National Underage Leagues and LOI underage

[sbgawa]

I agree with you up to a point.
Where clubs actually set up an academy with kids playing for the club the FAI should support it directly with grants that would make it worthwhile.
where the link is just for the sake of ticking the box (Joeys and Bray , Kevins and whoever) the support should be less.

[gufcfan]

FAI confirm St Kevin's presence will be one-off without league club partnership (http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/fai-confirm-st-kevins-presence-will-be-oneoff-without-league-club-partnership-36040392.html)

Crisis averted...

It's a small victory in the grand scheme of things. The FAI were facing a hugely embarrassing situation.

I hope the FAI pull some equally stupid **** next year, It will just unite the clubs against them. They might get a bit of cop and elect a league chairman that represents them then.

[Kingdom]

I'm not a legal person, but surely allowing Kevin's admittance to play even one match sets a bad precedence, particularly if Kevins want to challenge any potential removal from 2018.

[SecondBall]

I'm not a legal person, but surely allowing Kevin's admittance to play even one match sets a bad precedence, particularly if Kevins want to challenge any potential removal from 2018.

Good point. The mere fact they've even been left in set a very bad tone, first day. It shouldn't have been the case, it's a LOI competition. This is no knock on them, just my opinion.

[gufcfan]

I'm not a legal person, but surely allowing Kevin's admittance to play even one match sets a bad precedence, particularly if Kevins want to challenge any potential removal from 2018.

If the clubs pulled out of the league altogether, all the work that has gone into pre-season and all the games the kids would be missing out on... It would be a heavy price to pay for them imo. Not to mention the cost.

If clubs in the same division as Kevin's were to just refuse to play them and give walkovers, the FAI would have had "a word" with each of them privately in an attempt to split them up, under the threat of fines which the FAI hardly even need a reason for under the participation agreement,

Divide and conquer is always the FAI tactic. If **** was going to go down, giving walkovers would have seen UCD, Rovers, Athlone, Bray and ourselves under huge pressure from the FAI.

Even without directly retaliating against clubs, the FAI could probably do a lot of damage if they wanted.

[ArFella]

I'm not a legal person, but surely allowing Kevin's admittance to play even one match sets a bad precedence, particularly if Kevins want to challenge any potential removal from 2018.

So what are you legally classified as? An ethereal being? A brick? The possibilities are endless!

[Kingdom]

So what are you legally classified as? An ethereal being? A brick? The possibilities are endless!

I'm an inanimate carbon rod.

[disgruntled]

FAI confirm St Kevin's presence will be one-off without league club partnership (http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/fai-confirm-st-kevins-presence-will-be-oneoff-without-league-club-partnership-36040392.html)

Crisis averted...

It's a small victory in the grand scheme of things. The FAI were facing a hugely embarrassing situation.

I hope the FAI pull some equally stupid **** next year, It will just unite the clubs against them. They might get a bit of cop and elect a league chairman that represents them then.

Another complete mess that the FAI have created.

What happens in 2018 when Kevins threaten the FAI with legal proceedings because they won't be allowed to take part ?
The FAI have now created a precedent by allowing them compete this year.
Total incompetence :rolleyes:

[Kingdom]

Did anyone read Neale Fenn's article (can't remember which paper) saying he wanted to move all the underage Longford teams to be based in Dublin?

[Nah Nah Nah Nah]

Did anyone read Neale Fenn's article (can't remember which paper) saying he wanted to move all the underage Longford teams to be based in Dublin?

He was on LOI Weekly podcast. Basically saying that an all Longford team would be sh!te so there'd be no poing in going down that route. Sounds like the board are telling him where to go on that.

[outspoken]

He was on LOI Weekly podcast. Basically saying that an all Longford team would be sh!te so there'd be no poing in going down that route. Sounds like the board are telling him where to go on that.

