Domestic Prospects

[SkStu]

Would love for this thread to be kept respectful as I think it could be a useful tool to promote awareness of home-based players who many posters here wouldn't be aware of.

Maybe some parameters of links to articles/blogs only?

Either way, here is an article by Aidan Fitzmaurice (Bohs fan) talking to Dean Delaney about the current crop of Bohs youngsters.

Well worth a read as these guys could be the Seamus Coleman's of tomorrow.

http://www.herald.ie/sport/soccer/green-shoots-29281055.html


"It might seem like a big statement to make about a player who is so young but I can see someone like Luke Byrne going on to play for the senior international team, I really do," he said.
...
keep telling these players that they are getting a great opportunity here at Bohemians. If they can get into the first team, do well and maintain some good form, it's a brilliant way to start their career.

[Crosby87]

Fitzmaurice. That's a great name.

[gastric]

Great idea and gives the likes of me an insight into the potential of players in the LOI. You have posted before about Luke Byrne, I think you have the hots for him!

[nigel-harps1954]

The obvious prospects for the international team are basically the lads recently selected for the under 21 team and training panel, along with the likes of Ronan Finn and Chris Forrester.

[CraftyToePoke]

Great thread.

I started one similar in the L.O.I section a few years ago, but I was hunted out of there under suspicion of being a UK spy and the thread would be the cause of more players being lost, despite loads of players having already gone over recently prior to this, without any thread to blame for it. It made me wonder if new people in L.O.I. grounds casually asking about players they have come to watch are subjected to the same wall of silence & suspicion, it's little wonder the keepers of the flame have the terraces largely to themselves.

David O'Leary at Limerick could play higher up. He always has that bit of time on the ball and continues to improve each time I get back to a game. I will look and see if I can link it but Brian Kerr was full of praise on a recent RTE broadcast. Vs Cork I think. Kerr was clearly surprised at how good O'Leary had been that day.

[CraftyToePoke]

The obvious prospects for the international team are basically the lads recently selected for the under 21 team and training panel, along with the likes of Ronan Finn and Chris Forrester.

You have mentioned a young LB at Harps before, Coll, maybe. Is he still with the club ? And how is he doing this year if so?

[nigel-harps1954]

Ciaran Coll is still at the club. Is most certainly capable of playing at a much, much higher level. Not sure about international prospects, but certainly capable of making it successfully across the water. A Seamus Coleman type full back.

[Charlie Darwin]

The obvious prospects for the international team are basically the lads recently selected for the under 21 team and training panel, along with the likes of Ronan Finn and Chris Forrester.
I'd say the next six months are make and break for Finn in that regard. He's the same age Fahey was going to Birmingham and he's never really progressed beyond the fringes for Ireland. The sky is the limit for Forrester but I still fear he'll end up in League One getting outmuscled by players with only a fraction of his talent.

[osarusan]

I started one similar in the L.O.I section a few years ago, but I was hunted out of there under suspicion of being a UK spy and the thread would be the cause of more players being lost, despite loads of players having already gone over recently prior to this, without any thread to blame for it. It made me wonder if new people in L.O.I. grounds casually asking about players they have come to watch are subjected to the same wall of silence & suspicion, it's little wonder the keepers of the flame have the terraces largely to themselves.

Is this a joke?

[dong]

I can't see Finn being good enough for anything above league 1 level in England. I'm judging this based on what I've seen of him in several matches over the past two seasons including games against us where he often struggles to compete with Joey Ndo who is 38 years old. The last game in Tallaght was the only time I've seen him really put it up to Ndo But he was only back from a long spell of injury in that game.

Id agree Forrester has serious talent as well as a few on that Bohs team if they keep developing. A lot of the time it's not the skill levels that are lacking just the physical strength to hold your own when you step up a level imo.

[Crosby87]

What about Shane Tracy on Limerick?

[Dodge]

I started one similar in the L.O.I section a few years ago, but I was hunted out of there under suspicion of being a UK spy and the thread would be the cause of more players being lost, despite loads of players having already gone over recently prior to this, without any thread to blame for it. It made me wonder if new people in L.O.I. grounds casually asking about players they have come to watch are subjected to the same wall of silence & suspicion, it's little wonder the keepers of the flame have the terraces largely to themselves.

