Serbia v Rep of Ireland - Rajko Mitić Stadium, Belgrade (WCQ) Monday, 5th Sept. 2016

[Harry Tipper]

Tough fixture. Terrible conditions. Scabby ref.
Great to see them come back into a nasty away game like that and snatch a point.

[backstothewall]

Serbia could pass it about. They'd have been out of sight with forwards who could keep out of each other's way.

Without a doubt they knocked it about in the middle of the park where we weren't putting as much pressure on the ball, but they didn't create much where it matters. We handed them most of their their best chances through ropey defending or dodgy goalkeeping. And it has to be said that both our gals came from getting the ball forward quickly (I will conceed that we did little else).

As I type this Kenny Cunningham is making a good point about us dropping too deep in the second half, which meant the midfield weren't putting enough pressure on the ball from deep.

[zero]

We were really poor, and we always will be against a team that can pass the ball.

Never a penalty though, but they could have had another couple anyway.

I agreed with a lot of what Brady said after the game - we don't have the players, and we don't have a manager who really wants to play that way either, so we should stop lamenting how we don't pass the ball.

i agree to a certain extent but if we played with the conviction and high pressing that we did in the first 10-15 mins for even 30 mins maybe we'd be 2-0 up. then the opposition has to take risks and we can counter, but even if we can't we have that cushion.

i think the frustration is in knowing that we can do better because when we really need to go for it we have the ability.

anyway. it's the first game. a definite step back from our performances v italy / france but let's not forget we got caned by belgium too. we'll need to improve but had we lost it would already look like a bit of a mountain to climb.

side note, randolph looked really dodgy. 4 experienced defenders in front of him so no excuse. i'd feel more comfortable with westwood.

[Olé Olé]

Did anybody notice how biased against us Hamilton was during his commentary or just me? At one stage Serbia curled one well wide which Randolph had covered: "...and Randolph was beaten." A few instances where he was quite damning of our play. Fair enough Whelan was fairly critical but that's his job. He was referring to how the penalty and being 2-1 down was the best we could have hoped for.

Anyway, that aside. It was a frustrating game but a good result. So, not much point in complaining too much I guess. The penalty wasn't a penalty but goodness knows how that shot hit the crossbar for Serbia. We really didn't press the midfield and it had a terrible effect on us throughout. Quinn did well when he came in and so did Murphy but I thought Hendrick had been our best player. I guess he was sacrificed to leave Long, McClean and Walters on but he should be aggrieved. It was a numbers decision at that point though.

A few take aways from that: O'Shea was in no-man's land for the Serbian goal. I think he looked close to a mistake all night. He'll be doing well to keep his place as far as I can see. McCarthy will slot straight in for Whelan. I thought Whelan was very bad tonight although he was under pressure on his own somewhat. Brady looked excellent for the first 15 minutes. Completely faded then and looked fairly lost until he went back left-back and looked better. Ward was actually decent too and the completely unfair yellow card justified taking him off, even though I think the decision was as much influenced by a desire to keep Brady and McClean on the park. Hard to know how that selection will go now down the line. Quinn and Murphy have done themselves a lot of favours. It's no harm at all for them to have a good final 20 minutes in a really tough game like that, putting themselves firmly in the picture for the games against the weaker side in the group, Moldova and Georgia.

I'm just after reading over that paragraph and I've realized there's plenty in there for someone else to dispute and I could have wrote more which would be equal dispute-fodder. I think that just tells me that it's better to take little from this game. Maybe take nothing at all from it, except the invaluable away point. Is this the toughest fixture in the group? Could be.

[Real ale Madrid]

We have a problem at centre half. Poor goals conceeded against Sweden, Belgium,France and again tonight. Too many goalmouth scrambles for my liking. Jittery. No obvious solutions either. We created plenty chances tonight but coughed up a lot.

[Olé Olé]

Interesting to note Roy Keane didn't move from his seat all night. Goodness knows how frustrated he was watching us getting so dominated in the middle of the field. He must have been close to exploding.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

I think Murphy is a better foil for Long, and if not Murphy, someone like Quinn or Arter as an extra body in midfield who can pass, get stuck in and make quicker transitions. And for God's sake McCarthy as a like for like replacement for Whelan.

Walters can be a good option from the bench. But I don't see the reason he has to start let alone finish every game.

We're a turgid team with Whelan and Walters in there slowing things down.

We'd benefit a lot more with the energy of someone like Arter and Quinn. And Murphy creates more chances, wins a lot in the air and occupies defenders more.

Don't know what to do about central defense. You could make a point for any of partnership really. Aside from Wilson and Clark together.

