New owners at dundalk

[oriel]

None.
This looks like a big pressure cooker brewing up for Kenny.

Pressure to win his 4th title in 5 years? All managers at the top are under pressure to deliver and the same will apply for Caulfield to retain the title that Cork just won.

[sbgawa]

Caulfield won't be sacked if cork don't retain but if Kenny doesn't deliver with the biggest budget venture capitalists don't do sentiment.

[oriel]

You could be right, but I don't think they'll sack him if he doesn't win the league this season, as unless a collapse of epic proportions Dundalk will still qualify for Europe. The massive pressure will start if he doesn't win the 2019 league though, I'd totally agree he will be under huge pressure should then, but he is on a 3 year contract so he'll walk away with a nice package, but he wouldn't be happy with that career wise.

The squad is not yet complete, Dundalk need two more strikers, deadline is 22 Feb I think, that's probably the only area the new guys are clear on spending, player investment.

[sbgawa]

Your seading points will probably guarantee you two rounds in Europe even if you only qualify for the Europa league For the next few seasons......but I wouldn't rule out them deciding early to bring in their own man. Would be harsh but t hats the way these things normally go

[Mr A]

With the resources available last year was pretty poor at Dundalk. No major trophy and did nothing in Europe. Would be surprised if Kenny survived another season of the same, that's just the way football is.

[Real ale Madrid]

Kenny is under more pressure than Caulfield - FACT.

To be serious Dundalk have 2 rounds of being seeded in the EL this year - if they can get to the 3rd round and create an upset there it will create the type of momentum those vulture, I mean venture capitalists are looking for. Problem is are Dundalk as good as the last few years - there is a chance they are as good, but I didn't think SK did well in the Transfer market last year - the new signings have to improve the team.

[Ezeikial]

Fans of rival clubs are hardly going to be able to create "pressure" by message board comments.

It is performance v expectations that creates it among supporters and owners. He has delivered against that yardstick in 4 of the last 5 years.

He is a driven personality who creates and makes strong demands of himself and those around him. He thrives in this type of pressure to achieve.

[Real ale Madrid]

Fans of rival clubs are hardly going to be able to create "pressure" by message board comments.


You have told me that before I had 3,184 sorry 3,185 posts :(

[sbgawa]

Fans of rival clubs are hardly going to be able to create "pressure" by message board comments.

It is performance v expectations that creates it among supporters and owners. He has delivered against that yardstick in 4 of the last 5 years.

He is a driven personality who creates and makes strong demands of himself and those around him. He thrives in this type of pressure to achieve.


Yes the 3 or 4 comments on here are the pressure builders , not having a foreign VC fund sitting on his shoulder compared to the local boys.
In fairness foreign owners and VC are known for their patience.
Recognising Kenny is under more pressure with the new owners than the local boys is just common sense.

[vinnie]

With the resources available last year was pretty poor at Dundalk. No major trophy and did nothing in Europe. Would be surprised if Kenny survived another season of the same, that's just the way football is.

Is the league cup not one of the three major throphies anymore? Not being smart, but I'd still consider it worth winning

[vinnie]

He is a driven personality who creates and makes strong demands of himself and those around him. He thrives in this type of pressure to achieve.

Maybe he does, but we'd need to know Is he still careless with the oul Jumpers though? :bigsmile:

[oriel]

League Cup is a nice addition to have to your season but I wouldn't consider it a major trophy, League and FAI Cup are the obvious ones. If a club is on the up or a mid table side, it can certainly offer a nice end to a season. When Dundalk started out with Kenny it was the first trophy won under his mgt in 2014 in his second year, and it definitely helped as the first league title was won 6 weeks later.

On last year for Dundalk, I would still rate it as a bit disappointing, even though beaten on pens in the cup final, and very close in Europe (hit the bar in last min of ET which would have put them through on away goals, still went out) but end of the day the league was over by mid season really, and that's your real measure of the season.

[sulywaterfordfc]

Kenny is under contract until 2020 is he not? Surely if Dundalk finish in the top three he’ll be still be manager going into the following season. The club would surely be better off investing the money into the squad over as opposed to paying Kenny off for two years?

[pineapple stu]

Fans of rival clubs are hardly going to be able to create "pressure" by message board comments.
Wasn't it only last month you were saying a twitter poll indicated Bradley was likely to be the first manager sacked this year?

But now fans on the internet don't affect things?

Which is it?

[Ezeikial]

Wasn't it only last month you were saying a twitter poll indicated Bradley was likely to be the first manager sacked this year?

But now fans on the internet don't affect things?

Which is it?

I should not bother (and won't beyond this one response to you) as you are clearly trolling and probably unwillingly or unable to understand.

The twitter poll indicated the opinions of those who voted.

Posters on foot.ie saying SK is or will be under pressure does not actually create pressure on him - he is most likely oblivious to them.

