Its official – football has more participants

[drummerboy]

According to an ESRI survey football has more participants than the other major sports in this country. Yet both the IRFU and GAA received almost twice as much grant aid as the FAI.

http://www.unison.ie/sportsdesk/stories.php3?ca=12&si=1424594

[GalwayFrancis]

http://www.unison.ie/sportsdesk/stories.php3?ca=12&si=1424594

would you post up the full piece, for us who arent subscribed to unison.ie

[brendy_éire]

STANDING in the middle of one of the football pitches at the impressive Cabra Sports Centre last Thursday, it was reassuring to hear the chief executive of the Irish Sports Council admit that the FAI have a case for more funding.

John Treacy probably could have prefaced the word "case" with such apropriate adjectives as deserving, strong, undeniable or irrefutable because the Sports Council's 2005 grant of €2million to the FAI is the same amount as last year and falls well short of the €3.5million awarded to the IRFU and the €3.9m which the GAA will receive.

The FAI grant looks even more lopsided when one considers that a recent ERSI survey commissioned by the Sports Council revealed that apart from the recreational and largely unorganised everyday pursuits of walking and cycling, football has the most participants.

So, with 400,000 players in action every week, the FAI is the national governing body with the biggest participation level, yet this is clearly not reflected in the money it receives from the Sports Council.

The association are lobbying hard for an increase in funding for 2006 and recently chief executive John Delaney made a presentation to the Sports Council in Kilkenny but unfortunately we won't know for 12 months when the cheque is written if they have been successful.

That's not to say the FAI doesn't get government money in other ways. There is the capital grants programme, which yielded €10m in 2004, that allows clubs to build facilities and of course Sports Minister John O'Donoghue has committed €191m of exchequer funding to the €300m coast of redeveloping of Lansdowne Road.

But while those funds are directed towards bricks and mortar, the Sports Council grant goes towards player development as the FAI use it to fund their Technical Development Plan which Treacy admitted was "second to none".

In 2003 the Sports Council contributed 28 per cent of the funding to the FAI's investment of €5.2m in its Technical Development Plan. In 2004 it was 31 per cent of €6.2m spent but this year their contribution, in percentage terms, has fallen to 26 per cent because it will cost €7.7m to fund the Plan.

The Technical Development Plan is a five-year strategic plan for the future of football and involves 15 development programmes covering all strands of the game and all sectors of the community.

The Technical Department, under the direction of Packie Bonner, drives the Plan and will see its staffing levels rise from two in 1996 to 50 by the end of this year.

In Cabra last Thursday both Minister O'Donoghue and Treacy spoke of their hope that the national team would qualify for next summer's World Cup Finals in Germany.

They were, of course, expressing the hopes of every Irish person at home and abroad who not only want to see the team in Germany but also in Switzerland and Austria in 2008, South Africa in 2010 and every other major finals in the years ahead. It's an ambition the FAI also holds, but while the nation is primarily interested in the success of the senior international side, the association doesn't merely put its resources into one basket.

Brian Kerr's side get all the attention but in terms of what the FAI does it is only the tip of a very large iceberg.

The senior side only accounts for around a dozen of the 120 international matches that FAI teams participate in each year around the globe. Last year it cost €8.2m to stage 129 international matches of which 117 were non-senior games.

Then there are over 100 leagues at various levels from the Eircom League right down to the South Donegal Schoolboys League which provide football for those 400,000 participants every week.

The impact of the FAI's work is seen in every community in the country and it shouldn't be forgotten that the association is still the only major national governing body to have embraced disabled sports with its innovative 'Football for All' programme.

Not only have they appointed a full-time National Co-ordinator for this important area but on Saturday at the FAI's Annual General Meeting in Waterford, the association's rules will be amended to allow a 'Football for All' representative sit on National Council.

The FAI has attracted a fair amount of bad publicity over the years, much of it fully deserved, but there is a lot they get right and such good work deserves to be properly recognised.

While €2m is not a sum to be scoffed at, it is still almost half that received by the GAA and there is no way that the football community is only doing half the work of its Gaelic games or rugby colleagues.

Hopefully, by the time next year's grants are being handed out, the Sports Council will have realised their error and rectified it.

[gspain]

This was actually the case in 1986 contrary to popular belief that Jack Charlton brought football to the country. The gap has widened considerably since. Indeed even in Kerry the heartland of the GAA there are more football players than gaelic players.

