Trump

[mark12345]

So you don't believe the Clintons are in the mafia business of taking people out, they just have the occasional wiseguy whacked?

Excuse me. Charlie, not Danny

[mark12345]

A good breakdown of Donna Brazile's revelations in respect of how the DNC rigged the Democratic primary:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3W2GIZ8rN0

Brazile was the interim chairperson of the DNC from July of 2016 to February of 2017.



It's more than a bit hypocritical of Hillary Clinton to purportedly champion "democracy" and complain about alleged Russian interference and collusion with Trump to help swing the US presidential election whilst she benefited from the DNC rigging the Democratic primary in her favour. She's been going on for the past year as if she's been cheated - as if someone stole the presidency from her - when she stole the Democratic nomination from Sanders.

If the DNC hadn't undermined Sanders, it's entirely possible that he'd now be president instead of Trump, but the Democrats can't bear to admit that. They have only themselves to blame and must bear a significant degree of responsibility for Trump becoming president of the US.

It's true, the Democrats bear a large amount of responsibility for Donald Trump becoming president, but not in the way you think. Hillary Clinton was a thoroughly unlikable candidate on the Dems side, but one person more than any other, is responsible for Trump being elected president. And that person is Barack Obama. Eight years of political correctness (funny thing about political correctness is - anyone I have ever talked to or seen on TV talk about PC, has always detested it, yet it's still so much a part of our lives today? Funny how that works?) and eight years of him and his cronies labelling everyone who had a difference of opinion on his policies as a bigot, homophobe or racist. That sort of behavior is straight out of the communist play book, and what's more, the Democrats were so successful at it that freedom of speech took a real beating in America during the past eight years. And, the man who was going to right the wrongs of racism, stood there and threw gasoline on the fire, every day of his presidency. Never before have police in America been so put down as they were during Obama's eight years, and race relations have never been as bad in this awful racist country, which was so racist that it elected a black president, not once, but twice. America is still recovering from Barack Obama.

[Charlie Darwin]

I don't know that they have had anyone whacked. But there are an awful lot of rumours about such goings on involving them. And, as I say, their years of lying just adds to the suspicion (read about Bill's attack on Juanita Broaddrick "Bill Clinton raped me and Hillary Clinton threatened me," plus the stories of Kathleen Willey, Gennifer Flowers, Paula Jones). There are reportedly 24 women who have made allegations against Bill Clinton including one in England. Now do you know any guy, Danny, who could come home to his wife and tell her that he was under investigation for sexual misconduct at work and expect to get a "Don't worry about it honey, everything will be ok," answer? No, neither do I. He might get away with it once, but can you imagine any man coming home to his wife and telling her, 24 times, that he was under investigation for sexual misconduct? Would the wife still be around to listen to him? Not only was Bill Clinton's wife still around to endure a marriage which was nothing but a facade, she reportedly threatened many of these women who accused her husband. How preposterous is that? And to see the pair of them cozy up to one another two or three times on the campaign last year, when it looked for all the world that Hillary would be the next president. Well......need I say more.
You said you don't believe they did, not it's you don't know. Which is it? I don't care about the Clintons' marriage - it's irrelevant to me.

[DannyInvincible]

It would have been a much closer battle between Sanders and Trump, but God help America if Bernie every won. Free this, free that, free education for everyone! He tried it in his own state and they almost ran him out of town as it resulted in massive tax hikes for Vermonters. The real people who got screwed in the last election were the Bernie voters. There were 15 milion of them at one stage, it was reported. And then, after the election was stolen from him, the supporters were left high and dry. And to add insult to injury Bernie takes a 1.5 million dollar house in the Hamptons in exchange for supporting Hillary for the balance of the campaign. With Bernie being the consumate anti-Hillary, his u turn must have left his supporters seething. And it also begs the question, how anyone could ever take a man like him seriously again.

Perhaps Sanders saw Hillary as the lesser of two evils - the other (worse) evil being a potential Trump presidency - and decided to endorse Clinton on that entirely rational basis. I don't know enough about your bung-in-the-form-of-a-house claim to properly comment on it. Can you provide further details on it?

Having done a quick Google search, I did come across the following, however: http://jacksonville.com/reason/fact-check/2016-08-19/story/fact-check-did-bernie-sanders-accept-payment-endorsement-hillary


Times-Union readers want to know:

I recently received an email claiming that Bernie Sanders bought a $600,000 summer home shortly after endorsing Hillary Clinton. Did Clinton pay him for his support?

It is true that Sanders bought a $600,000 summer home, but there is no evidence at all that Clinton paid for his endorsement, according to the fact-checkers TruthOrFiction.com and Snopes.com. Nor could we find any indication that Sanders has been unethical in this regard.