I would be inclined to integrate John Egan. Bring in one of Jonny Hayes or Anthony Pilkington, and Anthony Stokes as much needed back up in the attacking positions. Pretty stocked in every other position.

I think Randolph has been great for us until now. This game will probably strengthen certain people's belief that Westwood should come in.

He normally resonates calm through the defense but we were all over the shop defensively tonight.

The players who were supposed to be covering them were leaking possession like a sieve though..

FFS Whelan sometimes the forward pass is the more pragmatic decision to make.

[SwanVsDalton]

That was a right poor performance but I'm delighted with the point. Between the away fixture, the dreadful pitch and the penalty, that's a good result. On another day, it could have been win or a loss. But someone is going to drop points in Belgrade and I'm glad it's not us.

A lot of that was pure rubbish. Even our two goals - if you were Serbian, you'd be gutted. A smelly two-deflection shot and free header. Still, there was a lot of fortune in Serbia's opener and it was never a penalty. Serbian threw himself to the floor before Walters even got close to him.

It was very poor from us but I can see some mitigation. The Euro hangover was alive and well and it should by no means be underestimated how dreadful the conditions were. Talk about a leveller. I see some people say Serbia were much better on the same surface, but Serbia - like most sides - do have slightly better technique than our players overall. And, despite that, they were dreadful and all. The many silly errors committed by both sides throughout the game. Oi vey.

Snap ratings:

Randolph - 4. Worst performance for us. Very poor and didn't help a jitttery defensive effort. Credit for the save from Ivanovic thought.

Coleman - 5. Wasn't the most captain-like performance. Bit unlucky for the goal - initially thought he got sucked in too easy but, in that split second, it did look like O'Shea was in trouble.

O'Shea - 4. Didn't inspire confidence. The sight of him sliding in late on on the edge of the box and missing the ball will stay with me for a long time.

Keogh - 6. Thought he didn't do too bad but it's a thin line between a 6 and a 5 here. But was much more than decisive than O'Shea.

Ward - 6. Got sucked in quite a bit early on, but some good tackling and tracking too. Got far less protection than Coleman.

Whelan - 4. In his defence, Serbia didn't really come through the middle. But didn't do anything of note outside of be a body in front of the back four.

Hendrick - 6. Not an ideal night for his on-the-ball talents. Thought O'Neill was mad to withdraw him but proved a decent decision.

Brady - 6. Some good deliveries. Didn't get much together in the middle of the park but never stopped.

Walters - 4. Probably his worst performance in an Irish shirt. He has plenty of credit in the bank and right to play him if he's fit. Also so little came up our right-hand side, he didn't get much of a chance to get into the game. But we all know he can a lot more and a lot better.

McClean - 4. I love James dearly but I thought he was rubbish - complete rubbish - after the first 20 minutes. His energy and effort is one thing but his technique is so often so poor. And he left Ward high and dry on more than a few occasions in the first half in particular.

Long - 5. Ran all day, as expected. Some decent runs. Should've scored from Murphy's flick on (at least it went in from the corner).

Quinn - 6. Good energy, good application and a useful substuition despite me being completely raging to see him off the bench.

Murphy - 7. Good on ya Daryl.

Tonight was an awkward assignment and we stumbled over it like a 10-year-old doing 110m hurdles. But we got the bare minimum we needed to get and we all know - players and managment alike - that we can do a lot better.

[tricky_colour]

Nice for Hendrick to get a goal, I see it seems to have been credited to him, could have gone down as an own goal
however he seemed to get it on target and kept it down on that boggy pitch which must have helped.

[Charlie Darwin]

Nice for Hendrick to get a goal, I see it seems to have been credited to him, could have gone down as an own goal
however he seemed to get it on target and kept it down on that boggy pitch which must have helped.
Hendrick's shot was on target so I think the usual protocol is to award it to him.

