Rugby 2016

[BonnieShels]

Less than two months to go in the year and frankly no better time to start the thread!

GERRIN' TA FOOK!

The bubble is burst. Magnificent performance.

[osarusan]

https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-0/s526x395/14907230_10153869484812001_3111627986569780843_n.j pg?oh=6029c99ed301bb673eb8d642a7422cc8&oe=58962676

[Real ale Madrid]

The caption should say 23 times in a row.

Nobody beats Ireland 23 times in a row

[BonnieShels]

Is it any wonder NZ win so often when they're playing different rules to the rest of us. Absolutely gutted with some of the reffing in that.

That throw forward at the end summed it up really.

[Real ale Madrid]

Is it any wonder NZ win so often when they're playing different rules to the rest of us. Absolutely gutted with some of the reffing in that.

That throw forward at the end summed it up really.

This blaming the ref craic is boring. The ref was poor but not the reason we lost. I cannot understand for the life of me the hoopla surrounding the Sam Cane tackle. It was a split second where Henshaw literally bounced off one tackle and twisted awkwardly into another. Ludicrous.

We look in great shape for the six nations mind - roll on the 4th of February.

[OwlsFan]

I think we could be still playing and not score a try. The difference was the backs. Ireland's backs found it really difficult to make ground while their seems to make ground at will. Ireland's forwards more than matched them. Good game.

[BonnieShels]

I'm still not over the NZ defeat and the refereeing. It'll take a while for that to happen. The visions of Korean Read pulling off the scrum early under the nose of Proper and us not getting either a penalty try and Read sinbinned haunt me. People were going on about us being sore losers are the same old apologists for this same scummy NZ team we have to put up with for decades. Tired of it.
---

This November series showed Rugby and refereeing to be a in a bind.i thought when England got the red against Argentina we had seen some sort of sense return. Only for 5 (6?) resets on the English line and no penalty try. They ended up with a yellow card too but Argentina still had to secure the try conventionally.
It was clear to me that he was trying to go easy on England after the early red card.
---
Our discipline stats are off the charts though our vaunted Defence is taken a knock. We're conceeding too many tries despite possession domination.

---

Anyway, thoughts on Bonus Points being brought in?

http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/2016/1130/835497-bonus-points-to-be-introduced-to-six-nations/

[OwlsFan]

Once Irish fans start talking up their team, in this case a Grand Slam, you by and large (wonder where that phrase comes from) know what is going to happen. Such a shame that having fought back and almost score another try, they give away a soft penalty to allow the Scots go ahead again. To be fair whenever the Scots went out wide they always looked more dangerous than us. The great thing about the rugby though is that the 6 Nations is every year. The hurt, unlike the football, only lasts 12 months.

[DeLorean]

It was a sickener for sure but who knows what will happen. Hopefully Wales and England will draw at the weekend and it's game on again (although not for the Grand Slam obviously!). :)

[OwlsFan]

I enjoyed the win over the French. I couldn't believe Daire O'Brien (maybe it's just me and RTE sports pundits) bad mouthing the performance at the end. At least Ronan O'Gara put him in his place. Ireland beat one of the major rugby playing nations of the world. Apparently now, they have to do it with style as well. To hell with that. On a wet and blustery day at Lansdowne they outplayed France. Doesn't happen that often. They should rejoice. Not moan.

[jbyrne]

I enjoyed the win over the French. I couldn't believe Daire O'Brien (maybe it's just me and RTE sports pundits) bad mouthing the performance at the end. At least Ronan O'Gara put him in his place. Ireland beat one of the major rugby playing nations of the world. Apparently now, they have to do it with style as well. To hell with that. On a wet and blustery day at Lansdowne they outplayed France. Doesn't happen that often. They should rejoice. Not moan.

agree. also think it was the biggest 6N win over France by us.