Your assertion sounds suspiciously like a rehashed or exaggerated version of the claim, for which there is no evidence, that is referenced above. So, again, what on earth are you talking about? It might be advisable to do even the briefest of checks on the "facts" that are fed to you by the "reputable" Fox News instead of gullibly swallowing them whole without a second thought. Weren't you purportedly advising critical analysis above and taking issue with the media fooling and deceiving people? I think you fall victim to the deceit yourself, or perhaps you willingly collude in it? That check took me two minutes to expose your claim as nonsense.

For the sake of argument, let's say your groundless conspiracy theory was true... According to yourself, the alleged "u-turn" brings Sanders' credibility into question, but why don't Trump's u-turns (http://www.straitstimes.com/world/united-states/president-donald-trump-u-turns-on-6-issues) lead you to question Trump's credibility? Why is Trump a protected specimen?

I'll just add that a healthy and educated society has benefits for all and not just for those who receive health treatment or education for "free". Those who go through education spend a career - nearly their entire adulthood - contributing back into the economy with their training, knowledge and labour, so it's not a case of "all take"; they generally pay back society's investment many times over, keep things ticking over and help society evolve and flourish for the next generation.

And such services aren't really free at all either, nor would Sanders suggest that they are, so you misrepresent him. Such services would be paid for through the general taxation of society as a whole, including those in receipt of the services. These are the costs of ensuring a better, more just society for all and of constructing a social safety net for society's most vulnerable.

[Charlie Darwin]

I'd want a nice house to endorse Hillary, to be fair.

[Real ale Madrid]

but one person more than any other, is responsible for Trump being elected president. And that person is Barack Obama. Eight years of political correctness (funny thing about political correctness is - anyone I have ever talked to or seen on TV talk about PC, has always detested it, yet it's still so much a part of our lives today? Funny how that works?) and eight years of him and his cronies labelling everyone who had a difference of opinion on his policies as a bigot, homophobe or racist. That sort of behavior is straight out of the communist play book, and what's more, the Democrats were so successful at it that freedom of speech took a real beating in America during the past eight years..

How are people even engaging with this utter lunatic. This particular passage is completely deranged.

The Communist playbook - Jesus wept.

[mark12345]

You said you don't believe they did, not it's you don't know. Which is it? I don't care about the Clintons' marriage - it's irrelevant to me.

I guess I should have been clearer. Do I think Bill and Hillary are hiding in the bushes with telescopic lenses to take someone out? No I don't. But a statistic has been put forward that 46 people close to the Clintons are dead now. That's sort of alarming isn't it.

[mark12345]

How are people even engaging with this utter lunatic. This particular passage is completely deranged.

The Communist playbook - Jesus wept.

Deranged? Lunatic? Something in my previous post you disagree with? Feel free to explain and be specific.

[Charlie Darwin]

I guess I should have been clearer. Do I think Bill and Hillary are hiding in the bushes with telescopic lenses to take someone out? No I don't. But a statistic has been put forward that 46 people close to the Clintons are dead now. That's sort of alarming isn't it.
Mafia men don't sit in bushes with telescopic lenses, they get somebody else to whack the schmo. To be clear, is that what you're suggesting the Clintons did?

[mark12345]

Mafia men don't sit in bushes with telescopic lenses, they get somebody else to whack the schmo. To be clear, is that what you're suggesting the Clintons did?

To be clear, read the above

[Real ale Madrid]

Deranged? Lunatic? Something in my previous post you disagree with? Feel free to explain and be specific.

As soon as you back up some of your balderdash with even the merest hint of a link, source or report then i might consider engaging with you. I can't for the life of me understand how you have been able to post so much unsubstantiated bile for so long. Poor old Skstu got the boot for a week for way less! I'd have reported your posts myself but every time I try and do it I think; - "This stuff can't be real - this guy is on a wind up!" and i hit "undo"!

So can I throw out a few starters for 10?:

"How did Barack Hussein Obama II help in electing the r:/Donald ?"
"How has freedom of speech taken a beating in the USA ? Few examples would be cool here.
"Name one person Barack Hussein Obama II called a bigot, racist or homophobe?" We will need a link.
"Name one person a crony of "Barrack Hussein Obama II called a bigot, racist or homophobe?" Again back up the truth with a link.
"What in the name of Allah* is the Communist Playbook?
"Why do you detest political correctness , and how would you say, citing examples, where it has had a detrimental effect on US society?



