Ireland V Sweden(A) 22 March & Austria(H) - 26 March 2013 - World Cup 2014 Qualifiers

[SkStu]

Before we started this campaign, I thought we'd be certs for a 4th place finish.

well youre bang on the money so far.

[ArdeeBhoy]

People who think Austria are a "mediocre" side are in for a nasty surprise. I personally think they'll finish 2nd, they've a lot of young highly regarded bundesliga/turkish league players you might not know a lot about yet but you will soon enough.

Know an Austrian lad who I got tickets for tomorrow, who keeps telling me they won't qualify and is only obsessed about beating Germany, though guess they missed their chance there.
All I'd add is they're a largely unknown quantity and one of Ireland's 'bogey' teams, enough said...

[SkStu]

Now that he's off the radio, we can look forward to more reams of self-indulgent nonsense like this from Ken Early in the Times.

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/soccer/lucky-general-trapattoni-hasn-t-met-his-waterloo-just-yet-1.1337844


wow. That is one of the worst written, indulgent pieces of tripe I have read in a long time and I agree with his general premise...

[the bear]

Sometimes you wonder is Trap just taking the ****. Sammon has looked comically bad in his cameos so far. hopefully the nerves will settle and he can provide a threat. Dissappointing because i was sure it was going to be Hoolahans big chance to break into the team.

Such a positive performance last friday we really made progression, Mccarthy, Wilson & Coleman were the most important cogs in the way we played so i'm hoping having them there tommorrow will see us continue in the same vein. If they are still looking for the ball to feet and trying to keep it hopefully not even the great Glenn Whelan can stink it up.

[Fixer82]

Sammon has looked comically bad in his cameos so far. .

Bit harsh. He played one friendly in which he admittedly wasn't great.
He didn't see the ball for the ten minutes or so he was on against Sweden

[the bear]

Bit harsh. He played one friendly in which he admittedly wasn't great.
He didn't see the ball for the ten minutes or so he was on against Sweden

Yes maybe a bit harsh, I just thought he didn't look like a footballer at all. I will be delighted if he proves me wrong tomorrow.

[pineapple stu]

Sammon starting is the lowest point of Irish soccer in my living memory
Hyperbolic tripe. Granted, I'm biased (but would still have started either Hoolahan or Doyle), but off the top of my head, you've got -

6-0 down against Germany
The Euro 2012 let-down
Henry's handball
San Marino's late equaliser
Ireland's late equaliser against Cyprus
5-2 in Cyprus
Sitting back on the 2-0 lead against Israel and blowing it
Saipan
0-0 v Liechtenstein
Chris Woods' rugby tackle somehow not being the penalty to send us to Euro 92
Any time John Delaney opens his mouth.

All far, far more disappointing than a Championship forward starting for Ireland.

[tricky_colour]

I was hoping for a league one forward myself.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Hyperbolic tripe. Granted, I'm biased (but would still have started either Hoolahan or Doyle), but off the top of my head, you've got -

6-0 down against Germany
The Euro 2012 let-down
Henry's handball
San Marino's late equaliser
Ireland's late equaliser against Cyprus
5-2 in Cyprus
Sitting back on the 2-0 lead against Israel and blowing it
Saipan
0-0 v Liechtenstein
Chris Woods' rugby tackle somehow not being the penalty to send us to Euro 92
Any time John Delaney opens his mouth.

All far, far more disappointing than a Championship forward starting for Ireland.
And being cheated by FIFA as far as back as 1965 and the play-off v.Spain.

Not to mention being cheated in the '80's in France, Belgium (or Holland. Or maybe even both?) and Bulgaria where the officials were probably bribed in keeping those times.

[ArdeeBhoy]

For all you optimists?


http://thescore.thejournal.ie/poll-how-will-ireland-fare-against-austria-844690-Mar2013/

[geysir]

:)
That poll has a blatant leading question/intro, designed to weed out optimism.

[Crosby87]

Sammon works hard, he can swim upstream as they say. He will do fine, as long as there is no roe during the match. He's a lover not a fighter.
I think he will go well with McLean who Nigel-Harps describes as kind of a "garlic mashed potatoes" sidedish of a player. And he is always in demand at weddings which makes him a well liked chap I suppose.

[pineapple stu]

And being cheated by FIFA as far as back as 1965 and the play-off v.Spain.

Not to mention being cheated in the '80's in France, Belgium (or Holland. Or maybe even both?) and Bulgaria where the officials were probably bribed in keeping those times.
Absolutely. And turning down a place in the 1950 World Cup too.

I was only going on living memory though. And even then, I got plenty.