[Real ale Madrid]

Rejoice? The French are hopeless for Christ sake lads. Apart from us gifting them them a win in Paris last year they have beaten no one of note for 6 or 7 years at this stage. It was crying out for a few more tries in the last few mins to really stuff it to them. I felt we got close to getting another try at 16-6 and we could have really rubbed thier noses in it then.Can you imagine if the situation was reversed. They would have put 60 points on us. God I hate the French!!

[OwlsFan]

Not sure they are that bad. They ran England to 3 points. They beat Scotland who beat us. We have won only a third of the games we have ever played against them. I'll take any win over them.

[DeLorean]

Yeah, I was a little frustrated that we didn't get over for a second try just before half time when we were in the ascendancy. We would have been well on course for a bonus point if we had. Overall though I was just relieved to get the win, especially when they brought it back to a seven point margin with only a few minutes remaining. The French are the French though and any win against them is a good win, especially with our record like you said.

Italy's refusal to take a spanking off England has pretty much compensated for the lack of a bonus point too (not that we should have been expecting one anyway).

Any kind of win over Wales and it's all to play for on the final day, but if Scotland could deny England a bonus point it would be even more ideal.

[Real ale Madrid]

Not sure they are that bad. .

1 win against Ireland and 1 win against Engalnd in 2014 - that has been the sum total of their wins against top level teams in the last 5 years.


They ran England to 3 points. They beat Scotland who beat us.

The ran England close so did Italy, we were shocking against Scotland. I don't see how that furthers the argument


We have won only a third of the games we have ever played against them.

I don't know why that is relevant except that it shows that the mindset of our fans is in the wrong place. We should be making the most of what we have - we played well Saturday for 30 / 40 mins and didn't exactly cut them open - we should be a lot better.


I'll take any win over them.
Fair enough but lets not dress it up as a good performance worthy of rejoice! We should be stuffing these while we have the chance - they will get their sh!t together eventually.

We have rte showing documentaries about 4 basically friendly matches in October on the TV it was good to see O'Brian have a bit of a go on Saturday - the rugby management get a very easy ride compared to their compatriots in other sports .

[DeLorean]

These are France's most recent results - http://www.skysports.com/rugby-union/teams/france/results

Narrow defeats against Australia and NZ, a 27-0 win against Argentina and a three point defeat against England. Remind me why we should be "stuffing" them again? Nobody else seems to be able to.

[Real ale Madrid]

Narrow defeats against Australia and NZ

2 teams we beat in the Autumn.



a 27-0 win against Argentina

The other match of that test series was lost - Argentina are in very poor form - their only other wins in 2016 were H v SA & Ita and A v Japan. They lost 2 x NZ , 2 x Aus, 1 x SA 1 x Wales 1 x Scot. A decent win for France but that's it. Doesn't further the argument at all.



Nobody else seems to be able to.

We were 16-06 up and dominating possession, WE should have stuck it to them Saturday. God knows they would have done it to us.

[DeLorean]

The argument is that nobody has 'stuffed' them recently, including teams that are ranked above us and in really good form, but you seem to think that we should be expecting to, why? It's you that's not furthering your argument, or even justifying it.

Okay, we were dominating possession at 16-6, but they were dominating during the first quarter and would have been full value for the 10-0 lead they very nearly got. Swings and roundabouts.

[Real ale Madrid]

The argument is that nobody has 'stuffed' them recently, including teams that are ranked above us and in really good form, but you seem to think that we should be expecting to, why? It's you that's not furthering your argument, or even justifying it.


The argument, which you seem to have completely missed is that we should somehow be rejoicing beating this bang average team at home. It was put forward that France are in good form based on recent results - this is an argument I would strongly refute based on the form lines of the teams they have beaten, and teams that they have lost to recently.



Okay, we were dominating possession at 16-6, but they were dominating during the first quarter and would have been full value for the 10-0 lead they very nearly got. Swings and roundabouts.

Match stats here:

http://www.espn.co.uk/rugby/matchstats?gameId=290909&league=180659

Almost 2/3rds possession - 70% territory - you can call that swings and roundabouts if you like - but after the first 15 mins we had the total run of the game, and should have pressed home our advantage against a side massively low in confidence. A ten point win was a really meagre return for our domination and we are not making our forward dominance tell in these games. We will need to be a lot more clinical to beat England. It was an OK performance, but rejoice? Give me a break.

