Slovakia v Republic of Ireland - 8th October 2020 - Euro 2020 Playoff Semi Final

[John83]

I see the "liquefy the midfield and use the paste to nourish some teenagers who can't get a game in the Championship" argument is out. It's as predictable as our toothlessness at this stage.

Retiring Brady, McCarthy, McClean, Hendrick, and Hourihane is a fine plan to see our ranking drop to something on a par with Georgia.

[youngirish]

I see the "liquefy the midfield and use the paste to nourish some teenagers who can't get a game in the Championship" argument is out. It's as predictable as our toothlessness at this stage.

Retiring Brady, McCarthy, McClean, Hendrick, and Hourihane is a fine plan to see our ranking drop to something on a par with Georgia.

Georgia will be overtaking us soon enough. They won tonight.

[Razors left peg]

These same players have disappointed time and again, especially the midfield. At this stage I dont care if we play Byrne from the LOI or Smallbone from the bench at Southampton but we need to start making changes. Wales dont think twice about introducing a player before hes playing regularly for his club and we might have to start thinking similar.

Tonight was still an improvement but we have no creativity at all. Too many journeymen. We had 46% possession which is a massive improvement on recent years but we didnt know what to do with it.

Hourihanes miss was ridiculous, sums him up, everything is passive. No conviction in the shot. Hes a nothing player who strikes a ball well at times. He adds nothing to a game.
McCarthy and Hendrick did nothing either, sick of waiting for a midfielder to try take a game by scruff of the neck. All these guys have been given too many chances and we need to move on from them.

[Eirambler]

I see the "liquefy the midfield and use the paste to nourish some teenagers who can't get a game in the Championship" argument is out. It's as predictable as our toothlessness at this stage.

Retiring Brady, McCarthy, McClean, Hendrick, and Hourihane is a fine plan to see our ranking drop to something on a par with Georgia.

Does it matter if our ranking drops much further at this stage? We're going to be third seeds again now for the next qualifiers - once you fall below the top two pots you're going to get a tough draw anyway regardless of what pot you are in. I would say our chances of qualifying for 2022 are the lowest they've been for any tournament since the 80s.

And of the replacement players mentioned only one is a teenager and he's a regular in the Championship and has been for over a year now. The others are 21, 24 and 25 (and all played regularly and performed well in that division last season). If we're at the point where we think we can't throw lads in their mid 20s in there to see how they get on, we might as well just give up.

I've seen more than enough of Hendrick, Hourihane and McClean now, I really have. It's been misery for the last three years watching them toiling out there while games pass them by. You could almost get away with having them there when we had a game plan that involved the ball flying over their heads most of the time, but now that we're playing through the middle it's obvious that they will have to be replaced before we will improve.

[John83]

People who look at our midfield and can't imagine how it could possibly be worse lack imagination. The backups are backups because they're inferior players. If they weren't, they'd be starting in the Premiership. There might be an exception in there; it's Kenny's job and that of his coaching staff to figure that out in the course of training and scouting. The baby and bathwater crowd **** me off because they are stopped clocks. 90% of the players they champion never amount to anything more than the next Paul Green, if that.

[Eirambler]

No they're in there because sometimes it's harder to get out of the team than it is to get into it. Hourihane is a Premier League player in name only anyway, there's a reason Barkley was brought in to replace him last week. McClean hasn't played in the Premier League for a while now and is in and out of the Stoke team this season. Hendrick looks for all the world like a top level player but rarely plays like one.

I can understand why they were given these few games to prove themselves, Kenny came in to a tough situation and has only had a small amount of time with the squad before the three games. But they have shown yet again that we will achieve nothing as long as they are there. The younger lads are already as useful as them at worst, and potentially have a much higher ceiling. But they'll never develop if we don't give them a chance.

[Yard of Pace]

People who look at our midfield and can't imagine how it could possibly be worse lack imagination. The backups are backups because they're inferior players. If they weren't, they'd be starting in the Premiership. There might be an exception in there; it's Kenny's job and that of his coaching staff to figure that out in the course of training and scouting. The baby and bathwater crowd **** me off because they are stopped clocks. 90% of the players they champion never amount to anything more than the next Paul Green, if that.

This.

Kenny's attempting to revolutionise the team. This was his third game. We probably should have won. I saw lots of excellent things and a bunch of players 100 percent committed to giving their all. I was proud to be an Ireland fan tonight and look forward to the future.

