Absolute rubbish!

[crc]

A bit of deja vu from last night as the boys in green defended abysmally and let the white team back into the game which should have been put beyond them. Wrong attitude, we shot ourselves in the foot and made far too many unforced errors. :mad: :(

[thejollyrodger]

Total sh1te for the entire 90mins :mad: :mad:

[Gareth]

As I said on Shels board:
They were TERRIBLE. No excuses, they were on a go slow or something. I have seen better league of ireland games. Portadown vs Shels was a better game. Terrible. Kerr should of freshened it up too. Bad all round. Lets hope France draw now!!

[Gibbe84]

The lack of urgency was horrible. They seemed to thing the game was over after four minutes when Morrison grabbed the early goal. They were killing time just wanting to get out of there from the half hour mark. I just didn't see the passion or work rate there tonight. It was almost as though the lads didn't care and thought Israel was some bum team that would quit. They failed to keep the ball for long periods of time and just didn't create enough chances. With Keano and Carr out midweek things don't look too great although Israel usually travel badly. I'm extremely disappointed.

[CollegeTillIDie]

Total sh1te for the entire 90mins :mad: :mad:

Was it even that good? :eek:

[thejollyrodger]

I was trying to put a positive spin on it.


Im glad that Carr and RMK are out for the return leg. At least Kerr has to include Reid and a mid fielder who can really run. Defintely not Mr Invisible though. Kavanagh or Miller

[thecorner]

I was trying to put a positive spin on it.


Im glad that Carr and RMK are out for the return leg
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[thejollyrodger]

Well did you think Roy has really put in a solid performance of international standard? Where was the hunger ? Reid is an attacking midfielder - something we need against israel so i dont know where the :rolleyes: comes from

[redgav]

definatly one to forget - straight from the Brian houllier school of defensivness.
only plus to come out of tonite is that so far after 70mins the french games scoreless

[Gibbe84]

Well did you think Roy has really put in a solid performance of international standard? Where was the hunger ? Reid is an attacking midfielder - something we need against israel so i dont know where the :rolleyes: comes from

If Reird loses some weight he might deserve a starting spot. If anyone has to go it's Kilbane who's been out of his depth at this level for years.

[carricksmasher]

0-0 in paris - up to us in the home games now

[Fergie's Son]

I'm gutted. That Israeli team was utter muck. Quite frankly Kerr's honeymoon is now over. I don't how well prepared Ireland are he just didn't pick the right team. He was playing for a draw the moment he picked Finnan over Reid. Morrisson was simply not match fit and should have been taken off at half-time. We're now playing for second place and the buck needs to stop with Kerr pure and simple.

[thejollyrodger]

France 0 Switzerland 0 is a result thank god

[Fergie's Son]

France 0 Switzerland 0 is a result thank god

How does that help us in real terms? France heads to Israel on Wednesday to pick up the win I assume.

[Gibbe84]

IMO the best result would have been a France win. We know that they will almost certainly win the group and therefore they'd might as well eliminate our challengers for second place. I know that sounds negative, but beating France over a whole group phase is tough. I think we could beat them on a one off but they have some much qualifty compared to everyone else. Why not cheer for them (I know how much it hurts to do so) and hope we can beat them, Israel and everyone else at Lansdowne or where ever the hell we end up playing (if games are moved).

[thejollyrodger]

reality check !!!

France are a pale comparison to what they were. They didnt score tonight cos they are a mess. The French public dont trust them, the players dont belive in the manager. They are unlikely to get a win against the Israeli's to be fair.

We couldnt get passed all those Israeli defenders and I cant see how the french will. The pitch is incredibly narrow. They didnt get past a crap Swiss defence at home tonight.

The swiss are no world beaters. They have a good tatical set up and maybe 1 or 2 good players. Look how open at the back they were against us. All in all, I think the general standard of this group is poor tbh and we have failed to capitalise on it with a negative mindset and hyping up the opposition by saying how great they are.

[dynamo kerry]

I think on balance of the games so far there was no reason we cou;dn't have won the group. in fact we still can.

away draws and home wins will put us in the reckoning.as it stands if we win all our remaining games (home to france, swiss, israel and away to faroes) then we win the group.

dont we?