[samhaydenjr]

Bloody hell, our inability to hold on to a lead has gone way beyond a joke at this point - luckily, tonight that came up against our burgeoning ability to dig ourselves out of a hole. I make that five times since MON took over that we've scored late to salvage a result that seemed lost - Germany and Georgia away, Poland at home, Italy at the finals and now Serbia away - so that's a good thing. I was listening to it on 2fm online and it really sounded like a poor performance, but at the same time we've opened our campaign with a draw in Belgrade. A defeat wouldn't have been a catastrophe first game out, so it's definitely a positive to come away with a point, even a somewhat lucky one. Unfortunately Austria and Wales both negotiated their respective banana skins safely so we really have to improve and come away with six points against Georgia and Moldova next month to be in a strong position going into the Austria and Wales games. As regards tactics, I don't see us as a team that can string together 15-20 passes and patiently build up an attack but that doesn't mean we have to resort to long balls constantly. We have midfielders who are capable of running hard at defenses, we have pace down the flanks along with a number of players who can make a defense-splitting pass. We have a couple of terrific dead-ball specialists as well as height in defense and attack so we can play for corners and free-kicks in our opponent's half. We can use long balls as part of our arsenal, particularly if our midfielders are able to charge onto any knockdowns, but we need to mix it up better and use all of our attacking weapons if we don't want to spend the whole campaign clinging on or worse.

[jbyrne]

its baffling really. if the euros proved something its that we are a much much better team when we actually take the game to the opposition. the way we sit back and welly the ball up the pitch is plain daft.

id start murphy as the focal point up front and bring long on for the last 20 each time. that wouldn't be popular with many but longs strength is coming on as a sub and we need more of a target man (murphy) than a runner (long) from the start.

[Stuttgart88]

I thought we were really poor. One step forward, two back with this team. They worked hard but you need more than that. I actually think it probably was a penalty. Walters was very naïve, he should have seen that coming. We really lacked the balls to just put the game to bed when we could have. A technical CEE team like that must love our willingness to cede possession. That was more of a Trap performance - cede possession but stand off it rather than press - not what I expect from MON. Too many players were just poor, hard work notwithstanding. McLean, Long, Walters, Randolph, all our midfielders including Brady who had some good moments. Yellow cards a worry too. Very frustrated, but a good point. We'll need to play better to get out of this group.

[seanfhear]

I hope that Point is handy in the end .

Bad pitch and the ref was certainly quick to yellow card our players and not theirs .

Hopefully we can do better .

[pineapple stu]

Without a doubt they knocked it about in the middle of the park where we weren't putting as much pressure on the ball, but they didn't create much where it matters. We handed them most of their their best chances through ropey defending or dodgy goalkeeping. And it has to be said that both our gals came from getting the ball forward quickly (I will conceed that we did little else).
I thought they created enough in fairness - more than we did for a start.

Of course, scoring in the second minute meant we could put ten men behind the ball, and that's always going to be a bit harder to crack open. But when they did get into forward positions, their patient build-up meant they had plenty of people up to support, and that helped. Their opener is the obvious example - man over in the box - but they had a couple of headers not far wide, they had the scramble just before half time ably set up by the divot, they had the earlier chance where Hendrick put off two of their players, they had players in the box to pressure Randolph into a mistake in the first half and to almost capitalise on both his mistake and Coleman's mistake in the second.

By contrast, we were just lumping it forward like a non-league team desperately holding on to a late lead in a Cup match. How often did we lash it upfield first time to no-one? Or maybe Long was there, and he flicked on to no-one. There was one stage in the first half where I think Whelan got the ball ten yards inside his own half facing back to his own goal, and instead of take it down or anything sensible, he just wellied it over his head first time. To no-one. Long-ball is all well and good, but if it's to a target. That nonsense last night wasn't long-ball. And there was literally zero chance we were gonig to hold out - and of course we didn't. So what on earth was the point?

I don't think at any stage in the match did any Irish player put a foot on the ball, look up, see no option, turn around and play it back. If there was no-one ahead, we either lumped it up anyway, or put the head down and ran.

One successful pass per minute. One. That's embarrassing.

It wasn't impossible to play it around, because Serbia could comfortably do it. And let's be honest, it's not as if last night's style of play was a particular surprise. We'd have done the same on a perfect pitch.

Somebody earlier said not many teams will take points in Belgrade. I don't agree, based on that performance anyway. Their defence was a shambles and were there for the taking. Wales and Austria will create far more against them than we did.

[Olé Olé]

I hope that Point is handy in the end .

Bad pitch and the ref was certainly quick to yellow card our players and not theirs .

Hopefully we can do better .

The inconsistency with the yellow cards was absolutely atrocious. The yellow for an unintentional arm on the dramatic Serb players head got a yellow for Whelan. Ivanovic clawed the head off Long and didn't see yellow fairly soon after. Tadic blatantly pulling Ward back in the corner in the first half with his two arms around his waist was as cynical an act as you'll see. Ward puts in a very strong (but, apparently, fair) tackle in on their right back before half was out and he sees yellow. Crazy decision.