[Crosby87]

And lets not forget those shorts Mick wore in the World Cup as manager, giving nightmares to Irish across the globe.

[Fergie's Son]

Sammon is an odd choice. Walters there to do what exactly? Seat holders at the Oscars are more effective.

[Colbert Report]

Walters has been doing a job for Stoke on the right hand side of midfield all season long.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Except Wally should be up front and Brady play on the right. Sammon for the metaphorical glue factory...

[Yard of Pace]

Walters has been doing a job for Stoke on the right hand side of midfield all season long.

In the fan's verdict on their club's season so far in the Guardian a couple of days ago he was singled out for having "struggled, playing out position" or words to that effect.

[geysir]

Walters usually looks like he's struggling no matter what, elegance or comfortable doesn't apply, Trap has a soft spot for the battler.

[DannyInvincible]

'Memory lane: Roy Keane on when Ireland lost to Austria but passed ‘Harry’s Challenge’': http://thescore.thejournal.ie/roy-keane-on-ireland-v-austria-1995-844911-Mar2013/?utm_source=facebook_self&utm_medium=thescore&utm_campaign=from_page


AFTER TRIPS WITH the Irish team, players would go back to their club at the end of an international week and swap stories with English players and those from other nations about the weird but wonderful Ireland camp.

Everyone had a laugh at the Irish. No one laughed harder than the Irish players telling the stories about the ****-ups, ****-ups and the various impediments you faced as a professional player representing your country. When I was young I told stories. And laughed.

Here’s a good one from Ireland’s qualifying campaign for Euro 96 – towards the end of Big Jack’s time as national team manager.

Because of injury I played only three or four games from the qualifiers. But Dennis Irwin and Paul McGrath were witnesses to this story.

Ireland were at home to Austria in a vital qualifying game. The day before the match, the team went to Lansdowne Road for a training session. On the way they stopped at a branch of Harry Ramsden’s on the Naas Road.

The photographers were on hand to capture the Irish team tackle their first big challenge of the week: Harry’s Challenge, a giant-sized haddock with chips and beans or peas, with a sweet to follow.

Eat up, lads, urged Jack. Some of the lads tucked into Harry’s Challenge. Then off to Lansdowne Road for the final training session.

Yes, Austria won 3-1. Some of the lads reported that their legs ‘went’ twenty minutes from the end. F**ked. But they’d passed Harry’s Challenge.

The story went down a treat in the dressing rooms around England.

Significantly, Ireland failed to qualify for Euro 96 because of that defeat. Holland beat them easily in a play-off game at Anfield. That was Harry’s Challenge.

[brine3]

Hyperbolic tripe. Granted, I'm biased (but would still have started either Hoolahan or Doyle), but off the top of my head, you've got -

6-0 down against Germany
The Euro 2012 let-down
Henry's handball
San Marino's late equaliser
Ireland's late equaliser against Cyprus
5-2 in Cyprus
Sitting back on the 2-0 lead against Israel and blowing it
Saipan
0-0 v Liechtenstein
Chris Woods' rugby tackle somehow not being the penalty to send us to Euro 92
Any time John Delaney opens his mouth.

All far, far more disappointing than a Championship forward starting for Ireland.


You've forgotten the ultimate disappointment of them all.

Goran Stravevski, 1-1, 93rd minute.

I was physically ill for days after that.

edit:

Also not forgetting that the same F.Y. Macedonian side absolutely rolled over when they hosted their F.Y. compatriots Yugoslavia.

I've really enjoyed every time we've beaten Macedonia since then.

[BonnieShels]

You've forgotten the ultimate disappointment of them all.

Goran Stravevski, 1-1, 93rd minute.

I was physically ill for days after that.

Yip!

That's my lowest moment too. I actually lost my mind in the sitting room when that happened. Screaming and shouting at the TV like a crazelord.

I'm still not fully recovered. I feel a little sick now thinking about it.

[brine3]

Worse still, I lived in Holland at the time. Ireland at Euro 2000 would have been brilliant.

[pineapple stu]

You've forgotten the ultimate disappointment of them all.

Goran Stravevski, 1-1, 93rd minute.
Good call. I'm sure there's more too.

[DannyInvincible]

Yip!

That's my lowest moment too. I actually lost my mind in the sitting room when that happened. Screaming and shouting at the TV like a crazelord.

I'm still not fully recovered. I feel a little sick now thinking about it.

That was my 14th birthday. Awful.

[Crosby87]

What's going to happen if some of the lads get wind of Harrys challenge now that Sammon is around?

[Bungle]

http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/international/2013/0326/378453-ireland-v-austria-the-opposition/

Have to say reading this article that Austria on paper look to be as good a team man for man in most positions as Sweden (obviously without a world class forward like Sweden). Alot of their players are playing at a high level for big clubs in the Bundesliga.