[thejollyrodger]

World Cup Qualifying Group 4 Table
P W D L Pts
Ireland 5 2 3 0 9
France 5 2 3 0 9
Israel 5 2 3 0 9
Switzerland 4 1 3 0 6
Cyprus 5 0 1 4 1
Faroe Islands 4 0 1 3 1


in a word yes. providing France only gets a draw in Israel.

[dynamo kerry]

but didn#t france draw at home with israel so a win for them there is a must

[Declan_Michael]

Apart from Morrison's moment of genius did we create any chances? Whats the point of Duff working hard when nobody gets on the end of his passes.
Keane's booking was pointless and now means he's out of the next Israel game. 2 points lost could mean the difference betwen automatic qualification and a playoff - which we aren't very good at.

[boysingreen]

Our destiny is in our own hands. If we win the 5 games we have left (France, Switzerland, Israel at home and Cyprus & Faroe Islands away) we'll top the group and qualify automatically. Then again, the same is true of France, Switzerland, and Israel.. but they all have to come to Lansdowne Rd.

As it stands now Ireland (+5), France (+4), Israel (+2) (in that order on goal dif.) top the group, with Switzerland (+6) 3 points adrift and a game in hand.

[onenilgameover]

onenilgameover my arse....

I think tactically we we're shown to be very poor tonight....and that has to come down to the decisions of Kerr not to go with Reid and not to change things at half time when things were obviously not right. How many free kicks did we take in the israeli half that went backwards and did Roy Keane play a ball forward at any time during the match? Totally disappointed with the attitude to sit back and try to scrape a victory we did not deserve. If we do not get to Germany it will be because of tonight. Gutted!

[Burner]

I must admit I'm kind of glad that Roy Keane is out for the next game- he set the tone tonight- he stopped us playing. He rarely loses the ball and has a controlling influence but we should have created chances on the counter attack in the second half and we couldn't, not just because of Roy, but he in particular looked like he was saving his energy for the club games. I think a game out might give him a chance to reassess his contribution.

Remember Rui Costa being dropped from the Portugese team- a player of undoubted ability but one that slows the game down to a snail's pace. And at least he's creative. Keane just looks for the easy ball at all times, never beats a man, never hits it long, never even looked forward tonight for all I could see. If only we had an offensive central midfielder to play alongside him. Could Reid play in the centre?
It's just a pity all our other central midfielders are virtually the same.

Carr being out forces Finnan to take the full back role- which he should have taken tonight- Carr was caught out of position too many times, Finnan never took his man on, never took the game to the Israelis. Stick Reid in there, may be even Elliot, he's young, he has the hunger.

[brine3]

Who knows, maybe Stephen Kelly might be worth a look in at right-half, or Stephen Reid might rediscover his form of early 2002 in the closing months of this season. It seems you have to be called Stephen to be right-sided player in Ireland.

I was ****ed off at this match, it was like Croatia, Yugoslavia and Macedonia away all over again. I thought that kind of shaite was banned to the past forever. Why do we play so bad when we play away? Hopefully this match will be a good kick up the arse for the players. The good news is that we're top of the group and the only away matches we have left are the Faroes and Cyprus. I hope France win in Israel by a good margin, because we need a) the Israelis to become demoralised and b) the current incompetent French manager to hang on in there at all costs. The last thing we need is a rejuvenated France coming to Lansdowne under a new manager.

Roy Keane anno 2005 is a decent holding midfielder but we need a box to box guy (Roy Keane anno 2001) next to him to do the running. Kilbane isn't up to it, he tries but he just doesn't have the skill or the tactical knowledge. It really is a pity Tim Cahill isn't Irish. The team could have done with his energy and attacking nous on the pitch.

[tetsujin1979]

How France didn't beat the Swiss I'll never know, but the important thing is our destiny is still in our own hands. Holland will come in for Keane in the next game, Finnan will go right full and Reid/Duff will be right wing, probably swap wings all through the game too. Too tired/drunk/p!ssed off to comment on the outcome of that game, what I will say is I think a draw or an Israeli win on wednesday is the best we can hope for.

