Post Ireland V Italia, Rome 1990

[Colm55]

Just recieved this on email, so not too sure of authenticity, but given the amount of hours spent on the "how Irish are English born players" this may be quite amusing!

"JUST when you think you've heard all the great Irish
football stories, along comes one that goes straight
into the top ten.

Niall Quinn told it at a recent fundraising dinner for
the Retired International Players' Fund in Dublin and,
if the uproarious reaction on the night is anything to
go by, this is a yarn that, despite much stiff
opposition, could yet go all the way to Number 1.

The setting was the Irish dressing room in Rome in the
immediate aftermath of the 1-0 defeat to hosts Italy,
in the quarter-final of the 1990 World Cup. Contrary to
the popular myth of the team of that era as the
happy-go-lucky Irish, determined to have a party come
what may, the post-match scene as described by Quinn
was one of emotional devastation.

Convinced they might have nicked a game which would
have put them just 90 minutes away from - gulp! - the
World Cup Final, the players sat slumped, completely
deflated, some with their heads in their hands, others
hooded in towels, the tomb-like silence broken only by
the sound of the odd boot thudding against a wall, as a
weary foot shook it off.

Suddenly, the door to the dressing room burst open and
a man in an elegant suit entered in good cheer and loud
voice. Arms aloft he launched into a stirring speech
about the warrior sons of Erin, the brave performance
of the team, the honour they had brought to their
country, and much more in that vein. This was Charles J
Haughey in full oratorical flight.

After he'd gone on like this for a couple of minutes,
Quinn was nudged in the ribs by Tony Cascarino, who
rather loudly inquired: "Oo the fack is 'e, then?"
Quinn growled back a whispered, "For God's sake Cas,
that's the Taoiseach." Whereupon, Andy Townsend turned
to Cascarino and asked:"Oo is it, Cas?" "I dunno,"
Cascarino replied, "but Quinny says he owns a tea
shop."

[crc]

Townsend turned
to Cascarino and asked:"Oo is it, Cas?" "I dunno,"
Cascarino replied, "but Quinny says he owns a tea
shop."
:D Brilliant. On this evidence, expecting any of them to sing the national anthem is completely out of the question.

[eirebhoy]

That's out of Mary Hannigan's section of the Irish Times. I actually have the quote's as a sig on another forum, I tried to use it as a sig here but it was too long.

[Donal81]

It reminds me of another Ireland story, maybe true, maybe apocryphal, of Terry Mancini, Arsenal and Ireland defender, turning to Joe Kinnear after Amhran na bhFiann and saying "fackin' 'ell, I 'ope ours ain't that long."

[sylvo]

If i'd been sitting in that dressing room when he came in all smiles and cheers,
I'd have chinned him.

[Cowboy]

i could never understand singing our Anthem in english, I cringe when Celtic fans do it

[eirebhoy]

i could never understand singing our Anthem in english, I cringe when Celtic fans do it
Never heard Celtic fans do it. BTW, there's probably Scottish Celts that know the Irish words to our national anthem then Irish people. The Turks were an awful lot louder than us in Lansdowne. :rolleyes:

[Cowboy]

there's probably Scottish Celts that know the Irish words to our national anthem then Irish people. The Turks were an awful lot louder than us in Lansdowne. :rolleyes:

Yes I would not disagree with either point

[eirebhoy]

Never noticed that Dav. I heard the anthem being sang at the Old Firm match last week, bit too difficult to make out what language it was in though. :)

[Duncan Gardner]

seeing as these ignorant people took our language away from many of us! :mad:

Who's stopping ye talkin' Wurzel, then? :confused:

[holidaysong]

Never heard Celtic fans do it. BTW, there's probably Scottish Celts that know the Irish words to our national anthem then Irish people. The Turks were an awful lot louder than us in Lansdowne. :rolleyes:

In fairness Irish and Scots Gallic are different languages. Have you ever read Scots Gallic? They came from the same thing but most Scots Gallic speakers wouldn't understand a lot of simple Irish nevermind be able to sing the national anthem.