Can you post a link to this thread please?

[Charlie Darwin]

I can't see Finn being good enough for anything above league 1 level in England. I'm judging this based on what I've seen of him in several matches over the past two seasons including games against us where he often struggles to compete with Joey Ndo who is 38 years old. The last game in Tallaght was the only time I've seen him really put it up to Ndo But he was only back from a long spell of injury in that game.

Id agree Forrester has serious talent as well as a few on that Bohs team if they keep developing. A lot of the time it's not the skill levels that are lacking just the physical strength to hold your own when you step up a level imo.
You could equally say the reason Ndo stands out in this league is his physical strength more than his individual skill, though he is undoubtedly very skillful as well. Finn just seems to have an awareness of what's around him and time on the ball that other players in the league don't have. I'd worry about Finn's physical prowess too, but I wondered the same about Fahey and he managed it.

[CraftyToePoke]

Can you post a link to this thread please?

http://foot.ie/threads/148393-This-Years-Crop-(Next-Batch-Bound-For-Cross-Channel-Clubs)

Big gang of thank you's for razor on outing the 'spy'.

Super.

[CraftyToePoke]

Is this a joke?

No. See link.

But this thread could be a really good long running one and hopefully wont be hijacked totally by this, and will last longer also. Probably, I should have put the original in here rather than in the L.O.I. section.

[osarusan]

http://foot.ie/threads/148393-This-Years-Crop-(Next-Batch-Bound-For-Cross-Channel-Clubs)

Big gang of thank you's for razor on outing the 'spy'.

Super.

You must be the thinnest-skinned person on the planet. 22 posts, 19 of which mentioned prsopsects like you had asked for. 17 of those posts came after you had been 'outed', in what was obviously a joke, given the line that followed. Jesus wept.

The link is there for anybody to read and see what nonsense you're spouting.

But go ahead and feel insulted.

[CraftyToePoke]

You must be the thinnest-skinned person on the planet. 22 posts, 19 of which mentioned prsopsects like you had asked for. 17 of those posts came after you had been 'outed', in what was obviously a joke, given the line that followed. Jesus wept.

The link is there for anybody to read and see what nonsense you're spouting.

But go ahead and feel insulted.


Take it easy there sailor, would you, if you are getting this upset over something which doesn't affect you at all, or anyone really, maybe you need some breathing exercises or something.

Yes, the link is there, its there as I just put it there.

I was neither insulted, nor am I thin skinned, it brought a wry smile if anything, was all.

Whatever statistical breakdown you deemed fit to apply to it, a thread on our brightest young players lasted scarcely over a page at a time when movement of players was at an all time high, was my overriding point.

Hopefully this one fares better, which it wont if it's dragged off topic like this so maybe agree to differ.

[Dodge]

Hopefully this one fares better, which it wont if it's dragged off topic like this so maybe agree to differ.

So stop talking ****e such as this


it's little wonder the keepers of the flame have the terraces largely to themselves.


This thread is pretty pointless though. You can't discuss "prospects" with people who haven't seen the players play. And everyone who has seen them play is already discussing them elsewhere

[Charlie Darwin]

http://foot.ie/threads/148393-This-Years-Crop-(Next-Batch-Bound-For-Cross-Channel-Clubs)

Big gang of thank you's for razor on outing the 'spy'.

Super.
I think you may have missed the thick layer of irony in that post.

I do think that thread goes to show just how few of the league's players are likely to make the jump across. Of those mentioned, I think only Stevens and Kearns have gone and neither have established themselves with their clubs, and that was over two years ago.

[CraftyToePoke]

So stop talking ****e such as this

It was a point made & left at that. A valid one also I feel, born out by the thread length.

You are a keeper of the flame Dodge, and getting a bit tetchy too by the looks of it.

Anyway, on and up and all that.

[CraftyToePoke]

I do think that thread goes to show just how few of the league's players are likely to make the jump across. Of those mentioned, I think only Stevens and Kearns have gone and neither have established themselves with their clubs, and that was over two years ago.

Kearns was recently released by Peterborough who will be in L1 for the coming season, but he was never given a run of starts despite doing well off the bench and fans warming to him.

[CraftyToePoke]

This thread is pretty pointless though. You can't discuss "prospects" with people who haven't seen the players play. And everyone who has seen them play is already discussing them elsewhere

Insular L.O.I. fan, much ?

