Epl 2014/5

[OwlsFan]

Although I am more interested in the Championship, I thought I had better start a thread as the wall to wall coverage had begun. Apparently it is huge news that Suarez sent his former manager a text wishing Liverpool all the best for the new season. I would have thought it would have been news if he didn't.

Champions: Man City
2nd/4th Chelsea, Arsenal and Man Utd
Relegated: Burnley, QPR and usually one existing goes down: Palace although there are a lot of other mediocre sides.

Championship - up for grabs. Awash with recent ex-Premiership sides that never made it back: Birmingham/Blackburn/Bolton/Wigan/Middlesbrough/Reading/Wolves to name but a few. If you don't bounce back the first year, it gets a lot harder.

[Eminence Grise]

Apparently it is huge news that Suarez sent his former manager a text wishing Liverpool all the best for the new season. I would have thought it would have been news if he didn't.

Something like a 'man bites dog' headline, you mean?:bigsmile:

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Why the hell are Man Utd fans getting so worked up about Nani's wages being paid in full during his loan spell in Lisbon? I would be more concerned about the fact that they are still tapping up players and encouraging them to revolt so they can force a transfer through, like what happened with Marcos Rojo; and Eric Dier at Tottenham.

[BonnieShels]

If I was a Man Utd fan I wouldn't give two s**ts about "tapping up". United are still not quite at the Bayern Munich level of "tapping up".

[Closed Account 2]

Talking of Bayern "tapping up" did you see this:

http://www.fourfourtwo.com/features/new-dortmund-signing-given-bayern-shirt-save-time

Apparently Bayern are trying to take legal action because of the article.

[BonnieShels]

That's almost not funny...

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

The downfall of Serie A is really something else.

Liverpool sell Luis Suarez for 65m. Mario Balotelli is set to sign for Liverpool for 16m? What kind of way is this to run a football club? Liverpool are guaranteed to make a profit of at least double that. If Rodgers does a better job of nurturing his talent than Allegri, Seedorf and Inzaghi - he could well end up leaving Liverpool for upwards of 40m.

Who else in Milan's squad would command a fee anywhere near 16m?

Serie A is like a graveyard for top footballers now - Robinho, Kaka, Vidic, Evra. Even the standard of young footballers Milan are signing are rubbish! Pablo Armero wasn't good enough for West Ham and now he's signing for Milan! Who next? Julien Faubert?

It's sad when Ashley Cole looks like one of the best Serie A signings of the summer. I just hope that Juve can at least keep Pogba and Vidal; but even if they do, that will just make the League even more un-competitive than it already is.

[Stuttgart88]

Italian football has been mismanaged beyond belief. Cronyism and corruption are only the start of it. Grounds are generally awful municipally owned multi-purpose venues devoid of any atmosphere. In an era when sale of overseas TV rights makes an enormous difference there's very little in the Italian product that stacks up well with the English, German and Spanish leagues.

[BonnieShels]

I attempted on several occasions last year to watch some Serie A and my word it is a tough watch. People complain about the LOI or Scotland but most games in Italy feel like reserve matches.

[Charlie Darwin]

If Rodgers does a better job of nurturing his talent than Allegri, Seedorf and Inzaghi - he could well end up leaving Liverpool for upwards of 40m.
Or Mourinho, or Mancini. The manager who can get the best out of Balotelli will be the biggest genius on the planet.

[Stuttgart88]

His pivotal role in that Aguerro goal against QPR is often overlooked.

Brilliant talent but Conor Sammon would have done a far better job against Costa Rica and Uruguay in June.

Part of me thinks that this is Liverpool's way of seizing the global media initiative and showing them as a club on the up and United as a club in decline. All the "scousers" in Sandymount, Singapore and Sacramento will like this one.

[Charlie Darwin]

Don't be silly, Stutts, Singapore and Sacramento aren't in Liverpool.

[DannyInvincible]

Liverpool sell Luis Suarez for 65m. Mario Balotelli is set to sign for Liverpool for 16m? What kind of way is this to run a football club? Liverpool are guaranteed to make a profit of at least double that. If Rodgers does a better job of nurturing his talent than Allegri, Seedorf and Inzaghi - he could well end up leaving Liverpool for upwards of 40m.

Balotelli is a shrewd money-ball signing: " Buy players with personal problems at a discount; then help them deal with their problems."

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/other-soccer/harry-redknapp-on-malky-mackay-he-hasnt-murdered-anyone-he-hasnt-raped-anyone-and-he-is-not-a-paedophile-30528548.html

Harry Redknapp - Everyone is racist, bigoted, sexist and homophobic; leave Malky alone.