I'm hoping and predicting that we can nick the 1-0 win. I'm predicting an awfully mediocre first half from us and for Wessi to come on in the 62nd minute and score with a bicycle kick of sublime beauty in the 72nd minute :cool:

[shakermaker1982]

I hope our back 4 resist the temptation to lump it forward to the Sammon tonight. Keep trying to play football like Friday night and we can win this.

I only know 3 or 4 of the Austrian starting 11 so cannot judge them really other than look at recent results. An early goal would calm the nerves for everybody within the ground and should rattle their young team.

I'm going to keep my positive hat on and say we'll nick a 1 nil victory. I really hope it's Sammon who gets the winner and the Trap makes us all look like chumps. It's time our home form picked up and LR was turned into a bit of a fortress like the good old days.

[NeverFeltBetter]

I'm weirdly nervous about this game, more than I have been for an Irish game in a while. Not so much about the result (well, relatively speaking), but with how the team will play. It sort of seemed against Sweden that a corner might have been turned in terms of mentality, tactics and putting trust in the players to actually play a bit of football as opposed to watching the other team do it. But the re-inclusion of Whelan (after Green's showing I mean) and choice of Sammon makes me worried that we'll end up back at the hoofball.

Dropped points here would be a total disaster and the Austrians shouldn't be pushovers.

[Sullivinho]

You've forgotten the ultimate disappointment of them all.

Goran Stravevski, 1-1, 93rd minute.

I was physically ill for days after that.

edit:

Also not forgetting that the same F.Y. Macedonian side absolutely rolled over when they hosted their F.Y. compatriots Yugoslavia.

I've really enjoyed every time we've beaten Macedonia since then.

That's the one for me too. Literally haven't been able to watch opposition corner kicks ever since.

[back of the net]

Yip!

That's my lowest moment too. I actually lost my mind in the sitting room when that happened. Screaming and shouting at the TV like a crazelord.

I'm still not fully recovered. I feel a little sick now thinking about it.



Sitting in a pub in dublin city centre when they equalized and been asked to stop my foul mouthed highly vocal rant that followed, by the barman or leave the pub.

Not proud of my rant of course - but the utter heartbreak of being so close and to have it taken away in the dying seconds was too much to handle......gutted

[footballplease]

That's the one for me too. Literally haven't been able to watch opposition corner kicks ever since.

My God i remember that one like it was yesterday. I was in a bar in Sydney at what must have been about 5am watching it. I think once the final whistle went, i just stormed out and marched all the way home in a foul mood with the gf running after me. She was wondering why one goal had turned me from a cheering singing bloke into an absolute grumpy b*stard for days on end afterwards!

[Fergie's Son]

Walters has been doing a job for Stoke on the right hand side of midfield all season long.

And what sort of job would that be? Stoke are dire and Walters hasn't been garnering much in the way of praise. Maybe he's just being brought down by a bad lot but it does seem an insipid choice.

[Fergie's Son]

Why time is kick off?

I was watching that match at a bar in Chicago. Ran into Tom Humphries of all people who was in the city for a year.

[paul_oshea]

7.45 our time. so 1.45 your time.

[Murfinator]

Keep trying to play football like Friday night and we can win this.


England, Chelsea, Man City etc all have realised that the EPL is a poor technical league, they understand that if they try to play a ground passing, possession game against teams from Spain/Germany they'll be destroyed so they do the exact opposite of that and are somewhat successful with anti-football. We need to understand the same, long ball is the way to play this particular game.
Austria are a more talented team than us but they're young, naive and unfamiliar with winning these kind of games. We need to be cute and wily, perhaps cynical. Teams like Austria constantly come a cropper to the mentally strong sides, they constantly embarrass inferior sides who think they can outplay them. It's why the old Italians have been kryptonite to a young Germany in recent years and why I'd seriously worry for Bayern in their champions league quarter.


Personally I think Austria will do us tonight, it's a game for experience and leaders and would have been made for Keane, Dunne and Duff. I'm afraid we might try to play open expansive stuff and they have players who can really hurt us, we don't have a good home record either. Austria 2 -0 on their way to a playoff place.

[paul_oshea]

You said before Sweden that they are far above us on paper and in practice, yet you come out and say after the game that Sweden are a mediocre side. IF they were way above us they would be at the level of Germany, and they are not. As I said before the game sweden on paper are about the same as us. ON paper we are slightly better than Austria. All 3 varying levels of averageness, but we showed against sweden that we can play this passing, short game.