But what's bothering me more than anything is the amount of people in the pub who were calling for Kerr to quit! I was told to boo Brian Kerr at the China game on tuesday - which I have no intention of doing.

[Fergie's Son]

I certainly wouldn't boo Kerr but I think the honeymoon is over. He left on Morrisson for far too long. Had McCarthy done that we would have been screaming blue murder. Moreover, he didn't try and go for the juggular when we could have won the game. Choosing Finnan was also set the tone of the match: Negative.

[blobbyblob]

ABSOLUTELY DISGUSTED. the whole game looks like it was in slow motion. they got the the edge of the box. stopped and passed their way all the way back to Given. They silenced the crowd after 3 minutes and fell got back on the plane for the last 87 minutes. Should be ashamed. We should be all but qualified this morning but they made a balls of it.

Gob****es

Fair play to the Israelis. They deserved more. Carbon copy of Switzerland.

[Condex]

Was at the game, thought Roy Keane played fairly well it was the people around him that were crap. Kilbane was back top his donkey days, Morrison apart from the goal did nothing, Robbie Keane did the usual I think its time to give Elliott a run.

And of Kerr :

1) did we take one decent free kick
2) Should have tried to kill the game at the end by putting on subs

[Junior]

Was at the game, thought Roy Keane played fairly well it was the people around him that were crap. Kilbane was back top his donkey days, Morrison apart from the goal did nothing, Robbie Keane did the usual I think its time to give Elliott a run.

And of Kerr :

1) did we take one decent free kick
2) Should have tried to kill the game at the end by putting on subs

At last some reasonable analysis.

Keane had a good game in midfield, one or two misplaced passes early on, but after that he ensured we kept posession, got forward on occasion but generally held the middle of the park together. Booking was costly though and unnecessary. I thought Kilbane covered a lot of ground, played deeper than usual (probably at Kerrs request) he put in a lot of tackles.

Carr and Obrien were disappointing at the back. Carr was caught out of position on a number of occasions and needlessly gave the ball away far too many times (some times far too close to our own goal!). O'Brien took too many risks for my liking at the back and I was expecting him to get robbed at any time during the game leaving a one on one with Given.

Cunningham did what he had to. O'shea played ok, supported Duff quite well on the left, which was pretty much where all our forward play came from.

Finnan on the Right was solid enough just not involved as much as I would have liked.

Robbie held the ball up well and as usual always showed for the ball. Probably should have done better with the header, but didn't really get/create another chance all night after that.

Morrison did little after his excellent opener.

Set Pieces were absolutely SHOCKING. Not one free or corner caused any danger whatsoever. Considering this 2nd string keeper was going to be tested - someone forgot to tell the players or at least practice something beforehand. Even the little dink freekick in the first half was a half cocked attempt.

At 1-0 we had them rattled and we should have picked up a 2nd goal as quickly as possible. We had alot of controlled posession and the Israelis seemed to struggle to get the ball back. However, the longer the game went on, the more half chances they created, the more likely and equaliser was imminent.

Have we learned nothing from the likes of Macedonia away?

Gutted.

[OwlsFan]

Hilarious some of the reactions here from the people who, like TurfPaddy, said in other posts they weren't worried about the result - that it was a dead cert. If you look at the predictions thread elsewhere we have a vast majority going for a win. In other threads we have people saying this is the new era - all this positive cr+p and talking about World Cup Semi Finals.

Fact: (a) we haven't won a major game away from home for 18 years!!
(b) our two main strikers aren't regulars starters in their Premiership sides.
(c) other than France away, the team's away competitive performances under Kerr have been poor (draw and loss away to Swiss, draw in Albania, scrape a win in Georgia)
(d) he picks negative sides (two full backs playing on the right and leaves ANdy Reid warming his ass on the bench).
(e) In midfield we have Kilbane who is losing form every day at Everton and a Keane in decline (but still a good player).
(f) in centre of defence we have O'Brien not getting his game at Newcastle and at full back O'Shea (also not getting his game at Man U and who finds it very difficult to pass to one of his own players).