I've great time for Neale and listened to that interview but was disappointed by those comments (as true as they probably are) Personally think the club aren't doing enough to build its reputation locally and comments like that from the manager aren't exactly helpful especially when the 'sure they're all dubs' sh1te is constantly thrown in the face of Town fans in this county anytime we are doing half decent. I've always said I don't care where the players come from once they give it their all and obviously training in Dublin helps us attract better players but long term I would like to see the club actually based in Longford

[RathfarnhamHoop]

I've great time for Neale and listened to that interview but was disappointed by those comments (as true as they probably are) Personally think the club aren't doing enough to build its reputation locally and comments like that from the manager aren't exactly helpful especially when the 'sure they're all dubs' sh1te is constantly thrown in the face of Town fans in this county anytime we are doing half decent. I've always said I don't care where the players come from once they give it their all and obviously training in Dublin helps us attract better players but long term I would like to see the club actually based in Longford

Are Longfords senior based in lexlip or am I confusing them with another club? Where are the underage teams currently based

[JC_GUFC]

Went to Rovers v Galway United yesterday. A 2-0 win for United. Charlie Concannon looks a serious prospect for Galway United. The Rovers RB looked their best player.
It struck me at the game that these are going to be the next crop of Irish internationals as at this age group they won't yet have gone to England.

Also looking at the groups it's clear that St Kevin's have been swapped with Cabinteely. Maybe they wanted to keep Kevin's and Bohs apart.

[outspoken]

Are Longfords senior based in lexlip or am I confusing them with another club? Where are the underage teams currently based

Senior team based in Lexlip, youth teams based in Longford

[RathfarnhamHoop]

https://www.thesun.ie/sport/football/1635267/shamrock-rovers-deserve-praise-for-helping-youngsters-combine-football-and-education/amp/

Good article on what rovers are trying to do with their academy

[CorribsideSteve]

it's good to see clubs putting proper academy like roots down and I wish them well. Was refreshing to hear Duff talking about a pathway existing now for young footballers here, analyzing maguires debut vs Moldova.

[nigel-harps1954]

https://www.thesun.ie/sport/football/1635267/shamrock-rovers-deserve-praise-for-helping-youngsters-combine-football-and-education/amp/

Good article on what rovers are trying to do with their academy

There's inaccuracies in that article though. It was clarified on Twitter too. They don't train at 6:15am four times a week. They do it once a week and train three evenings.

Still, paying for their education and putting in close to a full time schedule is a great bit of work if they can afford to do it. It is definitely the way forward.

[RathfarnhamHoop]

There's inaccuracies in that article though. It was clarified on Twitter too. They don't train at 6:15am four times a week. They do it once a week and train three evenings.

Still, paying for their education and putting in close to a full time schedule is a great bit of work if they can afford to do it. It is definitely the way forward.

Yeah i got it off twitter where he was corrected in the replies but i forgot to mention it.
http://shamrockrovers.ie/2017/10/13/7455/
Rovers have officially linked up with Ashfield now too.

[Philosophizer]

So this years u19 and u17 leagues have been wrapped up. The u19 final was won by Bohs, who beat St Pats 1-0 in the final at Dalymount, while the u17 final was won by Cork City, who beat Bohs on penos (0-0 after extra time) at Turners Cross.

Anyone see any of the matches or have anything to report?? I heard the Bohs no10 for the u19s is fairly decent.

[El-Pietro]

City won all three knockout rounds on penalties in the U17s. The keeper saved 7 penalties in the three games. Thats some going.

[thebronze14]

City won all three knockout rounds on penalties in the U17s. The keeper saved 7 penalties in the three games. Thats some going.
Thought he looked older than 17, then I relised it was Ciaran Kelly hopping in for the penos!Fix!

[legendz]

Hopefully Kerry will be represented in the U19 league next year. This year's U17 team were all U16 last year so got two years of U17 action having been U15 champions at the UL tournament two years ago.

If the FAI keep to a similar timescale from recent years, they should be announcing an U13 league next year for the end of 2019.

Once the U13 league is in place for a full year, it might be the time for the merits of an intermediary league between U19s and senior level to be considered by the powers that be?

[legendz]

http://www.the42.ie/john-delaney-mayo-league-of-ireland-team-2569845-Jan2016/ any updates on this?From that article, Mayo are behind schedule. They started in the U15s this year as opposed to the U17s.