[pineapple stu]

The twitter poll indicated the opinions of those who voted.
Yup. But that's not what you said originally. You said it "suggested he was twice as likely to be sacked" than Liam Buckley - so it could have a tangible effect.

Maybe you're learning after all; it is of course correct, as you now say, that internet chat won't affect Kenny in the slightest. But I suspect it's more that you have one rule for talking about Dundalk and one rule for talking about other clubs (Rovers mostly)

[Ezeikial]

Yup. But that's not what you said originally. You said it "suggested he was twice as likely to be sacked" than Liam Buckley - so it could have a tangible effect.

Maybe you're learning after all; it is of course correct, as you now say, that internet chat won't affect Kenny in the slightest. But I suspect it's more that you have one rule for talking about Dundalk and one rule for talking about other clubs (Rovers mostly)

Nope - I said nothing about " a tangible effect", just what the poll suggested. Pretty simply really.

Your condescending comment about "learning after all" certainly follows your usual arrogant attitude.

[Charlie Darwin]

Great discussion guys.

[sbgawa]

Nope - I said nothing about " a tangible effect", just what the poll suggested. Pretty simply really.

Your condescending comment about "learning after all" certainly follows your usual arrogant attitude.

The only difference between comenting on a Twitter poll and talking about people's views on Kenny on foot.ie is that youj like raising negatives about bradser but don't like people discussing Kenny. No one is having a go at kenny just recognising the new reality of working for a vc compared to two local lads

[nigel-harps1954]

This is like the foot.ie equivalent of "I know you are but what am I?".

[sbgawa]

I should know better at this stage :)

[placid casual]

Ezekials hard on for Rovers is as strong as ever.
He needs a nurse with one of them cold spoons to sort it out.

[Ezeikial]

The only difference between comenting on a Twitter poll and talking about people's views on Kenny on foot.ie is that youj like raising negatives about bradser but don't like people discussing Kenny. No one is having a go at kenny just recognising the new reality of working for a vc compared to two local lads

I have no issue with a discussion on Stephen Kenny or Dundalk - the point I made about "pressure" was pretty clear.

However it is also clear that many of the most recent posters on this thread (including you) are really more exercised with Bradley and Rovers related comments I have made.

[osarusan]

Ezekials hard on for Rovers is as strong as ever.
He needs a nurse with one of them cold spoons to sort it out.

Wouldn't think he is old enough for that yet.

[EatYerGreens]

Is the league cup not one of the three major throphies anymore? Not being smart, but I'd still consider it worth winning

I guess it depends on the club :)

It doesn't carry much kudos amongst Derry City fans, but that's because we got bored winning the thing all the time :D

[sbgawa]

Its a bit like the league cup in England , no one cares, the only way it makes any ripple is if the final is between two big teams...
I'd say the sponsors probably spend the early rounds on their knees praying to Saint Jude that the reserve sides of the big teams get through a few rounds to the point where they start to care.
I'd say the FAI cup would start to head that direction too if they took away the Europa league place...........just like English Premier now its all about qualifying for Europe

[sbgawa]

I see peak 6 have sold up in Bournemouth.
Can't figure if that is good news (pulling out of europe) bad news (loads of money to spend in dundalk) or no news at all......probably the latter

Depends on your perspective of course :)

[Yossarian]

I see peak 6 have sold up in Bournemouth.
Can't figure if that is good news (pulling out of europe) bad news (loads of money to spend in dundalk) or no news at all......probably the latter

Depends on your perspective of course :)

I’d say it’s no news in relation to Dundalk. They’ve probably made a profit on what they invested in Bournemouth and it looks like the Russian owner wanted full control. Though if it means they’ve more cash to splash on football we’ll happily help them out!

[sbgawa]

Bad news so :)

[oriel]

P6 only recently spent 300K kitting out the YDC behind the shed in Oriel Park this winter, upgrading and increasing the gym size, building new dressing rooms, and I think the underground car park will be also upgraded soon for better use. They also did some work on the bar inside the YDC, it was open for the two home euro games last season, but I think it’s also due to be expanded. Therefore it wouldn't appear they are looking to move on in the short / medium term.

Spectator facility improvements for both home and away would be nice if its next on their list!

[bohsmug]

And just a bit of an image revamp for the ground would do, as much as I hate to be so superficial. I don't really mind watching a game in **** conditions myself. But would prefer if the home of the team that's utterly dominated the last period in the league was a bit more presentable on telly. Genuinely think it damages the credibility of the league. It's not that Oriel looks bad, it looks terrible.

It's a pity because the Dundalk teams over the last few years have been admirable. Not intended as a dig.

[ToberonaTornado]

ORIEL - Bournemouth fans are glad to see the back of the p6 stake ownership because until the current owners got 100% ownershgip the move to a new ground was being held up.
P6 will be doing nothing in OP anytime.
Bottom line.