Therefore it was unlikely we would win in Israel and for people to come on here and say it was rubbish amuses me - what did you expect based upon the standard of our players, the negative approach of the manager and past history ? I think that this was one of the most predictable performances imaginable for those who have followed Irish football for a long time - especially the last minute equaliser :mad:

We have got draws in all our 3 away matches so that's ok. But for Clint's magical strike we might be coming home with nothing.

Qualification is in our hands but it will be a very hard battle. Our competitive record at home under Kerr isn't great either (Russia draw, Faroes 2-0 !! and Cyprus 3 or 4 -0).

And for those who like to have a dig at Mick Mc over his comments on the 2-2 in Holland, anyone hear Kerr saying that while he was disappointed with the late equaliser, he was satisfied with a point. Plus ca change.

[Stuttgart88]

It's crazy to suggest a French win would have been best. :mad: Luckily we're still well placed but what a chance missed to take this group by the balls. At least Israel will still be fighting like mad on Wednesday now too I suppose. Some very small consolation.

I actually thought RMK was good last night. Kilbane, who's had a great 12 months, was just not up to it in CM. Time for a rethink here. Keane anchored well but we needed some guile and creativity instead of a worker who was way off his game.

In general there were a few non-performers: Carr & Kilbane stood out for me as the biggest flops (actually wasn't it the same in Basle too?). Both the forwards were largely anonymous though I think that was probably more a function of our lack of penetration from midfield. But the biggest non-performance of all was from the bench - how on earth were Kerr & Hughton happy to leave things unchanged for so long?

Set pieces were an utter shambles.

Now the booze has worn off and some of the anger has subsided I still see things the same way: that was a narrow pitch which made it easier for them to handle Duff. If we'd had Reid on the pitch they'd have had somebody else to think about. Personally I'd have made 2 changes at half-time: another central midfielder in place of KK - Kav would have been my choice.

Also Reid for Morrisson and changing the shape to 4-5-1, or 4-4-1-1, NOT the defensive move it appears on paper. We'd have had Duff & Reid as attacking threats AND a more solid look to midfield.

Whether this is right or not is one thing. The real issue is that something needed to be done & it wasn't. Kerr really failed in his job last night because Israel were nowhere near as good as many of us thought they'd be and tactically we had nothing up our sleeves to capitalise on this. I don't even blame Kerr for picking the same XI that played well in France but when it was obvious things weren't happening that's when the bench could have sealed the 3 points for us.

We should still be fully behind Kerr but at some stage we have to assume the moral courage to kill these games off.

[onceahoop]

Carr was muck. Gave the ball away too many times. O'Brien failed to get out quick enough to block the goal and committed the cardinal sin (IMO) of turning his back and jumping. Kilbane was anonymous and there was a complete lack of urgency going forward. The Israeli back four looked very poor under pressure and even when they weren't the made basic errors.

Crap.

[brine3]

Good points Stutt. At the risk of getting shot here, we were always more of a danger at set-pieces when Harte was around. Just looking at O'Shea standing over a ball is enough to give me the willies.

That's another reason to bring Kav on - he's excellent at set pieces!

[brine3]

O'Brien failed to get out quick enough to block the goal and committed the cardinal sin (IMO) of turning his back and jumping.

The whole team was at fault here because we were standing with 11 men in the penalty box just asking the Israelis to have a crack. To single out O'Brien is a bit unfair.

[onenilgameover]

And for those who like to have a dig at Mick Mc over his comments on the 2-2 in Holland, anyone hear Kerr saying that while he was disappointed with the late equaliser, he was satisfied with a point. Plus ca change.


Have to agree with that. kerr's after match comments where from the Ireland text book of old. He should have been totally livid at dropping those points against a very poor side except its the old mantra great if we win good if we draw...We will get nowhere with this attitude. It may be too close to comment after this shocking result but the Swiss look better to qualify in first place.

[thejollyrodger]

It may be too close to comment after this shocking result but the Swiss look better to qualify in first place.

Swiss qualify first ? unlikely. I think its time we took an honest look at the games we played. We have all the hard work done and were in a better postion than most of the other teams. If France draw next Wednesday then I will be in good enough form.