[Eire06]

i could never understand singing our Anthem in english, I cringe when Celtic fans do it

Me too I got a Celtic Greatest hits album for christmas and the national anthem is on it in ENGLISH... Its a disgrace..
I was disgusted, it's bad enough that most of the population cannot string two words of Irish together..
Its the IRISH national Anthem ao it should be in IRISH no other language...

[brine3]

Like I'm gonna sing about Fianna Fail or soldiers coming from over the seas to fight for Ireland.

It's time the anthem was changed, it's not 1916 anymore.

[Cowboy]

Like I'm gonna sing about Fianna Fail or soldiers coming from over the seas to fight for Ireland.

It's time the anthem was changed, it's not 1916 anymore.

Well its my understanding the words of the anthem have nothing to do with the political party. I do agree with you though that the words could be updated but is this not true of most anthem which were written in a more jingoistic age.
As long as Phil Coulter has nothing to do with it :)

We could definitely do without hearing "send her victorious" :)

[Colm55]

A nation that forgets its past forgets itself. Why the hell should we change the National Anthem? Get the words, learn the words and sing it with pride.
I couldn't believe Paris when a lot of the people around me just stood up and stared into space when it come to the National Anthems.
If some of these liberal nouveau Irish get their way (Dublin 4 dwellers, to everyone else) we will very soon have a National Anthem in English composed by Ronan Keating or the like.

Hear Hear ! ! ! !

[Lionel Ritchie]

A nation that forgets its past forgets itself. Why the hell should we change the National Anthem? Get the words, learn the words and sing it with pride.
I couldn't believe Paris when a lot of the people around me just stood up and stared into space when it come to the National Anthems.
If some of these liberal nouveau Irish get their way (Dublin 4 dwellers, to everyone else) we will very soon have a National Anthem in English composed by Ronan Keating or the like.

Paranoid nonsense. When the fcuk are we going to get past this 'the anglos lie over the hill' crapology? I really like the air of the anthem but I'm sick to fcuk of this country being defined around a conflict with our next door neighbour ...and the lyrics of the anthem do just that.

We'd be kicking up a stink if GSTQ or any other anthem had references to us in it.

[Cowboy]

I couldn't believe Paris when a lot of the people around me just stood up and stared into space when it come to the National Anthems.


Yeah it seems some people are losing respect for anthems not just our own e.g guys talking during the anthems, coming in late and trying to sqeeze past while its playing (this really bugs me) etc

[Cowboy]

Paranoid nonsense. When the fcuk are we going to get past this 'the anglos lie over the hill' crapology? I really like the air of the anthem but I'm sick to fcuk of this country being defined around a conflict with our next door neighbour ...and the lyrics of the anthem do just that.

We'd be kicking up a stink if GSTQ or any other anthem had references to us in it.

sure as hell is better than Irelands call though :)

[drinkfeckarse]

sure as hell is better than Irelands call though :)

Dunno, I quite like Irelands Call.

Have to admit I don't know all the words to our anthem in English nevermind Irish :o :o :(

Reading this thread has shamed me into learning it fully immediately :o

[NeilMcD]

I think we should leave the national anthem as it is . As far as I know it has been there since the foundation of the state and I dont believe you should ever change your national anthem just for the sake of it. It should be sung in Irish at game with all the gutso we can give it. Nearly every anthem in the world refers to the winning of some battle and very few of them are politically correct as they were not written at a time when PC was the cultural Ideology of the day. GSTQ has the lyrics of "Rebellious Scots to Crush" and this is the Anthem of the Unitied Kingdom of which Scotland is a part of and yet that has not been changed. I dont see any need for it to be changed or to be sung in English or anything. Before anyone jumps down my back. I am not an IRA Sympathiser or Sinn Fein voter or Celtic fan just someone that thinks that a country should keep some of its traditions. I dont hate England either I just like to see them defeated at things like football and War.