Making my point for me while dismissing the same point.

[paul_oshea]

Kearns was recently released by Peterborough who will be in L1 for the coming season, but he was never given a run of starts despite doing well off the bench and fans warning to him.

Warning to him, what does that mean? Only a flag waver, or bar stooler would write something like that. You must be a cross channel spy. The Cold War never ended.

[CraftyToePoke]

Warning to him, what does that mean? Only a flag waver, or bar stooler would write something like that. You must be a cross channel spy. The Cold War never ended.

The war will go on for as long as the M & N keys live too close to each other it seems.

[Dodge]

Insular L.O.I. fan, much ?

Making my point for me while dismissing the same point.

I'm dismissing your pleas to stay on topic as you were the one to stray off topic. I've many thousands of posts on here and I bet you can't find one 'insular' post from me.

Happy to discuss football of any sort with anybody. I don't see the point in trying to point out potential stars to people when we all know the failure rate is high. If players are good enough, they'll make it. All the 'watch this lad' threads do no good IMO

[CraftyToePoke]

Happy to discuss football of any sort with anybody. I don't see the point in trying to point out potential stars to people when we all know the failure rate is high. If players are good enough, they'll make it. All the 'watch this lad' threads do no good IMO

So, to recap, just so I'm clear, in your book there is no point discussing the merits & demerits of emerging Irish talent in our own league, seven of whom make up the most recent international squad of ours.

Ok, we may not be able to influence their career path by discussing them, but I cant accept there is no point to it, because before our eyes each weekend in grounds around the country, are the next batch, and by that rationale are we to only discuss things in life we can directly influence Dodge ?

What a dull and pointless orbit that would make for.

And if you failing to see the connect between your not being willing to discuss players in the L.O.I. with those not watching L.O.I. each week, as I believe was exactly what you originally said - and there being an insular element to that mindset, well there isn't much I can do for you.

Yes, dismiss my plea to get a very worthy thread back on topic, Dodge, your thousands of posts and attendant ego by the looks of if does surely bequeath such powers.

Perhaps, I don't enjoy the illusion of such powers due to my lack of posts on here. Perhaps I had other matters to attend to down the years.

[paul_oshea]

Your whole post will be sacrificed on the word "our". Great post CTP.

[Charlie Darwin]

So, to recap, just so I'm clear, in your book there is no point discussing the merits & demerits of emerging Irish talent in our own league, seven of whom make up the most recent international squad of ours.
I think his point is that there's no point having a thread in this forum, which is more commonly frequented by people who don't follow the domestic league, when in fact these players are already being discussed by LOI fans in the relevant forum.

[Dodge]

So, to recap, just so I'm clear, in your book there is no point discussing the merits & demerits of emerging Irish talent in our own league, seven of whom make up the most recent international squad of ours.
No, there's no point in a specific thread dedicated to players who may/may not become international standard in the future. Of course players' performances will be discussed. It's pretty clear that no player playing in the LOI will be selected for the national team, so until they move I don't see the relevence in this forum.


Ok, we may not be able to influence their career path by discussing them, but I cant accept there is no point to it, because before our eyes each weekend in grounds around the country, are the next batch, and by that rationale are we to only discuss things in life we can directly influence Dodge ?
You can discuss what you like, I'm pointing out why I'm against these threads as seeing as the response to a previous thread disappointed you so much, maybe others agree with me.


And if you failing to see the connect between your not being willing to discuss players in the L.O.I. with those not watching L.O.I. each week, as I believe was exactly what you originally said - and there being an insular element to that mindset, well there isn't much I can do for you.
Once again, I'm happy to discuss any player's abilities or performances but I don't see what good a one way discussion is?


Yes, dismiss my plea to get a very worthy thread back on topic, Dodge, your thousands of posts and attendant ego by the looks of if does surely bequeath such powers.
So that's you admitting that you can't find any insular posts then is it? Me thinking that supporters pointing out potential internationals isn't based on any LOI insularity, it's based on years and years of seeing the majority of touted youngsters fail to make the international grade. To some here they're quite happy to jump on these players and call them failures. I don't believe anybody who makes a career out of football is a failure, so I don't like give others the opportunity to proclaim that.