The thing is, the penalty wasn't a penalty and they could have scored a different goal than that. But, it seems as though when we went 1 up we were afraid to go 2 up. And when they drew the game, we were afraid to regain the lead. Then, when we were down 1, we actually wanted to regain the draw. It was a very strange performance in that regard. It's like we subconsciously wanted nothing but the draw. Sure we had 3 chances leading up to the goal (McClean header, Walters offside, Long through) and then once the goal came (albeit in the 81st) that was it, job was done and we were happy to sit back and wait for the 12 minutes to pass like a kidney stone.

[jbyrne]

Somebody earlier said not many teams will take points in Belgrade. I don't agree, based on that performance anyway.

yes, think they lost 3 of their euro qualifiers at home.

[Lionel Ritchie]

On a night of many sub-par performances I'd like to single out McClean. That boy has taken up the great mantle left to him by Stephen Hunt -the quest to seek out a dead end on a spaghetti junction.

[pineapple stu]

yes, think they lost 3 of their euro qualifiers at home.

Well, one of those was the forfeit v Albania, but yeah, lost at home to Denmark and Portugal and only took points off Armenia.

[Olé Olé]

Also, the defeatism after the match from Liam Brady and O'Neill was pretty sickening. We showed at the Euros that we weren't just a long ball team. Tonight was a tough away match in dreadful conditions where our undoubtedly best technical players (Hendrick and Brady, even O'Shea is normally very tidy on the ball) were finding the ball very hard to control under time and space constraints.

Furthermore, it's very easy for O'Neill to play this card that our players aren't playing at the top teams. Mid-table PL is still much stronger than many other leagues with the money in there. Tadic is one of their best players. He plays as many games as Shane Long at Southampton, maybe less last season. He's not exactly Messi. Ignoring any comparison to Whelan that you can make, I thought that Guidelj gave one of the most ordinary performances in a midfielder I've seen in a while. I don't think he offered much at all but had the luxury of time and space. He will be exposed in the Aviva. And he plays for Ajax. Our keeper is better than their's and our keeper was poor on the night. Mitrovic is in the Championship. Kostic looks good but how much better than West Brom are Hamburg (Kostic is better than McClean, I won't argue that)? Okay, they have Ivanovic who is with Chelsea. But he was pretty culpable (as were many others) for their league position last season. For f*ck sake, Luka Milivojevic plays with Olympiacos. He wasn't there that year but in the 2012/2013 season, Liam Lawrence played 29 games as his PAOK side finished second to Olympiacos.

The influx of money has made mid-table PL, lower table PL and even the Championship very wealthy. People can say all they want about our players not being willing to play abroad but the Dutch, Portuguese and Greek leagues aren't exactly La Liga. Ask Barry Maguire, Alan Mahon and Liam Lawrence, Mr O'Neill.

[Real ale Madrid]

Well, one of those was the forfeit v Albania, but yeah, lost at home to Denmark and Portugal and only took points off Armenia.

And the Denmark game was behind closed doors.

After the away defeat to Denmark they threw their hat at the last qualification series. They will improve big time from that. I'd be surprised if either Wales or Austria won there.

[pineapple stu]

I honestly don't see how that shambles of a defence, which crumbled under any sort of pressure, will hold out against both Austria and Wales. And look at how many great chances they spurned at the other end.

I know they've a few young players coming through, and maybe we got them at a good time before they're really bedded in and confident (like the keeper last night), but still. Serbia weren't great at all.

[Real ale Madrid]

I honestly don't see how that shambles of a defence, which crumbled under any sort of pressure, will hold out against both Austria and Wales. And look at how many great chances they spurned at the other end.

I know they've a few young players coming through, and maybe we got them at a good time before they're really bedded in and confident (like the keeper last night), but still. Serbia weren't great at all.

Fair enough and they weren't great - but Kolarov and Matic will add a lot to that team and as a young team I'd expect them to improve - its not guaranteed tbf, and Austria go there in October so we will see!

[OwlsFan]

So when was the last time we had a good away performance? The play off in France I think and I am hard pressed to think of another over the past 10 years. We have had many good results but performances where we get the ball down and play: I am scratching my head to think of another. We do what we do. We scrap and that has got us through many a sticky game but it doesn't always work and we still await that magic away win against a rival in a group. I am not sure why people are surprised.

I am delighted with the 2-2 result. I don't see Murphy being even remotely on a par with Waters. The former's ball control and pace are far in excess of the robust but limited Murphy. It's great that he scored and the knock on to Long was excellent but he is at best an average player. A fit Walters is streets ahead of him. Quinn is now the new Messi after his cameo appearance. The truth is Serbia did an Ireland when they went ahead and paid the price by falling back. I don't think it had anything to do with the advent of Quinn.