[NeilMcD]

It is Tommy Tiernans to give him his credit

[lopez]

Me too I got a Celtic Greatest hits album for christmas and the national anthem is on it in ENGLISH... Its a disgrace..
I was disgusted, it's bad enough that most of the population cannot string two words of Irish together..
Its the IRISH national Anthem ao it should be in IRISH no other language...It was originally written in English in 1907 by Peader Kearney so I can't see why it can't be sung in English by non-Irish speakers. I do agree with the fall of Irish speaking in Ireland. You can blame us 2G for not being fluent with the language but where are the Irish to converse with? People are complaining about not singing the anthem in Irish yet not exaclty making an effort in wider life to speaking Irish. Even in the Cork Gaeltacht I feel an eejit ordering anything in a shop or pub in Irish. I asked for 'uisce' in a pub and got offered a whiskey FFS. In fact it seems that Irish is wheeled out only when it is needed to talk behind the backs of those that don't speak it, than anything else.

As for changing the anthem. Give us a 32 county state and that's when it needs to be changed. Presently the country is defined by its historical conflict with Britain and people can do whatever they want to pretend otherwise.

[holidaysong]

At Ireland vs. Croatia there a few months ago I was shocked my friend I was with was unable to sing the anthem.. He was making up the words. I thought everyone knew it!

The governement should have banned english in 1922 and shot anyone who spoke it - that would have sorted them out :D

[drinkfeckarse]

Even in the Cork Gaeltacht I feel an eejit ordering anything in a shop or pub in Irish. I asked for 'uisce' in a pub and got offered a whiskey FFS

:D He probably thought you had a strong Weshht Cork accent like! That's what it would sound like...whishke :D :D

[eirebhoy]

For those looking to learning and for those not looking to learn it (its your duty :mad: )

Amhrán Na bhFiann (with pronunciation)

Sinne Fianna Fáil, (Sheena Feena fall)
Atá Fá gheall ag Éirinn, (A-taw fay yal egg air-in)
Buidhean dár sluagh tar rúinn do ráinig chughainn (bween dor slooa, har tin duh raw-nig hween.)
Fámhoídh bheírh saor, (Fwee voij vay sair)
Sean-tír ár sinnsear feasta (shan teer are shin-sher fas-ta)
Ní fágfar fá'n tíorán ná fa'n tráil; (nee fawg-ferr fween tear-on naw fween troyl)
Anocht a theigeamh sa bhearna baoghail, (ah-nocht ah hay-im sah varna vweel)
Le gean ar Gaedhí chun báis nó saoghail, (le gyan err Gwail khun boss no sayl)
Le gunna sgréach: Fá lamhach na piléar. (le gon-nuh shkrayk fay law-voc na bill-air)
Seo Libh canaidh amhrán na bhFiann. (shuh liv konig Aw-rawn na bhFiann)

[Cowboy]

Well said Sir



I think we should leave the national anthem as it is . As far as I know it has been there since the foundation of the state and I dont believe you should ever change your national anthem just for the sake of it. It should be sung in Irish at game with all the gutso we can give it. Nearly every anthem in the world refers to the winning of some battle and very few of them are politically correct as they were not written at a time when PC was the cultural Ideology of the day. GSTQ has the lyrics of "Rebellious Scots to Crush" and this is the Anthem of the Unitied Kingdom of which Scotland is a part of and yet that has not been changed. I dont see any need for it to be changed or to be sung in English or anything. Before anyone jumps down my back. I am not an IRA Sympathiser or Sinn Fein voter or Celtic fan just someone that thinks that a country should keep some of its traditions. I dont hate England either I just like to see them defeated at things like football and War.

[Cowboy]

:D He probably thought you had a strong Weshht Cork accent like! That's what it would sound like...whishke :D :D


actually whiskey is known as uisce beatha (the water of life) and I've often heard older guys just calling it just uisce. When they saw Lopez (hard looking that he is :-) ) they must have assumed no way he's be ordering water :-)

[lopez]

actually whiskey is known as uisce beatha (the water of life) and I've often heard older guys just calling it just uisce. When they saw Lopez (hard looking that he is :-) ) they must have assumed no way he's be ordering water :-)
Thanks for that Cowboy. :o Actually there was a gaelic music festival going on in Bally MacEera in a pub since closed down and there was a lecture given in Irish. No one said 'no English' but I thought I'd give my very limited Irish a bash at the bar. True I knew the confusion it could bring. I was learning it here in the early 90s with Conchita and the only conversation I've ever properly had was with a Spiddal man before our game against Denmark in 92. Don't use then you'l lose it. My mate with me, who was a Millwall fan, was fluent in it as his parents were from West Connemara and spoke it at home. BTW, isn't poteen known as 'water of death or something' in Irish?

