Republic of Ireland V USA, Saturday, 2nd June 2018 - Friendly

[pineapple stu]

The US beat Bolivia 3-0 in a friendly last night; as noted in the World Football forum, George Weah's son scored on his debut.

Looks a very experimental squad going off wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_men's_national_soccer_team#Current_s quad) (which lists an insane number of players in the list of those called up in the last 12 months; 5 players have ten caps or more.

Really hard to know what to expect from this - or want from it.

A full team, a vaguely decent performance, and a win?

A full team, turgid hoofball nonsense, and a win?

Starts for Suppler, Burke, Williams et al and be happy with a defeat but some new players around?

And will the ground even be half-full? I'd actually forgotten I had a season ticket, which I think covers this one - or was there something about it covering a friendly in November instead of this one?

[tetsujin1979]

spinning the discussion for the upcoming friendly into its own thread

[OwlsFan]

The US beat Bolivia 3-0 in a friendly last night; as noted in the World Football forum, George Weah's son scored on his debut.

Looks a very experimental squad going off wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_men's_national_soccer_team#Current_s quad) (which lists an insane number of players in the list of those called up in the last 12 months; 5 players have ten caps or more.

Really hard to know what to expect from this - or want from it.

A full team, a vaguely decent performance, and a win?

A full team, turgid hoofball nonsense, and a win?

Starts for Suppler, Burke, Williams et al and be happy with a defeat but some new players around?

And will the ground even be half-full? I'd actually forgotten I had a season ticket, which I think covers this one - or was there something about it covering a friendly in November instead of this one?

It's included in the season ticket http://www.fai.ie/ireland/news/republic-of-ireland-to-host-usa-in-friendly

One question is will the Villa players and Fulham player be available for this game after the play off game. I think we have some reasonable promise in midfield. I worry about us up front and on the flanks. We need perhaps to play a game where wing backs do our attacking and we have such players in Coleman, Doherty and Cyrus.

We need a win. Losing can become a habit too easily.

[sbgawa]

A performance and a moral victory :)

[zero]

Perhaps not the right thread for this, though not sure it warrants a seperate thread - what would be our strongest side were everyone available?

Randolph
Coleman Duffy Clark Ward
McClean Rice McCarthy Arter/Hendrick Brady
Hogan?

Only five of the above featured against France.

I can't see us playing two up front anytime soon as it's the position in which we are arguably weakest. Villa will have to sell you'd think having failed to get promoted so Hogan/Hourihane's future is interesting given they were both big money signings so presumably on big enough wages.

[Diggs246]

Perhaps not the right thread for this, though not sure it warrants a seperate thread - what would be our strongest side were everyone available?

Randolph
Coleman Duffy Clark Ward
McClean Rice McCarthy Arter/Hendrick Brady
Hogan?

Only five of the above featured against France.

I can't see us playing two up front anytime soon as it's the position in which we are arguably weakest. Villa will have to sell you'd think having failed to get promoted so Hogan/Hourihane's future is interesting given they were both big money signings so presumably on big enough wages.

I would have Doherty at LB, Kevin long ahead of Clark and Brady would be on the bench for me

[SkStu]

Really hard to know what to ... want from it.

the semblance of a plan. A team that will play football and pass with intent.

[Razors left peg]

If this game turns into more of the same launching the ball aimlessly and stuggling to get even a chance let alone a goal I think there will be a struggle to get 10000 people at the games in september. There has to be some sign that he has been working with the players for the last 2 weeks and wants to change something going into the next qualifers.

[Closed Account]

1002970859047440384

[Paddy Garcia]

Any links for this lads?

[tricky_colour]

http://cricfree.sc/watch/live/ireland-vs-usa-live-streaming

[tricky_colour]

better link

http://sports4u.info/events/ireland-republic-vs-usa-live-free-streaming/

[Cathalsmart]

As always look clueless as you’d expect when you play for a manager who doesn’t get how modern football works, this is the worst team we will play all year and we still look hopeless.

[Cathalsmart]

And the US score 😂 it’s actually laughable how bad we are at the minute, losing at home to basically a u21 side and a bunch of journeymen at home, think we have hit rock bottom.

[tetsujin1979]

Shocking goal to concede

[pineapple stu]

It's much better than the French game, but I don't know how many of these guys would get near the full US team alright. It's a full strength team for us by comparison - albeit injury-hit.

That goal was poor too. Should Doyle have claimed the header across goal?