When we were 0-1 ahead, I asked my mate whether he would take a draw. We both agreed we would. Perhaps that mentality is also in the Irish team. I don't agree with MON that we deserved the draw but in life you don't always get what you deserve.

Some harsh criticism for JOSH on the goal. Very difficult night for defenders at both ends. He didn't let his man turn and get a shot on goal but Coleman was sucked in thinking that the opponent was getting away from JOSH and then the ball broke to Coleman's man. The back 4 were under huge pressure all night and I thought they coped well.

The penalty - when I saw it live I said peno. I think there was contact but they probably would have scored later anyway with the way the game was going.

Randolph motm ! At least two major gaffs that almost resulted in goals.

[RiffRaff]

Gutted we didn't win a match that was there for the taking. We should have learned from the game against Italy and the first half against France that we can frighten teams if we go at them but we reverted to type last night, decided we couldn't compete up the pitch and sat back. Fortune favours the brave but with a few exceptions, our squad isn't brave enough and that's what needs to be addressed by the management team. Had we attacked them I believe we would have won by a couple of goals but as it was, we could easily have had something similar to the 5-2 hiding Cyprus gave us. I didn't think Whelan was a bad as some people say but we do need someone like Artur to drive us forward rather than a defensive midfielder whose job is to sit in front of the defense.
I know conditions last night had a big effect on the game but I cant think of a more jittery goalkeeping performance than Randolphs in any Ireland game. McClean also had his poorest game in the shirt. Hendrick, Brady and Ward were the only ones to come away with any credit for me.

[pineapple stu]

One other disappointing aspect was the bench actually. O'Kane, O'Dowda, Pearce and McCarthy (who was injured) were left out. And obviously Arter and Christie didn't come off the bench. So still no sense of bringing newer players into the fold. I still don't think the players coming through are up to the standard of those in even recent campaigns, but I'm not sure how we're going to build a new team without giving guys game time. Last night must have been one of the oldest teams to have represented us? I make it an average age of 29.1, and 29.5 by the end.

All in all, I think the point is almost the only positive we can take out of last night's match.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Well if we are just looking at the last several games, Walters was arguably the worst player on the pitch against Sweden, granted he was unfit and shouldn't have been playing, and Murphy was one of our better players against Italy and France. He came off the bench last night, and along with Quinn, done more in 15 minutes than arguably anyone else did - except maybe Hendrick. He performed a thankless task in Bosnia due to the tactics and you can't really be too hard on him - unless you are blinkered. His hold up play was one of the main reasons we came away with a result against Germany in Dublin.

His goal for us has been coming. He has done everything but score, unlucky several times.

You can look at the performances when Walters + Long play in Scotland and when Walters + Murphy play against Scotland in Dublin, and then look at the performances when Murphy + Long played in the Euros and the 15 minutes tonight and IDK how anyone could think Walters would be a better option at this stage.

I am completely at a loss as to what he has offered for large parts of the last 12 months yet he seems to be guaranteed his place.

Even when he is playing wide, he never gets any crosses in, and when he does, they never beat the first man, his link-up play is average, he has no pace, he is a fundamental part of our long ball strategy yet he creates more fouls than he does win the ball - just look at last night.

He usually does a good covering job for the full backs but he didn't even do that last night.

We can't even do anything on the counter attack when he's on the ball because he slows things down to a snails pace.

If we want to be a more progressive team we have to start doing better than Walters and Whelan. I just let out a groan whenever I see his name in the team sheet because I know what the football is going to be like.

IDK how anyone could possibly think Walters is better for the long ball tactics or for the link-up play after last night.

But I'm not surprised.

He has got a lot of credit in the bank. God forbid any striker put in the performances he has been lately and continue to get selected.

[Stuttgart88]

The penalty - when I saw it live I said peno. I think there was contact but they probably would have scored later anyway with the way the game was going.

Randolph motm ! At least two major gaffs that almost resulted in goals.I have no complaints with the penalty at all.

No way Randolph MOTM. That was his worst game yet for us, but in fairness his late save was very important.

[tetsujin1979]

Well if we are just looking at the last several games, Walters was arguably the worst player on the pitch against Sweden, granted he was unfit and shouldn't have been playing, and Murphy was one of our better players against Italy and France. He came off the bench last night, and along with Quinn, done more in 15 minutes than arguably anyone else did - except maybe Hendrick. He performed a thankless task in Bosnia due to the tactics and you can't really be too hard on him - unless you are blinkered. His hold up play was one of the main reasons we came away with a result against Germany in Dublin.