[Cowboy]

BTW, isn't poteen known as 'water of death or something' in Irish?

No thats the Irish sea around sellafield your thinking of

[Docboy]

A nation that forgets its past forgets itself. Why the hell should we change the National Anthem? Get the words, learn the words and sing it with pride.
I couldn't believe Paris when a lot of the people around me just stood up and stared into space when it come to the National Anthems.
If some of these liberal nouveau Irish get their way (Dublin 4 dwellers, to everyone else) we will very soon have a National Anthem in English composed by Ronan Keating or the like.

Gotta agree with you there mate, I'm no raving IRA head but the politicaly correct brigade will bleed all trace of Irishness and our past and leave in a homogenised,franchised brave new world. Amhran na Bhfiann should stay where it is.

[jbyrne]

Gotta agree with you there mate, I'm no raving IRA head but the politicaly correct brigade will bleed all trace of Irishness and our past and leave in a homogenised,franchised brave new world. Amhran na Bhfiann should stay where it is.

yes, have to agree also. i cringe everytime that "Irelands Call" rubbish is played as our rugby teams anthem

[holidaysong]

yes, have to agree also. i cringe everytime that "Irelands Call" rubbish is played as our rugby teams anthem

The D4 Anthem..

I actually remember hearing a radio debate a few months ago on if we should change our flag, it was very interesting. A lot of people wanted to go back to the 1798 Rebellion flag of the gold harp on the green background with "Éireann Go Brách" (Ireland Forever) on it. Some D4 heads wanted the flag of St. Patrick which is white background with a red X. I like what the tricolour stands for though - peace between both communities on the island :)

[sylvo]

We'd be kicking up a stink if GSTQ or any other anthem had references to us in it.


Apperantly it has about seven verses which includes some of referances to some of its near neighbours.

[lopez]

...Some D4 heads wanted the flag of St. Patrick which is white background with a red X. I like what the tricolour stands for though - peace between both communities on the island...To me this is a flag that represents the British community in Ireland (like the tricolour or the Ulster flag is the community of nationalists in the O6C). The Fitzgerald saltire has nothing to do with anyone who wants an independent Ireland. Don't mind people bringing it along to Rugby internationals but it's riduculous to suggest that it belongs as the flag of Ireland. Typical West Brits.

There are enough people coming into the country now with absolutely no interest in Ireland or Irish affairs without our own turning their backs on their identity and tradition.
They should all be put through the kind of process wannabe-Australians are put through.
End of rant.Sadly a lot of these people coming in have more interest in Ireland than many people already here. Saw a programme in the mid 90s (sort of local news) and this Ukrainian bird was really good at speaking Irish. I wound up my F-i-L a few years ago by saying that I'd read in the papers that benefits of these 'imported scroungers' was being linked to how well they spoke Irish. Though a fluent Irish speaker himself he prefered they spoke English until he figured it was a wind up.


Apperantly it has about seven verses which includes some of referances to some of its near neighbours.Here's a link for you Sylvo. I sooooooooo know you'd like to learn these tunes. :D ;)
http://www.chaos.org.uk/~pdh/string/songbook.htm

[livehead1]

Like I'm gonna sing about Fianna Fail or soldiers coming from over the seas to fight for Ireland.

It's time the anthem was changed, it's not 1916 anymore.

no because that wouldn't be the 'in' thing to do now would it but dont you forget the thousands of people who died for ireland fighting the british, many of whom were from england. short memories...feckin eejit springs to mind

[lopez]

Flags?

