Shamrock Rovers takeover bid.

[nigel-harps1954]

Seen this posted elsewhere, and while I'd never really trust anything posted in the Sun, this is quite an interesting story.

Things like this never really end well for Irish clubs.

http://www.thesun.ie/irishsol/homepage/sport/7012450/London-based-consortium-is-aiming-to-take-over-Shamrock-Rovers.html

[FallenSaint]

I heard they unanimously accepted the proposal by the guy who's a member today.

[Dalymountrower]

I heard they unanimously accepted the proposal by the guy who's a member today.

Is that the Australian connection.? Former major shareholder in scheister usury/vulture fund "Pepper".? Is that why the celebratory distress flare was fired in the stand last night.
Also heard that the Clondalkin branch of Wells Fargo was also interested, but that ended up in pieces..

[disgruntled]

Time to sell your soul ;)
Bet the little man will be happy.
Good luck guys.

[fionnsci]

I don't see what could really go too wrong. It's only a 50% share so they won't be able to run the club into the ground. They don't own their ground so they can't be ruined in that regard. They get their investment and West Ham get their benefit too. Win/win?

[Nesta99]

Yes it worked out superbly for Home Farm/Everton. We often bemoan that lack of major businessmen willing to take a punt on a League of Ireland club and see how it goes (not chancers asset stripping or on a land grab) but when it looks like it might be happening quite a few of us are a bit 'Oooooh dunno about that, never works out well!' including myself too tbh but maybe its because its Rovers.

[placid casual]

correctamundo Nesta.
its more hope than expectation!:eek:

[Pablo Escobar]

It sounds like Arkaga's plan when they took us over......how could this possibly go wrong!?

Seriously though, investments are generally made with a view to making a return. You can't do that with those figures in this league without breaking into the serious stages in Europe. We all know the difficulties and risks attached to that. A prudent investor would surely cast major doubt on such "investment".

[Dodge]

Yes it worked out superbly for Home Farm/Everton. We often bemoan that lack of major businessmen willing to take a punt on a League of Ireland club and see how it goes (not chancers asset stripping or on a land grab) but when it looks like it might be happening quite a few of us are a bit 'Oooooh dunno about that, never works out well!' including myself too tbh but maybe its because its Rovers.

Rovers have just given away half their club for a loan of €1.5m. So if there's to be any investment, what will they be expected to give up?

[Nesta99]

Panic after losing to Pats? Nutsy always could get money out of club boards, Bohs selling Dalymount funded him that time but now he has the club selling half of itself, he is some boyo....

[Charlie Darwin]

Is that the Australian connection.? Former major shareholder in scheister usury/vulture fund "Pepper".? Is that why the celebratory distress flare was fired in the stand last night.
Also heard that the Clondalkin branch of Wells Fargo was also interested, but that ended up in pieces..
Ray Wilson. He's Irish but works for Pepper in Australia.

Not sure where the West Ham stuff is coming from. If they want to invest in the club there won't be much equity left for the members to sell.

[Dalymountrower]

Panic after losing to Pats? Nutsy always could get money out of club boards, Bohs selling Dalymount funded him that time but now he has the club selling half of itself, he is some boyo....
PF took the job after that "deal"for Dalymount.
With money sloshing around Rovers (again) I wonder whether SDCC will start charging a commercial rate for their stadium.?

[WeAreRovers]

Rovers have just given away half their club for a loan of €1.5m. So if there's to be any investment, what will they be expected to give up?

Not actually correct. Loath as I am to give non-Rovers fans the time of day on here, misinformation can be damaging and this is incorrect. Suffice to say the membership who actually have the details are very happy.

And as ever as an FYI Charlie Darwin knows less about Rovers than the Dalymount Cat and is not to be taken as representative of Rovers fans.

And everything else is just gossip and guesswork. :p

[mrtndvn]

Not actually correct. Loath as I am to give non-Rovers fans the time of day on here, misinformation can be damaging and this is incorrect. Suffice to say the membership who actually have the details are very happy.

And as ever as an FYI Charlie Darwin knows less about Rovers than the Dalymount Cat and is not to be taken as representative of Rovers fans.

And everything else is just gossip and guesswork. :p

Which part of this isn't true?

Rovers will receive a loan of 1.5 million euros from the Wilson family trust and Seamus Draws.

The Wilson trust's holding in Rovers increases to 50%.

If in the event the loan is repaid in 10 years, his stake dilutes to 25%. If the loan isn't repaid, he will sit down and negotiate.

He will become a member of the board, and will also appoint three other members, Stephen Gleeson and Micky O’Rourke being two.

[Dodge]

Suffice to say the membership who actually have the details are very happy.


Well yeah, they voted overwhelmingly for it.

[ThePrisoner]

It may well be the case that this is a rescue job rather than what it is painted to be.

Look at the filed accounts for recent years.

2013 a loss of €265,510
2014 a loss of €432,284
2015 accounts not filed yet. Profit or loss?

