Wexford Youths winding-up order?

[culloty82]

Just seen headline on Twitter from Sunday Times editor, stating that the club face a winding-up order over a €200k debt:

https://mobile.twitter.com/JohnBurnsST/status/820394583586721793

[Cuyahoga]

Hope it doesn't happen. The Wexford football public need to get behind the club.

[Longfordian]

The FAI owns the ground doesn't it? Worst case scenario they come back as Wexford FC and still play out of Ferrycarrig. Who do they owe €200k to anyway?

[NeverFeltBetter]

The Revenue?

I kid. I hope everything works out. Notwithstanding my distaste for Wallace, Youths are a good club.

[White Horse]

It's all so predictable.

Clubs with no fans eventually go bust. Can the people in charge of the licensing process not understand this??

Nice bunch of people at Wexford Youths though.

[nigel-harps1954]

I really hope Wexford come through this. I really like the club and the setup down there is excellent and loads of potential to grow a really good club there.

[NeverFeltBetter]

How much did Wexford spend between the promotion season and last year? Were there any ground improvments or other major spending?

[Lim till i die]

On a personal level I'm absolutely delighted for mick wallace. Would be a pity for all the volunteers and that.

One dot on the league of ireland map I wouldn't miss. It's easier to get to the moon from Limerick than wexford on a Friday.

[Lim till i die]

Clubs with no fans eventually go bust. Can the people in charge of the licensing process not understand this??

You're not wrong.

Trouble is you're sort of advocating a three team league.

[pineapple stu]

Hope Wexford pull through this (but "expenses", eh?), but it does highlight that the league is facing a crisis of sustainability. How will Athlone fare with an extra team to field? How long will Cabo survive? What would have happened Waterford or Bray had investors not come on board? And in the meantime, no-one seems to want to join the First Division (and who can blame them).

But it's OK. A ten-team league and live scores at bus stops will sort everything.

[total hoofball]

Hope Wexford pull through this (but "expenses", eh?), but it does highlight that the league is facing a crisis of sustainability.
The League has had this problem for years, but more so the past 10 years under the FAI's tenure. Half of the teams in the LOI are completely dependent on survival by 'investors', loans or very generous individuals happy to burn their money. This is exactly the unsustainable model the FAI have created as it means the FAI don't actually have to put in any effort to grow the league like they have done for the past 10 years.

I also can't wait for the lecturing from Stephen McGuinness on how we don't need clubs like Wexford Youths but more full-time clubs to pay his member's wages through the generosity of 'investors' like property developers

[total hoofball]

How much did Wexford spend between the promotion season and last year? Were there any ground improvments or other major spending?

There were ground improvements, they employed Shane Keegan full-time but no other major spending last season. I'd say the 200k has been accumulated over the years.

[pineapple stu]

I don't know if it's entirely the FAI's fault to be fair. The country has gone bust in the last ten years, which really hasn't helped. This thread wouldn't be here if Wallace could throw 200k at the problem and make it go away, for example.

But I do think they deserve criticism for ignoring the basic sustainability of the league, and for doing nothing to introduce new clubs.

Interestingly, both issues are discussed in the PCA document. Neil O'Riordan in The Sun yesterday seems to be advocating it too, although without mentioning it by name - https://www.thesun.ie/sport/football/431560/the-league-of-ireland-faces-an-uncertain-2017-with-no-clear-consensus-on-where-it-is-going/?CMP=spklr-_-default-_-TWITTER-_-IrishSunSport-_-20170114-_-777740107

But while the FAI blame the clubs for the state of the league, nothing's really going to change.

18 team league anyone? 10-team Premier and 8-team First?

I think UEFA requires a two-tier structure of 7 teams each at a bare minimum. We're not a million miles away from having no league at all here.

But hey, extra manager controversy (Gabay) and sales of TV rights to Mali (Conroy); that'll fix everything.

[Longfordian]

Seems the debt is owed to Mick Wallace's construction company which is in liquidation. The liquidator has a legal obligation to bring in as much of the money owed to the company as possible so it can be passed on to its creditors. They'll be looking for a settlement of some kind. Hard to know where the money will come from though.

[Bunny Kelly]

While a good idea for development of players, are the underage leagues sustainable for the clubs? These are added running expenses & no chance of bringing revenue in off it

[wonder88]

I am sure they will come to a settlement, this what happens in business. Would they try selling club shorts for 45euro each for example.
I see a lot of dislike for M Wallace from LoI supporters, I don't understand this as my own opinion is that he has been good for soccer in Wexford and in Ireland generally. Away from soccer his work in improving the operation of the Guards, and his attempt to change our awful culture of alcohol abuse by importing a more continental attitude to drink into our society is to be lauded. PD hard man Michael McDowell unfortunately backed down in the face of pressure from the vintners and Fianna Fáil, when he had the same aim. Imagine the number of people whose lives would be improved if there was even a small change in the Irish drink culture.