I do think we have improved as the games have gone on and I'm hopeful for 2 good performances in the last 2 matches - we are still well in it.

[DeLorean]

Nope... I understand the argument perfectly fine.

We should be rejoicing (or at least entirely satisfied) at getting the win we so badly needed. Anything less and it was curtains. That was the priority beforehand so mission accomplished. A bonus point would have been even better but I don't think many would have been expecting or demanding that.

I saw the game so I don't really need the stats, but thanks. We were the better team for sure and that was reflected on the scoreboard with a win by more than double scores. We won by a winning margin that the three best teams in the world right now could only equal between them in recent matches against France. They're not the most dangerous French team in memory but they're no whipping boys either.

If they had got that 10-0 lead their early dominance deserved it could have been a different story completely, who knows? Hopefully we'll get to unconditionally rejoice on the 18th March but at least that win has given us a chance of doing that.

[Real ale Madrid]

Nope... I understand the argument perfectly fine.

We should be rejoicing (or at least entirely satisfied) at getting the win we so badly needed. Anything less and it was curtains. That was the priority beforehand so mission accomplished. A bonus point would have been even better but I don't think many would have been expecting or demanding that.


We got the win, great, (but against that French team that has what? 3 wins away from Paris in the 6N in the last 5 years) - but I'm saying it was not a good performance, at least not a good attacking performance anyway - people can be allowed criticize that.



I saw the game so I don't really need the stats, but thanks.


No problem - they make interesting reading - we dominated in every facet of the game yet needed a late penalty to secure the win. Hardly the stuff of legend. But no - rejoice I tell thee - or at least be entirely satisfied.


We won by a winning margin that the three best teams in the world right now could only equal between them in recent matches against France. They're not the most dangerous French team in memory but they're no whipping boys either.


Two of those teams we have beaten in the same period, the third hopefully we can beat on Saturday week - but one thing is for sure - we won't beat them if we are not way more creative in attack. I'm not saying they are whipping boys but we could have got 30+ Saturday if we really pressed home our advantage in the latter stages.

[OwlsFan]

We will need to be a lot more clinical to beat England. It was an OK performance, but rejoice? Give me a break.

Rejoice = happiness, pleasure, joy, gladness, delight, elation, cheer, jubilation, euphoria, delirium, ecstasy, rapture, transports of delight, exuberance, exultation, glory, triumph, celebration, revelry, merrymaking, festivity, feasting.

Not being a huge rugby fan, a few of those definitions would not apply to me but happiness, pleasure, joy, delight, cheer would certainly apply. The main objective in any sport is to win and every supporter should rejoice when their team wins for that afterall is the object of the match. Everything else is secondary. True, if I may use a football analogy, the only time I might expect more than just a win is when we are playing a minnow such as Liechtenstein or San Marino etc but otherwise I am happy with a win, no matter what the performance. Others may go to the game or sit on their barstool to be entertained. All I want from my team is a win and I rejoice if and when it happens. In rugby terms, France are no minnows and they have far more rugby players than we do and a much greater record of success than we do. Ireland has a losing record against all the "home nations" and France, especially. I rejoice when we beat them and anything else is a bonus and I make no apology for the use of the word.

[Real ale Madrid]

Yeah fair enough but I'd go as far as happiness above in your list of adjectives - anything else is OTT. I'm always happy to beat France as you quite correctly pointed out we don't have a good record against them

However the context is important - as I've tried - ( and largely failed to convince anyway) to argue - France haven't won a game of note in long time bar 2 results in about 5 years. The fact that we won with a late penalty was nothing to write home about. The minimum we should have expected was a win. A defeat would have been a disaster.

It's just a pity we couldn't push on at the end - I thought, looking at the stats, and the overall run of the game, 23-6 or even 30-6 would have been a fairer reflection of the game to me. We have massive difficulty turning the screw.

