Liam Kelly (M Feyenoord (loaned to Oxford) b.1995)

[OwlsFan]

Im really disappointed he is a lovely player, terrible decision I have to say, he will never play for England

https://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/international-soccer/reading-young-gun-liam-kelly-turns-down-chance-to-play-for-ireland-36724753.html

Yes, very bad news ok. When someone called Liam Kelly sets his heart on England, it is a sad state of affairs. Time for this thread to move to World Football and to rot along side the Jack Grealish thread.

[DannyInvincible]

He hasn't actually declared for England. It seems he is going to hold off on getting too involved in our senior set-up for now or making what might be perceived as a sort of moral commitment. He is a dual national, after all. Of course, he'll probably jump at the chance to play for England if the FA offer it to him, so it doesn't look good for us from that perspective, but he still might end up sticking with us.

I am disappointed as he looks like he'll be a great talent, but it's ultimately his choice what to do with that talent.

[Stuttgart88]

Never trust a shortarse

[Dunners]

Danny should be no excuse here , he knows the rubbish that went on with the Grealish affair.
Made a big deal about how proud and Irish he is.
Should not be playing till this level before needing time to make a decision , if your Irish you know it , irrelevant of where you were born. Could be born in a stable doesn’t make you a donkey

[tricky_colour]

It is a bit of a Grealish situation but at least he was been pretty up front what his preferences are, so credit for that but it kind
of makes any future Ireland call up rather awkward.

I guess he missed the rugby at the weekend.

[CraftyToePoke]

Could be born in a stable doesn’t make you a donkey

Neither does it make you the messiah.

We will rise again.

He probably won't.


I suppose, since he started representing us about five years ago, to his now age of 22, your view of your place in the world, your identity forms a lot, can change a lot also. Or maybe its just another agent in a lads ear with bad advice serving only the agent well should an unlikely set of circumstances prevail here, i.e. a Prem move and from there to England reckoning. One thing is for sure, how he has handled this could not have been poorer (so poor it makes me wonder if there is something we don't yet know). I have lived in the UK since 2005 and my view of dual lads has softened in that time, some feel English, some Irish, and some do just feel both, that they can credibly represent either nation. But there is a way of handling that, respectfully, and Liam Kelly failed badly in that.

[DannyInvincible]

Danny should be no excuse here , he knows the rubbish that went on with the Grealish affair.
Made a big deal about how proud and Irish he is.
Should not be playing till this level before needing time to make a decision , if your Irish you know it , irrelevant of where you were born. Could be born in a stable doesn’t make you a donkey

I'm not doubting he feels Irish, but maybe he feels English too and is genuinely conflicted. It's possible to feel both Irish and English simultaneously. It would hardly be surprising if you have both Irish and English grandparents.

[gastric]

A certain Clinton Morrison procrastinated before deciding to represent Ireland and his commitment and passion to the cause were always evident. Give Kelly time, hopefully he will make the right decision.

[Razors left peg]

At 22 having been in the set up for a number of years he should know what he wants by now.

Very disrespectful that he wouldn't even answer MONs calls and just sent a text to say that he didn't want to be involved... that speaks volumes for his character I think. Hes probably looking at the England squad with Jake Livermore getting call ups and thinks he has a good chance, he probably does, Ive been impressed with him with the little I seen of him so its a pity that we have probably lost him. But maybe we are well rid if he cant even bother his ar$e having the manners or respect for a senior figure in the game to even answer a phone call.

[Charlie Darwin]

Clinton wasn't a shortarse though. I don't think Stutts stressed this enough.

[Olé Olé]

At 22 having been in the set up for a number of years he should know what he wants by now.

Very disrespectful that he wouldn't even answer MONs calls and just sent a text to say that he didn't want to be involved... that speaks volumes for his character I think. Hes probably looking at the England squad with Jake Livermore getting call ups and thinks he has a good chance, he probably does, Ive been impressed with him with the little I seen of him so its a pity that we have probably lost him. But maybe we are well rid if he cant even bother his ar$e having the manners or respect for a senior figure in the game to even answer a phone call.

Refusing to answer calls doesn't speak much to his character really, does it? He sounds more Jack Grealish than Declan Rice. Both of whole had PL experience under their belts when MON was picking up the phone.

