Central Midfield Problems??

[Ralph]

What a great result last night, we defended resolutely in the second half when Portugal had a lot of possession. Without Keano and Kilbane we are a much poorer team though it has to be said. Holland and Kavanagh lack the ability to receive the ball in a tight situation and retain it which is vital in the international game, thay kind of run around half heartedly looking for the ball and seem to be much more effective when they are trying to make tackles, both possess a good shot to be fair to them.

Maybe its time for Kerr to let Miller play in his favoured central role, he has to be given the chance if he is to take up the mantle of his fellow Corkman and to be fair his influence is very restricted playing on the right as he is not the type of player to beat people, or maybe even O'Shea could be given a chance in there. Portugals consistant weakness is their lack of a quality frontman and against teams with more cutting edge we are tempting fate going into a game without Keane\Kilbane and not having the ball for long periods.

[dr_peepee]

Miller was 'muck' last night!!!

[Stuttgart88]

Central midfield was the weakest part of last night's showing for me too. I think Keane's return and a better showing from KK will improve things here, tbut he absence of Keane clearly diminishes the side. Miller's not ready yet IMO, he needs to make the breakthrough at club level first.

Niall Quinn was smoking dope on TV last night, talking about how Miller was benefitting from "week-in, week-out" premiership football.

[PaulB]

I was saying this last night, the centre of mid is turning into our most problematic area. If Keane/Kilbane are out we're buggered. Kavanaghs not up to International std, Millers too lightweight, Holland is average, who else have we got. Whats the latest on Colin healy, is he still out Injured. he looked a good prospect till his injury, although the Jury was still out on him..

[eirebhoy]

Kavanaghs not up to International std
fickle, fickle, fickle...

[PaulB]

no ficklenss (is there such a word), just fact in my opinion. Good to have as a backup, but i'd be concerned if we went to Israel with Holland and Kavanagh as are top pairing in centre mid.

[Slash/ED]

Kavanagh is better than Holland and showed that last night imo. Centre mid is a problem though, espically if Keanes out. I'm still not fully convnced by Kilbane and we're lacking options there atm. Holland being third choice is quite worrying, I just don't rate him, at least not in a green shirt.

[carnstien]

A central midfield partnership of Andy Reid and Roy Keane would pass any team in europe off the pitch.

I think Reid would be well able for the rough and tumble in there too, especially beside Keane, he is no smaller than Scholes for example. Finnan on the right or McGready if he's up to it.

[Condex]

I'd have O'shea in instead of either Holland or Kavanagh. The Portuguese were walking straight through our midfield in the second half.

[pete]

Kilbane & Keane are first choice in the middle. In fact i think Kilbane is more crucial as Keane is a spent force.

Holland in ahead of Kavanagh (panics when he pressurised)

[1MickCollins]

[QUOTE=pete] In fact i think Kilbane is more crucial as Keane is a spent force.

[QUOTE]

:confused: Did you just arrive back from Mars?

[thejollyrodger]

Keane and Kilbane are a great combination.

Failing the above I would try Miller and Kilbane. I think Miller will come right in a season or so. Maybe even try Josh in there :P

We have Keane until Germany 2006. After that we really need the likes of Josh, Miller, Mc Geady et al to come good.

[eirebhoy]

Still sticking to Whelan as Keane's replacement in the holding role after the WC.

[Closed Account 2]

I think Kav's decent enough to play international football. He's not great going forward but he's decent at keeping the ball, and good at closing down the opposition. He's no superstar but does the simple stuff very well, so if we lost a defensive midfielder I'd think he'd be a good option to go in. I dont think Miller should be let anywhere near the first team at this moment in time. His confidence is at rock bottom, he lacks sharpness, he doesnt have the build to play in the center, he was out fought and subdued by Exeter City's midfielders twice last month. While I dont mind him playing in friendlies (maybe BK is trying to give him confidence etc), if he plays in Tel Aviv I think the Israelis will roll us over in midfield.

[eirebhoy]

I think Kav's decent enough to play international football. He's not great going forward...
He actually gets forward regularly for Cardiff, Kerr seems to prefer him in the holding role though. The only holders we have are Keane and Holland (and Delap, Kinsella if you include them) which is probably why Kerr plays Kav there.