*peace be upon him

[mark12345]

As soon as you back up some of your balderdash with even the merest hint of a link, source or report then i might consider engaging with you. I can't for the life of me understand how you have been able to post so much unsubstantiated bile for so long. Poor old Skstu got the boot for a week for way less! I'd have reported your posts myself but every time I try and do it I think; - "This stuff can't be real - this guy is on a wind up!" and i hit "undo"!

So can I throw out a few starters for 10?:

"How did Barack Hussein Obama II help in electing the r:/Donald ?"
"How has freedom of speech taken a beating in the USA ? Few examples would be cool here.
"Name one person Barack Hussein Obama II called a bigot, racist or homophobe?" We will need a link.
"Name one person a crony of "Barrack Hussein Obama II called a bigot, racist or homophobe?" Again back up the truth with a link.
"What in the name of Allah* is the Communist Playbook?
"Why do you detest political correctness , and how would you say, citing examples, where it has had a detrimental effect on US society?



*peace be upon him

"How did Barack Hussein Obama II help in electing the r:/Donald ?"

By going on a world tour and apologizing for his perceived American transgressions. By giving the world's largest state sponsor of terrorism, Iran, $152 billion (American people just loved that one) to do with as they wish. By never uttering the words "Radical Islamic terrorism" despite being asked to countless times to do so, and by labelling attacks like that in Fort Hood as 'workplace violence'. By not coming out and telling the truth about Benghazi. By not telling the truth about the IRS scandal. By giving Eric Holder a pass on Fast and Furious and hoping no one would notice. By not coming down on the side of reason when an Oregon couple were forced to pay state enforced damages for not baking a wedding cake for a gay couple (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/12/29/oregon-bakery-owners-pay-more-than-135g-in-damages-over-refusal-to-make-cake-for-gay-wedding.html) - although many people disagreed with the couple, can you really call it a free country when the goverment (of which Obama was president at the time) can actually force you to bake a cake? By not asking Hillary Clinton to come clean about those e-mails (all 33,000 of them).

"How has freedom of speech taken a beating in the USA ? Few examples would be cool here.

A few examples for you. Kids in public schools in America cannot celebrate Christmas anymore. In all honesty, it was probably trending that way before Obama, but the practice certainly sped up while he was in office. And kids cannot celebrate Halloween anymore (don't know that it's the case in every school across the country but the trend has already begun). Halloween is now "Black and Orange Spirit day". No more Columbus Day either. In Los Angeles the city council just passed that beauty of a bill a couple of months ago and it's coming to a city near you you can be sure. Prayers for high school football teams, pre-game, are now verboten in most schools. All it takes is one person to object and the wishes of the masses became irrelevant. America 'survived' very nicely for over two hundred years with the various religions co-existing together and respecting one another (religion was inclusive, not exclusive). Ethnic groups lived by the motto of 'faith and family' - but nowadays it's shut all religion out because it is offensive to a minority of people. And as far as the freedom to speak at universities - Antifa protesters shut down Milo Yiannopolous and Anne Coulter UC Berkley while causing tens of thousands worth of damage. It was a similar story at a free speech rally in Boston, which
was greeted by Antifa types who threw urine bags and rocks at police. These most blatant incidents of shutting down free speech have played out all across the country. And while they have occured during the Trump presidency, they were born in the Obama era and continued with the blessing of Hillary Clinton and her 'Resist' movement.

"Name one person Barack Hussein Obama II called a bigot, racist or homophobe?" We will need a link.

I never said he called anyone a bigot, racist or homophobe but his supporters certainly did if you had a difference of opinion with them - you only have to turn on a radio show in America to hear it. But in regard to Obama, what was he thinking when he invited BLM to the White House in mid July of last year, shortly after the killing of five police officers and injuring of nine others in Dallas by the same group. The assailant, Micah Johnson, was reportedly angry over police shootings of black men and stated that he wanted to kill white people, especially white police officers (Wiki).

Play book is an American football term. It basically means game plan. Communist play book = Communist game plan.

All I have time for right now.

[Real ale Madrid]

Just want to point out the only link you provided did not mention Barack Obama , it's just a link about a couple who were convicted of breaking a law. You provide no evidence of any of your claims and have provided no evidence for any of your supposed facts on this thread since you started posting. None.

Please no more , I have no time to engage with an idiot. Idiots drag you down to thier level and beat you with experience.

Your level of debate is somewhere between "Fox sponsored news" level and the level of "Thoughts and prayers after a mass shooting" in other words - pointless.

[backstothewall]

I was under the impression that the title of the thread was "Trump". Not "Clinton" or "Obama". The constant attempts to hijack this thread to talk about people who hold no office is nothing short of wumming.