[Razors left peg]

The midfield was out played tonight by players from Genk and Parma. Maybe we need to stop looking at who the players play for and look at their performances instead

[youngirish]

People who look at our midfield and can't imagine how it could possibly be worse lack imagination. The backups are backups because they're inferior players. If they weren't, they'd be starting in the Premiership. There might be an exception in there; it's Kenny's job and that of his coaching staff to figure that out in the course of training and scouting. The baby and bathwater crowd **** me off because they are stopped clocks. 90% of the players they champion never amount to anything more than the next Paul Green, if that.
That's complete balls. Egan, Stevens and McGoldrick had been playing in the Championship (or lower) for most of their careers until Sheffield United got promoted and gave them the opportunity to play in the Premiership. They have proved themselves to be better than many players playing in the same positions in the Premiership, particularly those players who are not regular starters for clubs struggling at the wrong end of the table.

Point being, if Sheffield United got a couple of points less in the year they got promoted its very likely all these guys would still be playing in the Championship and people like you would be claiming that they shouldn't be keeping players like Kevin Long out of the team because he occasionally gets games for Burnley at a higher level.

[Trequartista20]

We can expect certain players' retirements now, limiting our options further. And others will have to step up. Knight is one. O'Shea and Dunne being others.

Given previous failures, it's time to be bold.

[Eirambler]

That's complete balls. Egan, Stevens and McGoldrick had been playing in the Championship (or lower) for most of their careers until Sheffield United got promoted and gave them the opportunity to play in the Premiership. They have proved themselves to be better than many players playing in the same positions in the Premiership, particularly those players who are not regular starters for clubs struggling at the wrong end of the table.

Point being, if Sheffield United got a couple of points less in the year they got promoted its very likely all these guys would still be playing in the Championship and people like you would be claiming that they shouldn't be keeping players like Kevin Long out of the team because he occasionally gets games for Burnley at a higher level.

Absolutely. Steve Finnan was barely out of what is now League 1 when he came into the Ireland setup, he went on to win the Champions League. We need to focus on how good the players are, not what level they play at or what team they play for.

If Jason Knight had happened to sign with West Brom instead of Derby a few years ago he'd probably be a premier league player today. But it wouldn't make him any better or worse than he currently is - an exciting prospect with serious potential who is already showing that consistently for his club.

We're not talking about young lads going over to academies in England here - these lads are out playing senior games week in week out.

[backstothewall]

I wouldn't hang Kenny out to dry. He has only had 3 games and the Slovakian game, whilst disappointing and nowhere near the great performance some of these guys are claiming it to be, was markedly better than our last 2 games under him. Give him a campaign to bring the younger lads through and let's get rid of the deadweight. Then we can judge him.

I'm not hanging him out to dry. I'm not saying "Kenny Out" or anything like that, but it isn't good enough.

Slovakia are dreadful. Hamsik was easily the best player on the field tonight, but he doesn't have the legs to hurt teams on his own anymore. They'll be paying him well in China and he's earned it over the years. But now he's 90 minutes against the north away from having his swansong at a big tournament. Fair play to him.

They obviously knew they didn't have the players to hurt us. They had obviously watched us play in our last 2 games and decided that we have a defence they were unlikely to penetrate, but that we would be happy to run down the 120 minutes knocking the ball about in front of them. They had obviously decided that if they got bodies behind the ball we wouldn't be able to get through them, and they would maybe be able to nick a goal or go through on penos.

They were right on all counts. 3 games in we are already really predictable. We were better tonight, but not to enough of an extent to make a difference.

People are giving Hendrick a lot of grief. He's one of our better payers, and has had a cracking start to the season for Newcastle. What in gods name was he doing playing in front of the back 4? Every time I looked, Conor Hourihane, who actually does that job for Villa from time to time, was playing ahead of him. If that instruction came from the dugout, I have to question that. If it didn't I have to question why the dugout didn't stop it.

And then there's the subs. Kenny (rightly) gave McGoldrick a lot of praise after the game. But why was he taken off minutes before a penalty shootout? Who would you rather have hitting a penalty? David McGoldrick or Alan Browne? Has Alan Browne ever hit a penalty before?

I understand that it was unfortunate to lose Connolly and Idah, and that a big game is maybe not a time to take big risks, but it was absolutely an option tonight for Kenny to put on Molumby for McCarthy, and keep Hendrick further forward. If Hendrick was a problem, bringing on Jack Byrne to do that job was a readily available option. We did neither. We went with Shane Long and Robbie Brady.