[DannyInvincible]

Redknapp's clearly a bit of a dolt too then. That the League Managers' Association attempted to defend Mackay's exchanges as "friendly text message banter" is simply extraordinary: http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/aug/21/malky-mackay-texts-iain-moody-friendly-banter-league-managers-association

[Eminence Grise]

Releasing a statement using ‘banter’ as a defence is enough to say that the writer isn’t up to their job. But has anybody seen the messages, though? I don’t think any media outlet has published them. Britain tends to be a bit more strait-laced than we are when it comes to taking offense, so it can be hard to gauge how bad they were. Now, what Mackay texted may be so vile it’s unrepeatable, in which case he deserves everything coming to him. But, without wishing to trivialise things, it may equally be that the texts are glib, ill-judged and capable of causing offence without any being intended – in which case he should be damned for his stupidity, but not vilified. Hell, if I were presented with a record of all my mails and texts (and even posts here!) I’d have to confess that a few would be dodgy enough.

[DannyInvincible]

The Daily Mail published the messages exchanged between Mackay and Iain Moody, although I'm not 100 per cent sure which were the three incriminating ones sent by Mackay: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2731658/LMA-issue-apology-Malky-Mackay-friendly-text-message-banter-statement.html


'Fkn chinkys. Fk it. There's enough dogs in Cardiff for us all to go around.'
On the arrival of South Korean international Kim Bo-Kyung

'Go on, fat Phil. Nothing like a Jew that sees money slipping through his fingers'
On football agent Phil Smith

'He's a snake, a gay snake. Not to be trusted'
On an official of another club

'Not many white faces amongst that lot but worth considering.'
On a list of potential signings

'I hope she's looking after your needs. I bet you'd love a bounce on her falsies.'
On a player's female agent

A picture entitled Black Monopoly (where every square was a "Go to Jail" square)
Sent to members of Cardiff's staff

The initial LMA statement on his behalf stated that Mackay specifically denied having sent homophobic or sexist messages, so perhaps those with racist/anti-Semitic content were his.

The Daily Mail published some responses from those concerned here: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2731219/Malky-Mackay-s-text-message-victims-What-said-response-followed.html

[ArdeeBhoy]

Hmm, The Daily Fail make Mackay & Redknapp look like Franciscan monks by comparison, when it comes to double standards.

[DannyInvincible]

Why are Cardiff City so bothered and seemingly determined to tarnish Mackay's name when he no longer has anything to do with them? They reported Mackay to the FA for misconduct months after he was dismissed and then a selection of incriminating text messages get leaked as Mackay looks a dead cert to take the Crystal Palace job. They've also been very vocal about the inappropriate nature of the LMA's original statement. I highly doubt it's because they're benevolent moral crusaders... Is it Vincent Tan's way of getting some sort of revenge on Mackay for Cardiff's relegation and the alleged over-spending? Tan seems to be an utterly poisonous figure. If I was a cynic, I'd guess that Mackay's apology to Tan and the dropping of his legal claim for wrongful dismissal back in May (http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/former-cardiff-city-manager-malky-7094557) was as a consequence of a threat from Tan to reveal something incriminating if legal action was pursued.

Whilst the content of those three messages (out of 10,000) to which he has admitted sending is pretty damning and indefensible, Mackay seems like an otherwise decent man whose become victim of a nasty and malicious smear campaign.

[Charlie Darwin]

It's not cynical Danny, it's what happened. Mackay dropped his lawsuit and apologised in order to keep the texts and emails from being released to the media. Tan apparently said he'd keep them to himself as long as Mackay told the FA about them (I don't know exactly why) and when he didn't, he reported them to the FA, and somehow it got out to the media. Mackay has spent the last few months trying to get an injunction to stop them being published.

[Eminence Grise]

Those messages cross the line alright. Nothing glib or inadvertently offensive them at all. Mackay will find it hard to rebuild his reputation. Tan isn't coming up smelling of roses either though: if I get you right, CD, he seems to have held out the threat of exposure (blackmail by any other word) to force Mackay to drop a lawsuit. What's that old saying - revenge is a dish best served cold?