[pineapple stu]

While a good idea for development of players, are the underage leagues sustainable for the clubs? These are added running expenses & no chance of bringing revenue in off it
They're not sustainable at all. Talking maybe 20 per team to run an underage team. So could be 60k to run 19s/17s/15s. (Would vary by club of course)

But I think you're right that they're a good idea in terms of development of players - essential, almost. The FAI need to support clubs in rolling out these teams - it's in the FAI's benefit that we have a strong league. Instead, they're giving clubs a grant of a few hundred quid and telling them to cover the rest. That'll just push more teams under, unfortunately.

[ForzaForth]

As a Wexford Youth's supporter, the good wishes of fans from other clubs are very much appreciated. Many clubs in the LOI are skating on very thin ice, and we're undoubtedly one of them.

As regards sustainability, the Wexford Youth's model is not sustainable in its current form and probably never will be. We will shortly be adding a ninth new squad (five on the men's side and four on the women's side) by virtue of the new U15 league. No club could generate enough income to fund this programme particularly the Youths which has a relatively poor footfall through its gates.

However, with the ownership of the ground secured, I'd be confident that we'll be able to get to the starting gate for the new season.

[Mr A]

RTE piece on this. http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2017/0115/845074-wexford-youths/

Wexford have been a good addition to the league and have been better run than most. Hope they pull through. Can't help thinking that out of town grounds are always going to be a big hindrance to clubs though.

[wonder88]

I remember Pat Devlin putting a figure of 50k on running the u-21 team at Bray some time back, so if anything you are under estimating the cost Stu. I agree fully that LoI clubs will not be able to fund underage national teams over the long term. On a cost/benefit basis it is not worth for clubs much better to sign players developed by others. Brentford over in England got rid of their academy for this reason. The best system for LoI clubs would be a reserve/majority u-21 players league spilt into 3 regions.
Back to Wexford, good forward thinking by all involved, and most importantly FAI to safeguard the ground.

[pineapple stu]

50k a team is way too high; trust me.

[Darkglasses]

It's sad and scary but I'm confident we'll be there for 2017.


There were ground improvements, they employed Shane Keegan full-time but no other major spending last season. I'd say the 200k has been accumulated over the years.

We built the new toilets and SK was partially paid by commission for ad-sales, I think.

[nigel-harps1954]

50k a team is way too high; trust me.

It might not be a million miles away. I was told it costs around €40k per year to run each of Harps underage teams. It's incredibly tough for LOI teams to sustain this, but I do believe in the long run it will pay for itself.

[Nesta99]

I agree with Wonder88, I dont see why it it is not sufficient to link with an existing youth club as a feeder and up t a reserve/U21 league giving both the youth clubs players a pathway to senior football and the senior club access to an 'academy' or youth set-up. It would spread the cost burden. If youth teams cost that much to run how can the like of St Kevins run " Club has 48 Teams and over 800 Players and 105 Managers/Coaches." and please dont go on a travel cost tangent as it is a factor of cost not total cost in running a youth set-up. I agree Nigel it will pay-off in the long run but only when other aaspects of the league kick on in particular the ability to contract players properly and fully to obtain more than training compensation or the FAI got to bat to eek out every cent of compensation due to LoI clubs from the vultures picking the carcasses. Wexford Youth will remain if not entirely the same. At least on some level the creditor isnt ging to seem like rte local area business are being cut off with the financial burden if Youth reform after liquidation. Mick might have to expunge all the dates/stars he puts on his jerseys if a new club has to be formed ;p That the FAI took ownership of the ground and the ongoing issues that Wallace has had with his own companies something like this was on the cards quite a while.

[pineapple stu]

I presume a lot of St Kevin's members are paying subs? Maybe not the top teams at each age, but others surely?

[sbgawa]

If kevins are like cabinteely it's around 200 per player per year.

[wonder88]

Charging (expensive) membership is one way of offsetting the costs of these underage teams. And if Horgan for example becomes an instant star across the water it could help LoI clubs sell the dream to the kids parents so that they will be prepared to pay to play. A problem is that most LoI clubs do not own training facilities, so having to pay to rent them, makes it difficult to compete with the elite schoolboys/youth clubs. Ironically Wexford are better off than most in this regard, along Shamrock R. and Limerick I think, any other?
What is the story with UCD, regarding junior teams, strange having a University fielding school age teams.
My own view is that every club should have a womens team, in order to make them part of their community. Being an integral part of their local area is the best way to guarantee survival for clubs.
Ideally the player development/pathway is the way to go, but have LoI clubs the resources to make it work?

[NeverFeltBetter]

This was actually on the front page today, but only because of the Wallace connection.

[Nesta99]

Ideally the player development/pathway is the way to go, but have LoI clubs the resources to make it work?

This is where you would expect the FAI to be fully involved in terms of resourcing the game. I didnt realise that subs were as high these days with schoolboy clubs even the elite ones. The player development pathway allows for there to be a linking of existing youths clubs feeding in to LoI and spreading the financial burden a bit. Taking just Athlone for the moment - at the figures mentioned where could they finance U15's to U21's, ladies teams, and senior...at least Cabinteely have youth structures in place before LoI. Feeder clubs (or leagues even) would have to be a reasonable option initially at least to meet obligations for 15s to 17s!?