At November 2014 accumulated losses were €508,685. The share capital and share premium accounts are totally eroded by the losses at November, 2014.

What did November 2015 show? I'd wager another loss and increase in accumulated losses.

At some stage the losses have to be made good and/or dealt with.

So all the EUFA money and the profits earned from the Europa League are well and truly spent with not a lot to show for it.

[Dodge]

Well to be fair, Rovers fans were told of the losses, and that part of the new group's money was going on debts

[Dalymountrower]

I heard that the loan/gift was substantially more than 1.5 million.? It will need to be if the Prisoners figures quoted above are accurate and if their annual operating costs are over 1.5 mill as it is.

Shows up what a precarious model a fans owned club can be If Rovers can`t make a go of it.

[RathfarnhamHoop]

Just wondering where you are getting the rovers finances from? Seen consistent numbers on a few forums and stuff but can find them for free to see in full so any link would be greatly appreciated.
I thought I saw an article (The Herald I think) saying Rovers were 600k in black as of 2014 but I could be wrong.
2014 we had 2 teams so if your numbers are correct that probably has a lot to do with it.

where do the accumulated losses of €508,685 come from? No way at the start of 2013 we only had 100k in the bank or was 2012 that bad? I know Kenny cost a lot but surely we cant have spend the million or so Europa league money that quickly?

2015 I think might be a year where we break even with only one team, a smaller squad so in theory less money on wages, and the European money.

[White Horse]

Shows up what a precarious model a fans owned club can be If Rovers can`t make a go of it.

There is no guarantee that fans will make better decisions that owners.

[ThePrisoner]

Just wondering where you are getting the rovers finances from? Seen consistent numbers on a few forums and stuff but can find them for free to see in full so any link would be greatly appreciated.
I thought I saw an article (The Herald I think) saying Rovers were 600k in black as of 2014 but I could be wrong.
2014 we had 2 teams so if your numbers are correct that probably has a lot to do with it.

where do the accumulated losses of €508,685 come from? No way at the start of 2013 we only had 100k in the bank or was 2012 that bad? I know Kenny cost a lot but surely we cant have spend the million or so Europa league money that quickly?

2015 I think might be a year where we break even with only one team, a smaller squad so in theory less money on wages, and the European money.

I'm getting the figures from the filed accounts. I can't post them here so go to cro.ie and do a search on company number 245954.

A word of caution regarding newspaper articles and the likes: in a lot of cases the journalists basically haven't a clue how to read a set of accounts, do comparatives, draw reasonable conclusions and write an informed article.

Looking over the recent filed accounts the only figure that is in the ballpark of €600k is the current assets figure at November 2012 - €665,739. The largest figure in this category is debtors at €511,847. There is no breakdown given of the €511,847 but I would be of the opinion that it is substantially Europa League money.

I have no information on the Kenny situation.

The figure of €508,685 for accumulated losses at November 2014 is per the balance sheet.

The bank and debtors figures are as follows:
Nov 2010 €13,753 €447,028
Nov 2011 €769,584 €369,640
Nov 2012 €153,381 €511,847
Nov 2013 €85,962 €311,562
Nov 2014 €32,038 €120,334

So yes, the Europa League money is gone.

As I posted earlier, the 2015 accounts are not due to be filed yet so I have no figures. You can draw your own conclusions from the 'investment' that other posters have referred to.

In relation to your point on the 2 teams in 2014, whilst there would have been a cost running a second team you also have to factor in the receipts from the FAI/Liverpool match. I don't have the figures for it and I don't want to reopen the discussion other than to bring it to your attention.

[Ezeikial]

Shows up what a precarious model a fans owned club can be If Rovers can`t make a go of it.

Of course it works both ways - fans can be be owners, and owners can be fans.

There is no guarantee of the right decisions either way

[Nesta99]

12 months from November 2011 to 2012 fairly decimated cash reserves. No matter how its presented there has been unsustainable year on year losses that were covered over by by a good European run, that prize money has run out so this is a bailout really. Not that that is unusual in LoI. The lender requiring 3 seats on the board and equal equity with the membership would indicate that he wants to steady the ship in some way and protect his loan money from squandering. He can essentially veto the membership now with his 50% as will the entire other 50% always agree with each other? If he is prudent and Rovers have a mediocre season by Rovers fans' standards Fenlon may end up really cutting his cloth.

[RathfarnhamHoop]

Thanks for replying in such detail!
pretty disappointed we managed to more or less waste all that money.
Hopefully not all of it went on wages, paying off managers, etc and some of it went on things like roadstone development and the new stand fund.

[WeAreRovers]

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/soccer/shamrock-rovers-look-to-the-future-after-sealing-new-deal-1.2583521

[micls]

There is no guarantee that fans will make better decisions that owners.