It's an end of season friendly, so I wouldn't be too worried about it, but there's little positive in it alright

[Cathalsmart]

Losing to a US b team at home who have not even clicked, try defending Martin O’Neill now. We look like a team of headless chickens like always. There is nothing positive about this management team at all and I can’t believe they are still here. If we lose this game MON can just leave, I honestly am lost for words at how bad we are.

[pineapple stu]

Not going to argue against that.

I wonder how many fewer season tickets will be sold this time? Renewal is now

[ger121]

Last LOI player to score for Ireland?

[tricky_colour]

1-1 the Irish revival is on.

[pineapple stu]

Giles reckoned in another thread.

I suspect it was a better goal!

Thought he was quiet up to then. Far from alone in it, mind

[ger121]

Twitter says Treacy, 78 vs Turkey.

[pineapple stu]

Enda Stevens is marking Weah.

I have seen it all now

[tricky_colour]

2-1.

MON best manger in the world .

[tricky_colour]

We're back!! :hat::applouse::victorious:

[tetsujin1979]

I'm made up for Alan judge getting the winner, after being out for so long injured

[samhaydenjr]

Didn't see the game but from the comments here during play and on RTE's website it sounds like a catastrophe - a 2-1 come-from-behind victory (with a third wrongly flagged offside), with goals coming from two of the newbies to the team, along with another man-of-the-match performance from another up-and-comer, with a couple of other inexperienced players also doing well - dark days ahead indeed. Seriously though, the main point of these last four games was to take the chance to look at some new options... results and performance were secondary to getting a few more players bedded in, even if the performance was a little disappointing. So the main questions for those of you who did watch the recent friendlies is: Who makes the cut to be part of the Nations League action? Declan Rice by the sounds of it for one. Did the likes of Alan Browne, Darragh Lenihan and Daryl Horgan do enough to merit competitive action? Is Callum O'Dowda justifying MON's faith in him? Matt Doherty or Cyrus Christie for right-back cover? Is 3-5-2 a viable option for us? If so, does Derrick Williams' experience on the left side of a back three make him a candidate? Should the Graham Burke Experiment continue, even if he doesn't get a move to England? And where, oh where, are the goals going to come from during the next campaign?

[micls]

I was at the game. It was ****e. O Dowda stood out, as did Rice. Horgan gave us a bit of energy when he came on. Burke did fine, some nice touches but not in the game enough

[geysir]

USA 3rd team, maybe as good as Forest Green Rovers (reserves), maybe not and yet we struggled to play football. One thing for sure, Weah's son is better than his (alleged) cousin.

[samhaydenjr]

I was at the game. It was ****e. O Dowda stood out, as did Rice. Horgan gave us a bit of energy when he came on. Burke did fine, some nice touches but not in the game enough

Thanks for the input. Pity it wasn't a great performance overall but in this case you could justifiably say that this is the third most important aspect, behind the result (a come-from-behind win) and even more importantly, the performance of youngsters who were being blooded in or evolving into more important members of the team. And in that regard, it was a worthwhile exercise with both O'Dowda and Rice impressing you and Horgan offering something also. Also, I don't know about his general performance, but Darragh Lenihan clearly has an eye for goal, having essentially been robbed of two today, once by a team-mate and once by a linesman's flag.


USA 3rd team, maybe as good as Forest Green Rovers (reserves), maybe not and yet we struggled to play football. One thing for sure, Weah's son is better than his (alleged) cousin.

OK, now that's just a silly comparison - there was only one player on the field whose club could reasonably be compared to Forest Green Rovers and he wasn't wearing the Stars and Stripes. While this US team was young and inexperienced internationally, it was made up of players from clubs in the EPL, Bundesliga, La Liga, Liga MX, Eredivisie, Ligue 1 amd Danish Superliga topped up with some experienced MLS players. So while it doesn't make us world-beaters, this is still a fairly decent result for an end-of-season friendly where we took the opportunity to blood a few youngsters

[liamoo11]

I think 3 centrehalves should be our formation allows us to get Coleman and Brady on the ball and into the game. The danger in it for me is it leaves McLean without a natural position and increases the likihood that he plays behind the front man which I think is his worst possible role all headless and no guile. O dowda in that must forward midfield three offers us the ability to keep the ball and play a bit of ball. While McCarthy is out then Rice is needed most in midfield I think. The hope for me is the long and Mcguire can become a partnership up from but does Mcguire have the technical tools to play that link role at this level? Burke has more Of The style for that role but he is slower than mcgoldrick and it's hard to see him making up for those physical limitations enough to play in the premier league on a regular basis

[pineapple stu]

Twitter says Treacy, 78 vs Turkey.
Turns out both Giles and Treacy scored in the same game, but Giles scored first, so Treacy is the correct answer.

n7In9YUM9j8

[Diggs246]

(Apart from Rice) The one other very positive thing to come out of these friendly games, is that kevin long is now a starter for us. I think he is really good

[nigel-harps1954]

OK, now that's just a silly comparison - there was only one player on the field whose club could reasonably be compared to Forest Green Rovers and he wasn't wearing the Stars and Stripes

Why list something as a silly comparison and go on to make one yourself?