What has either of these guys done for their country or club since 2016 to justify being in the squad, much less taking the field? They've both scored big goals for us in the past, but Ray Houghton has scored more and I don't want him coming on either. When Kenny was given the job I was under the impression that he was going to bring through exciting young players from the under 21 squad and build a team for the next decade. Alan Browne is 25. That's not an exciting young player. He's coming into his best years and he's still not playing in one of Europe's big leagues. He went to Preston 6 years ago, and he's still there. At this point I feel Preston is his probably his level.

But this is all moaning. We're never going to win the World Cup so it's only ever a question of when we fail. and over the years I think most of you know I try to be a constructive in my criticism. So what I'm saying is this. Tonight was half a loaf. So were Bulgaria and Finland. If playing football is the plan, go for it. While everyone else is planning for a Euros that might never happen, lets play a team with an average age of about 23 (now), with a view toward the next World Cup in 2 years time, or the Euros in just over 3 years time. That's how it's going to work, because we have nothing to aim towards until a World Cup in December 2022, followed by a Euros in June 2024.

Left back is a case in point. And you have to look back as well as forward to see where we've gone wrong.

Stephen Ward is 35. Enda Stevens is 30. Derrick Williams is 27. Ryan Manning is 24.

I'm sure Derrick is a lovely lad, but he's going to be 28 years old in January, and he's had 3 caps. He's never going to be good enough, so what on earth is he doing in our squad? By the time he gets up to speed with international football he'll be 30. If we had brought him into the squad at Manning's age now, and he had won a dozen caps before Ward got too old, he might be an experienced international now who was ready to pick up the baton for 2 world cup cycles. But we didn't, that hasn't happened, and 2 years from now our best case scenario is looking at having a 32 year old Enda Stevens chasing up and down the left flank at a World Cup held in the Arabian Desert. Sin é.

The truth is there isn't an awful lot between Williams and Manning. So we should go with the younger man. He has time on his side.

So I'm not saying Kenny out. I think he has made mistakes, but I think can grow in the job. I don't care one way or the other that he made his bones in the League of Ireland. I don't care if our manager came from the League of Mongolia as long as we win games. This isn't good enough, but the defeat presents an opportunity. What I want now is to see what the plan is to take us forward, What I want now is to see how we get to Qatar.


He's taken two draws, including tonight, which I thought was the best performance of the three..

Aye. It felt like a good point away from home didn't it. ��

[Bielsa´s irish]

once hamsilk didnt score that own goal, I must say it was a sign. the referee was awful very bad guy.

I thought Kenny did wrong with the substitutions. Shane Long was needed , when he had to go for it he played browne who is the main responsable of our defeat dont want him again for a few years.

The eleven who started were ok,

ther refereee was awful.

we were the bettert team but couldnt get that 1st goal.. we will bounce back

[Bielsa´s irish]

did i say the referee was awful and in the 50/50 went in favor of the dark blue shirt

I think Hourihane played very good yesterday, bar that chance, whould have passed to mcgoldrick.

dont think mcgoldrick was so good, he is ok, but should have played off shane long at some stage

[eekers]

You have to take that performance in the context of how bad Slovakia were with all the players missing though. They made us look good even though we were ponderous in possession most of the evening.

Have you not seen us play against Gibraltar?

[Bielsa´s irish]

we really improved because of hourihane hendrick and mccarthy.

mc goldrick was ok but needed shane long. Robinson started good but faded, mcclean improved in the last 20 of 1st time...i thought ther ref was against the irish. really awful guy!!

[Charlie Darwin]

I see the "liquefy the midfield and use the paste to nourish some teenagers who can't get a game in the Championship" argument is out. It's as predictable as our toothlessness at this stage.

Retiring Brady, McCarthy, McClean, Hendrick, and Hourihane is a fine plan to see our ranking drop to something on a par with Georgia.
There's a certain symmetry to it though. Not long since Hourihane was scoring goals for fun in the Championship and we had to get rid of x or y to make room for him, and now the circle has squared once more. Give it three or four years and Knight will be a Premier League player who's not fit to lace the boots of the next prospect.

[Bielsa´s irish]

There's a certain symmetry to it though. Not long since Hourihane was scoring goals for fun in the Championship and we had to get rid of x or y to make room for him, and now the circle has squared once more. Give it three or four years and Knight will be a Premier League player who's not fit to lace the boots of the next prospect.

Hourihane was good yesterday as the other mids.

I tought the game was ready for Long. Kenny wasnt right with his substitutions. Doherty was ok, but Coleman is the main player

[Charlie Darwin]

I'm very surprised by people saying Slovakia are dreadful. They weren't amazing but they're a decent side, even without a couple of key players. Very much like ourselves. The way people are talking about them you'd swear they were Georgia or something.