If you look back over the last few years - the defeat to Wales when we spent the whole 2nd half camped on their line, the crushing World Cup defeat to Argentina, the bitterly disappointing defeats to France last year and Scotland this year, the abject failure to win that test series against that God awful South African team -all suggests to me that we a mentally a touch fragile and certainly not as consistent as our talent says we should be. To counteract that we have had some good wins alright - NZ a case in point but is this team really fulfilling our potential when it matters? I'm not so sure. Maybe I'm being too harsh I dunno. Lets hope for 2 big 80 min performances in the next 2 weeks and another championship. Lets face it - there is a World Cup in this group if we strive for it. But the litany of disasters populated amongst some good success needs to be acknowledged also.

[DeLorean]

However the context is important - as I've tried - ( and largely failed to convince anyway) to argue - France haven't won a game of note in long time bar 2 results in about 5 years. The fact that we won with a late penalty was nothing to write home about. The minimum we should have expected was a win. A defeat would have been a disaster.

You've explained your point well, I suppose there's no point in disputing how we should or shouldn't feel after a match, you feel how you feel. Like you said, a defeat would have been a disaster, therefore avoiding that outcome was enough for me to feel very very satisfied. It doesn't mean it was a perfect performance and it can't be critically analysed.

[BonnieShels]

I have been wary of wading into this argument, but suffice to say I'm with RaM on this. I hate when we don't mash teams when the opportunity is there to do it. Really winds me up.


Anyway, moving onto Friday's small matter...

Kearney back, Bowe on bench... and the roof will be closed...

http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/2017/0309/858407-wales-roof-closed/

[BonnieShels]

I'm done with Kearney. Take the high ball out and he's a passenger.

[Real ale Madrid]

I'm done with Kearney. Take the high ball out and he's a passenger.

Had the worst game of his career against France. Its like playing with 14. Another poor performance but still could have won only for Henshaw's Brain fart in the maul. We are so predictable going forward its actually beyond a joke.

[OwlsFan]

Rhyle Nugent and Donal Lenihan pretty much thought we just had to show up to win. And once they started saying what a poor season George North was having, I knew what as going to happen. Of course there is no co-relation between what a commentator predicts and what happens, but it just irritates the hell out of me when they say these things (tempting fate and all that). The friendly against NZ in Chicago aside, Ireland have found scoring tries difficult. I just don't think the team is as good as many in the rugby fraternity think it is based upon the friendlies against the southern hemisphere teams. That said, one mistake at a maul was the difference between winning and losing. O'Brien and Heaslip had quiet games by their standards and with Ireland's three best players going off injured, it was going to be a tough ask in Cardiff. I am from the generation where if Ireland only lost by 20 points in Wales, it was a result.

It's now a one off game against England - a bit like the southern hemisphere games so I wouldn't discount a win, although they looked mighty impressive against Scotland but not so impressive in the other games.

[BonnieShels]

Stade and Racing to merge.

Absolute shocker.

http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/2017/0313/859338-racing-92-and-stade-francais-to-merge/

[Stuttgart88]

Rhyle Nugent and Donal Lenihan pretty much thought we just had to show up to win. And once they started saying what a poor season George North was having, I knew what as going to happen. Of course there is no co-relation between what a commentator predicts and what happens, but it just irritates the hell out of me when they say these things (tempting fate and all that). The friendly against NZ in Chicago aside, Ireland have found scoring tries difficult. I just don't think the team is as good as many in the rugby fraternity think it is based upon the friendlies against the southern hemisphere teams. That said, one mistake at a maul was the difference between winning and losing. O'Brien and Heaslip had quiet games by their standards and with Ireland's three best players going off injured, it was going to be a tough ask in Cardiff. I am from the generation where if Ireland only lost by 20 points in Wales, it was a result.

