FAI Cup 2019

[Johnnie C]

FAI Cup - Qualifying Round
Friday, April 19
Maynooth University Town 5 Rockmount 1
St. Mochta's 0 Collinstown 1

Saturday, April 20
Newtown Rangers 3 Avondale United 4 (AET)
Glebe North 2 Midleton 1
U.C.C. 0 Malahide United 2

Sunday, April 21
Glengad United 1 Home Farm 1 (Glengad won 5-4 on pens aet)

TBC: Lucan United v Aisling Annacotty, St. Michael's v Regional United
Byes: Cobh Wanderers, Crumlin United, Killester Donnycarney and Letterkenny Rovers.

[EatYerGreens]

When is the next round (First round ?) ?

[littlebray]

11 August according to the fixture lists

[EatYerGreens]

11 August according to the fixture lists

That's a crazy gap ! But with the seasons being out of synch, I guess it makes sense.

[seand]

12 non-league teams in the last 32 is too many, the quality is not there. Give the euro qualifiers a bye into the last 16 and play the first round with 16 league and 8 non-league teams on the weekend between the European first round games when nearly all the Premier games get re-arranged anyway.

[marinobohs]

12 non-league teams in the last 32 is too many, the quality is not there. Give the euro qualifiers a bye into the last 16 and play the first round with 16 league and 8 non-league teams on the weekend between the European first round games when nearly all the Premier games get re-arranged anyway.

Already messed up the fixture list to “assist” the teams in Europe. Give the non league teams a day out.

[Charlie Darwin]

A couple of LOI teams will be shocked as usual by amateur sides. The first round of the FAI Cup is great. Bluebell and Sheriff have gotten to the quarters in recent years.

[pineapple stu]

Already messed up the fixture list to “assist” the teams in Europe. Give the non league teams a day out.
I agree with this. I'd have more non-league sides enter tbh. Anyone who wants to enter should be allowed. Restricting non-league clubs can't help the senior/non-league divide we have

[nigel-harps1954]

I like the first round of the cup having so many non-league teams. League teams get fast fed up playing the same games over and over again. The chance to potentially visit somewhere new and see a big local crowd for a non-league side in the middle of nowhere is great.

[seand]

Already messed up the fixture list to “assist” the teams in Europe. Give the non league teams a day out.
Indeed, under my proposition this mess up in the fixture list wouldn't be needed. The 8 best non-leaguers would still get their day out.


I agree with this. I'd have more non-league sides enter tbh. Anyone who wants to enter should be allowed. Restricting non-league clubs can't help the senior/non-league divide we have

I love the novelty of having non-league teams in the draw, and I'm not stopping non-league teams entering, but we don't need more Blarneys losing 12-2 to Derry. And I'm proposing eight non-league teams in the 16th-finals anyway! It's an opportunity to streamline the competition and prevent non-Euro teams having yet another idle weekend in July/August. FWIW I'd draw all Premier teams away to non-Premier teams in the first two rounds

[EatYerGreens]

I agree with this. I'd have more non-league sides enter tbh. Anyone who wants to enter should be allowed. Restricting non-league clubs can't help the senior/non-league divide we have

Definitely.

The LOI and FAI Cup need to be seen as the aspirational tops of the pyramid in Irish football. Somewhere every club would dream of featuring in, and want to do so if they could. If non-league clubs feel shut out of that, or worse still - start to feel pretty indifferent about being in the FAI Cup - then we'll have dented the prestige of the senior club game here.

[seand]

The 4 Junior Cup semi-finalists and the last 16 of the Intermediate Cup get into the FAI Cup proper. That's well over 500 non-league clubs with a shot at making the FAI Cup- nobody's being excluded.

[pineapple stu]

They are though.

Look at the FA Cup in England - anyone can enter. Ditto Scotland and France and so on. You start off in the qualifying rounds of course, and have to earn a shot at a top team. You could argue that the FAI Junior/Intermediate Cup are effectively a qualifying tournament for the FAI Cup, but I think that format just emphasises the divide. You can of course keep the Junior/Intermediate Cups in the same way that England has the FA Vase and FA Trophy - but any club should be allowed start off in Round 1 of the FAI Cup.

Let the FAI Cup start off in round 1 with however many clubs you can get. LoI clubs come in in the round of 32 (or maybe even the round of 64). If Derry win 12-2 - so what? Shows the LoI to be a decent league compared to the MSL, etc.

