :)

Keep in mind worst comes to worst and say they get hammered in the first leg the others could put out a reserve team in the second so they will get the co-efficent. I'd back them to get a result, not progress, but get a result.

[bigmac]

We got one off Lille :)

Keep in mind worst comes to worst and say they get hammered in the first leg the others could put out a reserve team in the second so they will get the co-efficent. I'd back them to get a result, not progress, but get a result.


Good point alright. Would be some laugh if they drew Steaua!

[thejollyrodger]

well the bigger clubs are defintely in the champions league so it may be easier to get into the UEFA Cup in theory.

But at the end of the day, teams like Rosenborg get into the CL and there is an awful lot of money to be made, plus the irish public only really watch the CL so its the place to push for which ever club wins the league. Not going for the CL and concentrating on UEFA Cup would be criminal IMO.

Getting into the UEFA Cup would be good for the league as well of course.

I reckon CCFC can get the co-efficients needed if they can make it to the next round.

[pete]

Highest Unseeded Team in CL 2005 - Rabotnicki Skopje Mac 1.484
Highest Unseeded Team in Uefa 2005 - Cork City Irl 1.375

Current eL team ranking for 2006 Ireland 1.320 + 0.055 from yesterday (1/3 of league points) = 1.375

Unlikely to give Derry ot Cork City seedingnext season but very hard to calculate as depends on teams who qualify from each country.

Only Shels will have any indiuvidual points for next season. Bohs losing theirs.

Even a draw in 1st round proper gets that individual team 1 full point which is why it guarantees seeding. I think this is why countries with same teams qualifying every season do better as have individual ranking points - Everton got hard draw this year as no ranking points of their own.

[CuanaD]

Good point alright. Would be some laugh if they drew Steaua!
:D would be a better laugh if they could then BEAT Steaua :cool: :eek:

thats what you would call having the last laugh

[swinfordfc]

Isn't ireland coeff for this year now at 1.66667 ? at the moment?

[Slash/ED]

Isn't ireland coeff for this year now at 1.66667 ? at the moment?

It is, yeah.

[swinfordfc]

So lets hope for a Cork win in two weeks time and we have a coeff of 2 our best ever :D

[thejollyrodger]

:D would be a better laugh if they could then BEAT Steaua :cool: :eek:

thats what you would call having the last laugh

That would be fantastic IMO. I hope Shels supporters would attend and make a demostration against a facist club.


1.66667 + 0.33333333333333333333333333333333 =2.0000033333333333333333333333333

wow, a co-efficent of TWO !! I havent seen that EVER :eek:

[OneRedArmy]

I hope Shels supporters would attend and make a demostration against a facist club.
On the basis that it takes one to know one? :confused:

I'd have thought you'd be showing solidarity.....

[thejollyrodger]

Im on about Steaua, maybe you didnt watch the Shels Steaua game but the amount of monkey chants heard was riduclous. Plus the facist poster seen in other games was another disgrace. I would love to see CCFC put them out of the UEFA Cup.

[CuanaD]

Has anyone got the latest rankings? Berts site doesn't seem to be updated since the 6th?

This site was updated today:
http://sathanasias.bravepages.com/f-res/football.html

[thejollyrodger]

Looking at UEFA website there... should we continue to equal this years run of 1.666 we will get to 30th position in 3 years time as already posted on this thread.



2004-2005 2005-2006 2006-2007 2007-2008 2008-2009 Co-efficient

1.333 2.000* 1.666 1.666 1.666 8.331
**7.99

* 2.000 If cork beat Djurgardens.
** 7.99 if Cork fail to beat Djurgardens (1.666 co efficient for 2005/2006)


30th position was held by Bosnia last season.. Their co-efficient was 7.165

30 Bosnia-Herzegovina 0.500 0.333 3.000 1.666 1.666 7.165




**The following is all hypothetical - too much time on a Saturday :P **


Should any club manage to get to the group stages next season and each season from 2006/2007 until 2008/2009 then we would jump up to 26th/27th position by 2008/2009. That’s if the other 2 Eircom League clubs continued to make up the 1.666 or 2.000 co efficient.

The following (2006/2007) is based on this year run with one club going all the way to the group stages of UEFA Cup (Using Cork as an example ) and coming out with 4 draws in the group stages.


If Cork beat Djurgardens in two weeks time then we will have a co-efficient of 2.


They then face a difficult opponent in the first round proper. The co efficient points are double. 1 for a draw, 2 for a win.

Say they went through on away goals. CCFC picked up another 2 co-efficient points over the two matches by drawing 0-0 at home and 1-1 away.


If the club managed to draw all 4 games in the group stages it would pick up 4 co -efficient points.


That’s a total of 5 coefficient points for Corks run (1 for the 1st round proper and 4 for the group stages UEFA Cup). 5 divided by 3 (to give the national co-efficient points) equals 1.666.

2 (what the league got so far on 2006/2007) + 1.666 ( CCFC's run from 1st round and group stages) = 3.666


So at the end of a year like this the country would have 3.666 co-efficient.




2004-2005 2005-2006 2006-2007 2007-2008 2008-2009 Co-efficient


1.333 2.000 3.666 3.666 3.666 14.331



25 Romania 0.833 2.625 2.166 4.333 5.500 15.457
26 Sweden 4.800 3.833 2.250 1.500 3.000 15.383
27 Slovakia 3.666 3.500 0.666 2.500 1.333 11.665



In short there is a big jump from going from 30th to getting seeded for the 2nd round.

It’s unlikely that CCFC will get past the first round of the UEFA Cup and make it into the group stages. Even if they did, it’s unlikely that they would draw all 4 matches. So it’s going to be tricky going from 30th to 25th. Plus teams could face very difficult opposition in the 2nd round and 3rd round each year.

The other side of it is not factoring in how well the other 2 clubs do. One club could reach the 3rd round of the Champions league regularly and obtain draws and likewise the other UEFA Cup team could reach the 2nd round qualifiers and obtain draws there.

[Slash/ED]

Good work, I think at the moment I would be very happy to maintain a 1.66667 average over the next few years. If we can do that, we're doing very well, get rid of the years where we earned very little. Anything beyond that is a bonus.

[pineapple stu]

If we can do that, we're doing very well, get rid of the years where we earned very little.
I think more importantly, if we get even 1.000 next season, Irish teams should be guaranteed seeded in both competitions for the next five years, which gives us a great foothold to build on.

[thejollyrodger]

the co-efficents have all been updated.. were still at 40th and I dont think we will move up or down this season

http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/index.html

[Slash/ED]

Add another draw to that, and we have a record high co-efficent :)

With a bit of luck, City will draw Steua

[eirebhoy]

If Cork can get just a draw either leg we'll be guaranteed to move ahead of Belarus and Liechtenstein into 38th. One win (or 2 draws) over the 2 legs and we'll move ahead of Iceland too.

[thejollyrodger]

here is the latest update to the co-efficents. were at 1.833 now for this year. The highest in a very long time. If cork can get a draw from one of the next games it would be a major boost. Who knows though, they could get a favourable draw

[Slash/ED]

The highest in a very long time.

Ever, I think

[gspain]

Fantastic performance last night and well deserved victor yover the 2 legs.

A draw in one game in the next round would be huge. While it would be nice to catch Liechtenstein and Iceland it is imperative we catch Belarus. If Cork get a draw then we move ahead of Belarus and into the last of the seeded places for the champions league 1st round draw. Furthermore Cork would obtain a club coefficient with a draw or win and thus be effectively seeded for 5 years in Europe.