[pineapple stu]

What is the story with UCD, regarding junior teams, strange having a University fielding school age teams.
Not really. It's common enough now for us to be signing players in fifth year, with the idea that they'll be going to UCD in due course. And it helps as (a) schoolkids are older these days i think; the starting age has generally gone from 4 to 5 in recent times and (b) we can get players earlier, before other clubs get them.

Look at Dylan Watts for example; he'd just finished fifth year when playing for us in Europe. Someone else - possibly Bray, as I think he played with Joey's - would have nabbed him if we'd waited another two years.

I would expect Mount Merrion FC to be involved with the u15s though. But the fact that we tend to have a young team is all the more reason to have a good underage structure, not a reason to avoid it.

[sbgawa]

I was wrong about the subs in cabo it's 300 for 1 kid 495 for two....and they have 1000 + members

[oldyouth]

Wexford Youths FC will be granted a licence and will compete in the 2017 SSE Airtricity 1st Division

[EatYerGreens]

Wexford Youths FC will be granted a licence and will compete in the 2017 SSE Airtricity 1st Division

Reporting a fact ?

Making a prediction ?

Reviewing your Christmas wish-list to Santa ?

[oldyouth]

Reporting a fact ?

Making a prediction ?

Reviewing your Christmas wish-list to Santa ?

Which ever one you want. I'm happier today than I was yesterday. Read in to that what you wish. Now to take my '2017 collectors item' season ticket down from e-Bay :)

[**FrOsTy**]

Hearing that Wexford Youths have been folded, and the application for a licence was under Wexford FC?

[outspoken]

Hearing that Wexford Youths have been folded, and the application for a licence was under Wexford FC?

Yep chatting a youths fan there, new colours, new crest and new name.

[White Horse]

Yep chatting a youths fan there, new colours, new crest and new name.

Hopefully the pink is gone, along with the curly haired one.

[ToberonaTornado]

Hopefully the pink is gone, along with the curly haired one.

I'm not 100% up to date on the story with Wex Youths and MW.Did MW mortgage Ferrycarraig Park at one time?

[Longfordian]

The FAI owns the ground doesn't it? Worst case scenario they come back as Wexford FC and still play out of Ferrycarrig. Who do they owe €200k to anyway?

I've sent them an invoice for €5k for this strategic plan

[oldyouth]

To clarify a few things, as best I can

On the plus side
We'll be playing in the LOI 1st Division
We'll be playing in pink & black
We'll be playing in Ferrycarrig Park

On the down side
The friggin' bull is still on the crest
The friggin' stars are still on the crest

If the name changes, it might be a good thing. Doesn't seem to have done Cork, Limerick, Galway or Waterford teams any harm

[EatYerGreens]

If the name changes, it might be a good thing. Doesn't seem to have done Cork, Limerick, Galway or Waterford teams any harm

I wouldn't use Cork or Limerick as examples of the positive implications of name changes.

Cork has had about twelve different clubs in the last 90-odd years, and it ended badly for almost all of them ! Limerick's had a few as well.

Successful clubs tend not to change name.

[ForzaForth]

The Wexford Youths pictures have been deleted from the top of the club's official twitter account. Like a phoenix from the flames, the metamorphosis begins!!

[redobit]

Successful clubs tend not to change name.

Pride, passion and commitment keeps a club strong and can take generations to forge, success can be only fleeting.

[ArFella]

Cryptic string of tweets by their Twitter as well. So far we have:

W
E
A
R
E,
W.
E.

I'm guessing an X might be next (real Sherlock Holmes stuff here), looks like an announcement is imminent anyway.

[oldyouth]

To clarify a few things, as best I can

On the plus side
We'll be playing in the LOI 1st Division
We'll be playing in pink & black
We'll be playing in Ferrycarrig Park

On the down side
The friggin' bull is still on the crest
The friggin' stars are still on the crest

If the name changes, it might be a good thing. Doesn't seem to have done Cork, Limerick, Galway or Waterford teams any harm

As advised the other day. I mentioned Youths in an earlier post but had to do so for obvious reasons

On to Carlow IT now for tonight's friendly V Drogheda

[Sunny Jim]

Can someone please explain to those of us not in the loop what the hell is going on?

[KBurke]

Can someone please explain to those of us not in the loop what the hell is going on?

You no longer support Wexford Youths.

You now support Wexford Fc ( The club formerly known as Wexford Youths)

[oldyouth]

Can someone please explain to those of us not in the loop what the hell is going on?

Wexford Youths FC is no more. Wexford FC will take their place in the SSE Airtricity 1st division in 2017. Remarkably, the new club will play in pink and black at Ferrycarrig Park and even more remarkably, the players have all agreed to play for the new club. Licence application was submitted in the name of Wexford FC and let's just say that no obstacles are expected

[nigel-harps1954]

It's kind of like that time Derry City ran away from debts and started again.

[oldyouth]

It's a League of Ireland tradition and we are sticklers for tradition