[DeLorean]

At 22 having been in the set up for a number of years he should know what he wants by now.

That's the problem I think, he does know. It's just not what we want.

It does seem like it could have been handled better alright but we've only heard one side of the story.

[backstothewall]

Very badly handled by Kelly. The whole text message thing is very poor. It's the sort of thing you would expect of a teenager, not a 22 year old man. There is a point there about how sheltered these players are by their clubs and the impact that has on their personality, but I can't be bothered getting in to it.

He's a bright prospect but he's a year older than Deli Alli and playing at the bottom end of the championship. Exposure to international football with us was his best opportunity to demonstrate his capacity to play at a higher level. It's a loss to the squad but he is the biggest loser here.

But no ill will towards him. If this is how he feels It's best we find out now. We move on with what we have.

He will never get anywhere near then England squad.

[Diggs246]

Reading are 5th last in the championship and could easily go down, he should be biting off our hand off to play. If they do go down and he is an Irish international, he 100% gets bought

[IsMiseSean]

For some reason, I think there is more to this than just Liam Kelly waiting for a call from England.

Call it a hunch! :D

[Olé Olé]

For some reason, I think there is more to this than just Liam Kelly waiting for a call from England.

Call it a hunch! :D

Spill...

[Diggs246]

For some reason, I think there is more to this than just Liam Kelly waiting for a call from England.

Call it a hunch! :D

Ok Detective Columbo... we are waiting?

[Fixer82]

The little boll!x.

Ah no, if he doesn’t feel it then good luck to him. Shame for us but I’d rather him be honest than take a jersey from someone bursting a gut to get it

[Olé Olé]

For some reason, I think there is more to this than just Liam Kelly waiting for a call from England.

Call it a hunch! :D

Stam sacked from Reading today. He would be back at Bath City potentially only for Stam. Any link?

[IsMiseSean]

I have nothing to spill. It's just a feeling... an uneasy one!

[gastric]

If Kelly is wanted by England, O'Neill should tell Southgate that it is racist as all Catholic players with Irish names are ours and ours only. He should also demand a gentleman's agreement whereby all players who represented us between the ages of 17 and 21 should not be targeted. This will ensure Kelly remains with us.

[seanfhear]

Would Liam kelly have got much of a chance with Martin O’ Neill in any case ? In important / qualifiers games like .

[Olé Olé]

Would Liam kelly have got much of a chance with Martin O’ Neill in any case ? In important / qualifiers games like .

I would rather see Browne or Hourihane get the nod in any such role ahead of Kelly. At least I think I thunk that before this anyway...

[Gather round]

https://i.imgur.com/joYhlNf.jpg

[Fixer82]

Good luck to him.
At least it wasn’t drawn out like the Grealish situation

[Diggs246]

For some reason, I think there is more to this than just Liam Kelly waiting for a call from England.

Call it a hunch! :D
Is this related to your hunch! ?

https://m.independent.ie/sport/soccer/international-soccer/reading-young-gun-liam-kelly-remains-open-to-playing-for-ireland-36734289.html

[Fizzer]

If that’s true then o’neills comments have been pure reckless.Now where can we find a fella to ask him to explain himself?....

[Olé Olé]

Good. I said he had come off after 60 minutes for Reading at the weekend after scoring. And the England idea is a bit unrealistic. Really poor communication on his part though. And MON did a good job of testing his commitment publicly.

[Olé Olé]

If that’s true then o’neills comments have been pure reckless.Now where can we find a fella to ask him to explain himself?....

Don't you think he was testing the commitment? I think if Kelly has pulled put a few times then he has cast doubt himself. MON has sought to drive Kelly one way or there other with his comments. No harm. They won't be reckless if Kelly is totally committed. Being at the mercy of Jack Grealish somewhat must linger large.

[Fizzer]

Possibly yeah, but if so,is it not another example of O’Neill placing his inflated ego over the good of the country?The man has a humility deficit. Who knows what comments yer man is after getting in the last few days.Could end up putting him off altogether.I’d rather O’Neill wasn’t ‘testing’ young players commitment on my behalf.

[CraftyToePoke]

Don't you think he was testing the commitment? I think if Kelly has pulled put a few times then he has cast doubt himself. MON has sought to drive Kelly one way or there other with his comments. No harm. They won't be reckless if Kelly is totally committed. Being at the mercy of Jack Grealish somewhat must linger large.

Do you attribute him with that level of awareness strategy here ? Is that why he was still speaking of Declan Rice as a potential England player til the other day, with the fella in the country to play for us ?

[Razors left peg]

This is all total nonsense. We have no reason to doubt MON when he said that he tried to ring Kelly a number of times and only received a text back. If Kelly was serious about still playing for Ireland he could have had the manner to pick up the damn phone.

Now having said all that, if he is injured and MON has just thrown him under the bus that's a whole other conversation..... maybe he wanted a different story floating around this week so he wouldn't get any more questions about the Stoke thing etc (tinfoil hat is firmly on coming up with that theory)

[Fizzer]

O’Neill has thrown him under the bus whatever way you look at it.

[Razors left peg]

O’Neill has thrown him under the bus whatever way you look at it.

Yeah but if Kelly is acting the p***k then its deserved

[tetsujin1979]

Is this related to your hunch! ?

https://m.independent.ie/sport/soccer/international-soccer/reading-young-gun-liam-kelly-remains-open-to-playing-for-ireland-36734289.html

no new quotes from player or managers in that article.

[Fizzer]

No,we’re too short of resources to have him publicly disclosing communication details and speculating in the way he has.Its bad leadership and it shows all the other players, and potential players that O’Neill can’t be trusted,he’ll sell you out if he starts getting media heat.

[backstothewall]

"You might want to ask about Liam Kelly who I think wants to keep his options open at this minute.

"Obviously he's born in England and wants to keep those options open and that's fine."

"What did I do? I did actually leave a message or two and he got back to me by text."

"I've always said here that it's the player's choice. It's exactly what it is and if he wants to think that England might come in, that's entirely his decision."

"He had not returned a lot of calls coming through at the time (when named in squad). Despite the fact that I knew where he was born, I thought that was okay. I spoke to his agent quite some considerable time ago and I think that was always going to be okay, I felt. He was in the squad before and had to pull out with a hamstring problem."

"Ah lads, lads, it's the name of the game," (when asked if a call would have been better than a text)


If that’s true then o’neills comments have been pure reckless.Now where can we find a fella to ask him to explain himself?....

The way i see it there are 3 possibilities here.

Either...

1. Kelly indicated via text that he wasn't available and gave not wanting to tie himself to us as a reason for his withdrawal
2. Kelly indicated via text that he wasn't available, giving a different reason, be it injury or something else.
3. Kelly pulled out giving no reason at all.

Unless and until we know what was actually in the text i don't feel it fair to cast judgement on O'Neill's comments, or Kelly's motives.

If it was scenario 1 O'Neill has been quite restrained. If there is an issue about him wanting to keep his options with England open I don't want him anywhere near the squad. We are a nation with a proud footballing history. I don't see why a cap for our senior international team should be equivalent to a late night booty call after the girl he actually wanted the shift with got in a taxi home on her own.

In scenario 2 O'Neill has been a little trigger happy to say the least. He has perhaps seen parallels with the Grealish situation and got the wrong end of the stick. On the other the player may well be under pressure from his agent/club not to commit to anything. By saying what he has said O'Neill will take a bit of heat in the short term, but he has forced the issue and has headed off the possibility of another year long saga as happened with Grealish.

If it's scenario 3 O'Neill is more justified in filling in the blanks. There may still be a way back, but Kelly really needs to be more professional and return his missed calls. He's still young enough at 22 that this can be put down to inexperience, but he would need to learn the lessons of this.

One thing is for sure, we've not heard the last of this.

[nigel-harps1954]

No,we’re too short of resources to have him publicly disclosing communication details and speculating in the way he has.Its bad leadership and it shows all the other players, and potential players that O’Neill can’t be trusted,he’ll sell you out if he starts getting media heat.

Too short of resources my hole...that's a ridiculous argument that people put out in times like this and it's total bulls*it. We've plenty of other players if it comes to pass that Liam Kelly doesn't want to represent Ireland, in the exact same way we had plenty of other players in place of Jack Grealish.

[gastric]

The article makes complete sense, the good news... with a bit of diplomacy we can get him on board which would be fantastic and he brings a degree of creativity we have lost with Wes' retirement. Don't worry about blame, I am sure it will be sorted out behind closed doors.