[Eminence Grise]

By not coming down on the side of reason when an Oregon couple were forced to pay state enforced damages for not baking a wedding cake for a gay couple (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/12/29/oregon-bakery-owners-pay-more-than-135g-in-damages-over-refusal-to-make-cake-for-gay-wedding.html) - although many people disagreed with the couple, can you really call it a free country when the goverment (of which Obama was president at the time) can actually force you to bake a cake?


Oh, this is just too funny for words. Firstly, that you still take Fox as a credible source. Secondly, that Obama has some kind of Martha Stewart fetish (maybe his superhero costume is an apron and a pastry brush?) and spent eight years forcing unsuspecting pore simple Christians from Oregon to bake cakes for subversive deviants like two women in love clearly hellbent on ripping the entire social fabric asunder. And possibly the space time continuum for all we know. Funny how the most self-righteous bleating about Christian rights comes from the most appallingly unchristian, bigoted, unforgiving, zealous f***wads whose bibles don’t open past the OT.

Thirdly, oh yeah, you still take Fox as a credible source.


All I have time for right now.

Don’t rush back. These are my last words on this anyway. Too bloody annoyed at the level of rubbish to want to engage further because, honestly, it’s not worth the infraction. Good night and good luck.

[samhaydenjr]

How are people even engaging with this utter lunatic. This particular passage is completely deranged.

The Communist playbook - Jesus wept.

Ah sure you know mark12345 (and maybe KrisLetang) is probably sitting in a large office block somewhere in Moscow, although why the FSB is focusing on our nice little corner of the internet here at foot.ie is beyond me - perhaps he's in training or something - or did their algorithm pick up on the fact that somebody set up a thread about Trump and automatically send somebody to troll us?

[dahamsta]

Real ale Madrid has a point, although he broke the rules himself in making it. Pot, meet kettle.

The rules of this forum (http://foot.ie/threads/32644-Rules-amp-Info-Current-Affairs-ONLY-Please!) are stricter than most forums, in that they explicitly state:


you have to back up your comments with facts, via links or references to texts; or in the case of opinions you have to argue your point in detail. Saying "in my opinion" followed by one sentence is not "detail".

I've watched this thread with amazement up until recently, confused and bemused by the fact that we had our own private little /r/The_Donald here; surprised by just how caught up Irish people can get in the Trump Idiocracy; shocked by just how naive, ignorant and occasionally actually stupid people's comments are. And let's be clear, the vast majority of those attributes are on the Trump supporters side; and let's be honest, there's only a few of them here.

At this stage I actually think they may believe what they're saying, because there does seem to be a category of people out there that take the 4chan/Donald koolaid and drink it, bath in it, possibly even use it for enemas, but it's no skin off my nose either way, I just want shot of it at this stage.

So let's apply the rules properly from now on. I'm not going to appeal to the Trump fans, because they're renowned for not changing their behaviour, I'm appealing to the rest of you -- when one of the Trump fans posts something as a fact without supporting evidence, please report the post and I'll provide them with an infraction. If they post something as an opinion without arguing their point in detail, in a realistic manner, report the post. They'll be gone in a week and we can get Current Affairs back to normal.

Trump fans, don't say you weren't warned. And to be 100% crystal clear -- when you're banned, it'll be site-wide. Remember that. Is it really worth it?

[backstothewall]

Getting back on track, these are my thoughts on the 1st year. (Disclaimer. It's not actually a year as he Wasn't sworn in until January but as things will shut down shortly for thanksgiving and Christmas it may as well be a year.)

Domestically he hasn't achieved anything policy wise. Obamacare is still chugging away, he's built a few dozen feet of border wall, tax reform hasn't happened and his Muslim ban keeps being knocked down in the courts as it is grossly unconstitutional.

In DC he can point to a real achievement. He got Neil Gorsuch onto the SCOTUS. Aside from that he can get nothing done. He simply isn't respected in congress by either party.

The same applies in foreign policy. President of the USA he may be (for now), but he will never be viewed as leader of the free world. It seems to me that the pause button has been pressed on the conflicts in the usual hotspots until America gets a proper President again. I don't see there even being an attempt to progress issues like Israel-Palestine any time soon.

In the future I can't see either the wall being funded or Obamacare being repealed in the run up to the mid term elections. The democrats should make gains regardless and take back enough to tie it up for the 2 years following that.

It seems a long shot that Trump could possibly be re-elected in 2020, which if he is on the ballot would mean Obamacare would be over a decade old before republicans get a chance to reform it, by which time it will be very well established.

For that reason, and setting Russia investigations aside,
I can see a strong chance of him being challenged for the GOP nomination if he gets that far.

[KrisLetang]

The party that is not in power almost always makes gains in the mid terms, although GWB did well during his first term. Obama got trounced in his first term.