[seand]

I don't understand the problem with the Junior/Intermediate Cups being the de facto qualifying competitions for the FAI Cup. The only difference is that when it gets to the business end the best non-league clubs also playoff for a trophy at the Aviva, as well as getting a crack at the big boys. Yeh you have 600+ teams in the FA Cup, but only 32 of them get a go with the 3rd/4th tier sides and have to win another 2 rounds to get at the top flight.

[EatYerGreens]

They are though.

Look at the FA Cup in England - anyone can enter. Ditto Scotland and France and so on. You start off in the qualifying rounds of course, and have to earn a shot at a top team. You could argue that the FAI Junior/Intermediate Cup are effectively a qualifying tournament for the FAI Cup, but I think that format just emphasises the divide. You can of course keep the Junior/Intermediate Cups in the same way that England has the FA Vase and FA Trophy - but any club should be allowed start off in Round 1 of the FAI Cup.

Let the FAI Cup start off in round 1 with however many clubs you can get. LoI clubs come in in the round of 32 (or maybe even the round of 64). If Derry win 12-2 - so what? Shows the LoI to be a decent league compared to the MSL, etc.

That's not true I'm afraid - as I know from my old team there. You have to be at Level 10 in the pyramid, or above (?). Otherwise it would be madness, with lots of teams just entering for the hell of it, and an outrageous number of preliminaries. Not to mention the variable quality it would result in.

[pineapple stu]

Fair point - but at least level 10 is a lot of teams. You're talking regionalised divisions there and everything - it probably goes down as far as the end of what's considered "senior" in England?

For the record, I'm not suggesting that teams in the UCD Superleague can enter the FAI Cup. If you have a fence around your pitch and changing rooms, I think that should be about enough.


I don't understand the problem with the Junior/Intermediate Cups being the de facto qualifying competitions for the FAI Cup.
I think the divide in the game here is a big issue, which this would go some small way to addressing. I think entering a competition knowing you could qualify for the FAI Cup - is it even a big deal for junior/intermediate sides? - is different to actually being in the same competition as Dundalk, Cork, etc. Whatever brings the football family (shudder!) closer together is worth considering I think. The way the leagues are set up here is ridiculous.

[Charlie Darwin]

I don't understand the problem with the Junior/Intermediate Cups being the de facto qualifying competitions for the FAI Cup. The only difference is that when it gets to the business end the best non-league clubs also playoff for a trophy at the Aviva, as well as getting a crack at the big boys. Yeh you have 600+ teams in the FA Cup, but only 32 of them get a go with the 3rd/4th tier sides and have to win another 2 rounds to get at the top flight.
I agree with you here but I don't see the point in scaling back the Cup to save the top teams one game when most of them will be playing fringe players anyway? Like Dundalk aren't exactly going to be playing Hoban and Duffy from the start against Sheriff.

[seand]

I agree with you here but I don't see the point in scaling back the Cup to save the top teams one game when most of them will be playing fringe players anyway? Like Dundalk aren't exactly going to be playing Hoban and Duffy from the start against Sheriff.

tbh I'm not comfortable with giving the euro teams a bye into the last 16, but streamlining it like this means the rest of the league is spared an idle weekend in July while Rovers and Cork and the like are galivanting around Europe. As a concession to the non-leaguers put them in a pot that guarateed they're kept apart, or keep the Premier teams in a pot that keep them apart and ensures they are drawn away. Then ensure the Euro teams are drawn away in the last 16.

[seand]

Fair point - but at least level 10 is a lot of teams. You're talking regionalised divisions there and everything - it probably goes down as far as the end of what's considered "senior" in England?

For the record, I'm not suggesting that teams in the UCD Superleague can enter the FAI Cup. If you have a fence around your pitch and changing rooms, I think that should be about enough.

It is enough- any of 500 clubs can qualify for the FAI Cup through the Jnr/Int Cup.



I think the divide in the game here is a big issue, which this would go some small way to addressing. I think entering a competition knowing you could qualify for the FAI Cup - is it even a big deal for junior/intermediate sides? - is different to actually being in the same competition as Dundalk, Cork, etc. Whatever brings the football family (shudder!) closer together is worth considering I think. The way the leagues are set up here is ridiculous.

Is the divide vis-a-vis the FAI Cup a big issue for the football family? Are the junior clubs clamouring for a dedicated FAI Cup qualifying path in parallel to the Junior Cup?

[pineapple stu]

I think it's one of the biggest issues we have to be honest.

Look at the basket case of the First Division; fading away because no-one's interested in joining. Dreck at the bottom of it usually because of no relegation. Dodgy "investors" coming in because the FAI can't afford to lose another club.