[Charlie Darwin]

Haha, it hasn't finished EG. Convenient the timing here, hours after Mackay apologised for the texts that were leaked out, more have emerged. Mackay apparently referred to Tan as a chink, and Moody makes reference to Mackay being a racist: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2732188/Malky-Mackay-called-Cardiff-City-Malaysian-owner-Vincent-Tan-chink.html

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

A week later came another illuminating exchange, offering what appears to be a startling observation about Mackay. At the time, Mackay was concerned that a player they were pursuing had been linked with a rival club. He relayed his feelings to Moody, who replied: ‘He told me he had an offer to go there but will never accept because the manager is a racist. Thankfully he hasn’t met you.’

Harry Redknapp?

Also, on what planet is it acceptable to blow off steam by referring to people as "chinks" and "*******"?

[DannyInvincible]

Hmm, I'll maybe retract that "decent man" hunch for now...


Mackay apparently referred to Tan as a chink

The most ignorant form of racism; if one must be racist, must they further humiliate themselves and be such a lunkhead so as to be geographically inaccurate and unaware of which ethnic group they're actually trying to insult?

[Charlie Darwin]

I doubt it's Redknapp as they were never in the same division so wouldn't be competing for players like that, but I don't think you could speculate who it is since a) even if we knew the player, we wouldn't know who the other club is and b) there are probably a few racist managers around.

[bennocelt]

Who sends that kind of banter as a text message though? Fair enuff if it was said with mates and all but actually sending it off as texts, that takes a little more thought. A little more mind!

[Stuttgart88]

You'd never get racist or antii-Semetic content in GAA texts or social media :) What was that idiot thinking?

I wonder how the Mackay texts got into the public realm?

What annoys me most about this episode is that these two are among the younger guys on the circuit. Football can't be expected to rid itself of old dinosaurs who grew up in a less enlightened time but Mackay is in his 40s. He's younger than me I think. Nobody my age finds this stuff even borderline acceptable anymore. Mackay needs to sit down with The Duke of Edinburgh for a lesson on contemporary political correctness.

[DannyInvincible]

The Daily Mail (Sportsmail) broke the news of the exchanges as an "exclusive" and claim to have been involved in "months of investigation": http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2730307/Malky-Mackay-Iain-Moody-investigated-FA-sexist-racist-homophobic-text-messages-time-Cardiff.html


After months of investigation, Sportsmail can reveal the details of two letters sent to the FA outlining explicit and offensive texts.

These messages came to light after a dawn raid on Moody’s south London home in March this year, as part of Cardiff’s £750,000 investigation into eight controversial transfers.

They engaged London law firm Mishcon de Reya, whose investigators obtained a search order from the High Court to enter Moody’s house in Balham, seizing work computers and phones and taking electronic imagery of evidence.

They were investigating alleged wrongdoing related to one of these transfers.

Around 70,000 text messages and 100,000 emails were allegedly recovered, including the text and email exchanges that form the basis of letters sent to the FA by Mishcon de Reya, on behalf of Cardiff.

Under FA rules, Cardiff are required to report any matters which may constitute ‘aggravated misconduct’.

The letters to the FA make reference to the following alleged offensive communications between Moody, Mackay and others:

Although Cardiff deny having had anything to do with the exchanges becoming public, the Daily Mail must have had an insider at either the club or FA leaking info.

[OwlsFan]

To me the most disappointing thing about the EPL this season was the sale by Southampton of half of their promising side and the departure of their manager. Is this how it is to continue to go. The ambition of the medium sized clubs is purely to survive in the EPL and feed the bigger clubs? Southampton had a chance to kick on and perhaps compete for a CL spot or at worst a Europa league position. Instead they decided to sell the crown jewels and once again dwell among the also-rans. Perhaps that's why they sent the reserve side out in the FA Cup quarter final: to preserve their assets. Unless you have the backing of a billionaire, it looks as if there is no hope for the medium sized clubs. The days of Forest and Villa winning leagues and European Cups are well and truly gone if that is to be the attitude.

Now when is that Azerbaijani billionaire going to complete his take-over of the Owls?

[Stuttgart88]

They did have a billionaire owner but he died. His daughter is in charge now and the club seems to be run by a cabale of dodgy spivs and misfits. My recollection is that they had huge debts from their earlier EPL days and some of these sales are a result of previous over exuberance. However, their academy seems very strong and they will always be a selling club. It has always been thus, except that instead of the big buyers being Italy, the biggest buyer now is the EPL - outside of Spain of course. The days of Forest and Villa winning European Cups is long gone anyway. Even Ajax is a non-entity in today's market.

Some criticise FFP as being the cause of this behaviour, but without FFP you get more clubs like Southampton going bust.