We know we nearly had the upper hand of both France and Israel and to a lesser extend Swtizerland. Were at home and all the players know what they have to do. Plus hopefully the players will be fitter then getting regular first team football.

[onenilgameover]

Swiss qualify first ? unlikely. I think its time we took an honest look at the games we played. We have all the hard work done and were in a better postion than most of the other teams. If France draw next Wednesday then I will be in good enough form.



The Swiss looked like they were up for it last night which as they say in international football is half the battle. They are ****e at the back but the attitude is right I think if were not out of sight by the last game against them. They will put us under serious pressure and I'm not sure where good in situations like that. Sure we're the best friendly team around when there's no real pressure on yet when it comes to tuff games we seem to bottle it and those matches have been well documented here I'm not gonna drag up the past we just need to be wary of them the have their away draw in Isreal and France and have a better goal difference and have beaten us at home already in the last 4 years they only difference is we've played em away already I don't think its unlikely at all and we would be foolish to think that it would be

[Stuttgart88]

That's another reason to bring Kav on - he's excellent at set pieces!

So too is Andy Reid (& McGeady for that matter though I wouldn't have had him on last night).


Have to agree with that. kerr's after match comments where from the Ireland text book of old. He should have been totally livid at dropping those points
Maybe he was livid. I tend not to read much into the mumbo jumbo said in press conferences.

A wider & bigger pitch, home crowd and enforced personnel changes ought to see us put Israel straight back in Dublin. Finnan is our no. 1 right-full back in my mind. Carr's recent run of form at Newcastle hasn't translated into good form in green.

I don't see why people are knocking O'Brien. I thought he & Kenny did quite well last night.

Time for a rethink in certain areas:
Finnan over Carr
A genuine central midfielder to partner Keane going forward.
Offensive 4-3-3 / 4-5-1 (i.e., using both Duff & Reid to full effect) is an option but defensive 4-5-1 (i.e., replacing Morrison with Holland and leaving Finnan RHM) is not. Bearing this in mind I'd give this a dry run at some stage on Tuesday (with McGeady instead of Duff maybe). Kav & Holland to start CM in any event.

A draw on Wednesday and 6 points in June would still leave us in a nice position. I still think that when we have our best attacking talent on the pitch (Robbie, Duffer, Reid, Kav) we're a handful but the memory of a crap 1-1 at home to Russia & a fluky 2-1 win over Albania, as well as the realisation that we're tactically one-dimensional, has me feeling cautious.

[pineapple stu]

Maybe he was livid. I tend not to read much into the mumbo jumbo said in press conferences.
The door to the dressing room was locked after the game, so it seems like he (or Keane, as Dunphy suggested! :p ) had someone up against the wall giving out hell. Which was about the only bit of good news all evening (until France drew again) as that preformance was shambolic. Whenever we got into the final third of the pitch, we stopped, let Israel regroup and then passed all the way back to Given. Keane (Roy) kept on passing level or back - never forward. If he's supposed to be dictating our play, he has to be more attack-minded than that surely? Finnan was poor - kept on going back. So much was made of the keeper being poor under crosses - and at the first corner, we put two men on him to try and unnerve him - but when we got the ball in wide positions, we never crossed! Same for frees! I can't see how the players unanimously decided to not to attack at all ever - Kerr has to take much of the blame for the team's mentality surely? We played well for five minutes - while at 0-0 and at 1-1. This has happened in the every game so far - we stopped playing against the Faroes and Cyprus at 2-0 up, and stopped at 1-0 up in Switzerland. WHY?!?!?!? :mad: :mad:

Our next game is home to Israel - this was a perfect opportunity (along with the French visit on Wednesday) to end their qualification hopes before that game - instead, they're going to be more fired up than they need to be. Shocking stuff...

[Donal81]

Another 60 seconds and maybe we'd all be saying it was a classic defensive performance away from home...That goal was meaningless in that there's nothing you can do about a strike like that, which came out of nowhere.

I don't think it was an overtly defensive performance in that we dominated possession and were in the Israeli half for most of the game. Where we really failed was on set-pieces; our free-kicks and corners were dismal.