How about the whole Blue Peter/Red Hand/Union Jack controversy in the past couple of days.

http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=4030797Can't see how the red hand is 'sectarian'. :confused: If that's the case the GAA must be collusion with loyalist paramilitaries. Just another complete overreaction. Typical uni bods: more time than sense.

Do like the Butcher's Apron in the shape of Ireland. Very post modern. :D Actually - and this should not come as a surprise - I'd say that in a country where most young people don't know anything about Churchill or Auschwitz (despite the constant cult of war in newspapers) the notion of the whole of Ireland being part of Britain shouldn't come as a shock. More ignorance than irredentism. Knew this bloke a few years back that said to me 'Right. So you want us Brits out of Dublin.' Priceless. :rolleyes:

[sylvo]

Here's a link for you Sylvo. I sooooooooo know you'd like to learn these tunes. :D ;)
http://www.chaos.org.uk/~pdh/string/songbook.htm



But what happens if the third in line to the chair thing ever takes over. Will they change the anthem to the hoss viesiill song or some tunes sung in the Hoff Brau house in Munich pre 1945. :confused: And will the ceiling pattern in that pub get copyed in that big council house in the mall. ;)

[pineapple stu]

For those looking to learning and for those not looking to learn it (its your duty :mad: )

Amhrán Na bhFiann (with pronunciation)

Sinne Fianna Fáil, (Sheena Feena fall)
Atá Fá gheall ag Éirinn, (A-taw fay yal egg air-in)
Buidhean dár sluagh tar rúinn do ráinig chughainn (bween dor slooa, har tin duh raw-nig hween.)
Fámhoídh bheírh saor, (Fwee voij vay sair)
Sean-tír ár sinnsear feasta (shan teer are shin-sher fas-ta)
Ní fágfar fá'n tíorán ná fa'n tráil; (nee fawg-ferr fween tear-on naw fween troyl)
Anocht a theigeamh sa bhearna baoghail, (ah-nocht ah hay-im sah varna vweel)
Le gean ar Gaedhí chun báis nó saoghail, (le gyan err Gwail khun boss no sayl)
Le gunna sgréach: Fá lamhach na piléar. (le gon-nuh shkrayk fay law-voc na bill-air)
Seo Libh canaidh amhrán na bhFiann. (shuh liv konig Aw-rawn na bhFiann)
That's only the chorus, though, isn't it? Think there are three verses as well?

[lopez]

But what happens if the third in line to the chair thing ever takes over. Will they change the anthem to the hoss viesiill song or some tunes sung in the Hoff Brau house in Munich pre 1945. :confused: And will the ceiling pattern in that pub get copyed in that big council house in the mall. ;)Check out this week's Private Eye. It's got the headline 'Nazi Gaffe Shock' with a picture of Hitler saying 'I've come as Prince Harry.' Dunno what all the hassle is over Hazza and his uniform. He's half German aint he? Erm, no I forgot, his father's James Hewitt. :eek:

[Cowboy]

Jesus H, I'd rather they played God Save the Queen than that dire crap.


Its bad but it aint that bad :)

[Superhoops]

Here's a link for you Sylvo. I sooooooooo know you'd like to learn these tunes. :D ;) http://www.chaos.org.uk/~pdh/string/songbook.htm
Lopez, first time I have seen this. Love the second verse:
O Lord our God arise,
Scatter her enemies
And make them fall;
Confound their politics,
Frustrate their knavish tricks,
On Thee our hopes we fix,
Oh, save us all!
Says it all really. Can picture the Burberry hat brigade beltin this out and using it as justification for kickin the sh*te out of all and sundry.

[eirebhoy]

That's only the chorus, though, isn't it? Think there are three verses as well?
I dunno but thats all thats played at matches.

[crc]

I have no problem with Ireland's Call at rugby matches - its a rousing tune and everybody knows the words. Northern unionists deserve a parity of esteem too. We have to realise that the symbols of the southern state don't represent them, so we have to use symbols that are representative of both communities (like the shamrock).
From a purely selfish perspective (i.e. the prospect of a united Ireland), it doesn't help us to make them our enemies by forcing our symbols on them. A united Ireland will only happen when everyone feels comfortable with it. You won't be able to force nearly a million northerners into it. In that regard, there needs to be a rapprochement not only between the communities in the north, but also between northern unionists and the south. This is one of the great things about the Setanta Cup!