[Stuttgart88]

Jesus that was hard to watch and I came home just flattened by the way O’Neill is managing this team.

Watched 2nd half again this morning am am now more positive, especially the way we played in the last 10-20 mins - though USA seemed to just collapse.

We won every second ball and used it constructively. I think Horgan made a lot happen by wanting the ball a lot. Horgan and Stevens worked very well together. Horgan has a great gift of being able to just crate a few feet of space to put in a good cross. A better player than McLean and far better at receiving the ball.

Stevens deserves credit but I actually think it’s at least as much down to picking a specialist LB in the LB position. Williams did OK in Paris and I think Cunningham deserves a look.

Overall I’m disappointed 2 friendlies went by without looking properly at Doherty.

Rice, Lenihan, Stevens (what a first touch from a drilled pass from Horgan) and Horgan were all excellent later on. O’Dowda decent but careless at times.

Kevin Long quietly impressive. Arter had a strong cameo. Burke was good all night I thought - better than Maguire is my first impression of each in an international shirt. Sure, Turkey away is harder but Maguire’s first touch was poor all night in his debut.

Doyle to blame for a goal again. As soon as the US won that header he should have charged out to at least punch it. Randolph would have I’m certain. Hendrick was shocked he didn’t come for it, though he should have taken charge himself in the absence of a shout.

We have 3 better keepers, Brady, McCarthy, Clark and Shane Long still to come back. That’s a lot of experience.

Hourihane, Hogan, Maguire, Doherty, Judge etc are still to figure properly. Browne has something to offer I think but needs a few more games before we can decide.

I’d make a good fist of making a good team from all of that.

So, less pessimistic than at HT yesterday except I still have no faith whatsoever in O’Neill and the first half was ****. The sight of O’Neill flanked by Keane, Guppy and Walford - who thinks he’s in fcuking Miami Vice - just makes me think we are managed by a bunch of utterly ineffective free loaders. We capped a few new faces but deep down I think O’Neill will interpret what he saw in a regressive fashion.

That’s where I disagree with SamHjr - I just don’t see O’Neill learning what was capable of being learnt from these games.

[colonelwest]

Thought that was a decent workout last night, albeit against an experimental USA team. For their goal arguably Doyle could have come for it but Hendrick shouldn't have let the ball past him unless he got a shout or something. Rice again MOM, only fella we have who'll show for and demand the ball and play little 5 yard passes to keep things ticking over and the odd through ball. We'll see how long him doing that lasts! Not to make the comparison but touch of the McGrath's about him in that we're well stocked at centre half and he's good enough positionally and with the ball that he can play in the middle of the park in front of the back four.

O'Dowda did ok, couple of nice driving runs through the middle but for me he's not a CM or an attacking CM even in a three. 2 appearances in Landsdowne for Horgan and the couple of crosses he put in in both appearances put the rest to shame, would like to see him given more minutes come the Autumn, he's out of favour at Preston though as Neill is very conservative in his approach. Love McClean's passion and work rate but he's been all over the place bar where he's supposed to be playing in the few games this year leaving gaps all over the shop. Great finish by Judge for the winner, hopefully he can get a good preseason behind him over the summer and start the season where he left off before his injury.

We've decent options all across the park and we're looking better for the future than 12/18 months ago imo, as usual though we need someone to start scoring goals and to bloody pass the ball 5 yards to someone who'll actually show for it instead of punting it down the channels.

[samhaydenjr]

Why list something as a silly comparison and go on to make one yourself?

OK, let's see if I can reasonably compare Forest Green to Graham Burke's team:
1. Stadium size: 5000
2. Average attendance: 2500-3500
3. Their Kit is hoops
4. THEY'RE CALLED ROVERS!