[Charlie Darwin]

I don't think anybody knows how FFP will play out but I think there's a reasonably good chance it will help lower teams out rather than slamming the door shut. It should, at the very least, stop so many clubs from dicing with death, and for the teams who can no longer look forward to being taken over by a benefactor, hopefully it will encourage more innovation on the still massively undervalued commercial side of football.

[Closed Account 2]

MK Dons did well to avoid a cup upset last night.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Can someone explain to me how Man Utd are allowed to spend, potentially, a combined £150m on Rojo, Di Maria and Falcao in the space of a few weeks?

Do the financial fair play rules apply to PSG but not to English clubs?

I'd love to know where the money is coming from because - apart from the new players - there is barely any sell on value in any players at that club apart from Rooney, and that is dwindling fast.

[NeverFeltBetter]

Falcao looks like a loan move, so dial the price of that way back. New sponsorships agreements have also injected a lot of cash in the club in the last few months.

[Stuttgart88]

Can someone explain to me how Man Utd are allowed to spend, potentially, a combined £150m on Rojo, Di Maria and Falcao in the space of a few weeks?

Do the financial fair play rules apply to PSG but not to English clubs?

I'd love to know where the money is coming from because - apart from the new players - there is barely any sell on value in any players at that club apart from Rooney, and that is dwindling fast.
Man City got sanctioned too.

United still can cover the FFP regulations from existing cash flow despite their high debt service costs. This debt was not related to any investment in infrastructure so the servicing counts fully towards their FFP number.

Falcao is indeed a loan move but as a loan move any fee paid to Monaco must be accounted for in one years's accounting period. But, the FFP breakeven assessment is carried out on a 3 year rolling basis, so any affect on the current season's finances can be blended into the previous two seasons or future seasons.

Even if a player cost 50 million (say) the impact on any season's expenditure column is probably only 10million as a player's transfer cost is amortised on a straight line basis over the life of his contract. Wages obviously impact things too, of course.

So Rojo and DiMaria's transfer costs don't hit the bottom line immediately, and the annual impact can be offset by past and future' years' results because of the 3 year rolling effect. So, without looking at Man United's accounts my guess is they have enough of a cushion from the last two years, plus they can take a bit of time to offload high wage costs and sell players.

Remember also that their commercial income is rising.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Falcao's going to cost £6 million for the season, presumably his wages...

[NeverFeltBetter]

There are reports that the first year of Falcao's deal is a loan expressly because of FFP, and a much larger long term deal has been agreed to make him an official Manchester United player in 2015.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Aye, £51 million !!!

[Charlie Darwin]

So almost £60m all-in when you factor in agent payments, etc. His wages alone will be £10m a year.

[ArdeeBhoy]

This year is a bargain then...

[Stuttgart88]

I think EPL players' agents earn more together in one year than the RFU does. Or very close anyway.

[OwlsFan]

Much and all as I hate Pardew's post game "referee is at fault" rants, he made a point that all the time wasting had been by Crystal Palace until Newcastle scored on very late in the game. Thus the Palace equaliser was in the injury time added due to their time wasting. Is this fair? However, the flaw in his argument is that the half would only have lasted 40 minutes if the Palace time wasting was not added on. So in theory Newcastle scored in the 40th minute and Palace in the 45th if the time wasting was taken off.

Apropos nothing, Rolando Aarons has apparently replaced Gary Ablett in the alphabetical list of Premiership scorers.

[The Fly]

http://i.imgur.com/YVyJeq1.gif

[osarusan]

Rooney finds out Falcao is getting paid more than him. (https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfa1/v/t1.0-9/1653279_10152272412096814_333819773134419502_n.jpg ?oh=ee282d3ebaa5b8176baf7169170d075e&oe=54720FEB&__gda__=1417559005_97d6141a7d51e84783201d031c69f55 0)



(stolen from Facebook)

[DannyInvincible]

There are reports that the first year of Falcao's deal is a loan expressly because of FFP, and a much larger long term deal has been agreed to make him an official Manchester United player in 2015.

I happened to have a read of this piece on the Daily Mail site* on the increasing prevalence of unusual loan arrangements and was absolutely staggered by its apparent naivety. I'm pretty sure Adrian Durham is one of the Daily Mail's primary football writers - the site even boasts itself to be "sports website of the year" - but he seemed to be completely oblivious of the impact that FFP has had on this transfer window and the favoured method of "transfer" for big-spending clubs in many cases: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2740400/The-loan-window-getting-hand-clubs-like-Liverpool-far-big-borrowing-players.html


I hate the loan system. This window has seen some bizarre deals – loans with a view to a permanent signing, loans with an obligation to sign permanently, a two-year loan deal, loans between Premier League clubs, and loans with the club sending the player out STILL paying his wages.