Perhaps, I don't enjoy the illusion of such powers due to my lack of posts on here. Perhaps I had other matters to attend to down the years.
Nobody here, including myself, has ever mentioned your number of posts. I brought up mine to show that while I may disagree with you on this issue, it's because of the issue and not because of any prejudice I have about non-LOI supporters. Unless you can find those posts that gave you that impression...

[CraftyToePoke]

I think his point is that there's no point having a thread in this forum, which is more commonly frequented by people who don't follow the domestic league, when in fact these players are already being discussed by LOI fans in the relevant forum.

I accept and see that, at least partly, but there was also a strong element of, 'no point discussing them here, with non L.O.I. regulars' which is nonsense. And inaccurate.

The thread was placed in the L.O.I. forum by me originally in 2011 and ran to one page + one post, so I, and ill wager, many others welcome its reemergence here and those who don't want to join in aren't forced to do so.

Also CD, my reply to the 'outing' on the original thread when I said '' I assure you Sir '' was laced with irony, I got what was said and how it was intended, but overall a joined up discussion, on one thread, for all to enjoy on our best young emerging players was not wanted in there.

For whatever reason.

[Dodge]

I accept and see that, at least partly, but there was also a strong element of, 'no point discussing them here, with non L.O.I. regulars' which is nonsense. And inaccurate.

It's inaccurate to think there was an element of that to my post.

You're continuing to make the fact that some fans didn't wish to engage with you on this on topic into a LOI fans versus non LOI fans issue, which is disingenuos at best.

Now I suggest if you want to discuss it further with me, you can PM me and if mods feel the need to lock this, and let a new thread emerge, then fair enough

[SkStu]

The one thing i asked to ensure that this thread stayed focussed and had at least some value was to keep it relevant and respectful. I hadnt anticipated that it would disintegrate due to a clash of LOI supporters egos. I thought there could have been value in a thread for LOI to promote prospects and increase awareness for those fans who dont attend matches but nonetheless have an interest in and look out for potential Irish prospects.

Whatever credibility this thread might have had is likely gone now so best to delete or lock.

[Charlie Darwin]

Just put it back on track, Stu. Has Rory Gaffney's stock fallen since the summer - he seems to be back fit but I'm not hearing anything about him.

[CraftyToePoke]

Whatever credibility this thread might have had is likely gone now so best to delete or lock.

There is value in it and all you say is correct, and it's a worthy topic which I think it will recover from its most unfortunate birthing difficulties of earlier this afternoon to become a valuable resource to track these lads, as I'm sure we all, all shades of fan, on here only wish them well and want to see their potential realized.

[CraftyToePoke]

Just put it back on track, Stu. Has Rory Gaffney's stock fallen since the summer - he seems to be back fit but I'm not hearing anything about him.

He is fit, and available but hasn't broken straight back in the side, no. He has made a few appearances recently but I haven't seen him play yet this year. He did look a cut above this time last year. Hard to really judge a guy who's preseason was so curtailed as his.

[Crosby87]

Gaffneys inclusion in the thread will just stoke the fire as pro and anti ginger factions on foot ie prepare their battle axes.
http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcROU6QFryD2L80vmCOxRy0QLMc77X07M 8_lOY9SViF4_Fo3FEmMrA

[gastric]

Don't let this thread get sidetracked lads. I have been away too long to know what the hell is happening in the LOI and don't have the time to find out. For me, the story and journey of players like Daniel Kearns or Enda Stevens is as important and interesting as that of Robbie Keane. This thread can be used for years to come and keep those who are interested in the loop.

[Charlie Darwin]

He is fit, and available but hasn't broken straight back in the side, no. He has made a few appearances recently but I haven't seen him play yet this year. He did look a cut above this time last year. Hard to really judge a guy who's preseason was so curtailed as his.
True - maybe the mid-season break will allow him to catch up a bit.


Don't let this thread get sidetracked lads. I have been away too long to know what the hell is happening in the LOI and don't have the time to find out. For me, the story and journey of players like Daniel Kearns or Enda Stevens is as important and interesting as that of Robbie Keane. This thread can be used for years to come and keep those who are interested in the loop.
I wouldn't have thought the LOI was any more time-consuming to follow than English football, probably a lot less so, especially with most of the European leagues about to finish for the summer. Stick on MNS on the RTE player every now and then and you'll soon be up to speed. Well, as long as Giles isn't on that week.

