2017 Licences

[atfconline]

A First Division licence, apparently without any conditions for Athlone.


SSE Airtricity League clubs awarded licences for 2017

Following a meeting of the Independent Club Licensing Committee of the Football Association of Ireland, 14 Premier Division and six First Division licences were awarded for the 2017 SSE Airtricity League season.

The following licences were awarded:

Premier Division
Bohemian FC, Bray Wanderers FC, Cork City FC, Derry City FC, Drogheda United FC, Dundalk FC, Finn Harps FC, Galway United FC, Limerick FC, Longford Town FC, Shamrock Rovers FC, Sligo Rovers FC, St Patrick's Athletic FC, Waterford FC

First Division
Athlone Town FC, Cabinteely FC, Cobh Ramblers FC, Shelbourne FC, UCD AFC, Wexford FC

[Longfordian]

Oh what's this..we've been promoted already, that's good. Six team First Division is a bit crap though.

[EatYerGreens]

Oh what's this..we've been promoted already, that's good. Six team First Division is a bit crap though.

You can get a Premier Division license without being in the Prem. It just means your facilities etc are up to scratch.

[EatYerGreens]

A First Division licence, apparently without any conditions for Athlone.

Which Athlone though ?

[Longfordian]

You can get a Premier Division license without being in the Prem. It just means your facilities etc are up to scratch.

Oh right, that's a new thing is it?

[El-Pietro]

Oh right, that's a new thing is it?

No. Its been that way for years.

[outspoken]

Oh right, that's a new thing is it?

We've been getting PD licenses for years even in the FD. It's thanks to our facilities

[pineapple stu]

Not sure if sarcastic or not...

[Longfordian]

I can't believe I've never read on here, every year since licensing began, that you can get a Premier Licence whilst playing in the First.

Come on lads ffs.

[Nah Nah Nah Nah]

Not sure if sarcastic or not...

I'm pretty sure.....

[nigel-harps1954]

Top quality bantz from Longfordian.

[EatYerGreens]

Gortakeegan once got a UEFA Category 4 license, purely on the quality of the famous Mon Dogs.

#TrueFact

[Partizan]

A First Division licence, apparently without any conditions for Athlone.

How the fcuk did Athlone get a licence?

I wouldn't even give them a TV licence.

[Real ale Madrid]

I wouldn't even give them a TV licence.

Or a dog licence.

[pineapple stu]

I'm pretty sure.....
Hard to tell with outspoken at times.

He can be a bit...outspoken. Like Dunphy. :)

[NeverFeltBetter]

Why do UCD only have a First Division license? What changed?

[osarusan]

How is it that UCD and Wexford only get FD licences even though they would have had PD licences in the past? Only applied for those licences?

[Mr A]

It is always that way- if you're in the premier you get the premier license but if you facilities are short of the mark you only get a D1 one in the first. Probably just because applying for the extra derogations isn't worth the hassle.

[Longfordian]

It's also a few quid cheaper to get a First Division one apparently. So if you're not interested in kudos for your filling in of forms...sorry your structures and facilities..then you can just apply for a First Division one. We did that one year.

[seand]

In recent seasons our licence has required the artificial pitch to pass UEFA standard tests. I'm guessing that's been ignored / waived / made-up-as-we-go-along this year, seeing as the new pitch is only down a couple of days.

The whole licencing system is clearly, in the words of one famous Dundalk fan, 'a faaaaaarce'

[pineapple stu]

How is it that UCD and Wexford only get FD licences even though they would have had PD licences in the past? Only applied for those licences?
We had a First Div licence last year too.

I'd say Collie hasn't done his coaching badges still

[Nesta99]

Was his name not on the list of participants with Bradly and a few others recently?

[gufcfan]

Was his name not on the list of participants with Bradly and a few others recently?

Yes.

http://www.fai.ie/domestic/news/fai-uefa-pro-licence-participants-confirmed

[pineapple stu]

Fairy nuff. Could be something like a PR person or something. I think we got rid of the CPO back in 09 when it was a Premier only requirement

[outspoken]

How is it that UCD and Wexford only get FD licences even though they would have had PD licences in the past? Only applied for those licences?

Because the FAI just hand out licensees to make life easier for themselves, it's a total waste of time.

[pineapple stu]

I see on extratime.ie that there's two new clubs this year - Waterford and Wexford.

Neither Wexford Youths nor Waterford United applied to join the league this year.