Oh wait, Georgia completely outplayed us last time we went there.

[Charlie Darwin]

Hourihane was good yesterday as the other mids.

I tought the game was ready for Long. Kenny wasnt right with his substitutions. Doherty was ok, but Coleman is the main player
I don't think Long is much use against a side who defend that deep. You had the choice between McGoldrick, who had to drop deep to get on the ball, or Long who does his best work running the channels. What we needed was a number nine and without Idah we don't have one.

[elatedscum]

That wasn’t a bad performance at all. It was much improved from the previous two games.

Defensively we were good. Randolph had one save to make and made it well, handled all the basic stuff well too. Duffy did excellently for the other Slovakia chance. It was pure defensive instinct. Same with a header he made late on, where, had he not read it, they would have been in. Egan was excellent too. Read the game excellently and snuffed out chances before the began. Doherty was much improved from the previous 2 games. Stevens was very good.

As for the midfield, mixed, we had sustained periods of domination and equally periods where they passed around us comfortably. Significantly though, through those moments they never created anything from those moments.

McCarthy did the basics well. Was a solid performance without being great, better than the last one I think. Put a shift in, did good defensive work and kept the ball moving. Unfortunate to get injured.

Hourihane, needs to score there. If it comes to him on his left, it’s a goal. Still, can’t miss it. I’m sure he’ll be kicking himself. The early yellow card might have hindered him, in terms of being able to tackle and do what midfielders need to be able to do. No idea what it was for, descent maybe? Great delivery for the free-kick that Hamsik nearly put in his own net, extremely difficult to defend. We were unlucky that the ref seemed determined to give a free-kick for every header we challenged for, all night. Even the one where duffy won the ball and got punched in the head.

Hendrick had one of his better performances in recent times. I still feel he needs to be willing to shoot 15-22 yards from goal. He had at least 3 opportunities. One inside the box, where he could have turned and shot and the others, outside the box where once it sat up to shoot and he didn’t take in, and the other the space opened up to shoot as he was dribbling but he didn’t cut inside. He did a lot of good things and linked up well at times but he was also infuriating at times. He gave away the ball terribly at least 6 times. There was 2 passes straight out of play, there was the backward pass to a Slovakian where they broke and 1 bad cross field pass to Robinson which was intercepted and 2 really careless short passes. The Robinson crossfield one really annoyed me because McGoldrick made a great run to give him an easier option and instead he played a needlessly difficult pass. About a minute later, McClean hit that clearance/pass down the line to no one and I thought to myself “Why didn’t that annoy me half as much as Hendrick?” and I realised that I know McClean, I know his strengths and his flaws and I’ve come to expect those mistakes - but Hendrick 2014-16 showed that he is a much better footballer than he’s displayed since, it feels criminal. He was knackered at the end and should have been subbed after 90 mins.

As for Browne, he should score both chances. The first one, he has to go back across the keeper, I can’t understand how he goes near post. It’s an easy finish back across the keeper. Second one where he hits the post is unlucky but getting the ball in that position, just like Hourihane, you’ve got to score. Decent performance though and first time we’ve seen him playing for Ireland that far up the pitch, I remember O’Neill playing him sitting in front of the back 4. At least he was able to get into those positions. I will say one thing. If Jack Byrne received those 2 Browne chances and the Hourihane chance, I’d put money on him scoring all 3. Not saying he’s necessarily the answer, just an observation.

McGoldrick was excellent. His hold up play, the use of his body, his intelligence, creativity and work rate. Best player on the pitch. Looking back, you’d have to be very critical of Martin O’Neill for failing to get him into the side...

Thought Robinson was bright and quick and lively, the only real pace we had with Connolly missing out. Did a lot right. Think he’s earning that starting spot. O’Dowda did well for that one move, really created the move.

McClean was industrious as ever. Harried and hassled well in the first half. Worked his ****** off. That sprint back in the 44th minute. I thought it was actually a good sign, when the Slovakian took the shot, we had 9 players back in our own box. I know we were 3v2 initially and looked vulnerable but 6 players bust themselves to get back and cover. The type of thing you’d see from a Bielsa team. The shot he pulled wide was heading straight to Robinson before it was blocked. It wasn’t a great performance but it was an improvement on the last few years since he lost a touch of acceleration. Won some good free kicks, covered Stevens when he got dragged out of position, played a bit of football and made himself a nuisance. Once he got the booking, he was always a risk and I think it was the right move to take him off. Brady was good and bad, a bit more good. Still think he wasn’t 100%, there was one run back where he looked like he was struggling for air and was really slow.