It's now a one off game against England - a bit like the southern hemisphere games so I wouldn't discount a win, although they looked mighty impressive against Scotland but not so impressive in the other games.As a fellow cricket fan you might agree that some of our recent games have been like those test cricket matches that have been very tight for the most part, but with the score-line suggesting a clear winner. Tight test cricket matches are often decided on the big moments. We won the big moments vs France (e.g., not going 0-10 down), lost the big moments vs Wales (e.g., Henshaw, Sexton). Also, home advantage is massive in these games.

[OwlsFan]

Predictions for the game. I'll start by saying either an Irish win or a big win for England. Let's plump for the former as Ireland seem to be able to raise their game in matches like this.

[Real ale Madrid]

Hope I'm wrong but we will lose by 10-15 unless England lay an egg. I'd like to see the team first mind you, there will probably be much needed changes which may help us. But instead of seeing Kearney dropped we could see McFadden on the bench. Mindset is key and we seem to have lost all momentum. The Irish team is much like this post. Incoherent.

[BonnieShels]

Murray's out... :(

But Kearney's also out... :)

http://www.rte.ie/sport/six-nations/2017/0316/860141-ireland-team-to-play-england-six-nations/

[Real ale Madrid]

Good win. Stop NZ getting 18 in a row at the start of the season, stop England at the end. Pity we were so Mediocre in between. Still finished 2nd.

[OwlsFan]

Was always a possibility because the team can play with great entensity on occasions for the big games but very hard to play like that every game. Enjoyable.

[Real ale Madrid]

Looking ahead we have the following to look forward to:

- Lions tour in Summer and USA (1 game) and Japan (2) for the rest - suspect our top 8-10 players will tour with the Lions prob rising to 11-13 with injuries etc

- 3 tests in Autumn of this year are penciled in as South Africa / Tier 2 team / Argentina.

- 2018 six nations fixtures to be announced in a few weeks.

- the end of year tour for 2018 is a mouth watering 3 tests away to Australia.

[SkStu]

Lions squad named and 11 Irish players make the cut. There were 16 from England, 12 from Wales and only 2 from Scotland. Seems like a huge squad although I suppose will have to account for the injuries. I have to agree with a lot of the sentiment that Payne is lucky to be in there and I think Cian Healy, Keith Earls and even Ringrose could have deserved a call up. Scotland fans will have to be disgusted at their representation though - and justifiably so given their performances this year...


Forwards: Rory Best (Ireland), Dan Cole (England), Taulupe Faletau (Wales), Tadhg Furlong (Ireland), Jamie George (England), Iain Henderson (Ireland), Maro Itoje (England), Alun Wyn Jones (Wales), George Kruis (England), Courtney Lawes (England), Joe Marler (England), Jack McGrath (Ireland), Ross Moriarty (Wales), Sean O'Brien (Ireland), Peter O'Mahony (Ireland), Ken Owens (Wales), Kyle Sinckler (England), CJ Stander (Ireland), Justin Tipuric (Wales), Billy Vunipola (England), Mako Vunipola (England), Sam Warburton (Wales)

Backs: Dan Biggar (Wales), Elliot Daly (England), Jonathan Davies (Wales), Owen Farrell (England), Leigh Halfpenny (Wales), Robbie Henshaw (Ireland), Stuart Hogg (Scotland), Jonathan Joseph (England), Conor Murray (Ireland), George North (Wales), Jack Nowell (England), Jared Payne (Ireland), Jonathan Sexton (Ireland), Tommy Seymour (Scotland), Ben Te'o (England), Anthony Watson (England), Rhys Webb (Wales), Liam Williams (Wales), Ben Youngs (England)

[BonnieShels]

I've never warmed to the Lions. And It's unlikely I will this time 'round either. Roll on our tour to the USA.

[Real ale Madrid]

Cian Healy? Barely first choice for Leinster!

We are off to USA and Japan Bonnie. The Japan series will be interesting, not Gimmies at all.

[SkStu]

Cian Healy? Barely first choice for Leinster!

We are off to USA and Japan Bonnie. The Japan series will be interesting, not Gimmies at all.