[Philosophizer]

Is there any talk of creating an u11 league once the u13 league is up and running? Or are the u13s as young as they want to go with the national leagues?

[sbgawa]

u13 as young as they go is the intention AFAIK.

[legendz]

u13 as young as they go is the intention AFAIK.
Yeah, that's been the plan so far.

[Kingdom]

Is there any talk of creating an u11 league once the u13 league is up and running? Or are the u13s as young as they want to go with the national leagues?

Personally speaking, I think an U11 league would be a step too far. Development squads up to the 12s age is enough. Then the National Leagues from 13s is perfect.

The part that I'm not getting - and perhaps it can be explained to me by those who know better - is the National League supplementing the existing leagues, or is a separate entity?

i.e. The players involved in the National Under 15s, are not involved in local leagues, and there is no movement of players say between Crumlin Utd and St Patricks Athletic once the season starts. Or can St Pats call up players registered with the clubs that they are aligned to throughout the season?

[ThirdManRun]

Personally speaking, I think an U11 league would be a step too far. Development squads up to the 12s age is enough. Then the National Leagues from 13s is perfect.

The part that I'm not getting - and perhaps it can be explained to me by those who know better - is the National League supplementing the existing leagues, or is a separate entity?

i.e. The players involved in the National Under 15s, are not involved in local leagues, and there is no movement of players say between Crumlin Utd and St Patricks Athletic once the season starts. Or can St Pats call up players registered with the clubs that they are aligned to throughout the season?

Players cannot move from schoolboy to LOI football freely, they can only move within transfer windows even if there is an affiliation between clubs. For example, a Shels U15 player playing DDSL cannot represent LOI U15 team until the transfer window is opened and the transfer is processed of moving from league to league.

There as positives and negatives to this process. Basically stops clubs with schoolboy teams alongside LOI teams stockpiling players with the promise that they'll be moved up from team to team.

[gormacha]

I cannot wait for the usual suspects in local schoolboy football to have a hissy fit about "their" players being nicked by a LOI team, when they have been doing that themselves since forever. I genuinely enjoy it. I'm a bad, bad person.

[JC_GUFC]

The part that I'm not getting - and perhaps it can be explained to me by those who know better - is the National League supplementing the existing leagues, or is a separate entity?

i.e. The players involved in the National Under 15s, are not involved in local leagues, and there is no movement of players say between Crumlin Utd and St Patricks Athletic once the season starts. Or can St Pats call up players registered with the clubs that they are aligned to throughout the season?

They are separate entities, so you can’t have a player lining out for St Pat’s in the National u15 League one week and then for Crumlin in the DDSL the following week.
I’m sure clubs may have arrangements in place that a player once finished his National League season can move back to his original club if he’s not ready for the next level up at the LoI club.
I think it remains to be seen how these various arrangements work and if the established schoolboy clubs will continue to support the league, a lot may depend on how the LoI clubs work with them.

[Mr A]

Our academy follows (to the extent it's possible) the model suggested in one of the Genesis reports on the league. Players stay with their own clubs, the academy provides extra coaching and development. Commitments to their own clubs take precedence where there is a clash. The academy plays friendlies and goes on trips as they aren't in a league (unfortunate, but without dual registration you can't really enter a league). Clubs get to keep their players a bit longer than they otherwise might though so it's good for relations that way. Despite all that there can still be strenuous opposition from admins of schoolboy leagues. They are willing to object to players getting extra coaching time with good coaches and alongside good players, but they're against it because.. I'm genuinely not sure. But change isn't exactly something some in schoolboy leagues embrace with gusto.

[Philosophizer]

It's not all doom and gloom in Athlone.

Athlone beat St Pats 2-1 to win the u15 title.

https://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/jubilant-scenes-as-athlone-strike-late-to-win-inaugural-under15-title-36353242.html

[outspoken]

It's not all doom and gloom in Athlone.

Athlone beat St Pats 2-1 to win the u15 title.

https://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/jubilant-scenes-as-athlone-strike-late-to-win-inaugural-under15-title-36353242.html

Do they get prize money for that?