Did Waterford go bust as well so? Ridiculous that you can go bust and stay at the same level.

[colonelwest]

Waterford were just bought by the Swindon owner, same club per se as far as I'm aware barring the name/ crest change etc. Probably a new holding company alright but they didn't go bust.

[pineapple stu]

That's what's strange; wouldn't have thought being bought by Swindon (or their director or whatever) would have tied in with going bust.

But they're clearly grouped in with Wexford in the Fran Gavin interview on extratime.ie.

A new ultimate holding company or company structure shouldn't affect the licence. A new company operating the club should be unnecessary.

All a bit weird.

[sbgawa]

Wexford are a decent crew and I don't want them hit with a points deduction but it is NUTS that they can walk away from debts start up again and hey presto ...no problems.
If I was an investor or a bank loaning money to a LOI side I would have a very close look at it.....no sanctions at all from the FAI for walking away from debt

[EatYerGreens]

Wexford are a decent crew and I don't want them hit with a points deduction but it is NUTS that they can walk away from debts start up again and hey presto ...no problems.
If I was an investor or a bank loaning money to a LOI side I would have a very close look at it.....no sanctions at all from the FAI for walking away from debt

Weren't Wexford Youths' debts to Mick Wallace's old construction firm, that is itself now bust and in administration ? In which case any repaid debt would get passed on to Wallace's creditors in a diluted form.

In short - I suspect it's banks and Dublin firms servicing the construction industry who'll take the eventual hit here, but it's all very indirect.

Was the name-change part of walking away from their debts then ?

[nigel-harps1954]

Wexford are a decent crew and I don't want them hit with a points deduction but it is NUTS that they can walk away from debts start up again and hey presto ...no problems.
If I was an investor or a bank loaning money to a LOI side I would have a very close look at it.....no sanctions at all from the FAI for walking away from debt

*Cough*...Derry City....*Cough*...Cork City...

Countless clubs have done it over the years.

[Longfordian]

Weren't Wexford Youths' debts to Mick Wallace's old construction firm, that is itself now bust and in administration ? In which case any repaid debt would get passed on to Wallace's creditors in a diluted form.

In short - I suspect it's banks and Dublin firms servicing the construction industry who'll take the eventual hit here, but it's all very indirect.

Was the name-change part of walking away from their debts then ?


That's my understanding of the Wexford situation though there could be other, smaller creditors that will get hit as well.

[sbgawa]

*Cough*...Derry City....*Cough*...Cork City...

Countless clubs have done it over the years.

Completly agree but there has to be a place and a time to call stop

[nigel-harps1954]

Completly agree but there has to be a place and a time to call stop

While I agree with what you're saying, there's nothing illegal about it.

[ForzaForth]

My understanding in regard to Wexford Youths/ Wexford FC is as follows. The old club, Wexford Youths, was a subsidiary of M&J Wallace and approx. 6m euro was spent on acquiring and developing what is now Ferrycarrig Park. I'm open to correction but I believe that no public grants were received. For some reason, and I'm assuming that money was getting tight, the final 200,000 euros spent on the Ferrycarrig complex was listed as an inter-company loan to the Youths. It was stated at the launch of the new club, Wexford FC, that it was never intended that this money would be repaid.

When a liquidator was appointed to M&J Wallace, negotiations were held with the liquidator in relation to repayment of the 200,000 euros. For whatever reason, these negotiations were not successful, and on 6 January 2017 the loan was called in and the old entity, Wexford Youths, was gone.

Wexford Youths had been busy preparing their licensing application in the old club's name, and it took trojan work by a number of volunteers to prepare all the paperwork and licensing required in the new name of Wexford FC. The FAI have been said to have been extremely helpful in this regard with Fran Gavin being particularly so. All reports are that Wexford came extraordinarily close to losing LOI football.

[sbgawa]

While I agree with what you're saying, there's nothing illegal about it.

From a company law perspective it is but in most leagues it would lead to a points deduction. It just looks bad. Anyway good luck to them...only 4 more sleeps :)))

[sbgawa]

From a co law perspective it is legal is what I meant

[total hoofball]

Should be an automatic 20 point deduction at the start of the season for any 'new' club entering the league on the back of a club in the process of liquidation. If Wexford Youths and Waterford United are in the process of liquidation then their replacements have gained a competitive advantage going into the season debt free

I've alot of sympathy for Wexford's unavoidable situation, they're trying to make a sustainable club out of a mess but deductions should still apply. If Waterford have done the same thing and are now dishing out stupid wages to sign the likes of Kenny Browne, Sander Puri and David McDaid then that's a total disgrace.