Really think Connolly coming off the bench against tired legs could have cause havoc and could have scored goals.

Re penalties, watched it with my father and said I didn’t want Browne or Doherty taking them before they began. Browne first. I remember a game I played in, ball came across box and I tried to go back across the keeper, I hit it hard and well but he was a little slow getting across the goal and was able to throw a flailing leg and somehow turn it around the post. I was so angry with myself. 5 mins later, we won a penalty, I was supposed to take it and I rejected it, the only time ever. I felt that keeper had somehow won a psychological battle. I also felt like that miss let everyone down and the pressure of the earlier miss made the prospect of missing a penalty so much worse. It was the only time I didn’t feel confident taking a penalty. That’s how I felt about Browne. He’d failed to score twice. He’s a youngish player, trying to establish himself as an international, he had the opportunity to create history on three occasions, the miss 1v1 against the keeper was one which gave the keeper an edge and the post was a real mental blow. I’d believe he went up there thinking about missing and the keeper saw him coming and thought he can’t score tonight. The penalty itself was unconvincing. Didn’t hit a corner. Good height to be saved. Wasn’t smashed to the point of unstoppable. Really poor penalty.

Doherty, because of the hamstring. If there’s something off, even in your standing leg, if you’re worrying about it, it can effect what you’re gonna do. Anything that changes your natural rhythm isn’t good.

There was an opportunity to bring on another sub. After 120 mins the legs are gonna be dead, I’d much rather fresh legs taking a penalty. I did suggest (not sure how seriously really) that I’d sub Randolph at that last throw in and bring on Travers, who has saved a lot of penalties in shootouts. Actually might not have been the worst idea...

Overall though, it’s progress. It was a good performance away from home. I think it’s fair to judge SK after we’ve completed the World Cup qualification. He’s probably had about 5 days of actually training time with the players across the two windows so far. He needs time and patience. I’d like to see Byrne and Cullen used at some point from the start, to get a sense how they handle it. I’d also like to see Shane Long start one game. Not scoring enough goals is a huge problem, Robinson probably won’t score many on the right, compared to the left, where he can cut inside or the centre where he’s scoring at the moment. O’Dowda and McClean don’t really look like they’ll score at all these days. McGoldrick’s intelligence and movement creates chances for others but we’ve got to be creative in coming up with ways to get other players into positions where they can score. Shane Long’s pace, strength and directness could offer something, maybe. I don’t really know how, whether on one of the wings, but filling the space McGoldrick creates when he can or what but maybe something will click or they can figure out something.

[DCWA]

Who really cares we missed out on a Euros that is likely to be behind closed doors anyway? Complete waste of time if we probably won’t even be able to gather to watch it at home either.

Write it off take the positives we can from it and let Stephen build. We have to refer back to Michael O’Neill’s first year or so with the IFA
team, that should be the precedent for the “give him time” approach because knowing both of them from LOI in terms of revitalising a team and transforming them both in terms of style of play and in terms of how they approach games and tournaments SK is miles ahead of MON.

The FAI need to step and give him unconditional medium to long term backing and let him oversee Irish football. Euro 2021
is no loss and Qatar 2022 equally so. Forget about them and let him work.

[Eirambler]

I also thought about the Travers switch. Maybe too big a call to make too early in Kenny's tenure, but no question I'd have preferred him in goal to Randolph in the shootout. Some keepers just aren't penalty experts - Given wasn't and Randolph isn't either. Travers once saved every penalty in a shootout in a league cup game - he's a big imposing presence on the goal line, would definitely have increased our chances in the shootout.

I think people are being overly generous of our performance and are overestimating the quality of opposition we played. That Slovakia team was the equivalent of Georgia and Macedonia teams we have consistently been able to handle in the past. There were weaknesses all over the field to be exploited and we weren't able to do it. It's a really disappointing result and needs to be a watershed moment for us, otherwise we'll never turn things around.

[NeverFeltBetter]

I don't think anyone here is calling for Kenny's head, and criticism of what happened last night shouldn't be taken as that. I'm wary of praising what I would only call an average performance at best, with its lack of cutting edge and midfield effectiveness. We have a number of difficult games coming up, so it's entirely possible that Kenny will still be looking for a win after seven, which is a very depressing thought, and bodes poorly for his longevity prospects. I can't see this team raising themselves to get at Wales.