[Philosophizer]

Bohs are set to announce a link with St Kevins Boys.

https://www.thesun.ie/sport/football/1861593/bohemians-and-st-kevins-boys-set-to-announce-partnership/

And the North Dublin Schoolboys League have got their knickers in a twist over it...

"the North Dublin Schoolboy League has confirmed they have ended their *agreement with Bohs in anticipation of them announcing a formal alliance with the club"

[Philosophizer]

Bohs link with SKB confirmed for the next 5 yrs.

"Under the agreement, the U13/U15 Bohs-SKB partnership teams’ first kit will be the Gypsies’ iconic red and black stripes with the St Kevin’s crest on the sleeves, while the second kit will be St Kevin’s traditional tangerine.
As well as the Bohs-SKB U13/U15 teams using St Kevin’s training facilities, the existing Bohemians U17 and U19 teams will do likewise.
The Bohs-SKB U13/U15 teams will play their matches at St Kevin’s pitches at Shanowen Rd, while the Bohs U17 and U19 teams will play their matches at St Aidan’s."

[sbgawa]

Good to see the child slavetraders were forced into a deal with a loi club.

[gufcfan]

Good to see the child slavetraders were forced into a deal with a loi club.

I wouldn't be so happy about it. Kevins are basically having their cake and eating it too.

[sbgawa]

It's better then allowing them in on their own. Also the next time they want to sell a 15 year old for 5k to Stevenage they will have to share it with bohs. Hopefully over time bohs will get theirf own facilities and take over all tyhe coaching and cut Kevin's adrift

[gufcfan]

It's better then allowing them in on their own.

I hear what you're saying but there was no need to let them in. They have no interest in senior LOI.

[Philosophizer]

I wouldn't be so happy about it. Kevins are basically having their cake and eating it too.

This is basically the exact same deal that the other major nurseries (belvedere, cherry orchard, home farm, st joeys) have already done with LOI other clubs. i think it's a great thing.

Love them or loathe them, the LOI clubs need to get into partnerships with these underage clubs for the betterment of irish soccer in the long run.

[Philosophizer]

Do Stella Maris have a link with any LOI club?? Shels would seem the obvious one as it's closest to them...

They seem like the biggest underage club in Dublin that have yet to link with a LOI club.

[sbgawa]

Ultimately al the LOI clubs need to start their own teams from 8 years up,

[Philosophizer]

Ultimately al the LOI clubs need to start their own teams from 8 years up,
I think most of them do to be fair.
Nothing wrong with forming partnerships with already established successful underage clubs though. Better to work with them than against them.

[gufcfan]

This is basically the exact same deal that the other major nurseries (belvedere, cherry orchard, home farm, st joeys) have already done with LOI other clubs. i think it's a great thing.

Love them or loathe them, the LOI clubs need to get into partnerships with these underage clubs for the betterment of irish soccer in the long run.

I meant LOI clubs having exclusive deals with a single club like that. Partnerships should be in conjunction with juvenile leagues. Partnerships with Kevins etc. is just more of the same.

[geysir]

On Oct 20, UEFA released the solidarity payments (http://www.uefa.com/MultimediaFiles/Download/competitions/General/02/51/12/37/2511237_DOWNLOAD.pdf) due from the 2016/7 season (Eur 825,000), to be paid to the FAI and then distributed for club youth developments programs. I am very confident that the FAI have already informed all the clubs involved about this modest but welcome windfall.

[Philosophizer]

I meant LOI clubs having exclusive deals with a single club like that. Partnerships should be in conjunction with juvenile leagues. Partnerships with Kevins etc. is just more of the same.

If the LOI clubs just partnered with leagues and not the big nursery clubs then we'd continue to lose a lot of serious talent being shipped across the water. The massive divide that exists in Ireland between our senior league and our underage clubs would continue unabated. It's not like we could ignore the big nurseries and they'll just disappear.

LOI clubs partnering with the traditional big nurseries is the best thing that's happened Irish soccer in a long time.

[sbgawa]

agree with you there and hopefully the people that run the junior clubs over time will start to recalibrate their objectives .....at the moment to be fair to the child slavetraders they see Stevenage or bohs as the same thing, with a partnership in place you'd have to think that will change over time....or at least the parents will start to see another path