[gastric]

True - maybe the mid-season break will allow him to catch up a bit.


I wouldn't have thought the LOI was any more time-consuming to follow than English football, probably a lot less so, especially with most of the European leagues about to finish for the summer. Stick on MNS on the RTE player every now and then and you'll soon be up to speed. Well, as long as Giles isn't on that week.

I could be wrong as I haven't checked in a while, but the RTE player did only work in ireland and wasn't available overseas.

[Charlie Darwin]

I could be wrong as I haven't checked in a while, but the RTE player did only work in ireland and wasn't available overseas.
That was actually a problem at the start of the season but they addressed that since. I believe MNS is available worldwide and the live games are available everywhere except the UK. I'm not sure if the live games are available in the UK for playback though.

[CraftyToePoke]

That was actually a problem at the start of the season but they addressed that since. I believe MNS is available worldwide and the live games are available everywhere except the UK. I'm not sure if the live games are available in the UK for playback though.

Hadn't realized this had been addressed, just assumed it was out of bounds, will take another look.

Hasn't Finn turned down UK moves ? Did I hear Palace were interested in him.

[gastric]

That was actually a problem at the start of the season but they addressed that since. I believe MNS is available worldwide and the live games are available everywhere except the UK. I'm not sure if the live games are available in the UK for playback though.

With the time difference between Oz and Ireland, playback is essential! Will have a look though.

[Charlie Darwin]

Hadn't realized this had been addressed, just assumed it was out of bounds, will take another look.

Hasn't Finn turned down UK moves ? Did I hear Palace were interested in him.
I don't think he's been offered any, but perhaps he was and didn't disclose. He has trained with Crystal Palace alright, but he didn't go for serious trials until he'd finished his degree.


With the time difference between Oz and Ireland, playback is essential! Will have a look though.
Playback lasts about three weeks so you should be OK :p

[CraftyToePoke]

I don't think he's been offered any, but perhaps he was and didn't disclose. He has trained with Crystal Palace alright, but he didn't go for serious trials until he'd finished his degree.

Was that the same for Paul Corry staying with U.C.D. ?

[Charlie Darwin]

Was that the same for Paul Corry staying with U.C.D. ?
Exactly the same, except I think Corry got a commerce degree which is fairly unusual. Most of the players who go to UCD do sports management or physiotherapy. You tend to see a lot of players leave UCD aged 21 or 22 after they've finished their degrees. I think Gary Dicker left without finishing his, Conor Sammon did finish his as far as I know. Conan Byrne, Evan McMillan, Ciaran Kilduff all have degrees.

[paul_oshea]

What about Chris Forrester? Some of the St Pats establishment were having the horn for him big time about a year or so ago, one season wonder?

[Stuttgart88]

I think if we were to limit discussion to Irish players who have only "succeeded" we'd have a much smaller forum. Over the years many interesting conversations have been had about players who ultimately failed to fulfill our hopes for them. It didn't make it less interesting though.

[Charlie Darwin]

What about Chris Forrester? Some of the St Pats establishment were having the horn for him big time about a year or so ago, one season wonder?
He's better this season from what I've heard and seen. Physically he looks very small but some stick-thin players are very strong so it's hard to judge.

[gastric]

Ronnie Moore impressed by Corry.


http://www.sportinglife.com/football/news/article/419/8565706/boss-more-to-come-from-corry

[osarusan]

Also CD, my reply to the 'outing' on the original thread when I said '' I assure you Sir '' was laced with irony, I got what was said and how it was intended, but overall a joined up discussion, on one thread, for all to enjoy on our best young emerging players was not wanted in there.

So at the time, you realised it was just a joke?

So why this post then:



http://foot.ie/threads/148393-This-Years-Crop-(Next-Batch-Bound-For-Cross-Channel-Clubs)

Big gang of thank you's for razor on outing the 'spy'.

Super.

Why are you pointing out the 'spy' element of the post, if you knew it was a joke?

And if we are to believe that you knew it was a joke, can you then point out what other part of/other posts in the thread gave you reason to say this:





I started one similar in the L.O.I section a few years ago, but I was hunted out of there under suspicion of being a UK spy