It's a big issue. We need a proper pyramid like every other country. We need a more unified game. We need promotion to the LoI, and for non-league clubs to develop beyond being big fish in a small pond.

A proper FAI Cup won't achieve all that, but it is part of what's needed.

So why not go for it?

[seand]

We definitely need a pyramid and more joined up thinking. I just think a dedicated and arduous FAI Cup qualifying phase for non-leaguers is not gonna be popular with junior clubs. It'd be seen as a chore and an additional commitment, I suspect.

[pineapple stu]

The idea that competing at the top level could be seen as a "chore" is exactly the kind of mindset to be gotten rid of, I think, and shouldn't be used as an excuse for anything.

Most clubs realistically would get knocked out after 2/3 games - it's the way of Cups. There's 22 games in in the LSL Major Saturday. Hardly taxing to add 2/3 more.

If it does pose a concern, get rid of the Leinster Senior Cup. A badly run, utterly pointless, competition with practically no interest.

(Obviously that's a Leinster bias - but the MSL is 18 games I think)

[EatYerGreens]

For the record, I'm not suggesting that teams in the UCD Superleague can enter the FAI Cup. If you have a fence around your pitch and changing rooms, I think that should be about enough.

The sole entry requirement should be a slick-looking DVD.

It's what JD would have wanted (sniffle)

[Nesta99]

Never gets old bar perhaps in Galway!
One of the reasons, albeit a petty one, that I enjoy non-league teams in the FAI Cup draw proper was due the far to common arrogance among junior clubs that they were LoI standard but couldnt be bothered with the hassle. Bar the odd exception like St Francis (or if a Dundalk fan Ashtownvilla/Malahide/Drogheda cup shockers) they usually get put in their place at least in the end...

Non league clubs should probably have to cede home advantage depending on their ground or find a suitable alternative. I get that that takes away from the romance of the cup but Stu's correct on the minimum being a permanant barrier arround the pitch and a reasonable clubhouse - changing rooms obviously lol, a bar preferably, but that there is definitely something along the likes of a medical room or one that can be temporarly kitted out. Changing roooms could suffice but definitely ambulance access that doesnt require a hike!

[Charlie Darwin]

Non league clubs should probably have to cede home advantage depending on their ground or find a suitable alternative.
That pretty much happens whenever they draw a LOI club. Bluebell moved their game to Tallaght a couple of years ago Crumlin moved to Iveagh Gardens against Dundalk, CIE to Greenogue against UCD.

[Nesta99]

Is that by choice though or by requirement? Not that it makes that much difference if it happens in practice. NL clubs might move to maximise the potential income but if they insisted on playing on a cabbage patch sould they do do?

[Charlie Darwin]

No, after the`first round they're forced unless they have a good ground. The FAI are strict on ground specs even in the Junior and Intermediate.

[redarmyfaction]

Most clubs realistically would get knocked out after 2/3 games - it's the way of Cups.

I don't what kind of maths they teach in UCD but 3/4 of initial entrants will be gone after 2 games.

[pineapple stu]

Well that assumes they all start in the first round, which mayn't be the case.

[redarmyfaction]

Well that assumes they all start in the first round, which mayn't be the case.
If all teams do not start in the first round that makes progress more improbable for those who do because the probability of a team who started in round 1 reaching round 4 is 12.5% while a team starting in R3 has a 50% of making R4.

Anyway my point stands a team in any KO tournament has at the nth round has a 25% chance of progressing to nth+2 as does my point about the sums they teach in Belfield.

[pineapple stu]

But I'm talking about all non-league teams, not just teams starting in the first round.

I think overall, there was nothing wrong with my statement, which is that most clubs - whatever stage they join at - will only last a max* of 2/3 games, and so seand's concerns about overloading non-league clubs' seasons are unfounded.

* - I should really have said in my original post that most clubs would be knocked out after 2/3 games, not would get knocked out. So it's an English typo, not a maths error.

[redarmyfaction]

But I'm talking about all non-league teams, not just teams starting in the first round.

I think overall, there was nothing wrong with my statement, which is that most clubs - whatever stage they join at - will only last a max* of 2/3 games, and so seand's concerns about overloading non-league clubs' seasons are unfounded.

* - I should really have said in my original post that most clubs would be knocked out after 2/3 games, not would get knocked out. So it's an English typo, not a maths error.

Did you not learn the Hole and Digging equation below?

[pineapple stu]

Must have been in the bar when they were giving that talk.

Bottom line is that, unless you want to get into tedious minutiae (and evidently you do - but then this is the internet after all), the fundamental point I made was entirely correct.