You can look at the performances when Walters + Long play in Scotland and when Walters + Murphy play against Scotland in Dublin, and then look at the performances when Murphy + Long played in the Euros and the 15 minutes tonight and IDK how anyone could think Walters would be a better option at this stage.

I am completely at a loss as to what he has offered for large parts of the last 12 months yet he seems to be guaranteed his place.

Even when he is playing wide, he never gets any crosses in, and when he does, they never beat the first man, his link-up play is average, he has no pace, he is a fundamental part of our long ball strategy yet he creates more fouls than he does win the ball - just look at last night.

He usually does a good covering job for the full backs but he didn't even do that last night.

We can't even do anything on the counter attack when he's on the ball because he slows things down to a snails pace.

If we want to be a more progressive team we have to start doing better than Walters and Whelan. I just let out a groan whenever I see his name in the team sheet because I know what the football is going to be like.

IDK how anyone could possibly think Walters is better for the long ball tactics or for the link-up play after last night.

But I'm not surprised.

He has got a lot of credit in the bank. God forbid any striker put in the performances he has been lately and continue to get selected.

Two goals against Bosnia at home and MOTM against Germany.

[geysir]

its baffling really. if the euros proved something its that we are a much much better team when we actually take the game to the opposition. the way we sit back and welly the ball up the pitch is plain daft.

id start murphy as the focal point up front and bring long on for the last 20 each time. that wouldn't be popular with many but longs strength is coming on as a sub and we need more of a target man (murphy) than a runner (long) from the start.
I don't agree that it is baffling it's the ebb and flow of most every away game we have against this type of opposition.
Serbia thought they could hold onto their lead, they sat back, we had space, we weren't being closed down with the same intensity, we could bring the ball out of defense, we looked good, set pieces are us, we scored, then they woke up again and pressed for the winner.
.

It's obvious we don't have hardworking football artists like Modric but this "we don't have the players" is total nonsense, total bull, that's saying we don't have players to pass and receive the ball and we don't have the players to press high up the pitch.
What we don't have is a team who are coached to play football with better tactics, better retention, how to hold a high line and still defend.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Also, the defeatism after the match from Liam Brady and O'Neill was pretty sickening. We showed at the Euros that we weren't just a long ball team. Tonight was a tough away match in dreadful conditions where our undoubtedly best technical players (Hendrick and Brady, even O'Shea is normally very tidy on the ball) were finding the ball very hard to control under time and space constraints.

Furthermore, it's very easy for O'Neill to play this card that our players aren't playing at the top teams. Mid-table PL is still much stronger than many other leagues with the money in there. Tadic is one of their best players. He plays as many games as Shane Long at Southampton, maybe less last season. He's not exactly Messi. Ignoring any comparison to Whelan that you can make, I thought that Guidelj gave one of the most ordinary performances in a midfielder I've seen in a while. I don't think he offered much at all but had the luxury of time and space. He will be exposed in the Aviva. And he plays for Ajax. Our keeper is better than their's and our keeper was poor on the night. Mitrovic is in the Championship. Kostic looks good but how much better than West Brom are Hamburg (Kostic is better than McClean, I won't argue that)? Okay, they have Ivanovic who is with Chelsea. But he was pretty culpable (as were many others) for their league position last season. For f*ck sake, Luka Milivojevic plays with Olympiacos. He wasn't there that year but in the 2012/2013 season, Liam Lawrence played 29 games as his PAOK side finished second to Olympiacos.

The influx of money has made mid-table PL, lower table PL and even the Championship very wealthy. People can say all they want about our players not being willing to play abroad but the Dutch, Portuguese and Greek leagues aren't exactly La Liga. Ask Barry Maguire, Alan Mahon and Liam Lawrence, Mr O'Neill.

Couldn't agree more with this. Hamburg, despite the prestige associated with their name, are relegation fodder in Germany.

And Bayern Munich winning virtually every game for the last few seasons doesn't say a lot for the general strength of the league.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Two goals against Bosnia at home and MOTM against Germany.

Randolph won MOTM tonight too, and he had a poor game IMO.

[tetsujin1979]

Randolph won MOTM tonight too, and he had a poor game IMO.
Walters was the best player on the pitch that night against Germany.

[SwanVsDalton]

Walters was the best player on the pitch that night agaisnt Germany.

Agreed. One of our most consistent performers in Euro qualifying too.

[pineapple stu]

In fairness, with Robbie Keane retired, TOWK has to turn his blinkered vitriol on someone else.

[backstothewall]

I have no complaints with the penalty at all.