[gypsyfella]

its a ****ing joke - we were the only country at the World CUp to have some ****ing pop song instead of our anthem...

the team is 'ireland', the flag is 'Ireland' and most of the fans are ;irish'... could you see the IFA changing the national anthem of the soccer team to include the 'minority' catholic players?

**** the song, and **** David **** Humphreys...

[Duncan Gardner]

As for changing the anthem. Give us a 32 county state and that's when it needs to be changed. Presently the country is defined by its historical conflict with Britain and people can do whatever they want to pretend otherwiseNo, keep the anthem. I quite like it sung in Irish :)

Can't see how the red hand is 'sectarian'. If that's the case the GAA must be collusion with loyalist paramilitaries. Just another complete overreaction. Typical uni bods: more time than senseStop being such an Orange apologist, Lopez :)
could you see the IFA changing the national anthem of the soccer team to include the 'minority' catholic players?

**** the song, and **** David **** Humphreys... Top political analysis there, gyp. You da man. If the IFA change at all, it's likely to be an effort to stress our difference from England, not something nationalists would see as tokenism.

[Cowboy]

The Barney song has the same aspects, and it's got better lyrics - 'I love you, you love me...', heck it works better than the one Coulter inflicted on us...

classic, best laugh i've had all day :D

[sylvo]

Check out this week's Private Eye. It's got the headline 'Nazi Gaffe Shock' with a picture of Hitler saying 'I've come as Prince Harry.' Dunno what all the hassle is over Hazza and his uniform. He's half German aint he? Erm, no I forgot, his father's James Hewitt. :eek:


He's the only total inguurrliish one out of the lot of them. ;)

[anto eile]

Even in the Cork Gaeltacht I feel an eejit ordering anything in a shop or pub in Irish. I asked for 'uisce' in a pub and got offered a whiskey FFS. In fact it seems that Irish is wheeled out only when it is needed to talk behind the backs of those that don't speak it, than anything else.

As for changing the anthem. Give us a 32 county state and that's when it needs to be changed. Presently the country is defined by its historical conflict with Britain and people can do whatever they want to pretend otherwise.

usice is water, fuisce is whiskey, an easy mistake. like ordering bulmers and getting bud.happens to me a lot

a nation once again is not appropriate, not until we actually are a nation once again, 32 counties.and id object to a national anthem in english.

the irish are as much to blame as the english for the decline of the irish language

[anto eile]

roinnt ceartúcháin daoibh

For those looking to learning and for those not looking to learn it (its your duty :mad: )

Amhrán Na bhFiann (with pronunciation)

Sinne Fianna Fáil, (Shin na Feeana fall)
Atá Fé gheall ag Éirinn, (A-taw fay gyal egg air-in)
Buidhean dár sluagh thar toinn do ráinig chughainn (bween dor slooa, har tin duh raw-nig khuwn.)
Fé mhoíd bheith saor, (Fwee vod veh sair)
Sean-tír ár sinnsear feasta (shan teer awr shin-sher fas-ta)
Ní fágfar fé'n tíorán ná fé'n tráil; (nee fawg-ferr fween tear-on naw fween trawl)
Anocht a théim sa bhearna baoghail, (ah-nocht ah hay-im sah varna vweel)
Le gean ar Gaedheal chun báis nó saoil, (le gyan ar Gwail khun bosh no sayl)
Le gunna sgréach:fé lamhach na bpiléar. (le gun-ah shkraykh fay law-voc na bill-air)
Seo Libh canaidh amhrán na bhFiann. (shuh liv konig Aw-rawn na veen)

now arent i pedantic

[anto eile]

actually whiskey is known as uisce beatha (the water of life) and I've often heard older guys just calling it just uisce. When they saw Lopez (hard looking that he is :-) ) they must have assumed no way he's be ordering water :-)

uisce beatha or fuisce