However the sad thing is that this popularity manifests itself in support for foreign teams thus making GAA and even rugby bigger spectator sports. Hence the evening Herald backpage headline on friday last was Liverpool drawing TNS in the champions league and the clash between the 2 champions of this island hardly getting a mention.

[brendy_éire]

Whilst football may have more participants than GAA, doesn't the GAA need the funding more than football? GAA support cannot ever be allowed to dwindle in Ireland. If GAA dies here, that's it, it's gone. Football won't ever die here, it has an international presence, essentially meaning most of the work for promoting it is done for us. The GAA on the other hand exists, for the most part anyway, amongst the 5 million odd people in Ireland. If it is to compete with other sports, it needs money.
I'd rather see sport in general get an increase in funding, but if it's a choice between the GAA or football and rugby, the GAA should get it. Don't blame the GAA for football's lack of funding, they deserve every cent they get and more besdies, the blame lies with the Govt.

[elroy]

Whilst football may have more participants than GAA, doesn't the GAA need the funding more than football? GAA support cannot ever be allowed to dwindle in Ireland. If GAA dies here, that's it, it's gone. Football won't ever die here, it has an international presence, essentially meaning most of the work for promoting it is done for us. The GAA on the other hand exists, for the most part anyway, amongst the 5 million odd people in Ireland. If it is to compete with other sports, it needs money.
I'd rather see sport in general get an increase in funding, but if it's a choice between the GAA or football and rugby, the GAA should get it. Don't blame the GAA for football's lack of funding, they deserve every cent they get and more besdies, the blame lies with the Govt.


I am a football fan first and foremost, however I do feel that article is all a little too rosy. It mentions that the FAI's presence can be seen in every community, that is far from the case. The gaa is in every community not the fai. Although I agree that football is played by more people, unfortunately IRISH football is probably only supported by a fraction of this amount. The media are a big reason for this as well as sky sports.
I cant stand the likes of as mentioned last Fridays hearld putting the pool game on the back page. If shels do manage to get the second/third qualifying round, we'll suddenly see The hearld backs shels campaign etc.
I dont think the fai will ever get the penetration in communities that the gaa has, but the main focus for the fai has to be to have a quality youth development structure in place in order to develop international class players which will result in a better international team which means more exposure and interest in irish football.
Unfortunately I dont ever see the EL being more than a feeder league and a league for those who dont make it in the UK.

[hamish]

I posted an example in the "More money for football" thread regarding the deep roots football has in this country. It's only one of MANY I could give. I'm really getting fed up with this mantra that footie is not in every parish in this country.

Ok, I'm sure there are a few but while there are is often only one GAA club per parish, you'll often find several footie clubs there. Why? Answer is easy, each club will represent a townland or small village in that parish.
Again, look at my Woodlawn example - it's one of MANY.

Conor74, you know your area more than I do obviously but I thought that there were five or six divisions in the Kerry League????? That seems to indicate loads of teams and clubs even if they're hard to find??? Many Kerry Primary and Secondary schools also take part in schools footie and many buy goals for the small sided games also - this I know for a fact, I used to organise delivery to those schools, rakes of them.

Guys like Henry Molyneaux and a McCarthy chap - can't remember his first name, he was a teacher and is now an FAI organiser or something down there - are doing great work in Kerry.

In my town and hinterland, there are about five GAA clubs. In the same area -
Ballinasloe Town, Ahascragh United, Skyvalley Rovers, Moore United, CB Trotters, Gurteen FC, Colemanstown FC, Cam Celtic, Laurencetown FC, St. Patricks FC, Moylough 79 FC, Shiven Rovers, Woodlawn Utd, Abbey Rovers, Dysart FC, Clonown FC, Rahara Rovers, St. Johns FC, Glen celtic FC, Kilkerrin Utd, Ballinaskill Utd - that's off the top of my head. Most of these clubs have rakes of under age (girls and boys) teams plus adult "B" teams. Throw in a load of schools also.

I could do the same for hinterlands of Portlaoise, Mullingar, Athlone, Tullamore, Longford, Tuam, Kilkenny and so on and so on and so .

Jesus, how much more proof do some of you need?????

[hamish]

Before I forget, RTE 6pm news sports ignored that ESRI report - now I wonder why?? :rolleyes:

You can be damn sure if it was a similar positive report on GAA or eggball, it would be mentioned.