[paul_oshea]

Interesting discussion on here this morning, its good to see balanced debate and not the usual positive spin nonsense regardless of the result or performance.
The general sporting or football public call out a poor performance but also they acknowledge a good performance when that happens - the odd time it does. The
mood is generally captured well as the presenter said on RTE last night. And the general consensus is that we had a decent performance.

I really think we have underestimated how poor slovakia were, and in the process over-estimated our own. The 60 minutes they dropped, and thats when things opened up for us
but you have to use the space given and we did do that in fairness. Their finishing was terrible in general and bar the midfield they did nothing. Their back 4 was
a new back 4 with many players not having played this season, yet we couldn't for 60 minutes fashion much or put them under more pressure. Slovakia dropped off as a
result and gave us space to attack the midfield. That won't happen in other games. They had lads who haven't played for their club all season and a sprinkling of slovakia/
polish/belgian/american leagues in their 11.

We are 300 mins with 1 goal, scored using a MON/TRAp/Mick type set piece setup, scored with a duffy head. We could be 5 games and 480 minutes without a goal from play.
Its going to be very difficult to pick up the players for the next two games. And i worry what kind of performance we have. For all the play we had and MCG dropping
we still dont have a goal scorer in the side, what if Long or Obafemi had got onto brownes(2) or Hourihanes chance. We need to accomodate an actual striker in our 11,
or else we are still going to be looking for goals. Kenny has a lot of work to do, and possibly changing his system here.

Barraclough isnt in the job long, Norhtern Ireland went 2 steps further than us, they scored away from home in a play-off and qualified for a play-off final.

I dont buy this building for the future, a young player in international terms is in or around the 20 years of age bracket, we seem to be thinking that
25 is still young and breaking through for ireland. Our player lifespan is much shorter in international terms for many reasons. So this leads to my
building for the future utter nonsense, we dont know what our team will be like in 4 years, we dont know who will come through or emerge. We cant write off campaigns,
based off some believe we will be playing super pressing football with tiki tika passing. We're a small nation, we don't have a conveyor belt of young lads coming through
that we can just replace so we will NEVER get into a position of going much furhter than a last 16 in a euros or whatever. Therefore this building is complete BS.
Barraclough didnt come out saying building or playing a way, he got Northern Ireland to a play-off final and potential Euros in Dublin.

The Travers one is interesting. I said at the end of normal time we should not let this get to penalties, that they had a big keeper, and i didnt really fancy Randolph.
To be fair their first 2 penalties were super penalties very hard and fast into the bottom corner, but randolph still got finger tips on one, so a bigger man might have got there.
Kenny is meticulous in his planning as we all know, but I sense he has a loyal streak in him which would merit confidence, and would never make a switch like that.

[Real ale Madrid]

I'd fancy Kenny more in the long term than Barraclough. Maybe that's just me.

Good performance last night. In the context of what has gone before anyway. We had 3 chances form 6 yards or less and if you don't take them then you can't crib about the result.

We still give the ball away too much and we need to improve a notch or two defensively but we are finally on the right road imo.

[paul_oshea]

Just one other bit i wanted to add, bar robinson and hte odd hourihane pass, we are still hitting the ball to slow between our players, when making the pass play it fast and hard to the feet so you move hte ball quicker and the opposing player doesn't have time to adjust and reset. Its those fractions that make massive differences, when trying to open up the midfield or do nice triangular movements of ball and player, removing an opposing player from the build up.

[Fixer82]

Just one other bit i wanted to add, bar robinson and hte odd hourihane pass, we are still hitting the ball to slow between our players, when making the pass play it fast and hard to the feet so you move hte ball quicker and the opposing player doesn't have time to adjust and reset. Its those fractions that make massive differences, when trying to open up the midfield or do nice triangular movements of ball and player, removing an opposing player from the build up.

I agree. For a team that were ultimately inferior to most of our players, their one touch passing was excellent at times and we could certainly take a leaf.

[pineapple stu]

We are 300 mins with 1 goal, scored using a MON/TRAp/Mick type set piece setup, scored with a duffy head. We could be 5 games and 480 minutes without a goal from play.
Its going to be very difficult to pick up the players for the next two games. And i worry what kind of performance we have. For all the play we had and MCG dropping
we still dont have a goal scorer in the side, what if Long or Obafemi had got onto brownes(2) or Hourihanes chance. We need to accomodate an actual striker in our 11,
or else we are still going to be looking for goals. Kenny has a lot of work to do, and possibly changing his system here.
While goalscoring is a big concern, it's worth noting (a) it's been a concern since Keane retired - 3 goals in two games against Gibraltar, one of which was an own goal, under McCarthy will show that and (b) Parrott, Connolly and Idah were all unavailable last night. They're still a little way away from being proven goalscorers - the law of averages probably says one won't even make it as a regular international - but it was still a definite handicap.