[pineapple stu]

Here's (http://www.extratime.ie/articles/18336/fran-gavin-hails-brave-decision-to-go-ten-team-premier-division/) the article btw - was on mobile earlier and couldn't link as easy.


Within the First Division there will be two “new” clubs with Wexford FC and Waterford FC joining the league. It means that those clubs start the season debt-free, which is a requirement of the licensing process.

There was a certain amount of controversy with the awarding of the licences to those clubs but Fran Gavin stressed that both clubs had met all of the licensing requirements.

“That was the old Wexford Youths,” said Gavin about Wexford Youths debts. “The new Wexford FC are starting afresh. We didn’t have an application for a licence from Waterford United or Wexford Youths this season.

“A new entity in Waterford and a new entity in Wexford applied. They both went through a very rigorous process of club licencing.

Fran Gavin sounds more like Comical Ali the more you listen to him. Though we know Comical Ali was just doing what he was told...

[oldyouth]

Weren't Wexford Youths' debts to Mick Wallace's old construction firm, that is itself now bust and in administration ? In which case any repaid debt would get passed on to Wallace's creditors in a diluted form.

In short - I suspect it's banks and Dublin firms servicing the construction industry who'll take the eventual hit here, but it's all very indirect.

Was the name-change part of walking away from their debts then ?

The liquidator of Mick's company, M&J Wallace, called in a €200k 'loan' that it made to the club. Wexford Youths FC had no assets, other than jerseys, footballs, packets of pasta etc. There was no financial value in issuing a closing down order on the club and it was designed by Cerberus to embarrass Mick because of his vocal criticism of them. The full story will be in our 1st match programme and I'll post it here after it is published

[Charlie Darwin]

Should be an automatic 20 point deduction at the start of the season for any 'new' club entering the league on the back of a club in the process of liquidation. If Wexford Youths and Waterford United are in the process of liquidation then their replacements have gained a competitive advantage going into the season debt free
They're also asset free. Being debt free isn't much use for a senior football club when you have no assets.

[EatYerGreens]

Should be an automatic 20 point deduction at the start of the season for any 'new' club entering the league on the back of a club in the process of liquidation.

Whilst I agree with you here, the problem is that in a closed football structure - i.e. not a pyramid - it would be a largely symbolic gesture against First Division clubs. Particularly in the coming year, when only one will go up and it's looking pretty clear before a ball is kicked which club that will be.

If we ever get to a proper pyramid system in the ROI - which even the likes of the Irish League and League of Wales have got ffs - then it would have some teeth. Otherwise it would be a largely symbolic gesture most of the time against FD clubs.

Perhaps a fairer way would be to spread a points deduction over a number of seasons i.e. 12 in Year 1, 5 in Year 2, 3 in Year 3 ? That would have more of an impact on the players, manager etc that a club can attract than just one season of pain.

[Martinho II]

how come Mick Wallace isnt involved with Wexford FC is that cos of him trying to call back the loan from Youths?

[NeverFeltBetter]

God knows Wexford are better off.

[Darkglasses]

how come Mick Wallace isnt involved with Wexford FC is that cos of him trying to call back the loan from Youths?

He didn't call in the loan, the US vulture fund liquidating the assets of his company did. He isn't involved as this was one of the stipulations the FAI made for issuing Wexford FC with a new licence.

Say what you will about Mick, but there isn't a hope that Wexford would have ever had a League of Ireland side without his input, even besides the millions he sunk into constructing Ferrycarrig.

[oldyouth]

Anyone who thinks Mick is done with Wexford Youths/Wexford FC doesn't know the man

[nigel-harps1954]

Anyone who thinks Mick is done with Wexford Youths/Wexford FC doesn't know the man

Can't imagine there's too many on here that do know him.

[colonelwest]

The Wexford situation is 100000000000% Cerberus sticking the knife into Wallace. Say what you will about his construction business over the years etc but he's done phenomenal work for Football in Wexford and is a proper football man. His bankruptcy and the calling in of the 200k off the Youths was all down to him outing them in the Dail for buying all those loans from Nama for pennies on the Euro, well below market value in another round of our grand old history of shady as fcuk political/ brown envelope dealings. Cerberus bought his debts from Nama and called them all in pretty much instantaneously to declare him bankrupt as payback for him publicaly outing their shady dealings in Project Eagle.