[drummerboy]

The GAA is struggling in many traditional areas. Many parts of Dublin the game has little or no existance. Met a guy on holidays who told me that Carrigaline in Cork is now a football area with the GAA really struggling.

[OwlsFan]

This was actually the case in 1986 contrary to popular belief that Jack Charlton brought football to the country.

The success of the Charlton era brought Irish international football to the attention of housewives and many other couch potatoes who wouldn't have known Davy Langan from a Bosche freezer. However, there were many thousands of diehard supporters following the team to foreign fields before Jack arrived but the team didn't have the nationwide popular support as it does now.

As for the statistics, they're obviously inflated by the fact that almost half the population of the country lives in Dublin and its environs where soccer is the game of the masses. I wouldn't have any worries about the strength of the GAA outside the Pale.

[gspain]

Valentia Island home of Mick O'Connell - probably the greatest Gaa player of all time has never had a GAA club. It has a football team. Mick regularly attends games as indeed he used to attend Cork Hibs games during the ban.

Conor is confusing facilities and attendances with playing numbers.

Yes the GAA have better facilities, yes far more people will attend the Munster hurling final then will attend the F.A.I. Cup Final.

Most clubs in Kerry probably just have a pitch, no clubhouse and poor facilities. all the more remarkable then that people still play the beautiful game rather than the neanderthal one.

I was in both Tralee and Killarney at football matches in the early 80's and football was really only taking off in Kerry then (and the pioneers faced many problems well documented elsewhere) but look at the growth in 25 years.

The whole point here is that football is the main sport in the country but support is only there for the national team and foreign clubs. Domestic football has failed miserably to attract these players to games and many will probably go and watch Liverpool/Man Utd and their local GAA county.

Up to 4,000 Irish people attend Old Trafford on any given weekend home game. How many clubs here would love that support?

[hamish]

I suppose when you see the FAI Cup Final pulling in 45,000 plus, to compare with the All Ireland Club Final, it would be a start.

I was referring to participation at junior level in townlands, villages etc - should have made it clear my point had nowt to do with LOI.

Sorry to see Kerry scene is not as healthy as I thought. The cows scenario is familiar I'll tell ya - I have twiced togged out in sheds with calves running all over he place but that was in early 80s. Bith clubs have now got enclosed grounds, clubhouses etc etc.

Brian McCarthy - that's the guy - met him in Mullingar in June 2000 - first and only time - nice bloke - involved with some Kerry school at the time -not a teacher - a coach.

The All Ireland Club Finals rarely bring in that big crowds - sometimes - it's like the Leinster schools eggball finals with so called 20,000 plus - usually around 6 or 7000 these days.

[hamish]

The success of the Charlton era brought Irish international football to the attention of housewives and many other couch potatoes who wouldn't have known Davy Langan from a Bosche freezer. However, there were many thousands of diehard supporters following the team to foreign fields before Jack arrived but the team didn't have the nationwide popular support as it does now.

As for the statistics, they're obviously inflated by the fact that almost half the population of the country lives in Dublin and its environs where soccer is the game of the masses. I wouldn't have any worries about the strength of the GAA outside the Pale.

That's my point, Owlsfan, football is growing like wildfire in non Dublin areas. A very good friiend of mine,Eamon McManus, who used to play for Roscommon and was involved with Clanna Gael told me "When the Kennedy Cup starts, we can forget about getting kids teams for GAA games" Between local games, training sessions etc etc The Kennedy Cup alone reaks havoc on all other sporst in nearly every area in the country for obvious reasons - the kids aren't stupid, they know that competition can be a conduit to Irish teams, sadly even English clubs.

I can name loads of players who are GAA stars who never made it past Kennedy Cup or Youths levels because they weren't good enough even for EL. Here's a few - Rory O'Connell (Westmeath), the two Dolans (Westmeath and Roscommon - they're related)- all ex Athlone Town Youths, I was with the club when they were there. Ditto Graham Geraghty (Bohs/Drogheda/Arsenal :D ) and so on. Once these guys know they're not good enough, they opt for Gaelic. Keith Barr is another one - he had a trial with Gillingham against Beeslow here in 1991 when Gills manager was Damien Richardson and was ok but not great - two of us got pi$$ed after game though. :D


In fact, the big clubs like Stella Maris, Home Farm etc are scooping up all the good players in Dublin and many of the smaller clubs representing a housing estate or area are getting ****ed off with this and some are closing down as the kids know they are the left overs - I heard this from numerous blokes in Dublin Junior football when I was up there in the late 90s.
In fact, we now have kids from Beeslow and other parts of western Ireland travelling up tomplay with the likes of Belvedere FC twice a week to get themselves noticed by Vinny Butler andother national under age team coaches. It's crazy.