I can't remember how many corners floated gently into the keeper's hands. How many free-kicks that went straight into a wall of players...

One of the things I remember being told on my first day as an under-8 player many years ago was that, when taking a corner, aim the ball for the penalty spot. The curl on the ball will leave it perched between the six yard box and the penalty spot. The keeper will either come for it and be exposed or stay there and allow you to have a go at it. Why did we forget this time and time again?

The result is a sickener but I don't think Kerr's tactics were that bad. What was woeful was the wasted possession and he has to take some responsibiity for that, as do our players.

[thejollyrodger]

on my first day as an under-8 player many years ago was that, when taking a corner, aim the ball for the penalty spot.

You were knocking them in to the peno area at 7 years old : p


seriously, I think we learnt a lot more about this team than if we got away with the 3 points. It would have been like after the italy rugby match. No changes would have been made and the bandwagon would have continued. It could have all come crashing down later in the group.

Still on schedule but we need to bring in new players.

[FarBeag]

The game is finished now, we drew with a very poor team and were lucky to get away with that, it was a result that many of us predicted before the game so why are we so SHOCKED.Given made a couple of fine saves and we had no other chances to win it apart from Robbies header, so to be fair we should be happy with the result.
The performance is another thing,totally negative especially after we scored the goal ,but we should have known that this would happen. We are always indifferent away from home and will remain like this unless we have more belief in ourselves. Lads,just look at the team..We really have only three world class players..Given. Roy and Duffers.The next best are Reid,Cunningham Carr (sometimes but not judging on last nites performance)Robbie, Maceady.The rest are a long way off. Kilbane played one good game for us last year and that was against France since that he has been utter crap and plays like that day in day out with Everton. O'Brien did nothing wrong last night but is not a regular at Newcastle, same applies to O'Shea.


We have a very small pool of players to choose from and we are not or never will be world beaters.If the players can regain the passion,pull together and all wear(I mean all) their hearts on their sleeves then we have a chance but dont forget we still have to play Cyprus away(which wont be easy)..
I also cant believe that people are calling for kerrs head its the players that have to be blamed just as much as him.

[ken foree]

seriously, I think we learnt a lot more about this team than if we got away with the 3 points. It would have been like after the italy rugby match. No changes would have been made and the bandwagon would have continued. It could have all come crashing down later in the group.


this is funny, i felt almost a weird relief last night when israel scored late on - as if the hype balloon had been justifiably punctured and deflated. strips away the bullsh*t and starts us anew

[thejollyrodger]

ken fore are you joking ?

I wanted to see us picking up the 3 points too. But we didnt deserve it. Questions must be asked about the mentality of this Irish side and the players who were picked werent up for it. In fairness if we had won we would all be cheering for Morrison and Kerr saying what a brilliant manager he is while papering over a dismal performance.

We would be going in to the China game not willing to make changes etc. As they say, more is learnt about a side in defeat than in victory.

[brine3]

Andy O'Brien's stats

2004/05 18 (so far)
2003/04 23
2002/03 26
2001/02 34

Looks regular enough to me.

O'Brien seems to me to be more of a continental defender. I think he's kind of wasted in the 100 miles an hour Premiership. He'd do well to move to Serie A. Not that they're begging for defenders there or anyone there wants him, but I think he'd do well there.

[Condex]

We really have only three world class players..Given. Roy and Duffers.The next best are Reid,Cunningham Carr (sometimes but not judging on last nites performance)Robbie, Maceady.The rest are a long way off. Kilbane played one good game for us last year and that was against France since that he has been utter crap and plays like that day in day out with Everton. O'Brien did nothing wrong last night but is not a regular at Newcastle, same applies to O'Shea.


Hear, hear but I would rather loose playing well than to play like we did lasty night.

[Stuttgart88]

we are not or never will be world beaters. I also cant believe that people are calling for kerrs head its the players that have to be blamed just as much as him.

Nobody's saying we should be world beaters at the moment, just that we are good enough with XI Premiership players to see out the last few minutes against a poor side by keeping possession in their part of the pitch. It's not as if what happened last night is anything new to an Irish team. We should have been good enough to do it but we weren't. It's so frustrating.