That's at least 5 of us who feel that way. That being the case among Ireland fans it must at least have been one of those ones that is given as often as not. If it had been Ivanovic on Shane Long we would all have been screaming for it.

[MeathDrog]

Walters is the first name on the teamsheet and with good reason. He was by far and away our best player last campaign.

[jbyrne]

That's at least 5 of us who feel that way. That being the case among Ireland fans it must at least have been one of those ones that is given as often as not. If it had been Ivanovic on Shane Long we would all have been screaming for it.

was he touched before he started falling over? don't think he was so no pen in my book

[SwanVsDalton]

That's at least 5 of us who feel that way. That being the case among Ireland fans it must at least have been one of those ones that is given as often as not. If it had been Ivanovic on Shane Long we would all have been screaming for it.

Thought it was dive and I'd think the same if it was one of our players, even if I would be completely chuffed if we got a peno off the back of it.

My take at the time was the Serbian was hitting the floor as soon as Walters came into his proximity. Walters might have brushed his back but he was bringing his hands up, there was no decisive contact that would send a player down and the only contact of consequence came when the Serbian's right leg struck Walters' leg - when he was halfway to the ground.

We could argue that Walters was looking a bit clumsy, was rushing in late but he still has to actually foul the guy.

[Bungle]

A decent result but one of the worst performances that I have seen from us.

There is a real mental block with us. We got the early goal and were terrible until we went 2-1 down. We then had a spell where we were the better team until we got the equaliser. After that, we returned to type rather than think about going for the win, our mindset at 2-2 was the solid draw. That could cost us. A good away draw is the type of result that gets you to an expanded euros, but a world cup qualification is a different animal. We need to take 10-12 points from Austria, Wales and Serbia by my reckoning to get first. We need to focus on that because there will be better teams than those three in a playoff - a look at some of the other groups means that you are going to get 2-3 really top nations in a playoff.

The good news is that we have on paper a decent team, even if we were appalling last night. We have guts in abundance and we are never out of a game. MON needs to find a place for Arter and/or Wes. Wes was needed when we were 1-0 up to get us on the ball and give us the option of a go-to man in midfield. Arter looks like he might be a better long-term candidate throughout the campaign.

The bad news is that there is a mindset in our team that doesn't seem to truly believe that they can go to places like Belgrade or Vienna and win. I am also concerned long-term that while there is a decent enough chance that MON could get us to World Cup, he could leave an almighty job for his successor - we can talk all we like that it is his job to play the best team and it is a world cup campaign after all, but there are quite a few young lads that could be in or around the squad, even if they are not starting. O'Dowda is a welcome exception. For example, what do we have to gain by the likes of McShane being in the squad.

I saw a bit of the Georgia-Austria game and Georgia looked very dangerous. They deserved at least a draw. I thought Austria were very poor but it's a good result for them. I'd fear Georgia more than Austria from what I saw. Hopefully, they will be well out of the running, by the time we play in Tiblisi.

[Real ale Madrid]

I have no complaints with the penalty at all.


Was it similar to McClean v Italy? Minimal contact last night for me. Very soft.

[paul_oshea]

Long and Walters were brutal, we do really need goals to start coming from every player.

Serbia were atrocious lads apart from the wings. You wouldn't have spotted on tele, but they were at 6s and 7s and couldnt organise themselves off the ball at all, ivanovic has no excuse here really, before the ball was played in for the offside goal we had 3 free men, no one picking them up. It was criminal that we still stayed offside, as they had so much space and time to move around. Their keeper was brutal.

I have not seen as bad a team organised defensively as they were, or a keeper as dodgy as theirs was. It's two points dropped. Even though the pitch was bad, we never used our pace, and their defenders weren't tracking anytime we made a run.

Get over your own negativity and the talk of when did we last beat blah blah blah nonsense. The fans and the players have a brittle, weak mentality. We were screaming the stands to push out and actually get on the ball. Everytime we had space we headered it or blasted it instead of taking it down, with loads of time to do so. Anytime we attacked we looked like scoring they were that bad.

Murphy said himself for hte goal, he had so much time that its one of those you end up missing. Because you have too much time to think. I read that and thought, well why the fc*k didn't ye go and do something about it then. It happened everytime we got a quick ball into the box.

[zero]

Thought it was dive and I'd think the same if it was one of our players, even if I would be completely chuffed if we got a peno off the back of it.

My take at the time was the Serbian was hitting the floor as soon as Walters came into his proximity. Walters might have brushed his back but he was bringing his hands up, there was no decisive contact that would send a player down and the only contact of consequence came when the Serbian's right leg struck Walters' leg - when he was halfway to the ground.