I thought Trump's speech on N Korea was pretty effective. I'm still just not sure what the plan is.

As far as it being a long shot Trump could possibly be re-elected in 2020, it's funny. Most Democrats I've listened to lately disagree strongly. Former NY Governor David Patterson (an interesting guy, he seems very kind and is blind) said this morning while guest co hosting on 710 WOR that he sees Trump getting re elected. I watch Kennedy's show on Fox Business sometimes and her panel is a mix of Democrats and Republicans and Libertarians, and very often long time Dem operatives (Like Jessica Tarlov) talk about the Democrats short bench when it comes to 2020. Corey Booker? Meh. I'm from NJ so I can tell you he likes to hide the fact that he grew up VERY wealthy in Old Tappan. Kamala Harris? Those California policies will not play in the mid west. Elizabeth Warren? She is no spring chicken....I think Terry McCauliffe is running, popular outgoing Gov of VA and a former Clinton money bundler, and Clinton loyalist. He might have a shot I guess. Joe Biden seems to think he would be a shoe in. I just don't think so.
He's kind of touchy feely and there are real weird things going on in his family to say the least. Mark Zuckerberg? Has a hard time connecting socially in person to put it mildly. But who knows.

[backstothewall]

Those names you have listed all have the meh factor, but It's that issue which makes me think it will be someone else at the top of the ticket.

The Irishman in me is looking at Rep. Joe Kennedy but i think somebody can come out of the pack who will make Trump look as old and incompetent as he is, and who will be able to deal with his campaign BS.

[KrisLetang]

I'll say another thing that a lot of smart wonky people were tweeting yesterday on both sides that I kinda agree with: i don't know if "Trumpism" really exists....I think it was more people being tired of Hillary, and the Clinton's. I trudged up to the voting booth that day. I went in more concerned about local elections honestly. I swallowed hard and nicked the button for Jill what's her name and the green party. Jill Stein. I was ****ed about losing good health ins under Obama after he said if you like your doctor you can keep your doctor. And so right before I pressed the "vote" button... I switched to DT. I don't feel great as I walked out. But i celebrated that night. I know that doesn't make a lot of sense but that's the damn truth. I don't like the man. But i like the shrill people like john Oliver (Who TF IS THAT GUY) and Steven Colbert even less. I think the great Norm MacDonald's take on the late night anti Trump brigade was pretty good recently. He said via twitter: "The saddest thing about Trump is that people who hate him think that is a worldview." "Without saying any ideas. It's just simple hate as worldview." Norm is NOT a Trump supporter.

It's not about ideas anymore...its just like...I hate him! So I'm smart! What is that. you know? JMHO. Like personally this is Dahmasta's website or whatever so he can set the rules. I just wish the BS was more seen on both sides of the aisle. Its evident on BOTH sides like crazy, no? I don''t mean here per se...We just elected a old, white, rich Goldman Sachs exec as GOV of NJ. (Over a female I might add.) He was asked how he wound fund things in his plans during the debates (for example pensions) and he refused to say. That's how stupid things have gotten........also old white Goldman Sachs exec who ran out small companies...BAD...well unless he is on our side. Then...good.

[backstothewall]

I trudged up to the voting booth that day. I went in more concerned about local elections honestly. I swallowed hard and nicked the button for Jill what's her name and the green party. Jill Stein. I was ****ed about losing good health ins under Obama after he said if you like your doctor you can keep your doctor. And so right before I pressed the "vote" button... I switched to DT. I don't feel great as I walked out. But i celebrated that night. I know that doesn't make a lot of sense but that's the damn truth. I don't like the man.

Would you mind me asking which state you are in? Or even an idea of the region. It's good for getting an idea of where you are coming from in context.

[Real ale Madrid]

Real ale Madrid has a point, although he broke the rules himself in making it. Pot, meet kettle.


I'd like to apologise for breaking the rules - but I plead insanity due to concussion after getting a clatter across the back of head from a flying Communist playbook. Will keep it civil from now on.

[ontheotherhand]

You don't live in America Danny, do you?
Just wondering?
What American media are you familiar with? Is it CNN, MSNBC, ABC, CBS, NBC? Or do you watch Fox News Channel?
Do you listen to any of the leading Talk Radio shows in America?
I listen to them all because I live here. And the only TV channel who will give you reputable news (they criticize the country's politicians equally) is Fox News. All of the Talk Radio shows are usually on the money when it comes to the corruption in Washington and on how we are being fooled and deceived by the mainstream media when it comes to Donald Trump.