If we lose to Austria it has nothing to do them being the more talented team than us, it will be our own undoing, blended with a mixture of old journey men and young naive Austrain league players, who haven't faired much better than some LOI sides recently enough btw, it has nothing to do with anything else.

We are not as bad as you would like to make out, and we don't have to resort to this football that you speak of all the time. Change the tune, its old and ineffective. Ireland are a decently average team, missing an out and out striker of good calibre. Thats about it. The majority of our players play in a stronger league week in, week out.

I hope we win tonight, and then finally put you in your box. I see us drawing, but this fear-of-god stuff given so much respect and disrespecting Ireland (as much as to defend your horn for Trap )is begining to grate me.

[Murfinator]

Sweden are a mediocre side with a couple of exceptional players. If you nullify those players or they have an off night then they are an entirely mediocre side. With Green man marking Ibra and Keane hassling Kallstrom from deep we managed to disrupt both of them and as expected the rest of their team wasn't up to much. That is what I said and that is why we got a draw.
Austria are different in that they have quality throughout the pitch, you can't stop them all.


blended with a mixture of old journey men and young naive Austrain league players

This is a ridiculous comment. They have 2 players who are starters for sides who were in the Champions league knockouts, their ages are 26 and 20. Only two or three players who'll start will be from the Austrian league, the rest from the Bundesliga, Turkish league or Serie A. Also they have one player who is 30 and nobody else in their thirties in their squad, it's a young squad so you're clearly just flat making up things about a team you don't understand. If you'd care to explain who are these old twenty something journey men I'd love to know.

[paul_oshea]

Sweden are a mediocre side with a couple of exceptional players. If you nullify those players or they have an off night then they are an entirely mediocre side. With Green man marking Ibra and Keane hassling Kallstrom from deep we managed to disrupt both of them and as expected the rest of their team wasn't up to much. That is what I said and that is why we got a draw.
Austria are different in that they have quality throughout the pitch, you can't stop them all.

This is a ridiculous comment. They have 2 players who are starters for sides who were in the Champions league knockouts, their ages are 26 and 20. Only two or three players who'll start will be from the Austrian league, the rest from the Bundesliga, Turkish league or Serie A. Also they have one player who is 30 and nobody else in their thirties in their squad, it's a young squad so you're clearly just flat making up things about a team you don't understand. If you'd care to explain who are these old twenty something journey men I'd love to know.

You didn't obviously watch the game, Green wasn't anywhere near Ibra, and didn't man-mark him. Keane played deep. You are clearly making stuff up not me. Austria's average age is 24.5 ours is 26.5. They have 2 or 3 around 30 and they have 2 from Austria, 1 from swiss league, 1 from bayern the rest from lower/average German teams(2 for bremen lying 4th from bottom in the bundesliga), along with a couple from average Italian sides(bolonga lie 11th in Italy a little like stoke in england). Outside of the top 2 or 3 in Germany the league isn't stronger than the English top tier. Sweden are a stronger team than Austria, with 1 exceptional player and 1 very good player. We played a better game of football, playing barcelonaesque at times in terms of cohesion and pressure when without the ball, now we have gone back to a game that hasn't worked for us, and has us seen us get trounced by good opposition, yet its the game you are suggesting we play because it works against average teams, but you said they are better than us - I see us as average. The system doesn't work for us, or anyone else, we showed what works for us and that's what I am advocating.


Here is a very good article from Stephen Reid http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/steven-reid-picking-sammon-a-mistake-it-shouldve-been-hoolahan-29153400.html

We showed on Friday that having a player capable of playing ball and dropping deep like Keane did on link up we are far more effective. Sammon does not give us that, so playing this hoof-ball game is not our key to winning, crowding the midfield and having a decent playmaker is.

[BonnieShels]

Couldnt find a ticket thread so will post here. Have a spare ticket for sale for 17.50. Pm me if interested.

Section BLK116
Row Q
Seats 19
Description ENTER VIA
SOUTH STAND - LOWER
GREEN ROUTE STILE C

Make a thread for it then!

[Murfinator]

You didn't obviously watch the game, Green wasn't anywhere near Ibra, and didn't man-mark him. Keane played deep. You are clearly making stuff up not me. Austria's average age is 24.5 ours is 26.5. They have 2 or 3 around 30 and they have 2 from Austria, 1 from swiss league, 1 from bayern the rest from lower/average German teams(2 for bremen lying 4th from bottom in the bundesliga), along with a couple from average Italian sides(bolonga lie 11th in Italy a little like stoke in england). Outside of the top 2 or 3 in Germany the league isn't stronger than the English top tier. Sweden are a stronger team than Austria, with 1 exceptional player and 1 very good player. We played a better game of football, playing barcelonaesque at times in terms of cohesion and pressure when without the ball, now we have gone back to a game that hasn't worked for us, and has us seen us get trounced by good opposition, yet its the game you are suggesting we play because it works against average teams, but you said they are better than us - I see us as average. The system doesn't work for us, or anyone else, we showed what works for us and that's what I am advocating.