We could argue that Walters was looking a bit clumsy, was rushing in late but he still has to actually foul the guy.

i haven't seen it back but i thought there was minimal contact on mcclean when he won the free kick that led to our first goal. serbia were all over us when they got the pen - who's to say if it wasn't given they wouldn't have scored a later goal giving us no chance to get back into it.

another lucky MON result as others have mentioned. it's great that we keep going til the final whistle but it we could change our mentality to try to pull further ahead THEN sit back it would stand in our favour in the long run i reckon.

[backstothewall]

Thought it was dive and I'd think the same if it was one of our players, even if I would be completely chuffed if we got a peno off the back of it.

My take at the time was the Serbian was hitting the floor as soon as Walters came into his proximity. Walters might have brushed his back but he was bringing his hands up, there was no decisive contact that would send a player down and the only contact of consequence came when the Serbian's right leg struck Walters' leg - when he was halfway to the ground.

We could argue that Walters was looking a bit clumsy, was rushing in late but he still has to actually foul the guy.

That was also my take, but that's a penalty. The Serbian guy drew the foul, as he is quite entitled to do, and Walters fell into the trap. Once the Serb got there first Walters had no business placing a hand on his back and down he went as soon as he felt the contact. You are right that the trip, which was also enough to give a penalty for in my opinion, happened on yer mans way down, but there was already enough before that happened.

It's not how things were 20 years ago. It's not how any of us would like things to be. It's bloody infuriating. But that's how things are and players have a responsibility not to make stupid clumsy challenges like Walters did last night.

The odds are that if Walters had let him run on nothing would have come of it. He was heading out towards the corner flag and posing no danger at all, so all Walters had to do was nothing.

Just for the record, it seems like I'm focusing a lot on Walters there. Given what others are saying about him I just want to add that despite a bit of a **** up (imho) on this occasion, I'm still a big fan of the guy. If it was in charge he'd be one of the first names on the teamsheet.

[Stuttgart88]

One more positive is that we seem to be a team that can score goals in most matches.

[Stuttgart88]

The Serbian guy drew the foul, as he is quite entitled to do, and Walters fell into the trap. That's exactly how I saw it. Well phrased.

[pineapple stu]

The Serbian fella had possession, and Walters had no business running that close to the back of him. He was caught completely out of position, and either the Serbian fella was going to get a shot away or Walters would nick the attacker and cause him to go down. Daft defending; no complaints about the peno. I'm not sure how much it'd take to knock you in that situation tbh.

[EAFC_rdfl]

Long and Walters were brutal, we do really need goals to start coming from every player.

Serbia were atrocious lads apart from the wings. You wouldn't have spotted on tele, but they were at 6s and 7s and couldnt organise themselves off the ball at all, ivanovic has no excuse here really, before the ball was played in for the offside goal we had 3 free men, no one picking them up. It was criminal that we still stayed offside, as they had so much space and time to move around. Their keeper was brutal.

I have not seen as bad a team organised defensively as they were, or a keeper as dodgy as theirs was. It's two points dropped. Even though the pitch was bad, we never used our pace, and their defenders weren't tracking anytime we made a run.

Get over your own negativity and the talk of when did we last beat blah blah blah nonsense. The fans and the players have a brittle, weak mentality. We were screaming the stands to push out and actually get on the ball. Everytime we had space we headered it or blasted it instead of taking it down, with loads of time to do so. Anytime we attacked we looked like scoring they were that bad.

Murphy said himself for hte goal, he had so much time that its one of those you end up missing. Because you have too much time to think. I read that and thought, well why the fc*k didn't ye go and do something about it then. It happened everytime we got a quick ball into the box.

Thanks for enlightening us!! There was me thinking they were one of the best drilled sides I'd seen in a long time

[paul_oshea]

Long is begining to grate me a bit, chewing his gum, everyone calling for him to start for about 4 years, retire robbie and Long himself coming out saying similar to things of those effect when he would score or if he wasn't getting enough chances has he perceived it.

Well you've had your chance the last year and half or so and you aren't doing much about it.

[pineapple stu]

Thanks for enlightening us!! There was me thinking they were one of the best drilled sides I'd seen in a long time
Yup; no-one on the thread at all has commented on how bad their defending was. Sure neither of our goals were down to defensive howlers at all.

Here's the goals (https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2016/0905/814424-watch-the-goals-from-serbia-2-2-ireland/) btw. No complaints on the pitch for the penalty award, interestingly.