[hamish]

As someone who lives in Kerry, plays the game in Kerry, sits on the committee of one of the largest 'soccer' clubs here in Kerry, have played on most pitches in the county, I reiterate that the bubble has well and truly burst in Kerry. I too remember the days when 2,000 (yep, two thousand) people attended a 'soccer' match in Camp, a village on the Dingle-Tralee road about 15 years ago, and Camp's own team contained about 4 Kerry senior football players. That, unfortunately, is well and truly history. The league here is a farce, for the past number of years it just trails off in about May with most end of season fixtures unfulfilled as the GAA season gets into full swing. And, as the original claim was about the mark the FAI is leaving in communities, any club that has put together facilities, Tralee Dynamos, Killaney Celtic and Athletic, Internazionale Kenmare etc. will very quickly tell anyone how much aid came from the Government or the Lotto funds and the pathetic input by the FAI. The FAI have had a negligible impact on 'soccer', and obviously on sport, in Kerry. I will acknowledge that Brian McCarthy put in trojan work at schoolboy level in Kerry was excellent - I can only assume that was through dint of his own character rather than anything that came from the FAI.

I didn't know Valentia had a pitch. They certainly have had no team that I am aware of playing in the Kerry District League for years. In fact, the number of teams on the Ring of Kerry was crap - 120 miles of road with 4 clubs between Killorglin, Killarney and Kenmare. On the other hand, gaelic football has an enormous following in South Kerry. Believe me, I live it, I have to put up with the puzzled looks from people when I say that I go to Cork City games and have limited interest in gaelic football, I would LOVE it if I could say here that 'soccer' is the game in Kerry, but it's not even comparable to gaelic games and, in very recent years, rugby.

Fair point Conor 74 - you truly know the scene down there but maybe the League is going through a down time - it happens to all leagues - then, some new blood comes in and things get better. Keep your chin up - I can truly relate to what your saying/doing, having been on countless committees, coaching, myself and playing in various leagues etc etc.
I did think that the FAI was doing a load of work down there -I thought Brian Kerr launche some big scheme down in Kerry lately?????? If not, that annoys the hell out of me because we have loads of FAI schemes/coaches up here in the Midlands/Roscommon/The West.
Same goes for Laoise, Longford, Mayo, Sligo, Meath etc etc etc

[colm3012]

i am interested in these facts and they dont surprise me at all.it is clear to anyone who lives in our country that football is more popular than other sports such as gaa and rugby.if you look at the amount of people playing football compared to others ie every school yard in the country footbal is played in at lunch break and you see a lot more footbal jerseys being worn than any other.the sport is on the up as far as quality is concerned ie eircom league with clubs doing well in europe over the past few seasons and the fact that it is professional. The F.A.I. should be receiving more grants from the government to further improve the beautiful game.

[brendy_éire]

The F.A.I. should be receiving more grants from the government to further improve the beautiful game.

At the expense of the GAA and/or IRFU?

[gspain]

At the expense of the GAA and/or IRFU?

Yes of course.

[gspain]

I didn't know Valentia had a pitch. They certainly have had no team that I am aware of playing in the Kerry District League for years. In fact, the number of teams on the Ring of Kerry was crap - 120 miles of road with 4 clubs between Killorglin, Killarney and Kenmare. On the other hand, gaelic football has an enormous following in South Kerry. Believe me, I live it, I have to put up with the puzzled looks from people when I say that I go to Cork City games and have limited interest in gaelic football, I would LOVE it if I could say here that 'soccer' is the game in Kerry, but it's not even comparable to gaelic games and, in very recent years, rugby.

Valentia had a pitch and a team about 2 years ago. Big feature in our of the daiys. No idea what league they play(ed) in.

I've no doubt the crowds are bigger at GAA game sin Kerry - even the mickey mouse ones and facilities too but we're talking people playing the game here not watching either on tv or on the sideline.