[paul_oshea]

I'd fancy Kenny more in the long term than Barraclough. Maybe that's just me.

Good performance last night. In the context of what has gone before anyway. We had 3 chances form 6 yards or less and if you don't take them then you can't crib about the result.

We still give the ball away too much and we need to improve a notch or two defensively but we are finally on the right road imo.

Ya Maybe thats just you, this is the kind of silly stuff expected on foot. At the end of the day hes achieved something Kenny hasnt thus far, a shot at Euros in a play-off final.

[Fixer82]

Also worth noting that Alan Browne was about 4 inches away from winning us the match too with the ball coming off the post

[pineapple stu]

Yeah, you can't really bring one-off games into a comparison when the margins were so tight. We had two great chances - Browne and Hourihane - and had either scored (and Kenny could do nothing about either) then we'd have won our match away from home and Kenny would have been better than Baraclough.

Doesn't make sense.

[paul_oshea]

I actually wondered why he took that foot to take the shot, but if you look again ,he was never getting onto it properly so no we weren't that close from getting it, it came back off the post from the far side too, the whole angle didnt look right. Not sure if we can blame him for mistiming his run or not, cos the ball seemed as good as it possibly could be from O'Dowda

[paul_oshea]

Yeah, you can't really bring one-off games into a comparison when the margins were so tight. We had two great chances - Browne and Hourihane - and had either scored (and Kenny could do nothing about either) then we'd have won our match away from home and Kenny would have been better than Baraclough.

Doesn't make sense.

And if duffy hadn't saved off the line, or the ball that just went wide. You cant say could hvae should have would have. We're not there, they are, and no ones saying who's better, that was RMA being sillly pulling out a one liner as if he trumps the point.

[pineapple stu]

We're not there, they are, and no ones saying who's better

It really does sound like that's what your point was when you said -


Barraclough isnt in the job long, Norhtern Ireland went 2 steps further than us, they scored away from home in a play-off and qualified for a play-off final.

[Real ale Madrid]

Ya Maybe thats just you, this is the kind of silly stuff expected on foot. At the end of the day hes achieved something Kenny hasnt thus far, a shot at Euros in a play-off final.

Congratulations to him and to them. But long term I know who I'd like to have as manager. Comparing the two's results last night as an argument against Kenny long term is nonsensical in my opinion.

[Fixer82]

I actually wondered why he took that foot to take the shot, but if you look again ,he was never getting onto it properly so no we weren't that close from getting it, it came back off the post from the far side too, the whole angle didnt look right. Not sure if we can blame him for mistiming his run or not, cos the ball seemed as good as it possibly could be from O'Dowda

I think given the circumstances he probably did as well as he could, keeper was on top of him, he couldn't get his left foot around it in time so had to let it come off outside of his right foot to get it under the keeper. Difficult chance to convert, despite being two feet out

[paul_oshea]

It really does sound like that's what your point was when you said -

How? Its the metre of measurement we are using, a defensive line being thrown out since the start about Kenny. I was using a simple comparison to another manager not long in charge (much lesser knowing for 2 years he would be )of a team definitely with inferior players than us. i was merely pointing out it doesnt really hold water, especially given how long he has to build up to this.

[paul_oshea]

Congratulations to him and to them. But long term I know who I'd like to have as manager. Comparing the two's results last night as an argument against Kenny long term is nonsensical in my opinion.

Again, where did anyone say long term? I've already made the point, and hopefully cleared it up so I am not going to go any further with it.

The other thing I don't like about this whole thing of rebuilding lets go for 2024, you can't discard results and then say build for the future, because you'll end up in lower pots and qualifying becomes even more difficult, so this whole concept is seriously flawed. Well done you play great football but now you've 3 teams ranked higher with better footballers than you to overcome - its just not going to happen no matter how you play. And you all know why it wont happen, because at the end of the day you need players of that quality. So if theres one thing that i really really hope people cotton onto after these 5 games is, it is NOT about performances and building to something, its about results and performances that will hopefully lead to building something sustainable. Otherwise I'm going to be on here again in 3 years saying this is what we saw coming.