I have seen the American mainstream media lie through their teeth, often through decption, for years now. I never thought one way or the other about the stories on the six o'clock news, but when you finally see what they are saying and how they are
presenting it to you, it is disgusting beyond belief. However, not everyone in America is a news / policical junkie like me and the end result of that is that a good 40 per cent of this country is completely clueless as to what is going on in government in Washington. They get their news from comedians and blogs and Facebook, but I'm sure that is the same in Ireland.

Here are some examples, if you care to read them, of the bias against Donald Trump in the MSM.
On November 8 last year, the day Trump got elected, a man in Chicago was driving away from the poll booth when he was run off the road and pulled out of his car by four youths (three male, one female). His crime - he had a Trump sticker on his car. They beat him senseless and he is lucky to have gotten away with his life. They also robbed him. Now, had the shoe been on the other foot (ie Trump supporters doing that to Hillary supporter) CNN would have broken away from all election coverage and devoted all their time to this incident. What did they do? They tried to bury the story and hope it would go away. It was only two days later that they showed it to the public, and only then because it was all over YouTube.

And what did CNN tell us about the DNC server hacking? They tried to bury that one also. The server was hacked, we were told. And when the FBI came to Philadelphia to investigate the crime (remember it was a crime commited on American soil, which is under the jurisdiction of the FBI, they were told that their services weren't needed). The FBI were told that the DNC had contracted the investigation out to a private firm called Crowdstrike. It is reported that the DNC did not want the FBI looking at the server as it had evidence of the way they had railroaded Bernie Sanders in order to get Hillary elected. CNN, and the other main media outlets kept this under wraps and are still doing it to this day. At the same time they are pushing a narrative that Trump was colluding with the Russians. Now it's ok to say that if there is evidence of that. But there is none, over a year after the story began.

And how can you take CNN et al seriously when their anchors were openly crying the night Donal Trump got elected.

Just the other night, when news came through that unemployement figures were at their lowest since 1973 and the Dow Jones at its highest mark ever, what the ABC and NBC do? They decided not to run their financial segment, which would have showed Trump in a favorable light. And then there was the decision not to investigate Hervey Weinstein, he of Hollywood fame who has now several charges of sexual misconduct and rape against him. Harvey was a big Democrat donor. He contributed to Hillary and others and ABC decided twice not to run a story about him which showed his transgressions.

All day long the mainstream media are criticising Trump. You just cannot take them seriously, because they are trying to deceive you into thinking the way they want you think. Propoganda in other words. Unfortunately too many Americans believe them, and I know from talking to people in Ireland and England that the news is similarly slanted there.

Look, Donald Trump is a brash New Yorker. He has his mannerisms which some people may not like. I'll give you that. But those things are objective. His substance is without question however. He is the best thing to come along in American politics (because he is not a politician) in decades. He is nothing if not a realist - look at his comments on the New York terrorist attack this past Tuesday - while others around him are telling us that day is night, and night is day, and questioning our intelligence when we don't believe them.

I have gone on far too long Danny. But I must say this before leaving. You said the following:

"At the end of the day, Trump still made a hames of the condolence call and of matters since, regardless of what the media wish to say. Perhaps no other president has ever made such a mess of a situation like that, meaning there would have been nothing for the media to uncover then?"

You are as wrong about this as was the man who said the Titanic was unsinkable.

I do live in America and the above is utter garbage. Rupert Murdoch's Fox News is your source of truth? And Talk Radio shows? Alex Jones among others I'm guessing?

The truth is all the media in America is owned by people who want to influence things one way or the other. The hard work is in figuring out what to believe and what not to. The easy work is in figuring out the worst outlets and avoiding them. Fox News is top of that pile of ****.

Donald Trump's substance is without question? Are you a plant, a fool or a WUM?

[KrisLetang]

Would you mind me asking which state you are in? Or even an idea of the region. It's good for getting an idea of where you are coming from in context.

I grew up in Bergen County, NJ. I live in NYC. Went to college in CO.

[strangeirish]

Would you mind me asking which state you are in? Or even an idea of the region. It's good for getting an idea of where you are coming from in context.

As a Trump supporter, he must be in a terrible state altogether...

[KrisLetang]

Here is something I am really interested in:

What would you do about North Korea's nuclear program if you were DT? The reason i phrase it like that is BC someone saying what they WOULDN'T do sort of leads to an endless cycle of conversation like Dahmasta doesn't want. I think we can all agree him tweeting things is not the answer. So what WOULD you do.

[backstothewall]

Here is something I am really interested in:

What would you do about North Korea's nuclear program if you were DT? The reason i phrase it like that is BC someone saying what they WOULDN'T do sort of leads to an endless cycle of conversation like Dahmasta doesn't want. I think we can all agree him tweeting things is not the answer. So what WOULD you do.