[seand]

A shade over 10,000 to see Bournemouth hammer Chelsea last night. Fair to say AFCB are being held back by the limitations of their ground.... sounds familiar!

[Shearer]

A shade over 10,000 to see Bournemouth hammer Chelsea last night. Fair to say AFCB are being held back by the limitations of their ground.... sounds familiar!
Their ground isn't a ****hole though, just small.

[oriel]

ORIEL - Bournemouth fans are glad to see the back of the p6 stake ownership because until the current owners got 100% ownershgip the move to a new ground was being held up.
P6 will be doing nothing in OP anytime.
Bottom line.

It wouldn't appear P6 have interest in spectator improvements at the minute, I think that's fairly clear. How much would a damn roof cost for both sides of the stand, install lighting and build toilets? no one is asking for an overnight miracle but basic improvements wouldn't be too much to ask for.

When they leave, and they will at some point, it will be dreadful if no spectator improvements are made to show for the legacy of the successful period from 2013 onwards.

[Ezeikial]

When they leave, and they will at some point, it will be dreadful if no spectator improvements are made to show for the legacy of the successful period from 2013 onwards.

Peak6 have nothing to do with the period prior to Jan 2018.

Even if they gave some mixed messages during the year, they were crystal clear on their intentions from the start. Its just that some fans did not want to hear.

[EatYerGreens]

It wouldn't appear P6 have interest in spectator improvements at the minute, I think that's fairly clear. How much would a damn roof cost for both sides of the stand, install lighting and build toilets? no one is asking for an overnight miracle but basic improvements wouldn't be too much to ask for.

When they leave, and they will at some point, it will be dreadful if no spectator improvements are made to show for the legacy of the successful period from 2013 onwards.

Investing in Dundalk was a business decision for them.

Their aim is clearly to make money via Europe. Putting money into the ground will do little or nothing to aid that, and be guaranteed to cost them money. So it's a mystery why anyone thinks they would want to do it ?

[marinobohs]

Ezekials hard on for Rovers is as strong as ever.
He needs a nurse with one of them cold spoons to sort it out.

In a thread started by a shams fan about Dundalk. :rolleyes: no double standards there now (or maybe shams like the cold spoon treatment ?) :D

[bohsmug]

I think the issue people probably have is not that P6 have gone against their word.

Let's say if I was a Dundalk fan who was unhappy when P6 came on board with little or no interest in improving the ground, I'd still be unhappy about it in 2019. It wouldn't mean I've forgotten anything, it just means I still don't like it.

[oriel]

It's obvious of course why P6 came onboard in the first place, to get a return on their investment and in Ireland, that's via Europe only.

Ezk point also correct, pre 2018, nothing to do with them, but DFC supporters are still entitled to be disappointed with the lack of almost any ground improvement in recent years.

I still think the basics could be done, and a lot of this won't cost massive money either. The appetite to even look at that is more disappointing really, they have only been there one full year, and that's fair enough, but there was still time for example during the winter to get things spectator related improvements in place, nothing happened as expected of course.

[EatYerGreens]

It's obvious of course why P6 came onboard in the first place, to get a return on their investment and in Ireland, that's via Europe only.

Ezk point also correct, pre 2018, nothing to do with them, but DFC supporters are still entitled to be disappointed with the lack of almost any ground improvement in recent years.

I still think the basics could be done, and a lot of this won't cost massive money either. The appetite to even look at that is more disappointing really, they have only been there one full year, and that's fair enough, but there was still time for example during the winter to get things spectator related improvements in place, nothing happened as expected of course.
But again - why would they do anything like that ? It won't aid their business objective. It'll just cost them money and be a distraction. So seriously - why would they bother ?

If any Dundalk fans find this disappointing, it's because they have given themselves inflated expectations.

[oriel]

I'm not talking about huge new builds here EYG, I`m suggesting basics could be done, and not at too high expense either.

Hardly too much to expect even in the medium term.

[mcgonigle]

I'm not talking about huge new builds here EYG, I`m suggesting basics could be done, and not at too high expense either.

Hardly too much to expect even in the medium term.

Depends on your definition of basic*. It could be argued that basic work has and is being carried out. Drainage and resurfacing behind the town end goal. painting in the stand and plenty of other "basics".

Then there's a lot of investment in the YDC which I presume is part of a plan to create top of the range facilities for players and to help attract a better calibre of player over time.

*I want a lovely new stadium as much as the next fan but I'm a realist

[Ezeikial]

I think the issue people probably have is not that P6 have gone against their word.

Let's say if I was a Dundalk fan who was unhappy when P6 came on board with little or no interest in improving the ground, I'd still be unhappy about it in 2019. It wouldn't mean I've forgotten anything, it just means I still don't like it.