[redarmyfaction]

Must have been in the bar when they were giving that talk.

Bottom line is that, unless you want to get into tedious minutiae (and evidently you do - but then this is the internet after all), the fundamental point I made was entirely correct.
So so in UCD the uncontestable truth is tedious minutiae, nice to know that privilege outweighs logic.

[Johnnie C]

Lucan beat Aisling Annacotty 3-1 (aet) and St Michael’s beat Sheriff 1-0 in the outstanding qualifying round ties over the weekend. Anyone know when draw for 1st round is taking place?

[seand]

Lucan beat Aisling Annacotty 3-1 (aet) and St Michael’s beat Sheriff 1-0 in the outstanding qualifying round ties over the weekend. Anyone know when draw for 1st round is taking place?

July 4th was the draw last year, for the first round involving LoI teams on Aug 10/11, so possibly some time around then, but really who knows.

[nigel-harps1954]

Assume it'll be held during the festival of football in Limerick?

[littlebray]

Lucan beat Aisling Annacotty 3-1 (aet) and St Michael’s beat Sheriff 1-0 in the outstanding qualifying round ties over the weekend. Anyone know when draw for 1st round is taking place?

After what's been happening in the Junior Cup, do we really want them in the Senior??

[sbgawa]

Drives me nuts, why can't they do the draw now and let us anticipate.

[brendy_éire]

Draw is on Monday 8th at 19:00.

Non-LoI teams are:
Maynooth University Town
Collinstown
Malahide United F.C.
Glebe North
Lucan United
Crumlin United
Killester Donnycarney F.C.

[ArFella]

Draw is on Monday 8th at 19:00.

Non-LoI teams are:
Maynooth University Town
Collinstown
Malahide United F.C.
Glebe North
Lucan United
Crumlin United
Killester Donnycarney F.C.

Wouldn't that only make up 27 teams? I read elsewhere that Avondale & St. Michael's are also in the draw, so still missing 3 teams by my count.

[ArFella]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_FAI_Cup

Wikipedia has Cobh Wanderers, Glengad United & Letterkenny Rovers as the other 3 teams.

First round scheduled for weekend of August 10th

[joey B]

Glengad and Letterkenny rovers in it as well

[brendy_éire]

Completely ignored non-LSL sides!

Maynooth University Town
Collinstown
Malahide United F.C.
Glebe North
Lucan United
Crumlin United
Killester Donnycarney F.C.
Avondale United
Cobh Wanderers
Letterkenny Rovers
Glengad United F.C.
St. Michael's

[Martinho II]

Completely ignored non-LSL sides!

Maynooth University Town
Collinstown
Malahide United F.C.
Glebe North
Lucan United
Crumlin United
Killester Donnycarney F.C.
Avondale United
Cobh Wanderers
Letterkenny Rovers
Glengad United F.C.
St. Michael's

wheres glengad from as never heard of them? also will there be live coverage of it considerin soccer republic has bein massively scaled back?

[joey B]

wheres glengad from as never heard of them? also will there be live coverage of it considerin soccer republic has bein massively scaled back?
Glengads from North Inishowen, people think going to Ballybofey is a long trip you can add another hour on to get to Glengad!

[Martinho II]

Glengads from North Inishowen, people think going to Ballybofey is a long trip you can add another hour on to get to Glengad!

we played in buncrana in fai cup a few years back so i would imagine it is still a good bit up from there. sums up my ignorance when I spell the placename wrong!!

[nigel-harps1954]

wheres glengad from as never heard of them? also will there be live coverage of it considerin soccer republic has bein massively scaled back?

Most northern club in Ireland as far as I know. Pitch is out in the middle of nowhere. They played their qualifying round game against Home Farm there. If they managed to draw another non-league club or small First Division club they'd push to have their game played there, but if they drew a bigger club they'd likely move the game to Maginn Park.

It would certainly be an experience to anyone to go watch a game up there. Cracking surface, but no spectator facilities and barely even changing rooms there.

EDIT: Second most Northern club, Sea Rovers in Malin Head are the most northern.

[brendy_éire]

If they managed to draw another non-league club or small First Division club they'd push to have their game played there, but if they drew a bigger club they'd likely move the game to Maginn Park.

One of those teams I'd always love to draw away (along with Fanad), but moving it to Buncrana would be far less craic, but totally understandable.

[EatYerGreens]

Glengads from North Inishowen, people think going to Ballybofey is a long trip you can add another hour on to get to Glengad!

Not if you're coming from Derry though :p