[liamoo11]

Thought that was a decent workout last night, albeit against an experimental USA team. For their goal arguably Doyle could have come for it but Hendrick shouldn't have let the ball past him unless he got a shout or something. Rice again MOM, only fella we have who'll show for and demand the ball and play little 5 yard passes to keep things ticking over and the odd through ball. We'll see how long him doing that lasts! Not to make the comparison but touch of the McGrath's about him in that we're well stocked at centre half and he's good enough positionally and with the ball that he can play in the middle of the park in front of the back four.

O'Dowda did ok, couple of nice driving runs through the middle but for me he's not a CM or an attacking CM even in a three. 2 appearances in Landsdowne for Horgan and the couple of crosses he put in in both appearances put the rest to shame, would like to see him given more minutes come the Autumn, he's out of favour at Preston though as Neill is very conservative in his approach. Love McClean's passion and work rate but he's been all over the place bar where he's supposed to be playing in the few games this year leaving gaps all over the shop. Great finish by Judge for the winner, hopefully he can get a good preseason behind him over the summer and start the season where he left off before his injury.

We've decent options all across the park and we're looking better for the future than 12/18 months ago imo, as usual though we need someone to start scoring goals and to bloody pass the ball 5 yards to someone who'll actually show for it instead of punting it down the channels.

I can't see where Hogan will fit in if we go 3 at the back which I think o Neill will to try and have Coleman and Brady more involved. O dowda has been an o Neill project and I really hope he continues to play in that 3 in midfield he brings us a bit of guile and confidence on ball with lively acceleration.

I liked the bit of variety on free kicks and corners second half mostly from Hendrick which is where the first goal came from with the ball back to o dowda .

For the second when Coleman rolled the ball back to rice on the sideline last minute of game 99% Of The time in an Ireland game the player receiving it is keeping his head down and pumping it into the box. It was quality to see rice look up and play such a lovely weighted ball for McLean who to be fair did ever so well to sell the dummy.

[seanfhear]

O’ Neill needs a new John Robertson . His coaching backup team needs a shake up .

Why not get some new coaching blood in . Surely O’ Neill does not think he knows it all .

[colonelwest]

I can't see where Hogan will fit in if we go 3 at the back which I think o Neill will to try and have Coleman and Brady more involved. O dowda has been an o Neill project and I really hope he continues to play in that 3 in midfield he brings us a bit of guile and confidence on ball with lively acceleration.

I liked the bit of variety on free kicks and corners second half mostly from Hendrick which is where the first goal came from with the ball back to o dowda .

For the second when Coleman rolled the ball back to rice on the sideline last minute of game 99% Of The time in an Ireland game the player receiving it is keeping his head down and pumping it into the box. It was quality to see rice look up and play such a lovely weighted ball for McLean who to be fair did ever so well to sell the dummy.

I think the 3 at the back is definitely an option for us now, we've the players/ depth positionally for it compared to the half arsed attempt at it last summer where we had 3 wingers playing centre mid in the states. Agree 100% on O'Dowda being an O'Neill project and tbf there's the makings of a good player in there, if we go with 3 at the back I'd like to see him in behind the front two or if he's the attacking of 2 centre mids given licence to drive forward and be that support between the midfield/ wing backs and up front.

The 3 at the back potentially gives us a bit more a threat up top with the 2 up there as while 4231 does work well with how deep we play it leaves the front man in a different time zone nearly, never mind a different half of the pitch they're that isolated. 2 up top gives us options of Maguire/ Long/ Hogan etc playing in tandem. Plus then it gives us far better angles for keeping the ball and recycling it than with a flat back 4. On the flipside though we've a number of handy wingers who'd be shut out or playing wildly out of position but good to have the options to change it up if needed.

[Stuttgart88]

Yeah, I think the 3 at the back is something we can take away from these friendlies. Also, bar Gelsenkirchen maybe, I can't think of a single time* that Walters on the right has ever really worked. If he plays it has to be centrally alongside a partner in my opinion.

*Just because I can't think of a time it has worked doesn't mean it has never worked. I just can't remember :)

[jbyrne]

Also, bar Gelsenkirchen maybe, I can't think of a single time* that Walters on the right has ever really worked. If he plays it has to be centrally alongside a partner in my opinion.


thats exactly one of the few things i took from sat nights match in particular. i havent watched the game back yet but what i saw live reminded me that walters is much more effective through the middle than out wide. i thought he played well through the middle and i was happy that he will still be a good option for us for the next 12 months anyway.

i also learnt that horgan looked a much better threat down the left when he came on than mcclean has looked for quite a while now.

i thought odowda played well and looks a threat. overall i think the friendlies have shown that we have decent enough resources to put out a good competitive team come the autumn. goalscoring will be a big issue though.... obviously

[zero]

Yeah, I think the 3 at the back is something we can take away from these friendlies. Also, bar Gelsenkirchen maybe, I can't think of a single time* that Walters on the right has ever really worked. If he plays it has to be centrally alongside a partner in my opinion.