I'll bite.

If i was POTUS this is what i would do about North Korean and their nuclear program.

I would invite the Chair and the ranking Democrat on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee to the White House for dinner. Over that dinner i would suggest outlining a clear, bipartisan policy on North Korea. I would propose something like the following

State publicly that:

- The USA will not launch a first strike nuclear attack at North Korea.
- In the event of a North Korean missile being launched against Japan, South Korea, Australia, New Zealand, the USA, or any US territory, the USA will destroy Pyongyang with nuclear weapons in retaliation.
- In the event that it appears that North Korea is preparing to launch and armed nuclear weapon against any target, the USA will attempt to disrupt their launch using non-nuclear weapon systems.

In private I would:

Approach China about a permanent resolution to the partition of Korea. The Chinese aren't stupid. They already know that North Korea is a crisis waiting to happen on their border, and know that a nuclear North Korea only makes the situation worse. The only reason they haven't done anything about it already is that they fear millions of refugees coming over the Yalu River, and suffering significant loss of face.

I would propose a joint Chinese/South Korean "peacekeeping force" entering North Korea from China to provide stability after some manufactured or conveniently timed crisis. The exit strategy is a puppet government lead by a South Korean general taking over, with everyone stating an intention to reunite the peninsula within 2 years.

This would still involve loss of face for China. To address this i would propose partial fulfilment of their One-China policy. I would have my Secretary of State chair negotiations which would lead to Taiwan being reunified with China under similar terms as those the British negotiated when Hong Kong came back under Chinese sovereignty.

[KrisLetang]

interesting. One thing I wonder. if Kim was somehow taken out in a coup, would there be any chance of NK/SK reunification or would China never ever allow that? The Chinese are treating Donald much better than BHO. Xi didn't even greet BHO when he landed, US had to sneak him out of the back of the plane to save face.

[BonnieShels]

Ah sure you know mark12345 (and maybe KrisLetang) is probably sitting in a large office block somewhere in Moscow, although why the FSB is focusing on our nice little corner of the internet here at foot.ie is beyond me - perhaps he's in training or something - or did their algorithm pick up on the fact that somebody set up a thread about Trump and automatically send somebody to troll us?

They're clearly practicing for a full-frontal assault on YBIG.


I grew up in Bergen County, NJ. I live in NYC. Went to college in CO.

And a Penguins fan to boot?

[backstothewall]

I can't imagine a scenario where China would ever allow US allied troops to march up to their border. I just can't imagine that ever happening unless there was something they really wanted in it for them.

America pulling out of TPP was a dream come true for them. They will be delighted to have Trump in the White House. I'd imagine the Chinese are putting on a show as they are aware he is under pressure and want him to look strong on television in America. It is in the interests of China for Trump to be in the White House. He is weak and would find it very difficult to find the political support in Washington for any action to contain their expansion.

All the opposites were true of Obama. There was no negative consequence to embarrassing him as he was leaving office anyway, and that slight gave Trump ammunition to use against HRC in the election (who despite what she said during the campaign would in all probability have signed TPP).

The Obama White House should have seen it coming tbh

[Mr A]

The nuclear NK issue is complicated by their arsenal of biological and chemical weapons which can be deployed more easily and in a more deniable fashion. They could create mass casualties at any time and they are more likely to actually use them than nukes as they know that would see their immediate destruction. There are no easy answers there. Invasion or regime change would potentially see millions of people die. That's why having someone like Trump, who seems so impulsive, playing a key role is deeply scary.

[KrisLetang]

See NK cannot fight a war. Look at this...the soldier is 5'5" 132 pounds. And these are their best guys on the DMZ. Saying nothing of the poor guys other problems. Which are disgusting. A coup has to be coming. The Army is going to get tired of starving. Plain and simple.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/north-korean-defector-had-10-113556241.html

[BonnieShels]

They've been starving for 50 years and haven't bothered til now.

[KrisLetang]

It's gotten progressively worse BonBon. USSR fed them 50 years ago.

Al Franken in a Shi* storm, can't believe he lasts the day. Keith Ellison will be appointed in his place as Jr. Sen from Minnesota. First Muslim in the Senate I believe. Fair play to the left wing columnists..I haven't seen even one defending Franken all day. Most calling for him to resign by nightfall.

[BonnieShels]

It's gotten progressively worse BonBon. USSR fed them 50 years ago.

Al Franken in a Shi* storm, can't believe he lasts the day. Keith Ellison will be appointed in his place as Jr. Sen from Minnesota. First Muslim in the Senate I believe. Fair play to the left wing columnists..I haven't seen even one defending Franken all day. Most calling for him to resign by nightfall.