I take your point, although expectations around stadium developments and ground improvements may be a little more nuanced than you outline

On your latter point, of course some fans have been consistent in being concerned about the lack of significant spectator upgrades or any clear plans around Oriel Park. It is fair to say that even though the Consortium were unequivocal at the outset that infrastructure was not an immediate priority, many fans chose to believe that incremental upgrades can and would be made. Interviews with Mike Treacy and Mal Brannigan during the season reinforced this view and raised expectations.

Oriel's comments about it being 'dreadful' if there are no spectator improvements as a legacy for the most successful period in the clubs history are fair and reflect a dawning realisation among many of what the Peak6 consortium folk said at the outset.

It also may be premature to consider that the end of this era is anywhere in the immediate future.

[placid casual]

Happy to see McMillan didn't go back to dundalk. He would have almost guaranteed the title, in my view. Just need hoooooooooban to get injured and it's a level playing field 😉

[CorribsideSteve]

Happy to see McMillan didn't go back to dundalk. He would have almost guaranteed the title, in my view. Just need hoooooooooban to get injured and it's a level playing field 

It's actually pronounced as hooooooooobin.
Just a guess but I assume the owners would quickly upgrade Oriel once Dundalk qualify for Europa or Champions League

[EatYerGreens]

It's actually pronounced as hooooooooobin.
Just a guess but I assume the owners would quickly upgrade Oriel once Dundalk qualify for Europa or Champions League

1) There's no way to quickly upgrade a stadium like Oriel in any meaningful way. That would require structural change, which would require both time and permissions.

2) Dundalk already have qualified for Europe, and can reasonably be expected to continue doing so for most of the foreseeable future. Yet nothing substantive is being done to the stadium.

3) For a business which sees it's main return coming from European qualification and progression, why would they spend any money on a stadium to do so when they can just use Tallaght or the Aviva instead when they need to ? That would increase their matchday revenue from participation in Europe at a tiny fraction of the cost of getting Oriel up to standard.

[CorribsideSteve]

1) There's no way to quickly upgrade a stadium like Oriel in any meaningful way. That would require structural change, which would require both time and permissions.

2) Dundalk already have qualified for Europe, and can reasonably be expected to continue doing so for most of the foreseeable future. Yet nothing substantive is being done to the stadium.

3) For a business which sees it's main return coming from European qualification and progression, why would they spend any money on a stadium to do so when they can just use Tallaght or the Aviva instead when they need to ? That would increase their matchday revenue from participation in Europe at a tiny fraction of the cost of getting Oriel up to standard.

I was aware that they already qualified before. Perhaps what I should have said is once more, in that if they qualify again and would do it more often than not, the riches would flow. I suppose one can't wave a magic wand, but within a few years (quickly by Irish standards of getting anything done), with sustained cash from sustained qualifications, I wondered if that might be the only way they would do an upgrade if they ever have plans to. Based on Larnaca last year, there's no certainty that they can be reasonably expected to qualify, although I hope they do, and that the away tie was just a horrible night where everything went wrong. Of course, keep using Tallaght as it's relatively near, but long term, surely it would be nice to have something like Tallaght or TX in Dundalk Town.

[wonder88]

Do many Dundalk fans still volunteer for the club?

[RathfarnhamHoop]

1) There's no way to quickly upgrade a stadium like Oriel in any meaningful way. That would require structural change, which would require both time and permissions.

2) Dundalk already have qualified for Europe, and can reasonably be expected to continue doing so for most of the foreseeable future. Yet nothing substantive is being done to the stadium.

3) For a business which sees it's main return coming from European qualification and progression, why would they spend any money on a stadium to do so when they can just use Tallaght or the Aviva instead when they need to ? That would increase their matchday revenue from participation in Europe at a tiny fraction of the cost of getting Oriel up to standard.

It's worth pointing out that using tallaght or the Aviva might not actually result in increased matchdays revenue. The costs of just opening the Aviva are huge and then there's no way of knowing if they'd get all the concessions income and for Tallaght there'd be rent to pay and the cost of anything that needs to be added to get it up to grade or if they're all provided then the rent may be even higher and for concessions to make money they'd have to set up their own stalls since as is all the stalls are 3rd party or Rovers and not tallaght stadium which would cost money, not a lot, but you'd have to weigh that up against the potential income.

This is the problem though when you get in bed with these companies who are only there to make money and the football club is just a way to do that for them. In theory the licencing laws should mean investment in facilities but the FAI set the standard so low and don't even enforce them at that so that won't happen.

It's sad really, as annoying as dundalk fans can be sometimes it's sad to see a loi club not taking full advantage of its success and repeating the mistakes of the past and banking on more short term success instead of planning for the future so if things do go tits up there's still some sort of legacy.