[Stuttgart88]

I saw the NI highlights and from what I saw they did eff all better than we did, got a horribly ugly goal that had little to do with any particularly good play. Fair play - it's not a criticism, we thrive on those type of goals - but heralding Barraclough over Kenny based on last night is mind-boggling. Barraclough lost 5-1 at home in his first game. Similarly, Scotland barely registered a shot on target at home to Israel. The only real difference was that we took two poor pens, Israel took a poor pen not dissimilar to Browne's, totally telegraphing his intentions to the keeper. Bosnia the same. NI ballooned one over. Them's the breaks.

Last night's performance in my opinion was decent enough overall. Poor opening as we guaged the tone of the game, very good 20-43 minutes, very poor 45-60 minutes, very good after that. Some players were solid all night, others played well in parts but were poor in parts too. I am such a big fan of Doherty but if Christie had played like him last night he'd be hammered. Some of our errors and misplaced passes were maddening, some of our best play was great. If any or all of those 3 gilt-edged chances had gone in they'd have counted as among the best-worked golas we've scored in a long time.

I'm not that disappointed, surprisingly. As said above I think these Euros will be soulless if there are no fans, and Qatar is hard to get excited about too, though the qualifying campaign is, as they all are for me.

I think the rest of the year will be tough for us because we're in an awkard place where some of the experienced guys aren't old enough to put out to grass and the younger guys probably aren't ready yet. Could Kenny have been bolder? Sure, of course he could. Was some conservatism / pragmatism justified? Yes, I think it was.

[paul_oshea]

I am pretty sure by June the fans will be back in, but i'm still sore this morning, and the irish in me doesnt want the neighbour to do well(im not on about Northern Ireland) so i hope I'm wrong and the games are played behind closed doors.

[Stuttgart88]

I'd fancy Kenny more in the long term than Barraclough. Maybe that's just me.

Good performance last night. In the context of what has gone before anyway. We had 3 chances form 6 yards or less and if you don't take them then you can't crib about the result. We still give the ball away too much and we need to improve a notch or two defensively but we are finally on the right road imo.For what it's worth I saw nothing silly and certainly no silliness typical of foot.ie here. I'm sure that'll be of great comfort to you :)

[ArdeeBhoy]

Annoyed by an obvious lack of Irish preparation for a penalty shoot-out...

Otherwise, same old, same old.

[paul_oshea]

Ya the lads did only mention penalty practice this week, whereas our neighbours had said theyd been practicing penalties in September. It felt like with all the changes that it wasn't made with penalties in mind.

I wonder how the Slovakian media rated the game and performances?

[John83]

I am such a big fan of Doherty but if Christie had played like him last night he'd be hammered. Some of our errors and misplaced passes were maddening, some of our best play was great. If any or all of those 3 gilt-edged chances had gone in they'd have counted as among the best-worked golas we've scored in a long time.
I thought Doherty was absolutely awful last night. When he wasn't giving the ball away, he was getting caught out of position and conceding fouls. If he'd been booked early on - and the ref last night was fussy - he'd have been a massive liability for the rest of the match.


If any or all of those 3 gilt-edged chances had gone in they'd have counted as among the best-worked golas we've scored in a long time.
Yeah, there were positives in that regard. I'll be a lot happier when I finally see us start scoring again though.

[paul_oshea]

Another thing i was thinking last night when i should have been sleeping :D The highline we play and the movement leaves us open to counter attacking football, as it did last night, and that general type of play especially from set pieces leaves us susceptible, as mentioned earlier Slovakia were fairly toothless up top, so never punished us. A better team would have, in the 4 on 3, 3 on 2s that we ended up having. Its all well and good saying that's par for the course if you want to play that way, but until we can score then its not an effective way of playing, as well end up conceding and then being frustrated up top. I think the kenny philosophy and style lives on finding a proper finisher, be that Idah or Parrott or someone we haven't thought of yet, and I think he'll live or die by the sword of that.

[seanfhear]

Its a Results Business and that was a Bad Result considering the Opportunity that Knocked !

[Stuttgart88]

Matt Doherty said he has been practising penalties for two weeks. That would have been in September.

[geysir]

Obviously that was a disappointing result, had we scored it would have put a different perspective on the performance, the clearest of the chances was Hourihane's, one that a striker or McClean would have relished and probably dispatched.
First prize flight of fancy on how it all could have been different, goes to the idea that had we used a different taller goalie in the shoot-out, he would've dived exactly like Randolph did and got his fingers to the ball.

[paul_oshea]

He was practicing in his back yard by the looks of things :D