Of course the players are to blame too, but you've also got to blame Kerr for leaving things unchanged for so long when it was obvious some players weren't playing well or having any influence. Kilbane, as you say, was crap. But it's not his fault he was on the pitch throughout the game. It's not Clinton's fault that one of our forwards was exhausted. Saying Kerr must take a lot of the blame is not the same as calling for his head though.

As for not winning being a good thing because it punctures the bandwagon, the softer aspects of the Irish media is a cross we will always have to bear unfortunately. I'd rather have the 3 points and still have an objective and honest appraisal of last night's performance from those who can tell their arse from their elbow.

Anyway, it's done now. Luckily we are still in a good position but I just hope some lessons are learnt from this. Maybe it's a welcome reality check.

[eirebhoy]

We've played 5 matches and 3 of those matches have been our hardest on paper. We are joint top of the group and we have the easiest run in of all the teams left. If we won last night it would have been our best win in an away qualifier in 15 years. If Israel lost we also would have broke a very good undefeated run in Tel Aviv from them.

Too many people are underestimating the difference between playing at home and playing away, especially with this team. Mick McCarthy was coaching us for what? 6 years? He only lost 1 home competitive match in that 6 years with no better a team than we have now and that match was his last match in charge against Switzerland. Our away record is brutal and until that changes we can't be expected to beat teams like Israel no matter how good we look on paper.

Looking at the table, all we need is 4 wins and a draw against either France/Swiss to top the group. We really can't expect it to be any more in our own hands than that in a group like this.

And the only thing we can blame Kerr on is playing Finnan on the right of midfield and replacing Morrison with Holland. I hate SGE but I still backed him when they lost against the French. Everyone put the blame on his tactics for the way they sat back. Its psychological and no coach can do anything about that. I remember I had a bet on Chelsea to beat Arsenal on Highbury in the quarters of the CL. I was probably happier to see them go 1-0 down than I would have been if it stayed 0-0 as it was inevitable that Arsenal would sit back.

This is what he Kerr after the match:
“We didn’t create a whole lot, and could have been more incisive going forward."

He's basically saying what we all are. You can't put all the blame on Kerr. Kilbane has gone from being MOM in our last 2 qualifiers to the fans wanting to be dropped. Duffer was not at his best but nobody likes to admit it about him. If it was anyone else that passed that ball back like Duffer did in the match he would have been slated to bits. Robbie Keane was poor too. In fact, Cunningham was our only 1 good outfield player last night. Everyone deserves their fair share of blame, not just the coach.

[Éanna]

We really have only three world class players..Given. Roy and Duffers.The next best are Reid,Cunningham Carr (sometimes but not judging on last nites performance)Robbie, Maceady.The rest are a long way off. Kilbane played one good game for us last year and that was against France since that he has been utter crap and plays like that day in day out with Everton. O'Brien did nothing wrong last night but is not a regular at Newcastle, same applies to O'Shea.
Given and Duff are world class. Roy Keane WAS, certainly isn't anymore judging by last night and the two Milan games when he was hardly noticeable. Cunningham IMO is one of the best in the Premiership, but most defenders in that league are average at best anyway. None of the others are near world class, and only 3 (Robbie, Reid and McGeady) have the potential to be anything like world class. As for Kilbane- to say he's only had one good game for the FAireland team, and that he plays crap for everton........well, thats just so far wide of the mark it doesn't even warrant a response

[tricky_colour]

Lets take a look at the remaining away fixtures.

France:--Swiss, ROI, Israel.
Israel:--- ROI, Swiss, Faroe Islands.
Swiss:---ROI, Cyprus, Faroe Islands
ROI:-----Cyprus, Faroe Islands.

France have to face 3 of the 'big four'
Israel have to face 2 of the 'big four'
Swiss have to face 1 of the 'big four'
ROI have to face 0 of the 'big four'

We are in a great position, its not easy winning away from home as we
and the others have found.

None of these teams have got a result against us on their home ground
so their chances of doing so away from home are pretty slim, most
will be happy to come away with a draw.

If we had held out for the win we would have been in a fantastic position,
as it is we are in a good position, one which our rivals must be envious of.