[eirebhoy]

Who? :confused:
Jaysus Dav, you can't be serious? Plays the holding midfield role for the U-21's. Beat Elliott to the U-21 player of the year award last week. Playing week in week out for Sheffield Wednesday. More experience than anyone else in the under 21's with over 50 domestic starts to his name and even has a UEFA cup appearance with Man City to add to his CV. :)

[Slash/ED]

To be honest I don't think he'll ever be good enough to be a regular for us from what I've seen of him, hope I'm wrong though.

[eirebhoy]

Slash/Ed. we've had this discussion already and come to the conclusion that you've seen very little of him. :) The journalists that voted Whelan ahead of Stephen Elliott for the U-21 player of the year have seen a lot more of him than most of us. You must be expecting to see the skill of McGeady but he's a holding midfielder and has a superb pass and tackle (can't remember him even given a foul away against Port Vale and he put in a few sliding tackles).

Dav - He left Man City by mutual consent at the age of 19/20 because he had interest from other clubs and there was too much competition for a central midfield place (far more competition than there is for the centre half spot where McCarthy is still waiting to get a sub appearance). Whelan and Joey O'Brien have now started 13 consecutive games in central midfield together for Wednesday and yesterday was their first defeat in 10 matches.

Its is extremely rare to find a holding midfielder at such a young age.

/edit - Started every U-21 match since his debut at the end of 2003 afaik. :)

[Slash/ED]

I've seen him for the U20s at the world cup, the U21s and the Wednesday team. I've seen plenty of him, more than enough. He is, undoubtabley, a good passer and an intelligent footballer but lacks the physical strenght and presence to really do it at the highest level, espically as a central mid field player, I just can't see him ever consistently playing for Ireland.

Journalists opinions mean little to nothing to me :)

[eirebhoy]

I've seen him for the U20s at the world cup, the U21s and the Wednesday team. I've seen plenty of him, more than enough. He is, undoubtabley, a good passer and an intelligent footballer but lacks the physical strenght and presence to really do it at the highest level, espically as a central mid field player, I just can't see him ever consistently playing for Ireland.

Journalists opinions mean little to nothing to me :)
Liam Miller is over 4 years older than him and lacks the physical strength, as did Roy Keane at 19 or 20.

[Slash/ED]

Miller plays a different role to Whelan in fairness.

And I really disagree that Keane ever lacked physical strenght and presence any more than anyone else his age would have. Keane could always impose himself on a game which Whelan can't do as well though Whelan does play a different role.

[1MickCollins]

Miller plays a different role to Whelan in fairness.

And I really disagree that Keane ever lacked physical strenght and presence any more than anyone else his age would have. Keane could always impose himself on a game which Whelan can't do as well though Whelan does play a different role.

Keane has unusual stamina and endurance, he started as a box-to-box player, non-stop Energizer-bunny action for 90 minutes, he was small originally but never lacked strength. There are few who can be compared favourably to Keane so we would be better off looking for the next Kinsella or Townsend.

Unless Whelan has significantly improved his conditioning in the past 12 month I don't see him ever playing regularly in the top half of the premiership, he certainly could become as good as Mark Kinsella.....

[eirebhoy]

I doubt Whelan is lacking strength anyway. He's partnering an 18 year old in the 3rd tier of English football (believe me, there's more beasts in that division than there is in the premiership). If he was lacking in strength Sheffield Wedensday would not be 3 places away from the Championship as central midfield is probably the most important part of any team.

Anyway, I'll let Mr.Potential do his work and see how Whelan turns out. :)

[Ralph]

I happened to be in sheffield and saw wednesday versus Swindon last month, O'brien scored, whelen was very good, he keeps it simple and doesn't concede possession, he settles the play when he gets the ball, i suppose he isn't the biggest but the likes of Kinsella have shown that at international level physique isn't always an issue, the swindon midfielders were donkeys n comparison to the irish boys.

[martin_rules_ie]

...In fact i think Kilbane is more crucial as Keane is a spent force...

look like niall wasn't the only one smoking dope! :rolleyes:
roy, a spent force? tell that to sir alex and brian kerr :cool: