I hate the tax man/women

[Roo69]

Seriously, i really fcuking hate him or her ! :mad:

[Peadar]

Seriously, i really fcuking hate him or her ! :mad:

I pay tax in Ireland and I don't even live there.
I also pay Council Tax etc. in England.
The various services wont pay for themselves so I've no problem paying tax.
It's wasters who claim off the state because they're total wasters that really get to me.

[Aldini98]

Seriously, i really fcuking hate him or her ! :mad:

Don't waste your time on him/her, just hate Bertie, he's ruining (not running) this country. Just watch him the next time you see him on the TV, he'll either be reading a pre-written speech, written by somebody with an IQ of over 80, or he'll be actually saying nothing except politican speak that really doesn't mean anything. :mad:

[Roo69]

I pay tax in Ireland and I don't even live there.
I also pay Council Tax etc. in England.
The various services wont pay for themselves so I've no problem paying tax.
It's wasters who claim off the state because they're total wasters that really get to me.

Seriously, you would hate him/her/bertie if you just paid what i did on tax today ! I should not have had to pay that amout of tax no matter what, i dont mind paying tax, as you say it goes towards "trying" to run our country but it is disgusting what i had to pay out. a very bitter sweet pay check.

[$Leon$]

delighted to see ray burke goin to jail for not payin tax
just felt it was some what relavant to the topic roo69

[Roo69]

delighted to see ray burke goin to jail for not payin tax
just felt it was some what relavant to the topic roo69

Oh it is indeed. Should have been for longer though

[finlma]

Ray Burke should definitely have gotten more time.

My old man has the dubious job of working with the Revenue Commisioners and he hates his employer with a passion.

[Macy]

delighted to see ray burke goin to jail for not payin tax
Interesting to here Bertie back tracking from his support, saying he had no way of knowing. Eh Bertie, how about Albert telling you he was dodgy and he wouldn't (and didn't) have him in his cabinet? :rolleyes:

Very funny listening to the speech again the other night where he implies the press are hounding an innocent man... :D

[pete]

I'm not standing up for Burke but how many other tax evaders have seen jail time?

[fosterdollar]

There's a lot of gloating over "same rules apply to everyone now" going on as well. I'm not convinced people would have the same opinions on paying tax of they were getting cash-in-hand or the likes on nixers, summerjobs, etc. :rolleyes:

[pete]

I think the big difference with Burke is that he didn't avail (Berties) of numerous tax amnesties which meant jail inevitable...?

[fosterdollar]

Or that he did avail but in a taking the p!ss sort of way in that he declared damn all of his finances in the 1993 one

[Macy]

I'm not standing up for Burke but how many other tax evaders have seen jail time?
Not enough, especially those that didn't pay tax on undeclared bribes. However, wasn't there a Cork farmer who went down for 2 years recently for similar tax offences?

Magoo, a huge difference between a nixer and a corrupt payment to an elected representative, to influence planning decisions. Not even Conor would try and argue that (okay he probably would, but would still be wrong)....

[fosterdollar]

Magoo, a huge difference between a nixer and a corrupt payment to an elected representative, to influence planning decisions. Not even Conor would try and argue that (okay he probably would, but would still be wrong)....
Ray Burke was jailed for tax evasion.

[Macy]

Ray Burke was jailed for tax evasion.
On money he received for what?

[joey B]

I pay no tax whatsoever ha ha the joys of student life :p

[the 12 th man]

I pay no tax whatsoever ha ha the joys of student life :p


also music composers in ireland pay zip income tax

[fosterdollar]

My point is that he was jailed for not paying his taxes and many people (i mean in general, not necessarily on this MB) are being all high and mighty about how what he did is indeed a serious crime, yet the same people dodge tax payments on a regular basis. This i know to be true. I have put the facts to them and they invariably reply by referring to the amounts of money involved. This goes against the 'one law for all' way of thinking.

With regard to the reasons he got the money, they are quite sickening and he surely does deserve what he gets in whatever roundabout way. But even to take a moral high ground on this is perhaps unfair because, taking previous example of nixers, often means you are in some way either doing your employer out of business, using their property for your own financial gain or using company time to work on the nixer.This is not always the case of course. I point this out, though, to illustrate the similarites between RB and Joe Soap. He was jailed for taxes (okay, he was breaking other rules as well). Someone doing a nixer is probably not paying taxes and very often is breaking other rules also. Might be food for thought for some people.

Okay, so what am i saying? RB shouldn't be jailed? No, i think more effort should be put into nailing these gits for corruption which is a far more serious crime than not paying taxes IMHO. In fairness to people of that generation, tax evasion was pretty much par for the course during the periods the tax was evaded so I'm not a big fan of convicting people on this usinmg modern standards.

[Peadar]

I pay no tax whatsoever ha ha the joys of student life :p


Enjoy it while you can.
You'll probably spend more than twice as many years paying tax than you've been alive already.

[pete]

Didn't Burke cliam he kept 50k or something for election expenses yet never actually spent the cash?

AFAIK Burkes case was that he was more or else being accused of fraud (bribe monies) & since they couldn't prove that he getting done for not declaring that cash.

There should be a proper National fraud squad - Politics/Business actively invested on anythjing from bribery, corruption to anti-competition parctices.

Interestingly wasn't there a report last week that said a large percentage of people were over-taxed in 2003?

[joey B]

Enjoy it while you can.
You'll probably spend more than twice as many years paying tax than you've been alive already.
Thanks for putting a dampner on it for me :( ,34 years of tax :eek: ,its inhumane :mad:

[Peadar]

Thanks for putting a dampner on it for me :( ,34 years of tax :eek: ,its inhumane :mad:

Are you a mature student or what?
I've got more than that left and I've been paying tax constantly for the last 8.5 years.

[fosterdollar]

Just copped the title of this thread. Are you suggesting it takes more than one woman to do a man's job Roo69? ;)

[joey B]

Are you a mature student or what?
I've got more than that left and I've been paying tax constantly for the last 8.5 years.
It said double the number of years i am now 17 so do the math.

[fosterdollar]

... so do the math.
but that's what you're supposed to be doing

[Peadar]

It said double the number of years i am now 17 so do the math.

Correction, I said "more than twice."

If you start work when you're 20 then it's 45 years to retirement age.

[joey B]

Anyway im definitley not a mature student. :D

[Macy]

AFAIK Burkes case was that he was more or else being accused of fraud (bribe monies) & since they couldn't prove that he getting done for not declaring that cash.
Burke was done for tax, as the evidence in tribunals is inadmissable in other courts - the theory being to get people to cooperate. Incidentally, Burke hasn't cooperated with that either, hence the €10 million legal bill.

Magoo - by getting caught up in the tax aspect of the conviction, your missing the wider point. They couldn't do him on the other points, so they got him on the tax. That's why this conviction should celebrated - strike one for the man in the street against decades of corrupt politicians getting away with it. Hopefully he'll be the first of many to get sent down by whatever charges are necessary for some form of justice.

[joey B]

but that's what you're supposed to be doing
Nope im a computer student, there is some maths total bolix.

[fosterdollar]

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad to see Burke get sent down. I think it would be an even greater victory for the man on the street if it was for corruption, mind. What's being exposed in the tribunals, especially Flood, is horrific. Developers had some of the most politically powerful people in this country wholly in their pockets.

[Peadar]

Developers had some of the most politically powerful people in this country wholly in their pockets.

We didn't need a tribunal to tell us that.
All you have to do is look at some of the builldings on places like St. Stephen's Green in Dublin or even Liberty Hall to know how corrupt the planning process was.

[fosterdollar]

We didn't need a tribunal to tell us that.
All you have to do is look at some of the builldings on places like St. Stephen's Green in Dublin or even Liberty Hall to know how corrupt the planning process was.


And the Bunglaow ...ahem... Bliss that is parts of semi-rural Ireland.

[pete]

From what i've heard planning system is as corrupt as ever. Lots of who-you-know stuff going on everywhere.

Burke will be the best candidate for bribery conviction but I suppose he'll be as sick as CJ if & when that ever makes court. Its been proven Burke kept 50k & he unable to come up with good excuse.

[Macy]

And the Bunglaow ...ahem... Bliss that is parts of semi-rural Ireland.
I know a few people that have been trying for planning for 5+ years for an average house (within the old first time buyers grant size) that would drop a few grand if that was true. Individuals don't have the bucks to make it worth the risk of the planners/ politicians....

[the 12 th man]

I know a few people that have been trying for planning for 5+ years for an average house (within the old first time buyers grant size) that would drop a few grand if that was true. Individuals don't have the bucks to make it worth the risk of the planners/ politicians....


a high profile irish flat race jockey bought a sizeable piece of land near punchestown race course that the previous owner could'nt get planning permission to build on.

within 6 months not only hads he planning for his own house but one for
his elderly parents at the entrance to the property.

makes you wonder

[fosterdollar]

TBH honest I don't know if it's still true (I doubt it given circumstances at teh moment) but in the past, plenty of 'gifts' were given to Co. Co. people for various favours, be they planning or otherwise. Incidently, many favours were done purely on association by family of friendship grounds also. It's still corruption.

[Macy]

a high profile irish flat race jockey bought a sizeable piece of land near punchestown race course that the previous owner could'nt get planning permission to build on.

within 6 months not only hads he planning for his own house but one for
his elderly parents at the entrance to the property.

makes you wonder
Not saying it doesn't. Maybe I took up Magoo wrong, but I thought he was getting at the average family - not "high profile jockey's". There's certainly high profile (and weird looking) houses getting built that make you think how the fook did they get planning when it took us 2 years for a small one on family land...

[fosterdollar]

Not saying it doesn't. Maybe I took up Magoo wrong, but I thought he was getting at the average family - not "high profile jockey's".
Not the average family, but not necessarily juts the "high profile jockey's" either. Favours have been done by people in Administrative Authority which is clear given the occurance of houses such as the ones you mentioned.

[the 12 th man]

Not saying it doesn't. Maybe I took up Magoo wrong, but I thought he was getting at the average family - not "high profile jockey's". There's certainly high profile (and weird looking) houses getting built that make you think how the fook did they get planning when it took us 2 years for a small one on family land...


i was probably going off topic,but i was just doing a comparison between having the neccessaries & know how to grease the wheels as opposed to being an ordinary joe.

[Macy]

Not the average family, but not necessarily juts the "high profile jockey's" either. Favours have been done by people in Administrative Authority which is clear given the occurance of houses such as the ones you mentioned.
Okay I'll agree, just about - but don't let it develop into an anti rural development/ bungalow debate, we have D4 state sponsored w@nkers An Taisce for that....

[fosterdollar]

That's a whole other story. As it happens it's cr@p like the two year wait for planning permission that only reaffirms my stance on the conviction of corrupt authoritarians.

BTW, Joe Duffy has just been speaking to a woman (from Finglas ;) ) who was airing her disappointment that Mountjoy could be moving near her area. Planning process appears to have be expedited despite her son being refused for basic extension recently. Didn't catch the full conversation so please excuse any errors/omissions.

[Macy]

That's a whole other story. As it happens it's cr@p like the two year wait for planning permission that only reaffirms my stance on the conviction of corrupt authoritarians.
Believe me, we were one of the quick ones in Wicklow :rolleyes: In a few years, I garantee they'll be big developments in the surrounding area once the next round of re-zoning (the real corrupt power games) goes through.

If you get the chance, go for a drive around a rural area with a local in 90's (grandparents etc). Let them tell you all the one off houses that were there in the past - you'll genuinely be shocked and wonder what the fook An Taisce and the save the look of the countryside lot are arguing about. Ireland has always had a housing culture of building on family land....