Not to defend Al, but how come the Pussygrabber-in-Chief is getting a pass in all of this?

[Charlie Darwin]

Not to defend Al, but how come the Pussygrabber-in-Chief is getting a pass in all of this?
I guess Franken is a hypocrite because his behaviour is contrary to what he preaches, whereas Trump has never made a secret of the fact he's a lecherous old perv who degrades women and worse.

[backstothewall]

Franken has apologised and the woman in question has accepted the apology. TBD if that will be enough to save his job.

Any ideas about a presidential run are dead for this cycle at least though. Trump/Pence/Ryan just dodged a bullet. Franken would have taken any of them to the woodshed in 2020

[KrisLetang]

Ah, there would be one issue with that.

[backstothewall]

What's that now?

[KrisLetang]

I don't think a Jewish person could get elected president. Bloomberg or anyone else. I honestly do not.

[DannyInvincible]

I don't think a Jewish person could get elected president. Bloomberg or anyone else. I honestly do not.

Why's that? Sanders was Jewish and, even though his Jewish heritage was reported and became a relatively minor "matter of note", I don't think there was that big a deal made out of it. Or was there? Maybe I missed it (and obviously he wasn't actually elected), but I didn't get a sense people thought it his background could cost him the presidency if he'd received the nomination.

[samhaydenjr]

I don't think a Jewish person could get elected president. Bloomberg or anyone else. I honestly do not.


Why's that? Sanders was Jewish and, even though his Jewish heritage was reported and became a relatively minor "matter of note", I don't think there was that big a deal made out of it. Or was there? Maybe I missed it (and obviously he wasn't actually elected), but I didn't get a sense people thought it his background could cost him the presidency if he'd received the nomination.

Agreed - when he was still in the race, he was consistently polling a few points better than Clinton against Trump, which should have been enough to overcome the voter suppression tactics, the Fake News interference of the Russian bots and, admittedly, Trump's better management of the Swing States to win Electoral College.

[Charlie Darwin]

I'd agree the Trump constituency would be loath to elect a Jewish person alright.

[KrisLetang]

Sanders is the first to win a presidential primary ever. Goldwater was a Methodist or something. I don't think Sanders is religious at all. But again, he would not have won the Presidency.

[samhaydenjr]

Sanders is the first to win a presidential primary ever. Goldwater was a Methodist or something. I don't think Sanders is religious at all. But again, he would not have won the Presidency.

And that supposition is based on what? The consistent 10-15 point lead he held over Trump in polls from February to June of 2016?

[KrisLetang]

Those polls are meaningless AF. You do know he was trailing Clinton right? The morning of the election? CNN posted the now infamous graphic "Likely Election winner odds: Clinton 91%...>Trump 9%." at 3 PM election day.

[Charlie Darwin]

Yet Clinton could have won the election, which sort of backs up Sam's point.

[DannyInvincible]

I'd agree the Trump constituency would be loath to elect a Jewish person alright.

It's not as if they're a majority though. They'd have been loath to vote for Obama too, but he still got elected twice.


Sanders is the first to win a presidential primary ever. Goldwater was a Methodist or something. I don't think Sanders is religious at all. But again, he would not have won the Presidency.

Were you only talking about religious Jews then (rather than cultural Jews)? You've still not actually answered the question as to why you think a Jew could never be US president.

I would suggest that it's probably your own reluctance to answer questions posed to you that makes it difficult for you to have adult conversations (http://foot.ie/threads/223094-Saudi-Arabia-not-observing-the-silence?p=1935990&viewfull=1#post1935990) with those with whom you disagree. ;)

[samhaydenjr]

Those polls are meaningless AF. You do know he was trailing Clinton right? The morning of the election? CNN posted the now infamous graphic "Likely Election winner odds: Clinton 91%...>Trump 9%." at 3 PM election day.

Actually the polls close to election date were more accurate than people seem to realise - the last batch had Clinton ahead overall by 3-6 points - she won the popular vote by 2.1% and the late swing state polls showed Trump ahead or within margin of error in the key swing states he won. I saw those polls over the weekend and went into Election Day with a feeling of dread that Trump might pull it off, even though the Liberal Echo Chamber was, yes, in denial. So it was more the interpretation of the polls that was off, not the polls themselves. And overall in the polls, Clinton's lead over Trump was always smaller and softer than Sanders. So again, had Sanders won the Democratic nomination he would probably have won the General and if a 75-year-old, little-known, unpolished, uncharismatic, self-described Democratic Socialist Jewish candidate can come so close, then to say that America will never elect a Jewish president is as silly as saying that America will never elect an African-American president (particularly one with Hussein as his middle name)