Here is a very good article from Stephen Reid http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/steven-reid-picking-sammon-a-mistake-it-shouldve-been-hoolahan-29153400.html

We showed on Friday that having a player capable of playing ball and dropping deep like Keane did on link up we are far more effective. Sammon does not give us that, so playing this hoof-ball game is not our key to winning, crowding the midfield and having a decent playmaker is.

Could you name the old Austrian journeymen in their current squad that you were referring to, please.
And I would hope you're not calling Stuttgart or Schalke "lower/average" teams. I would disagree with your assertion that the mid-table Bundesliga is weaker than the mid-table of the EPL. The Bundesliga mid-table is filled with teams who have played in Europe, contested league titles and even won league titles. The strength in depth is stronger. In England the mid-table consists of sides with championship experience, set up in a way to be difficult to beat and preserve themselves in the league. They have no European experience, no experience contesting the league and importantly no winning culture. Sounds familiar don't you think?

Again we have players capable of playing ball against mediocre or weaker midfields. It was the right move against Sweden and would be the right move against the Kazakhs or faoroes. It would be an abysmal, suicidal move against Germany and probably unwise against Austria. A lot of people don't seem to understand the perils of playing that kind of game against a team who can do it better than you.

[Fergie's Son]

7.45 our time. so 1.45 your time.

Thanks Paul. Have the clocks gone forward an hour in Ireland yet?

[geysir]

I'd say our chances are evens.
1/3 a chance for a win, 1/3 for a draw, 1/3 for none of the aforementioned.

[DeLorean]

Thanks Paul. Have the clocks gone forward an hour in Ireland yet?

Not until next weekend.

[paul_oshea]

Could you name the old Austrian journeymen in their current squad that you were referring to, please.
And I would hope you're not calling Stuttgart or Schalke "lower/average" teams. I would disagree with your assertion that the mid-table Bundesliga is weaker than the mid-table of the EPL. The Bundesliga mid-table is filled with teams who have played in Europe, contested league titles and even won league titles. The strength in depth is stronger. In England the mid-table consists of sides with championship experience, set up in a way to be difficult to beat and preserve themselves in the league. They have no European experience, no experience contesting the league and importantly no winning culture. Sounds familiar don't you think?


Pogatetz and György Garics, Janko as well if they go with him. I thought Fuchs was 30 as well actually. I was referring to Bremen where two of the players come from. The Europa league has loads of English teams left at this stage, the CL having 2 german teams left, which I agreed with about the top 3 or 4 teams.

[DeLorean]

Another reason we should have played Green ahead of Whelan - he's clearly 1995 hat-trick hero (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2Fpe0dxKZ4) Peter Stöger's clone!

http://www.solofutbol.cl/Imagenes/Albunes%20de%20futbol/austria/Austria%201998/stoeger,%20peter%201998.jpghttp://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/52026000/jpg/_52026622_green226_getty.jpg

[shakermaker1982]

Murf,

We are only talking about passing a football now and again from defence into midfield instead of hoofing it out for a throw in. I wouldn't see that as perilous. Nobody thinks or expects us to play tika taka but keeping the ball now and again is a good move at any level of the game.

Obviously I respect Austria but they aren't at the level of Spain, Croatia, Russia, Germany etc & we should be looking to get 3 points tonight.

[geysir]

Austria are Germany lite.

[Noelys Guitar]

It really depends how we play. Austrian didn't score against Kazakhstan which says a lot. I watched the first half of that game and they struggled even more than we did. Ourselves, Austria and Sweden at probably at the exact same level. My worry is our the style of play at home and our inability to control the game. McCarthy is going to be the key player again tonight and I expect a better game from Long that was shown against Sweden. The key is going to be if we do take the lead (as i expect) can we hang onto it. Still no confirmation on whether Wilson plays. I really hope he does and we keep the same defensive unit as against Sweden.

[tricky_colour]

I have been wondering why we seemed to hit so many over-hit balls in the final 3rd V Sweden
and have reduced it to two possible causes:-


a) Our players are crap :p

b) The pitch was doctored. It looked to me like the grass was cut much shorter in the final The sort of dirty trick only the Swedes are capable of. Looked like it was cut progressively shorted causing through balls to run on a couple of yard more than normal.

I expect they will have mown the evidence away by now though.