Supporting a club is belonging to a club, being part of a club. The team representing that club goes on to the field and can generate passions and memories that very few other things in life can bring.

I don’t expect the players to have the same love and support for a club that the fans have. But I do expect commitment for all the time they are there.

At a time when, at the top level of our game, players have become so distant from fans, the plethora of loans sadly increase that distance.

Sunderland signed two players on loan on deadline day – Sebastian Coates from Liverpool, and Ricardo Alvarez from Inter Milan. I’ve no reason to doubt they will both put in 100 per cent when asked to play for their ‘temporary’ club.

But ultimately these players don’t belong to Sunderland. They’re not as committed to the club, because they don’t belong there.

The same applies to all loans, although the bizarre nature of Alvaro Negredo’s ‘loan’ switch from Manchester City to Valencia is a bit different. He’s joined on loan, but at the end of his year-long stay back in Spain, Valencia are obliged to buy him from City.

So why not just buy him now?

And what’s to stop Valencia carrying out their obligation of signing him permanently next summer, but then immediately selling him on to a Premier League club, possibly one of City’s rivals?

In this case, the commitment of Valencia to the player is questionable.

Players loaned between Premier League clubs simply shouldn’t be allowed. The only exceptions should be Under 21s – loan moves for Jack Wilshere, Daniel Sturridge and, long before that, David Beckham proved fruitful.

But on deadline day Gaston Ramirez, an international who set up Uruguay’s winning goal against Italy to take them through the group stage in Brazil, a player who was Southampton’s record signing only two years ago, a ‘statement’ signing after the club’s fantastic rise from the depths of League One back to the Premier League, joined top-flight rivals Hull City on a season-long loan.

It’s a clever move from Steve Bruce – his record signing Abel Hernandez was also at the World Cup with Uruguay. The £9.5million striker might settle in quicker with a familiar face close by.

Having lived in Hull I can see where Bruce is coming from with that thinking.

But one Premier League club borrowing a World Cup player from another Premier League club is just wrong. If you want him – buy him.

If you can’t afford to buy him, then don’t buy him. Loans like these can sometimes depend on which managers or chairmen are friendly with each other – this isn’t how football should work.

...

Some loans are understandable – Radamel Falcao’s serious injury that forced him to miss the World Cup would be enough to make any club want to ‘try before they buy.’

A serious glut of injuries, or the sudden departure of a key player, might also lead to loan moves. Some temporary transfers are understandable, but generally I’m not in favour of loans.

...

He didn't mention FFP once in the piece, so it obviously hadn't struck him that it's a primary motivating factor in what he merely comprehends as "bizarre" or inexplicable arrangements. I just thought it a bit strange that a professional football writer wouldn't spot something so obvious. It's embarrassingly imperceptive. What else could have triggered such an odd spate of "transfer" agreements?

*I have to resort to it sometimes as it's one of the few sites uncensored in work, I swear!

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

It's going to be a long hard slog of a season for Man Utd. Top heavy with talent but a staggering lack of depth at the back and then there is the Rooney conundrum.

3-3 at the moment with Leicester.

[NeverFeltBetter]

The way that Van Gaal and Woodward have approached the United defence is truly baffling. Between the recurring injury problems (must be some issue with the physio/training regime) and the steadfast refusal to bring in proper CB's to replace Ferdinand and Vidic, its already bad, but then you have this self-evident lack of confidence. The way some of them were hoofing balls away when 3-2 up defied belief.

Opposition teams have long since figured out that when something goes wrong they just panic, and its been happening since Alex Ferguson retired. Every time I see United play nowadays, I see their defenders getting hassled in possession, and struggling to deal with it.

[OwlsFan]

There I was going to post about the League Cup after the Liverpool vs Boro game that the Championship sides are as good if not better than the multi-million pound players who are in the Premiership squads - that was until Maine Road last night. Mind you Forest gave Spurs reserves a tough time and Bolton almost forced a draw against Chelsea.

[DannyInvincible]

This banner was displayed by anti-Pardew Newcastle fans today away to Swansea:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BzHNvpnIYAALLl_.jpg

[DannyInvincible]

Mourinho's lucky he didn't shake Van Gaal's hand early yesterday to head off down the tunnel; he'd have gotten serious football pie on his face. Would he even have dared to try something so disrespectful with his old buddy anyway?