While that's true, there's more liklihood in a large group that the moderate/sensible voices will temper the crazies. If you've got one owner, and he turns out to be a nutjob (Tom Coughlan), the club is ****ed. If you've 200 owners and a few of them are nutjobs, the club will likely survive.

[Dalymountrower]

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/soccer/shamrock-rovers-look-to-the-future-after-sealing-new-deal-1.2583521

It`s certainly a positive that there is to be investment in the training infrastructure for young players. The existing schoolboy clubs aided and abetted by their allies in the FAI will oppose any move to interfere in their racket of exporting young talented players (too early) to England.Good luck to Rovers in breaking up that monopoly.

[Charlie Darwin]

The Sun are reporting the West Ham consortium have talked to Pats too. Starting to think somebody's on a wind-up with that one.

[Ezeikial]

While that's true, there's more liklihood in a large group that the moderate/sensible voices will temper the crazies.

Some would argue that exactly the opposite is the case. Especially if the debate hinges on spending more in pursuit of glory.

[El-Pietro]

Some would argue that exactly the opposite is the case. Especially if the debate hinges on spending more in pursuit of glory.

I can't speak for other clubs, and I certainly can't say what will happen 10, 20 years from now, but at our club we've been burnt before and the majority of the membership is cautious at this point.

[ThePrisoner]

The Sun are reporting the West Ham consortium have talked to Pats too. Starting to think somebody's on a wind-up with that one.

There's probably a bit of truth in this story, be it Pats or Shams.

You can rest assured that the only interest of the UK clubs is the their own.

[sundance kid]

The Sun are reporting the West Ham consortium have talked to Pats too. Starting to think somebody's on a wind-up with that one.

Just shows that idiot journalists like Neil O'Riordan will believe any old nonsense and write about it, without any direct quotes from people involved with West Ham, Sullivan or Shamrock Rovers. Then when Rovers say there's absolutely no truth in it, or contact from either west ham or sullivan, he repeats the story, again with no direct quotes from the people involved. Sickening that a WUM like him is getting away with conning a wage writing about football in this country.

[Yossarian]

Just shows that idiot journalists like Neil O'Riordan will believe any old nonsense and write about it, without any direct quotes from people involved with West Ham, Sullivan or Shamrock Rovers. Then when Rovers say there's absolutely no truth in it, or contact from either west ham or sullivan, he repeats the story, again with no direct quotes from the people involved. Sickening that a WUM like him is getting away with conning a wage writing about football in this country.

Do you not realise that this is how most football stories work, not just in Ireland but all over. Stories get leaked all the time to journalists on the basis of no direct quotes. It doesn't mean there's no truth to the story. I happen to think O'Riordan and all the journalists covering the league here do a pretty good job.

[sundance kid]

There was never any truth to the story, and thankfully the rovers membership knew this. Its Pats turn now apparently, after rovers, who never spoke to anybody turned them down.

[Calcio Jack]

The actual facts are : agents on behalf of a two Premiership clubs made an approach to the Rovers board but didn't disclose the names of their clients - the Rovers board declined to engage with them. So there is some basis to this story albeit no confirmation as to whether WHU were one of the clubs

[Nesta99]

The old adage that somewhere in the middle lies the truth!

[Charlie Darwin]

I'd guess it's probably an Irish-based agent with links to clubs in England flying some kites. O'Riordan's a good journalist but papers don't refuse ink, etc.

[Ezeikial]

Shamrock Rovers F.C. is pleased to announce the appointment of Brendan Murray as Chief Executive Officer.

http://www.shamrockrovers.ie/news/latest-news/4264-ceo-appointment

Where does that leave Jonathan Roche's man Noel Byrne?

[sundance kid]

http://www.shamrockrovers.ie/news/latest-news/4264-ceo-appointment

Where does that leave Jonathan Roche's man Noel Byrne?

What does the CEO position have to do with Noel Byrne?????????

[Ezeikial]

What does the CEO position have to do with Noel Byrne?????????

That is the question I am asking....

Will the new Chief Executive Officer appointment have any impact on the current General Manager.

Will Noel Byrne be staying on as full time General Manager & Club Secretary?
If he is, will some of his job functions now be assumed by the new CEO?

[Ezeikial]

What does the CEO position have to do with Noel Byrne?????????


That is the question I am asking....

Will the new Chief Executive Officer appointment have any impact on the current General Manager.

Will Noel Byrne be staying on as full time General Manager & Club Secretary?
If he is, will some of his job functions now be assumed by the new CEO?

You are not alone sundance - extratime.ie does not know either....

I wonder does Noel Byrne know?


Shamrock Rovers have announced the appointment of Brendan Murray as Chief Executive Officer, in what is a newly created position at the football club. Murray assumes the role at the Tallaght club following a career in corporate finance, beginning his career in 2007 with KPMG, before taking up a senior position with private equity firm FL Partners.


http://extratime.ie/newsdesk/articles/16600/shamrock-rovers-appoint-brendan-murray-as-ceo/