[Fizzer]

Delicately put Nige but in relation to your hole,you’re talking out of it,as standard.You’ve missed the point that the way O’Neill deals with Kelly could affect the decisions of potential players.

[nigel-harps1954]

Delicately put Nige but in relation to your hole,you’re talking out of it,as standard.You’ve missed the point that the way O’Neill deals with Kelly could affect the decisions of potential players.

Well, it's been said many times before, but if a player makes a decision on their international future based on who is the manager, then they're not worth the time or effort.

This isn't club football.

[backstothewall]

The article makes complete sense, the good news... with a bit of diplomacy we can get him on board which would be fantastic and he brings a degree of creativity we have lost with Wes' retirement. Don't worry about blame, I am sure it will be sorted out behind closed doors.

I don't see anything in that article that isn't consistent with Kelly sending a text message mentioning his desire not to be permnently tied to us.


Independent.ie understands that Kelly's primary motivation during this international break was to focus on his efforts to be fully fit for Reading's final eight games of the season

The term "primary motivation" jumps out at me. What was his secondary motivation??

[Razors left peg]

We love a bit of drama don't we. In a week where we have quite a few lads making full debuts we waste time talking about the one that's not there and I'm as guilty as anyone.... I still haven't even managed to figure out how to watch the game as its not being shown anywhere in the States!

[tetsujin1979]

I appreciate this is a delicate subject, but let's not resort to personal insults.

[gastric]

I don't see anything in that article that isn't consistent with Kelly sending a text message mentioning his desire not to be permnently tied to us.



The term "primary motivation" jumps out at me. What was his secondary motivation??

I don't forensically read newspaper articles or situations tbh, I think it's an age thing! I feel the article gives a logical explanation for his non appearance and nowhere does it mention a desire to actually represent England over us. What I will say is, if there a desire to make this work on both sides, it will happen. It is also good to see his commitment to helping Reading avoid relegation!

[CraftyToePoke]

1. Kelly indicated via text that he wasn't available and gave not wanting to tie himself to us as a reason for his withdrawal
2. Kelly indicated via text that he wasn't available, giving a different reason, be it injury or something else.
3. Kelly pulled out giving no reason at all.

Unless and until we know what was actually in the text i don't feel it fair to cast judgement on O'Neill's comments, or Kelly's motives.

So we have textgate, it didn't take long to be back at it now did it :) with again regrettably MONs communication to the press under early scrutiny again.
If, if, that lad (despite making a right balls of this, granted) has not indicated that his reasons are England related, why on earth would MON see fit to introduce that to the mix as conjecture.

His communication failings grow very f*cking tedious at this stage.

[backstothewall]

If, if, that lad (despite making a right balls of this, granted) has not indicated that his reasons are England related, why on earth would MON see fit to introduce that to the mix as conjecture.


I agree it's a big if. It also seems unlikely that either party would reveal the contents of that message so i suspect we'll not find out exactly what was said for quite some time.

As i said there is a possibility that O'Neill was trying to force the issue. It's idle speculation, but that's the case with anyone who hasn't seen the contents of that text. If that's the case he has been very effective, or it could be that O'Neill has done something very odd. That's the thing with O'Neill. You're never quite sure. The fact that he was Brian Clough's captain suggest to me that there is a least an element of the unpredictability in his actions being very deliberate.

[seanfhear]

Maybe Liam Kelly realised that he is not physically big enough to play Martin O’ Neill’s style of football and attempted to go missing to avoid embarrassment all round = Plan = Backfired

How are Liam's Grandmothers ?

[seanfhear]

Unfairness I’d find it hard to play for Martin O Neill’s style......but that is because I ain’t no good .

[Fizzer]

Well, it's been said many times before, but if a player makes a decision on their international future based on who is the manager, then they're not worth the time or effort.

This isn't club football.

What a load of total nonsense. Who cares how many times it's been said, it's still ridiculous. Of course players are influenced to declare for us/or not to/or to wait, based on the manager, sure they're even influenced by who's the assistant manager. if they're good enough players, they are worth the effort.
You are right when you point out that it's not club football, and that's exactly why O'Neill needs to stop treating the job like he's at a club, which can buy and sell players.
He needs to cop on, shut up and get on with trying to win games instead of playing schoolyard games.