*Just because I can't think of a time it has worked doesn't mean it has never worked. I just can't remember :)

Agreed - it's also a position where we are well stocked with options. If a system where we can play our best players can be effective then it makes sense to explore it. At centre half we have Duffy, Clark, Long, Rice (though he can play in midfield), Keogh, Egan, Lenihan... I would say it's a shame we didn't look at Doherty in the wing back position as that's where he plays for Wolves (albeit at right back).

Maybe Rice as a ball playing centre half in a back three/five could be interesting.

I also agree with the Walters on the right view - it always surprised me that Long wasn't the one to take up the wide berth with his pace. The only positive aspect of Walters out right is that he'll frequently win flick ons against the full back into space but I can't even remember that really resulting in anything much.

[Stuttgart88]

I think we have enough capable (I use the word carefully - almost damning with faint praise!) CBs without considering Rice there. Rice just has to play defensive CM for us. He's the only guy capable of doing what we really need to do. I'd love to see him and McCarthy together some time. I'd love to see Hendrick at full potential too. It's a shame O'Kane was injured.

Overall though, it's still going to be a case of having a lot of half-decent players but with O'Neill ultimately playing safe, if not downright obstinate, picking McClean ahead of Horgan (who was excellent), playing McClean upfront if necessary and all kinds of regressive things.

[tetsujin1979]

I did find it interesting that, with some of the regular starters missing, O'Neill chose to experiment with a different formation, instead of trying out new players in a standard 4-4-2.

[backstothewall]

I'd like to see Rice in the middle of a back 3 as a libero. It's as difficult a role as there is in football but I think he's good enough.

Possibly in a 3-4-3 to allow us to get a bit of creativity going with a xouple of inside forwards getting around the opposition box.

[tricky_colour]

Jesus that was hard to watch and I came home just flattened by the way O’Neill is managing this team.

Watched 2nd half again this morning am am now more positive, especially the way we played in the last 10-20 mins - though USA seemed to just collapse.

We won every second ball and used it constructively. I think Horgan made a lot happen by wanting the ball a lot. Horgan and Stevens worked very well together. Horgan has a great gift of being able to just crate a few feet of space to put in a good cross. A better player than McLean and far better at receiving the ball.

Stevens deserves credit but I actually think it’s at least as much down to picking a specialist LB in the LB position. Williams did OK in Paris and I think Cunningham deserves a look.

Overall I’m disappointed 2 friendlies went by without looking properly at Doherty.

Rice, Lenihan, Stevens (what a first touch from a drilled pass from Horgan) and Horgan were all excellent later on. O’Dowda decent but careless at times.

Kevin Long quietly impressive. Arter had a strong cameo. Burke was good all night I thought - better than Maguire is my first impression of each in an international shirt. Sure, Turkey away is harder but Maguire’s first touch was poor all night in his debut.

Doyle to blame for a goal again. As soon as the US won that header he should have charged out to at least punch it. Randolph would have I’m certain. Hendrick was shocked he didn’t come for it, though he should have taken charge himself in the absence of a shout.

We have 3 better keepers, Brady, McCarthy, Clark and Shane Long still to come back. That’s a lot of experience.

Hourihane, Hogan, Maguire, Doherty, Judge etc are still to figure properly. Browne has something to offer I think but needs a few more games before we can decide.

I’d make a good fist of making a good team from all of that.

So, less pessimistic than at HT yesterday except I still have no faith whatsoever in O’Neill and the first half was ****. The sight of O’Neill flanked by Keane, Guppy and Walford - who thinks he’s in fcuking Miami Vice - just makes me think we are managed by a bunch of utterly ineffective free loaders. We capped a few new faces but deep down I think O’Neill will interpret what he saw in a regressive fashion.

That’s where I disagree with SamHjr - I just don’t see O’Neill learning what was capable of being learnt from these games.

It was a vast improvement on the French game, restored my belief in the squad, we created a lot of chances.
Maybe it is "only the USA" but they are higher ranked (24th) than us.

[tetsujin1979]

Dan McDonnell mentioned on Off The Ball that it's the first come from behind win under O'Neill

[tetsujin1979]

Highlights
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