He is first choice for Leinster. Sure he has a Furlong and a couple of other youngsters coming up the inside and challenging him strongly but he's won his place back after a couple of tough seasons with injury and has the most appearances and minutes in his position so that to me suggests first choice.

Don't get me wrong, he was not a slam-dunk for selection by any means in my opinion but he is very good and very experienced and has played with the Lions before. He was also mentioned quite a bit recently in a couple of places as warranting a spot.

[Charlie Darwin]

Healy is second choice for Leinster behind Jack McGrath - Furlong plays on the opposite side. He's probably unlucky not to travel as Marler isn't great but the way things go with injuries he will need to keep his boots laced anyway. Can't believe I'm actually saying that - the younger me would never have willingly expressed any interest in rugby.

Anyway, looks like a fairly solid if unspectacular selection to be beaten 3-0 by New Zealand. Can't say any Irish players can be hugely aggrieved at not getting in as for the most part the players selected ahead of them warrant their place on merit.

11 Irish players travel. You can probably assume at least two will pick up medium-term injuries that keep them out into next season and the fatigue will probably hamper Irish teams next year. Still, the players seem to see it as the pinnacle so good luck to them.

[SkStu]

Oh for gods sake, I totally meant to say Jack McGrath. My mistake! That said, He does have more appearances and minutes than McGrath this season and last game I seen Leinster he was starting.

Anyway, I agree fully with the rest of the post and that it was possibly a coin flip re Healy going v Marler. That said, I always like to see Irish lads get the nod in those situations and will find a way to feel (a little) aggrieved!

[BonnieShels]

Cian Healy? Barely first choice for Leinster!

We are off to USA and Japan Bonnie. The Japan series will be interesting, not Gimmies at all.

MY tour to the USA. Japan ain't happening til 2019 for me.

[Real ale Madrid]

Oh for gods sake, I totally meant to say Jack McGrath. My mistake! That said, He does have more appearances and minutes than McGrath this season and last game I seen Leinster he was starting.

Anyway, I agree fully with the rest of the post and that it was possibly a coin flip re Healy going v Marler. That said, I always like to see Irish lads get the nod in those situations and will find a way to feel (a little) aggrieved!

Healy or Marler? A conversation that literally nobody had in the past few weeks. Dave Kilcoyne is having a far better and more effective season than Cian Healy - and should be Ireland's back up to McGrath, not Healy. Healy like a few of his counterparts in the Irish squad these days are in because of reputation rather than what he has achieved in the past year or two. A weakness in the scrum these days, his discipline leaves a lot to be desired also.

Anyway I'd rather we had less than 11 - id rather bring 6/7 and have them in and around the test team. We have a big year ahead of us next year, all 3 winnable Autumn tests , six nations and a tour to Australia. What's the point of our lads getting bashed around NZ this summer - its a great honour for them but the luster is gone from the Lions for me. If we selected a squad to go down there and play nice rugby, good to watch then we could get behind it but Gatland would have no issue going down there and win the first 2 tests 3-0 and 3-0 and head home with his test series. Win at all costs. Rubbish!

[SkStu]

Stop being so cocky and arrogant. It has been mentioned in many media pieces before and after the announcement. I have selected a few for your reference. "literally nobody"

Alan Quinlan: https://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/2017/0419/868705-quinlan-lions/


Cian Healy is someone who can feel disappointed, a little unlucky.

When you look at the English situation, they have Mako Vunipola and Joe Marler, we have Jack McGrath and Cian Healy as looseheads."

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/live/2017/apr/19/lions-2017-squad-announcement-live-british-irish-rugby-union-new-zealand-all-blacks

Props look very good, thought Cian Healy might go but Marler edges him

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union/2017/04/18/lions-squad-new-zealand-plane-face-blacks-final-verdict/joe-marler-england/

Joe Marler.