[fosterdollar]

If you get the chance, go for a drive around a rural area with a local in 90's (grandparents etc). Let them tell you all the one off houses that were there in the past - you'll genuinely be shocked and wonder what the fook An Taisce and the save the look of the countryside lot are arguing about. Ireland has always had a housing culture of building on family land....

You're preaching to the converted here. It stands to reason. There has been substantial sway back to the towns and cities over the last 30/40 years. All those people had to live in houses when they were still in rural areas. Accomodation density in cities (esp. Dublin) has to be affected by(in a more minor way than by others) the difficulites in gaining planning permission in areas such as Co. Wicklow.

[pete]

I wouldn't think money changes hands for planning permission but i've heard stories of people who couldn't get any permission to build, spoke to local councillor & then suddenly got permission they needed.

Planning permission in certain counties a scam. Around Dingle you can't buy land as an outsider & get permission to build. However you can buy land as a local, get planning permission & then sell to outsider. Means outsiders have to buy derilect cottages if want to build something. Complete scam to make money for locals - prices down there would rival dublin. :eek:

[Macy]

I wouldn't think money changes hands for planning permission but i've heard stories of people who couldn't get any permission to build, spoke to local councillor & then suddenly got permission they needed.

It's standard practice to approach councillors to help your case. All they do is give you a heads up to withdraw before you get a refusal (negative planning history seriously effects your chances of getting it, and the site value). They'd also put your case in terms of need etc. Personally I think it's councillors doing their job, if a constuent asks them to look into it. Very different from a section 12(?) or whatever where councillors vote on it and have a direct influence. However, if you're politically connected, you seem to have much less hassle.


Planning permission in certain counties a scam. Around Dingle you can't buy land as an outsider & get permission to build. However you can buy land as a local, get planning permission & then sell to outsider. Means outsiders have to buy derilect cottages if want to build something. Complete scam to make money for locals - prices down there would rival dublin. :eek:
In Wicklow they have a 10 year clause in the planning permission - you're not allowed to sell within 10 years without their permission (or because a lender needs to sell). Still nothing to stop an outsider buying a cottage, and whats considered an outsider is all up to the planning department. People that have been in the area 20 years, having raised a family who have known nowhere else as home, have trouble over the "local" issue. :rolleyes:

[$Leon$]

That's standard enough in a lot of places, and was seen as a way of reducing the proliferation of holiday homes that lie vacant for most of the year and do nothing for a rural community. It is now difficult to get planning in many rural areas, they want people to buy in or near towns and villages. So it is difficult to get land outside a town or village and subsequently obtain planning. It is easier for locals, but even they usuallly face a condition that they have to reside in the property for the first 5 or 7 years after construction, so they cannot sell a site but actually have to build and live in the house.

did anyone c da way da government don't need plannin permission for da new jail

[Macy]

It is now difficult to get planning in many rural areas, they want people to buy in or near towns and villages. So it is difficult to get land outside a town or village and subsequently obtain planning.
And that's where the policy is wrong. Ultimately I believe it's because if you want to become a planning officer you have to get a qualification in town planning. They haven't really an idea how rural people want to live, or how they have lived in the past for generations i.e. building beside family on family land.

I actually don't have too much problem with the clauses saying you can't sell, or the "local" aspect. They just go to far in what they want (as in the case of the family that have been there for 20 years and still being questioned over it).

[Macy]

I thought you just needed a brass neck, ie. the same qualification as auctioneers!
Who'd want to be a planning officer in a rural county - their the rural equivalent of clampers....

[Roo69]

I pay no tax whatsoever ha ha the joys of student life :p

my pay check had 5 figures in it for last month........now whos laughing (cue Dr. Evil laugh !!!!!)

[Peadar]

my pay check had 5 figures in it for last month.

Do all rent boys get paid by cheque? :eek: :D