Sneaks in ahead of Cian Healy, but could easily assert pole position for the tests..."

http://www.planetrugby.com/news/lions-2017-left-at-home-xv/

http://www.skysports.com/rugby-union/news/16057/10843207/alternative-lions-xv-we-pick-a-team-from-players-unlucky-to-miss-out

Shane Byrne: http://www.newstalk.com/shane-byrne-on-2017-lions-squad

[Real ale Madrid]

Stop being so cocky and arrogant. It has been mentioned in many media pieces before and after the announcement. I have selected a few for your reference. "literally nobody"

Alan Quinlan: https://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/2017/0419/868705-quinlan-lions/



https://www.theguardian.com/sport/live/2017/apr/19/lions-2017-squad-announcement-live-british-irish-rugby-union-new-zealand-all-blacks


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union/2017/04/18/lions-squad-new-zealand-plane-face-blacks-final-verdict/joe-marler-england/


http://www.planetrugby.com/news/lions-2017-left-at-home-xv/

http://www.skysports.com/rugby-union/news/16057/10843207/alternative-lions-xv-we-pick-a-team-from-players-unlucky-to-miss-out

Shane Byrne: http://www.newstalk.com/shane-byrne-on-2017-lions-squad

Stop being so touchy and sensitive Stu FFS.

Every single one of those articles you reference is after the event (i.e the selection) - realistically Healy was never in the running for a spot. Most of those articles are fluff pieces anyway, and most of them concede that he has lost his place in the Irish team to McGrath.

The quote in the Guardian is just from some random punter - again after the event.

The Great (Former St.Pats Programme contributor) Gerry Thornley Esq. for example even had McGrath in his squad prediction, not Healy.
http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/gerry-thornley-picks-his-lions-squad-for-new-zealand-1.3049270

I'm not sure what Quinlan was getting at in his article on RTE, he definitely doesn't say why Healy was unlucky or why he suddenly is ahead of McGrath in the pecking order either - just rolls off a few names - a nonsense piece.

Healy is just a big name people like to reference after the event.

[Charlie Darwin]

Oh for gods sake, I totally meant to say Jack McGrath. My mistake! That said, He does have more appearances and minutes than McGrath this season and last game I seen Leinster he was starting.
The IRFU require that players' game time is managed over the season so the main guys all play similar amounts of rugby. As McGrath plays more for Ireland, he plays less for Leinster.

[SkStu]

Stop being so touchy and sensitive Stu FFS.

Every single one of those articles you reference is after the event (i.e the selection) - realistically Healy was never in the running for a spot. Most of those articles are fluff pieces anyway, and most of them concede that he has lost his place in the Irish team to McGrath.

The quote in the Guardian is just from some random punter - again after the event.

The Great (Former St.Pats Programme contributor) Gerry Thornley Esq. for example even had McGrath in his squad prediction, not Healy.
http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/gerry-thornley-picks-his-lions-squad-for-new-zealand-1.3049270

I'm not sure what Quinlan was getting at in his article on RTE, he definitely doesn't say why Healy was unlucky or why he suddenly is ahead of McGrath in the pecking order either - just rolls off a few names - a nonsense piece.

Healy is just a big name people like to reference after the event.

If it was brought up after, it would have been brought up before. I can really go and scour some of the older articles I read if you want. You can't just assert that my statement that Healy was unlucky not to make the cut was preposterous and then ignore multiple, various sources that make the same claim I made just because you think you know better.

[Real ale Madrid]

If it was brought up after, it would have been brought up before. I can really go and scour some of the older articles I read if you want. You can't just assert that my statement that Healy was unlucky not to make the cut was preposterous and then ignore multiple, various sources that make the same claim I made just because you think you know better.

Jees Stu take a chill - 'tis only the internet.

Lets just agree that McGrath should have possibly made the plane , Kilcoyne & Cronin should fight for the No. 1 spot in Japan if and when he does get a call and DJ Proper Church should remain on the decks for the summer hols.

I do concede that Healy would have been in the conversation with some pundits but realistically for reason's I've mentioned previously he was never really in a position to win a spot imo. OTT to say he wasn't touted alright.

[KrisLetang]

Cronin is the greatest Irish name!!!!